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Old 09-24-2012, 04:31 AM   #211
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Hi back at ya scalestepper!

portcop - good for you going back to work especially since you like what you do! I was in sales my whole life. Did well at it $$$ wise but did not find it gratifying down in my soul. I hope my switch to addiction counseling will give me more of what I need from helping others. Can't wait to hear how your first day goes! Are you working part or full time?

FBG was 90 this morning. I'm so happy about that. I want to see what the readings are the next couple of days. I hope I'm onto something.

Off to the gym...

DG
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Old 09-24-2012, 08:31 AM   #212
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DG I'm little stressed I went to work and they sent me home after two hour of watching videos said they had not got approval from home to hire me back yet plus have to do a back ground check on me.and they lady who has to do my papers is on vacation till next Monday..so I go back next Monday
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Old 09-24-2012, 01:24 PM   #213
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Awe portcop that must have been very upsetting! How are you doing now?

It does sound plausible that maybe someone jumped the gun about telling you to come on in to work before some of the formalities were complete - I could sure see that happening anyway. I hope you will try not to jump to any negative conclusions before knowing what's really going on!!!

And for sure....don't let this unexpected situation send you running for cookies. You can have an extra fat bomb if you want one.

I hope you will try to have faith that we are always right where we are supposed to be, and that all things will work out in the end the way they are supposed to.

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Old 09-24-2012, 04:46 PM   #214
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DG I'm little stressed I went to work and they sent me home after two hour of watching videos said they had not got approval from home to hire me back yet plus have to do a back ground check on me.and they lady who has to do my papers is on vacation till next Monday..so I go back next Monday
Sorry to hear that I can see that would be a letdown. I played tag with my current employer for a bit too before they finally got everything in order.


DG- I am still reading Jenny's book and feeling a bit anxious about ever finding the answers I had hoped for. I knew deep down that LC was not the cure-all I had thought it was in 2010 when I was at goal-but her book so far has sealed that feeling for me. I was at goal didn't binge for 6 months and suddenly all the old habits and feelings of deprivation were back, just as she describes! How do we beat that or do we just settle for the best we can do? Very though provoking.

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Old 09-24-2012, 04:59 PM   #215
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It is very thought provoking Jeanie. I am in a very similar place - LC worked great until......it wasn't working so great. I don't know if it was "me" or "it" but you know what I mean I think! I went well over 1.5 years without sugar crossing my lips (and was at goal weight over a year). Then sugar...then the binges. I too have not quite got it all figured out yet.

I think what is reassuring to me about that book is that she describes the experiences like you and I have had, and says that lots of people have had these experiences. It doesn't make it any less frustrating, but it sure makes me feel less alone. I also find it reassuring that there are lots of iterations of low carb that DO work for people when some other iteration doesn't. Some people do well on the ketogenic versions, others don't. And 110g carbs is still "low carb." I tend to forget that.

I'm also glad she points out that fi we raise the carbs a bit, then the fat needs to go down, or calories go too high. I like that she talks about calories being a factor. I know many people don't believe they are, but I know for ME they are. I like knowing I'm not alone with that either.

I'm thinking my "all or nothing" efforts of trying to be extremely low carb - then blowing it - are just not paying off. I'm thinking something more moderate in terms of carbs might be better if I can do a better job sticking to it. That really is the bottom line - figuring out what is liveable that we can stick with as a lifestyle, right? I haven't found it yet but I'm not giving up. I also think "the best we can do" really is what we are after here - perfection is something that backfires for me.

Very thought provoking Jeanie - I'm glad you posted that. How far into the book are you now? I'm about Chapter 11 or something like that.

portcop - I hope you are doing OK tonight after a disappointing morning.

Hi scalestepper and Christine!

DG
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:34 PM   #216
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I'm thinking my "all or nothing" efforts of trying to be extremely low carb - then blowing it - are just not paying off. I'm thinking something more moderate in terms of carbs might be better if I can do a better job sticking to it. That really is the bottom line - figuring out what is liveable that we can stick with as a lifestyle, right? I haven't found it yet but I'm not giving up. I also think "the best we can do" really is what we are after here - perfection is something that backfires for me.



DG
Yes! I ask myself how many times am I going to keep trying VLC before I get it in my head that it isn't the answer. I think some of it is like I believe Jenny mentions in the book is that the motivation and the novelty has worn off. Also perhaps an underlying feeling that I know deep down I will not be successful so why bother trying yet again. I have posted this before but I really don't care for meat and eggs that much anymore and I can't make the gooey casseroles without overeating them! I need to come up with a lower carb menu that is different and more appealing I guess. Also now with this feeling of being so overheated all the time all I crave are cold foods. I love homemade protein shakes but I guess too many of those are not all that healthy, I don't know maybe yogurt, cottage cheese, tuna, ham and cheese chunks? Sounds like a low fat diet ha ha!
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Old 09-25-2012, 04:53 AM   #217
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Jeanie - As I was thinking about your post, it occured to me that I might make a couple of lists. One list will be foods that I know I cannot control myself with - foods that I know in all honesty cannot be part of my plan. (sugarcarbies will be at that top of that list). I'm thinking I will make another list of foods that might make a plan "liveable" for me. Some fruit? What sorts of main courses? What sorts of snacks?

I also think that I carry a certain amount of "brainwashing" from my Atkins days (which were successful in the short term!) such as "what is low fat?" I tend to think that if I'm not eating excessive fat, then I am trying to eat "low fat" which is really not true. Once again - that all or nothing thinking. I could be eating 30% fat or 50% fat and not necessarily be "low fat." Logically, "low fat" is not any amount of fat that is less than 80% of my diet, LOL!

In my experiments, I have actually done OK BG wise with 20 - 30g carbs in a meal. I'm thinking that's in line with the possible idea of 110 carbs a day like Jenny talks about. I've never really tried consistently targeting carbs to that sort of level. (I may have accidentally been at that level at times) My "all or nothing" way is to either be way below or way way above that.

This is really thought provoking discussion so I hope you will continue to add your thoughts.

I know I also use food to cover up uncomfortable feelings, etc. I've listened in on a couple of OA meetings and am wondering if some of that might be helpful in finding a way to keep food where it really belongs in my life - as fuel, not as a warm fuzzy blanket. No harm in listening in on the phone to see, I guess.

DG
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Old 09-25-2012, 03:21 PM   #218
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I bought greek yogurt,cottage cheese and some small honeycrisp apples. I plan to eat these foods along with leaner cuts of meat, poultry and salads. Jenny mentions evaluating why you fall off your plan and then deciding what to do to make it livable-so I'll try this menu for a while and meanwhile check BS.

It appears that if we are going to develop type 2 it is more or less out of our hands due to genes?? Did you come away with that DG? Also she says to shoot for a BG of 120 or less at all times if you are not diabetic, seems a bit high to me, but probably due to my extreme all or nothing thinking.

I went to one OA meeting and immediately came home and gave my husband a grateful hug for being the supportive loving man that he is! It was very sad to see some of the women there in tears over the way their spouses treated them in regards to their weight/food issues.

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Old 09-25-2012, 05:25 PM   #219
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Hi again Jeanie. I will be interested to hear how the new menu works out for you, especially from the "liveable" standpoint. I think that's important. One thing is for sure....If we eat strict ketogenic low carb for 5 days, then go hog wild binging for 2 days, our BGs will be FAR worse off than if we can find a liveable plan that is maybe 75 or 100g carbs. I definitely came away from Jenny's book with that.

I think the number to stay below is 140. It is BG above 140 where organ damage occurs. Obviously BG fluctuates so it needs to be lower than that generally and then never rise above it. I always try to keep in mind what truly normal numbers are. (the ranges are in the book, on her site, and in many other places) I don't want to be TOO far off that. (and if I am, I need to try to get on meds)

Right now my biggest problem is FBG. I am reading that FBG is not the best predictor of ultimately ending up with Diabetes though. Post prandials are a better predictor of that. For whatever reason, my post prandials (so long as I'm eating reasonably well) are usually not bad. I'm finding a few specific foods that seem to shoot them up. Like sweet potatoes. (but 3X as much white potato did NOT spike me???) Oddities like that.

All we can do is experiment, and test.

I have been making sure to watch my carbs at individual meals and for now I am really not wanting any individual meal to be over 25g (total, not net). So sometimes that just means choices. This OR that rather than this AND that.

We'll see how it goes. I am still a giant petrie dish!

Went to the gym today and had a kick azz workout. That felt good. I wonder if I will be walking tomorrow??? These free classes for the over 50 crowd are really awesome. The trainer showed me how to use 3 different AB machines today that I had always been curious about but never figured out how to use. After I was done with my basic workout, and we talked about adding some machines he said "what are you trying to change?" I said "I'm trying to change into Pamela Anderson." LOL - he said "go home and take a nap - maybe in your dreams it will happen.

I get my beef from a local farmer but not pork or chicken. I ordered some of that recently from US Wellness meats. Had the pork chops for the first time tonight. WOW. Best.Pork.Chops.Evah! I'm serious. Melt in your mouth good. I'll be ordering those again.

How are you today portcop??? Hope you are feeling OK after the job thing yesterday.

Waving to Scalestepper too!!

Nighty Night! I'm gonna hit the showers and then see if my kindle is re-charged yet!

DG
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Old 09-26-2012, 04:52 AM   #220
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DG sounds like you had a work out! Iam doing much better,I had a rough day that day,I did not cheat but ate extra fat bombs thank God for those,

Today is my weigh in day got my fingers crossed I want to drop 2.2 a week this is first time In my live I stayed off scales for a week..husband hid them.

I'm still doing LC,hf,mp loving it better than just LC I can have great foods...go for blood work oct.11 can't wait too see results.

Have you found your comfort zone yet? I think that's is so important once you do it's great.
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Old 09-26-2012, 08:04 AM   #221
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Hi portcop! So glad to hear that you are feeling better. Good for you and the fat bombs!! Way better than veering off the rails IMO. I think I am finding my comfort zone. For me that seems to be moderate protein, carbs and fat. So far anyway. And STEER CLEAR of my trigger foods. I hope you have a great weigh in! Whatever the scale says, just remember that if you do the right things every day, then it will all work out in the end! The scale can be fickle sometimes - that's just part of the journey. Hopefully today it will not be fickle!

Shout outs to Jeanie and Scalestepper and Christine! LOL I think of your avatar Christine each time I'm at the gym, which has been 5 of the last 7 days I think!

Took a "senior mobility" class today. Got some glares from a few women - I wonder if they think I'm too young??? Not gonna worry about that, LOL! It ended up being sort of like a Leslie Sansone walk off the fat sort of thing. Not overly challenging, but frankly a nice session following a killer workout with heavy aerobics and also some resistance / core work thrown in, and then weight work yesterday.

Food was on track yesterday. FBG 115. WAAAAY better than yesterdays number!! I also took it last night 2 hours after dinner - 104 which is great. I think the exercise has made a huge difference in all my daytime numbers. Just that dang early morning fasting number. I'll keep working on it.

Conference call for a volunteer project at noon, then off to school. Quiz this afternoon in ethics - UGH. Wish I knew what material he was going to put on the essay portion.

DG
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Old 09-26-2012, 08:46 AM   #222
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Well I gained .25 in a week.dont like it but its what it is.i did not exercise last week or walk..so I'm sure that's some of it.but still Happy. DG keep me informed how that works for you.
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:56 AM   #223
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Hi DG and hi everyone! I hope everyone has a good day!
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Old 09-27-2012, 03:36 AM   #224
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Old 09-27-2012, 10:54 AM   #225
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Thanks Christine!!

Hi Scalestepper!!

portcop - do not sweat a .25 *whatever* on the scale! Follow your plan and trust that it will work. There will always be fluctuations along the way. .25 is a 1/2 a cup of coffee! I think you've been losing nicely, right? I always "take a pause" after a period of losing smoothly. I think our bodies have to adjust. You are doing SO WELL sticking to your plan, and that is what will ultimately get you where you want to go. If you stay roughly the same for several weeks - don't sweat that either. Just figure out what you are going to tweak.

Look at me. I know what to do. Why don't I do it??? Well - for the last several days I HAVE been doing it. One day at a time, just gotta keep it up.

Hi Jeanie!!! What's going on with you?

Went to the gym this morning. Did 30 minutes on the elliptical which is awesome progress for me since I could barely stand 10 minutes a week ago. As much as I walk, the elliptical uses totally different muscles!! No resistance training today - was a bit sore and didn't want to push it.

FBG 113 today. Was 108 an hour later (still fasted) right before breakfast. Hmmm....

Gotta run to a presentation at school for extra credit. Hope all are having a good day!

DG
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:33 AM   #226
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Had a bad eating day yesterday. I tested my BS 3 hours after the bad carbs and it was 155! This morning fasted it was still 117! I am playing with fire, but I can't seem to get in control. Today I worked out at the Y for 40 minutes and have eaten well.

How is everyone doing?
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:49 AM   #227
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Doing good here.you be careful with that bs..what did you eat to make it go up??
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Old 09-27-2012, 12:59 PM   #228
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Ice cream and pretzels. I know better.

DG- Why do I feel so confused after reading Jenny's book?
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Old 09-27-2012, 02:28 PM   #229
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Jean o jean...make those fat bombs .........
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:46 AM   #230
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Had a bad eating day yesterday. I tested my BS 3 hours after the bad carbs and it was 155! This morning fasted it was still 117! I am playing with fire, but I can't seem to get in control. Today I worked out at the Y for 40 minutes and have eaten well.
Jean - that is the exact sort of pattern I've been seeing in my own BGs if I carb out. If your pattern is anything like mine - here is the good news. Get back to a sane eating plan and they will come back down. For me, my post meal BGs are not "normal" but as long as I eat decent (which seems to be roughly 120g carbs or less, with calorie/portion control) my post meals are well in the normal ranges. My FBG takes DAYS to slowly come back down after an episode of binge eating, or even just high calorie eating.

Keep testing your BGs would be my suggestion. The "reality check" is helping me anyway - hope it might help you too.

Quote:
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DG- Why do I feel so confused after reading Jenny's book?
Maybe because she does not give a "formula" for success? ie. She does not say "eat exactly this way to best control your BGs?" I found myself feeling a little sad about that, however what I realized is that there is NOT "one way" that will work. I actually found it uplifting that at least the way my BG is right now, a 100g moderate carb plan CAN work for me. I may have to tweak that later but for now things seems to be going pretty well. DO NOT GIVE UP. Keep trying.

Quote:
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Jean o jean...make those fat bombs .........
Fat bombs!!! hi portcop!!! You just made me hungry LOL. Those things rock.

Hi Scalestepper, Christine, lurkers and other friends!

BG this morning 105. It is slowly coming down which makes me very happy. I have incorporated a bed time snack and a middle of the night snack. Right now they are just light cheese sticks. (ala Diabetes Miracle) I don't know if they are helping my BG but man I am sleeping a lot better! I am fully capable of waking up a zillion times during the night which I KNOW is not good in so many ways. I've been waking up only once which is awesome, and somehow putting just that cheese stick in my tummy seems to help me fall right back asleep. I'm seeing no down side right now, so will keep that up.

I have been double tracking my food intake in Life Form (similar to the other trackers people use - automatically calculates ratios, etc.) I have also been tracking WW points. I really miss going to WW meetings and the comaraderie and am wondering if there is a way to make it all work. WW doesn't limit choices, so it's really up to me to see if I can make good choices that will help me control BG, stay reasonably satisfied, lose weight, and BE HAPPY. For several days of experimentations, here are what the ratios look like:

Fat: 50%
Carbs: 20%
Pro: 30%
Cals running about 1600 - 1700 or so.

I am also working out at the gym. I am slowly losing and feeling reasonably satisfied. I am eating NO grains, NO sugar. My carbs are coming mainly from vegs and fruits, with of course the few carbs that come from eggs & some dairy.

For anyone who is a WW person, this is runing around 29 - 33 PPV per day.

I always bought into the "OMG!!! WW is a LOW FAT diet!!!" Of course it can be. But the way I am currently working it, I don't think it is. I don't believe 50% calories from fat is "low fat." It's not "high fat" either but I think it's moderate fat. Any alternative opinions?

Gotta run! going to an open house this morning at a treatment provider for class extra credit. And hopefully some good contacts for future internship or employement opps!

DG
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:56 PM   #231
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Old 09-28-2012, 03:10 PM   #232
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Jean o jean...make those fat bombs .........
Which recipe do you use?
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Old 09-28-2012, 03:12 PM   #233
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Rebecca I love them and very easy to make.co,almond butter,butter,stevia,and coco.
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Old 09-28-2012, 03:13 PM   #234
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How are you today Jeanie? I hope you are having a good day.

I felt like getting outdoors today - the weather is beautiful. So I went to one of the parks and did about 5 miles. I even jogged several time for short distances. I'm pooped! Just ate an apple with some almond butter. Yum.

Salmon and asparagus for dinner. I hope to go to bed early!!

DG
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Old 09-28-2012, 03:13 PM   #235
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DG Are you attending WW meetings? Do you notice a significant difference in cravings/hunger with your new carb and fat levels?
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Old 09-28-2012, 03:28 PM   #236
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Hi Jeanie. Right now, my craving levels are low. (those cRaZy cravings where it's like I'm watching someone who looks like me get in my car and go to the store and load up on cookies and crap and down it all)

My hunger level is....I would say moderate. But it always seems to be sort of moderate. Even on very low carb I never seem to achieve that "hungerless" place. I suspect maybe that is related to my BG or something??? One benefit of doing so much reading and study about this BG thing is that I'm feeling like there is at least an explanation for some of this stuff as opposed to me just sitting around with nagging fears that somehow I'm broken, and things will never work for me like they do for others.

I've been in and out of WW meetings, but I did go last Sunday just for grins. I really like the leader and the group. One thing I have to be REALLY careful about if I'm going to follow the WW plan is NO SUGAR/GRAINS, NO GOING REALLY LOW ON FAT, and also planning to use all my points - not skimp thinking I'll lose weight faster or something like that.

I cannot trust myself to "eat until satisfied." That just doesn't work. I have to have structure or I will way over eat - no matter what sorts of foods I'm eating. So if I'm going to have to live with some structure to make sure I'm not stuffing myself, WW is as good as any I guess. It's not for everyone, and I'm not 100% sure it's even for me. But I keep gravitating back there, and frankly my weight is more stable when I am active in WW. Just gotta keep it real with the foods that DON'T work for me.

That's my 2 cents on it....

DG
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Old 09-28-2012, 03:45 PM   #237
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I haven't finished Jenny's book yet, but it seems she believes that if we have the genes for type 2 that we will eventually develop it. Did I interpret that correctly?
One thing I like that she said was that after eating too many carbs and the subsequent insulin release your body wants to continue releasing that amount of insulin at the next meal because it expects to have to deal with an influx of sugar. This process makes us feel hungry again soon after even a low carb meal until we become low carb consistently.
Geez I don't know which koolaid to drink these days?


You are doing great! It has been a long time since you have had one of those cRaZy binges!

Last edited by jeaniem; 09-28-2012 at 03:48 PM..
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:02 PM   #238
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"I cannot trust myself to "eat until satisfied." That just doesn't work. I have to have structure or I will way over eat - no matter what sorts of foods I'm eating.""

That is so me! Frustrating.
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:57 PM   #239
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Originally Posted by jeaniem View Post
DG
I haven't finished Jenny's book yet, but it seems she believes that if we have the genes for type 2 that we will eventually develop it. Did I interpret that correctly?
One thing I like that she said was that after eating too many carbs and the subsequent insulin release your body wants to continue releasing that amount of insulin at the next meal because it expects to have to deal with an influx of sugar. This process makes us feel hungry again soon after even a low carb meal until we become low carb consistently.
Geez I don't know which koolaid to drink these days?

I'm still trying to wrap my brain around all this information. I think what she is saying is that if you DON'T have the genetic predisposition then you WON'T develop diabetes. Might develop pre-diabetic symptoms and/or insulin resistance, but not diabetes unless you are genetically inclined. But...there is also the toxin side of things and I'm not sure if that is separate from genetics, or combined with genetics. I know I will be reading this stuff more than once to really understand it LOL! (I'm reading "Blood Sugar 101" right now)

My understanding is the same as yours re: the insulin issue and plummeting blood sugar that causes hunger. What I didn't realize is that the "swing down" in blood sugar causes raging hunger no matter how high or low the actual BG number is. (i.e. one does not have to drop to hypoglycemic levels to experience this - it could happn during a steep drop from 200 to 150)

I am trying to keep my carb levels stable from meal to meal. I do less carbs in the morning (ala Bernstein) but similar carbs for lunch and dinner, and less at an afternoon snack. I'm hoping that steadiness pays off.

I'm still having to remind myself that 80 or 100 g carbs a day is not "high carb" LOL! And that 50% fat is not "low fat."

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristineCQ View Post
"I cannot trust myself to "eat until satisfied." That just doesn't work. I have to have structure or I will way over eat - no matter what sorts of foods I'm eating.""

That is so me! Frustrating.
I feel your pain for sure!!! I don't know who stole my off switch, but somebody out there is running around with two of 'em!

Just got out of the shower and boy am I tired and a tad sore. I'm taking a day off tomorrow from exercise. This old bod has put in a pretty intense week compared to what I'm used to!!! Am thinking about my exercise plans for next week starting on Sunday. Will probably do...

S: Walk with some running thrown in at the park
M: Oldie strength and mobility
T: 50+ Fitness Fusion (weight training on the machines with trainer supervision, for free, which I still cannot believe!!)
W: Oldie "motion" (basically like Leslie Sansone)
T: 50+ Fitness Fusion
F: Walk
S: Rest

We shall see! I have got some MAJOR paper writing to do this weekend! I've been focusing more on all this other stuff than school. That was fun while it lasted but I better get my nose back in the school books!!! Two articles to present Wednesday night, then next week is midterms, then 2 research papers due shortly after that. No rest for the wicked.

Jeanie, I was thinking about you today and was thinking about how when I was first coming off the cRaZy binges, it seemed to help me to eat low carb but not restrict quantities for a couple weeks. I overdid cheese, nuts, etc. but it really helped me get past the sugarcarbies. Keep us posted what you experiment with!! I think it's OK to experiment!!

DG
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:08 AM   #240
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WTG on the workouts DG!

Any thoughts on low serotonin being a cause for binge eating?
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