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Old 10-20-2010, 03:27 PM   #301
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I don't know. Here's the deal though..you know that Armour and Naturethroid...well, pig thyroid in general (any ol' pig)....leaves us with a FT4 of about midway of range and a FT3 of at LEAST midway and hopefully higher...and that most of us feel well like that. Why? Because pig thyroid closely 'mimics' the action of the human thyroid when it's normal.

As you go along, if you start feeling like edgy, or just don't feel well...like 'tired and wired' kind of feeling...then you might want to suggest to lower that T4. I'm so very used to many doctors doing that...if they add in T3, and your FT4 is more than say...2/3 of it's range...they always decrease the T4 to compensate.

Pam
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Old 02-01-2011, 05:43 AM   #302
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I'm going back to the endocrinologist this Thursday for a scheduled check-up.

When I saw her in October I had been LCing for four months, my weightloss had pretty much stalled after induction. I had lost 13.4 lbs. At my appt. in Oct. I weighed 178.8 lbs. by my scale (but on her scale I weighed 181.8 lbs.) and she wanted me to take injectible Victoza, which is for diabetics, so I could lose weight. I refused. I told her that LCing was working for me. (It had just started working the month before, when she upped my medications to get my thyroid levels correct, FINALLY! My thyroid levels were on track and I was finally losing weight from the LCing and there she was, telling me the only way I was going to lose the weight was by injecting myself with Diabetic medication that works on the Pancreas. I. don't. have. diabetes.) She ALSO wanted me to take cholesterol meds. I refused.

After losing 12.6 lbs. since my appt. in October, I hope she believes that I'm on the track to getting my weight down. I also can't wait to see my cholesterol numbers. I'm sure they will be better. (But no matter what, I'm not taking cholesterol meds.) She was all upset about my high LDL, she didn't care about my low triglycerides or my high HDL, she was just very alarmed at my LDL.

These are my test results last October, after LCing four months:
Total Cholesterol: 248 (Range: 0-199, but they did admit this is a useless number.)
Triglycerides: 63 (Range: 0-149)
HDL: 60 (Range: 40-59)
LDL (calculcated): 175 (Range: 30-99)

Glucose: 72 (Range: 70-100)

I asked if they could test my LDL for the Particle A (fluffy) and Particle B (small, dense and dangerous) sizes and they said they don't do that. They just medicate when the LDL is too high. (What?!?)

She also told me that I even though it didn't look like it on paper, I was pre-diabetic and I NEEDED to take Victoza to lose weight. (WHAT?!?)

The only reason I go to this endocrinologist is because she keeps my thyroid medicated properly. I get T4 and T3 meds and I'm finally feeling better, so I won't leave her as long as she keeps my thyroid levels good. (It took me two YEARS to find a doctor that would give me T3.)

So I'm preparing myself for another heated discussion about my cholesterol this Thursday. I will come prepared with my calculator (so I can do the ratio of LDL to HDL) and my little charts about particle size in LDL.

Sorry this got so long!

I will post my labs after I get back on Thursday and report what she had to say.
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06/21/10: 192.2 Size: 14/16 Began Atkins
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Last edited by Beezer Louisiana; 02-01-2011 at 05:46 AM..
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Old 02-01-2011, 08:02 AM   #303
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I'm really sorry that you're stuck with this doctor, but I agree that it's worth it if that's the only way you can get your T3. (By the way, there are doctors who don't ordinarily prescribe T3 who will continue the prescription for a patient who is already on it, and you might want to look into that.)

Because her take on cholesterol and diabetes is just nuts. To say that they "don't do" VAP tests on particle size is crazy because they don't have to "do" it; they just order the test, as my endo did.

And that comment about 'pre-diabetes'? Where's the evidence for that? Your glucose number is optimal. And most doctors really avoid using diabetes drugs for weight loss because you really don't want to mess with the pancreas unless it's necessary.

I've been lucky with a great endo, but my sister, who is both a type2 and hypothyroid (and a medical secretary who knows a lot of doctors) has yet to find a decent endo or even internist where she lives. So you may have to stick with this doctor. But I would not give in on things I would be reluctant to do--like taking statins!
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Old 02-03-2011, 11:16 AM   #304
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I'm back from my appointment and everything went fabulous!

I saw the P.A. I want to see him EVERY time now. He was great!

Lab Results:
Total Cholesterol: 217 [0-199]
Tryglycerides: 47 [0-149]
HDL: 57 [40-59]
LDL (calculated): 151 [30-99]
Glucose: 85 [70-100]
Vitamin D3: 73 [30-100]

He said that the only thing that concerned him was the LDL, because he likes to see it under 130. I said, "Yes, but I'm a low carber so we'd expect mine to be higher. I would think that my LDL is mostly the large, fluffy Particle A instead of the Particle B. Could we do a NMR LipoProtein test to see?"

He rolled his chair back and started laughing in a good-natured way. He rubbed his eyes and said, "No, this is good. Where did you learn all of this? Do you work in the field?" I said no, I was just a dedicated low carber and I read and researched a lot. He asked me what book I had read it in and the only thing I could think of (that I was willing to say) was "Good Fats, Bad Fats" by Taubes. (I didn't want to tell him I'd also seen it on 'Fat Head' the movie and on the LivinLaVida Low Carb website and HERE on the LC forums! I didn't think he would take me seriously.)

So he ordered a NMR LipoProfile test for my next appointment in August.

I asked him if we needed to run an A1C test because the last time I was there "Dr. F" was really pressuring me to take the Victoza and I was refusing. He said, "No. You don't need it. It's really amazing what you have achieved without the Victoza." (26 lbs. weightloss.)

My thyroid meds remain the same, even though my TSH was very low. He said he wants to sit on it like this because it does fluctuate throughout the day and my T4 and T3 are exactly where he wants them.

TSH: 0.017 mIU/L [0.300 - 2.500]
Free T4: 1.51 [0.89 - 1.95]
Free T3: 3.00 [2.30 - 4.20]

He said he likes to see Free T4 between 1.3 - 1.5 and Free T3 between 3.0 - 3.5.

I'm glad they aren't reducing my meds! When I made my appointment for August, I made sure it was with the P.A. again!

p.s. I'm also very happy about my D3! Three years ago it was at 16 and I was catching every cold that came my way. Now, I haven't had a single cold in the past six months!!!!!!! (Since I started LCing and seriously supplementing my D3. Right now I take 50,000 IU/week.)

Last edited by Beezer Louisiana; 02-03-2011 at 12:10 PM..
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:04 PM   #305
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Isn't it amazing that the PA seems to be more sensible than your MD
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:14 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by Leo41 View Post
Isn't it amazing that the PA seems to be more sensible than your MD
I know!

The other thing I liked about him was that there was no chip on the shoulder, big ego attitude. I could talk to him and I didn't feel like I was being dismissed.

I'll be asking for the P.A. from here on out!!!
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Old 02-03-2011, 02:09 PM   #307
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I'll be asking for the P.A. from here on out!!!
Donna, is that Dr. Marionneaux? I love him! Glad you got to see him, and that he didn't change your thyroid meds again!
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Old 02-03-2011, 03:56 PM   #308
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Donna, is that Dr. Marionneaux? I love him! Glad you got to see him, and that he didn't change your thyroid meds again!
Yes, and I will always be asking for him when I make my appointments from now on.

He was so great!
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Old 02-03-2011, 04:09 PM   #309
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i love PA's!

so glad things are going so well. if you feel great there then its perfect.. if you feel like you could tweak, then maybe a wee more T3.
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Old 02-03-2011, 04:52 PM   #310
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i love PA's!

so glad things are going so well. if you feel great there then its perfect.. if you feel like you could tweak, then maybe a wee more T3.
That's what I was thinking too. If you recall, my last prescription for T3 was to be taken twice a day, but I only took it in the mornings and felt a lot better. In the past couple weeks I was thinking about taking the noon dose, but it was too close to my bloodwork so I didn't.

If I increased my T3 would it make my TSH even lower? Could it be a situation where I need a little less T4 and a little more T3?

I think they left my prescriptions alone, so I'll still have the twice a day T3 prescription. I might try it.

(But on an aside: he's testing my estrogen and testosterone levels to see if I'm in menopause. I had a partial hyst. in 2005 and I'm having several symptoms that I didn't connect to menopause -- I was blaming everything on my thyroid. He said I could already be through menopause, since I have so many symptoms. It sounds like he may give me a trial of a little testosterone, depending upon my test results. So, that may make me feel like $100,000,000. So, I was thinking I'll wait until after I try that before I fiddle with my T3. What do you think?)
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