Ok Nonstick Pam and other Thyroid Guru's...

[nonstickpam107]

Originally Posted by Butterflyk

Hi Pam, and yes I did get that list of dr's here in Canada. I was suppose to see Dr. D in Toronto, but the first appointment got postponed, and the second one I move into October because of the biopsy. His office agreed that it was best to get these results and then see him.

Speaking of which, I meant to ask, how much do they normally take out when doing a thyroid biopsy. I thought it was only a small amount, like enough to put on a slide, but what I saw was 3/4 of a urine sample jar full. It just seemed like an awful lot??? Also the dr. who did the proceedure asked me how long I have known about the nodule and before I could ask, he then quickly said for me not to speak. That seemed a little odd to me, not trying to be paranoid of course while waiting for the results. I had the procedure done last Thursday afternoon. How long should I wait for results? I meant to ask but seemed to be whisked in and out type thing. Thanks so much again. Bk.

If the goiter or thyroid is full of liquid, or fluid, than they will take whatever they can get...because papillary cancers can be found even 'around' the thyroid itself.

Some doctors will assess if it's a hot or cold nodule first, others will take biopsy, and go from there. Some doctors will want the thyroid taken OUT even if it's NOT cancer, but many here in the USA will shrink the goiter (no cancer) with T3 as well as T4 therapy (T4 ONLY doesn't shrink it, we know that now..newest info).

Don't know how long your lab would take, I've had results called in to me/FAX'd to me within two days, but I've also waited two WEEKS to get them.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam thanks so much for the response, you are truly a wealth of information. I thought the amount seemed to be alot because the nurse (from the dr's office) initially told me that they take a tiny sample with a single syringe - I saw them pull out the cup, a long hose and several needles and figured there was more to this than I was being told. Of course the specialist not having the report at the time I saw him surely didn't help.

I also got copies of my TSH tests that were done before the ultrasound (infact the only ones done over the past 1 1/2 years):

July 2 - 0.5 (lowest end of normal)
July 29 - 1.7
Aug 13 - 2.59 (this is the only number the specialist had when he said that my TSH was normal

Of course no one has ever thought to do my TSH when I am really ill - but as per usual they missed it by wanting to believe it was in my head instead of my neck.

Am going to call the specialist office tomorrow about the results. Thanks again, will write back then. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

Um, TSH is a pituitary test. YOU need your thyroid tested. FT4, FT3, etc. TSH means NOTHING..it can go from .20 to 3.5 during the course of any normal day! You also do NOT want a doctor doing anything with hormone replacement using ONLY TSH. So..it really doesn't matter WHAT your TSH was...at anytime. So, you saying they are 'missing' when your TSH is high enough...um..doesn't compute. You need to find a doctor who does the CORRECT testing (FT4, FT3, Total T4, Total T3) and knowing where they should be in range (not just that they 'are' in range).

Me? Five doctors. All 'notable' endo's. Every one of them only did TSH. Um..so..what happened? I had a TSH of under a 1...I went in myxedema coma (yep, rare indeed..BUT..they would have caught that with correct testing...when I reached the ICU my FT4 and FT3..didn't register. At all. Had none.). So...I know first hand what a doctor who 'worships at the altar of TSH' can do (or not) for you.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, thanks again, I received a copy of my thyroid ultrasound today and it reads as follows:

It says both lobes are of normal size. That the left lobe is slightly larger in width by .5 cm with evidence of a focal hypoechoic lesion measuring 1 x 0.2 x 0.8 cm noted within the left lobe of the thyroid with moderate increased vasularity. Conclusion: A solitary hypoechoic slightly irregular nodule is noted withinthe left lobe of the thyroid. Recommend FNA.

Pam can you please explain to me what exactly are they saying? What is a hypoechoic lesion? They say there was only one, yet this doesn't explain 3/4 jar of fluid that took out of me.

Also I did have fT4 and fT3 done along with TPO, TPO was positive (but below their range for Hashi's - don't understand that), the fT4 was within range and the fT3 was right on the border line - lowest end. The report said though that my fT3 was not optimal - something to do with the ratio between fT4 and fT3. It recommended T4/T3 therapy but the dr's I have seen thus far are still going by the TSH - until I can see the one in Toronto -Dr. D. I don't think I will get the help I need here. I am only waiting now for the biopsy results so that I can take it with me.

I won't get word on the biospy for maybe another week. I am suppose to be seeing an endocrinologist the referal is being made today, buy typical wait time is usually a couple of months. The dr who made the FNA is an ENT dr.

I look forward to your advice and help. Sincerely, Bk.

[lisabinil]

A hypoechoic lesion is most likely a cyst. It sounds like they drained this during your FNA.

[Butterflyk]

Hi, thanks, the only thing that read different of course is the conclusion part where they called it a nodule. Sure sounds a little confusing when they first called it a lesion and then concluded it was a nodule. They must be obviously the same thing right? Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

Sounds like you have all your bases covered for your upcoming appointment! At that appointment, you'll get more info, and most likely be treated for your low FT's. Let us know how it goes! I feel you are correct to just wait for the results and see the doc in Toronto...Dr. D will be a wealth of information and treatment to you. You're clearly hypothyroid..most likely autoimmune. Fluid filled cysts (some lab techs call them lesions) are pretty common, but it's always good to be safe, not sorry with FNA/FNB.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, thanks so much, will definitely get back with the results. Trying not to worry and keep things in perspective to get the best treatment and as quickly as possible - again, all with so much thanks to you and all the others posting to this amazing site. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

You know, we've actually come a long way in the last two years with doctors who treat the thyroid (not just do TSH and send scores of women away telling them they are 'normal' but not having any other answers as to why they feel so crappy). That applies to Canada, too....two years ago there was only ONE doctor on the patient recommended Canadian list...now there are several. It was frustrating for the patient, and equally frustrating for advocates who wanted to recommend a good thyroid doctor, yet had either no one to recommend, or the patient had to be wealthy in order to travel (and who wants to travel when you don't feel well?!).

You will be one of the proactive patients..you're not going to be satisfied just to be told "Just take that thyroid out and you'll be good as new" or 'TSH is normal, now go away'. And you can bet that you'll be passing along good info and recommended doctors to the next generation and beyond too. We need to make getting good, correct treatment and thyroid care as essential as that yearly PAP and mammogram...not a 'hide and whisper names of doctors who will help' thing.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hello Pam, you are so right about finding the good dr's, meaning the ones that actually listen and will do something to really help you. In the past 12 years since my symptoms first hit hard (have come to realize that I actually was having a few thyroid attacks at 11 years old and again at 17 - then only very mild attacks that I dismissed of course after that until I was 35). I still don't have my test results back from the biopsy yet and this Thursday it will be two weeks. I have called the dr's office twice now during this time and so now I will wait until Thursday before trying again (although the receptionist/nurse has been very nice when I have called). I did some more reading/research and found that moving tissue around a nodule is not necessarily a good thing - can you explain this more? Also since they did the biospy/drain thing, I have been feeling rather poorly again - my entire body is achy and my abdominal very crampy. Is this something most people tend to feel afterwards as well? I hope it doesn't sound silly to say, but honestly I am so afraid of going through any more of these attacks - even the thought is almost unbearable. You know I have been to 4 hospital emergency departments countless times over the past 12 years, and then saw at least another 32 different dr's after that not even including those emerge dr's and after 12 years it was a pharmacist who suggested that I had a thyroid problem. I then researched a lab and found ZRT in the US where I could do the thyroid tests and bingo - there it was. Of course I spent alot of money and time and all these years suffering terribly before I even got to this point. I so understand others. Funny and not ha ha - is the fact that so many prominent diseases can and have been linked to the thyroid - so why is this not being thoroughly investigated from the get go? Anyway at this point, I am telling anyone who will listen what I have found (mentioning your great site too) and letting them know that maybe what is really ailing them is a thyroid problem - because honestly I wouldn't wish this on anyone. Have a great day. Will be back with the results. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

BK, I really can't tell ya about the tissue around nodule thing...I don't get into the 'surgical/path' side of thyroid..I'm just too busy trying to hook prospective patients up with doctors who can help them. Sorry.

I hope the biopsy turns out ok...and you can go on to see a doctor who will help you.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, totally understand and definitely efforts much better in directing patients to the best dr's.

What I am going to say next, may surprise or not surprise some people, but I was totally surprised. I contacted the specialist who ordered the thyroid biopsy today (2 weeks wait since the procedure). The nurse/receptionist told me that my results were in just today, and that I needed to book an appointment for the results. No problem - or so I thought. She comes back on the line and tells me Oct. 14th - I said surely you must have something sooner - she says no - long story short, I was refused a copy of my results and told that the dr has no available appointments this week and is gone on holidays all of next week and that he will not release the results to me no matter what they are and that I have to come in and he will discuss them with me. I insisted that these were biopsy results and was again told by the nurse that it didn't matter that I would have to wait. By the time I got off the phone I was feeling alot of emotions, mostly confusion - considering I had already waited two weeks for the results to come in and now I was to wait another two weeks to find out the results.

I contacted my family dr's office to see if they could get the results and tell me what they said. I was told that they could get the results but that my family dr was also on holidays and only she could authorize the release of the results to me.

After the second phone call, I started to get mad. So (and I wouldn't advise anyone else to do this), I took matters into my own hands yet again and contacted the hospital where the biospy was done and requested all hormone and thyroid test results including of course the biospy. I was told that I couldn't have the results that I needed to see the dr who ordered the procedure. Quickly thinking, I then said that I already knew the results but needed a copy because the dr who ordered them was away on holidays and I was seeing a specialist in the US about them. Well that got me immediate results and tomorrow the results will be ready for me to pick up right from the hospital.

Perhaps its wrong of me to do it this way, but honestly, I refuse to wait another couple of weeks, when in this same time frame I could be seeing the thyroid dr and getting more information and even proper treatment started.

Well sorry to go on so about this, I was just so ticked by all the refusals for this information. Our laws state that a patient has the right to his/her medical records and yet when you attempt to get them, more often than not you are refused. My question is "what's the big secret?". If its comprehension or interpretation of the test results, well that's why they publish medical dictionaries.

Anyway, tomorrow I will be able to see for myself. The sad reality is being told no matter whether the results are good or bad, that I would still have to wait and get the results from the dr who ordered it.

As NonstickPam says "the thyroid is nothing to mess with.....", well I totally agree and I refuse to wait until its convenient for the dr to tell me what's going on with my body - not to mention suffering needlessly longer than I already have. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

Well, that's ONE way to get the results. (I'm kinda thinking it's not something really awful if they'd wait all this time?...). Now, see, I woulda done the same thing...called both docs..but I'da been "Is it CANCER??? Should I be calling the ONCOLOGIST?? OMG..I just KNOW it's CANCER..isn't it??? You just don't CARE if I sleep or eat or have a nervous breakdown DO YA???" Heh heh. At least they prolly woulda said "Oh, no, it's NOT cancer, but the doctor wants to see you anyway". ???

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hello again,well I received the results in hand today - with an additional thyroid test result that I was never even told about the results from a throat x-ray about a month and a half earlier after having gone to the emerge.

Results from Hospital Ultrasound concluded - "there is a heterogeneous predominately hypoechoic nodule in the mid and lower motion left thyroid gland."

According to the hospital ultrasound just prior to the biopsy, they found a second nodule?

The cytology results were: "scanty aspirate. Only rare hemosiderin-laden macrophages present with scant cells on the cell block. Not specifically diagnositc."

Now the neck x-ray I had done earlier on and wasn't told these results stated: "There is calcification of the thyroid and laryngeal cartilage."

I agree with what you had said Pam about asking whether it was cancer or not when I contacted both dr's offices, but the specialist office still refused me any information - they were completely unwilling to say anything. I haven't heard yet from my reg. dr's office - but I did express my concerns with knowing if I had something to worry about or not.

From what I understand from the above, the FNA did not provide sufficient results and calcification is not a good thing?

I honestly am not sure what to make of these results or what I should be doing next. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I know I should still see the dr in Toronto, but should I be more insistent with getting in sooner? Help please.

Thanks. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

I had extensive calcification (and still do in many body organs...I had a tumor on my parathyroids..they control calcium....and before it was taken off...I calcified all over...and have Paget's) of my thyroid...and...it doesn't work...cuz of Hashimoto's.

Many have several nodules and yours is pretty common in thyroiditis/Hashimoto's. This might help explain a little better:

Sonographic Appearance of Focal Thyroiditis -- Langer et al. 176 (3): 751 -- American Journal of Roentgenology

I don't think you 'can be insistent' about getting into that Toronto sooner...kwim? I'm hearing that office is getting huge number of calls for appointments. I think you have Hashimoto's and it needs treated. Some nodules have been known to shrink with T3 therapy (Armour, adding Cytomel to T4, etc.) but I haven't seen them shrink if given ONLY T4 (I imagine I'll be hearing from the one person with the one thyroid nodule that actually shrank with T4 ..lol).

WHEN is the appointment?

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, thanks so much for getting back to me so soon. I also believe that its Hashi's that I am dealing with and that getting treatment asap would be in my best interest. I contacted the dr in Toronto this morning, their office is closed until Monday. They told me to call back once I had the biopsy results and that they would get me an appointment then. So looks like I am waiting over the weekend. My regular dr's office called this morning and told me that the test results were not cancer finding and that I had nothing to worry about. Why don't I entirely believe that? Especially considering all my symptoms and the obvious results I do have - there is definitely something going on with my thyroid. Well I also telephoned another ND in my city who is suppose to be quite good as well (just found out about him through my pharmacist) - never hurts to get a couple of other opinions on diagnosis and treatment. I have left "insistent" and somewhat pleading messages at both dr's offices - both apparently don't work on Fridays.

Thanks so much for that link too - the explanation really helped alot.

Will keep you posted on the progress. So tired of feeling tired & drained, so tired of feeling major abdo cramping/pain, terrible nausea etc. and of course the boughts with shortness of breath (the calcification helped explain that at least if I understood correctly that it can constrict the blood vessels in the chest). How can such a small gland - a butterfly shaped one at that cause so much havoc in a person's body?

So sorry to hear about Paget's disease - that is quite rare and on top of all your thyroid issues as well. How do you combat the calciification? Is there anything you can pass along in the way of dietary habits etc. Our bodies are certainly not responding well to our environments anymore and I pray alot that my children and their children will have a better world without diseases.

All my best to you Pam, you are truly an earth angel in my eyes. Bk.

[Butterflyk]

Hi again, sorry to be such a bother, but my reg dr's office called back again (the nurse/receptionist is a total blessing in all sense of the word). She told me that they only found one nodule that is located in the mid to lower level of the left side of my thyroid. So apparently within two weeks of both ultrasounds it grew from what I wrote above earlier to 2.2 x 0.9 x 1.1 cm. (1.0 x 0.2 x. 08 cm - orginal finding). Pam, do they remove nodules that are growing? Do they remove cysts? Is that a consideration with treatment? Bk.

[loveslife]

Hi Pam. I am new to this group and have spent the last 5 hours reading the forums. What a wealth of information you are. I am so glad I found this site. I was diagnosed with a thyroid nodule in early 2007. Had two ultrasounds and was told it was actually a goiter and my endo was not concerned. I told him I thought I was borderline hypothyroid, but he said no. Last few years I have gained weight even though I am on a very healthy organic whole food diet, get cold easily, very dry skin, and low body temp (97.4). So, six months ago I saw a doctor who specializes in thyroid issues and uses a natural approach. When he first saw me he immediately said I had a thyroid problem and I never even mentioned that when I made the appointment. He doesn't believe in blood tests for thyroid, he goes by symptoms. He put me on 65 mg. of Naturethroid. A week or so later I had blood tests.
TSH 0.95 Range 0.35-5.50 (Prior TSH was 3.1)
Free T3 3.32 Range 2.30-4.20
Free T4 1.11 Range 0.89-1.76
T3 Total 1.48 Range 0.60-1.81
T4 Total 6.5 Range 4.5-10.9
Thyroxine Binding Glob 21 Range 11-27
TIBC 319 Range 260-430
Iron 102 Range 40-170
Transferrin 256 Range 200-380

(My endo received a copy of the tests, sent me a note that said these results were excellent.) I did not take Naturethroid before the test. The new doctor put me on 25 mcg of Cytomel in addition to the Naturethroid, because I told him I still cannot lose weight, skin still dry, and body temp is even lower (96.4). But, I have severe PVC's and skin rash while taking Cytomel. I cut the dose in half and still have the PVC's. Doc said to keep taking it, but I had to stop the Cytomel today. I see the natural doctor next week...but am so confused. I actually felt much better before taking the meds. What do you think?

[nonstickpam107]

Originally Posted by Butterflyk

Hi again, sorry to be such a bother, but my reg dr's office called back again (the nurse/receptionist is a total blessing in all sense of the word). She told me that they only found one nodule that is located in the mid to lower level of the left side of my thyroid. So apparently within two weeks of both ultrasounds it grew from what I wrote above earlier to 2.2 x 0.9 x 1.1 cm. (1.0 x 0.2 x. 08 cm - orginal finding). Pam, do they remove nodules that are growing? Do they remove cysts? Is that a consideration with treatment? Bk.

Removing a nodule off of a calcified thyroid would be like putting lipstick on a pig. . No, but some docs are very FAST to remove a thyroid..instead of trying other methods FIRST of shrinking the nodule (cuz if it's thyroidiits, most usually Hashimoto's, just the antibody attacks themselves will shrink that thyroid to 'nothing at all'.

Your symptoms are...just that..the 'usual' symptoms of having thyroid disease. And it's untreated, so you're not getting any relief. I've met individuals with over 50 nodules before. Multinodular goiters aren't rare at all.

So.don't expect a doctor to 'be quick and efficient' about getting back to a patient who has..um..something 'common'. (Hate to say it, but..especially where you live...even getting Cytomel added to T4 is 'new' to most docs/patients in Canada...and the USA isn't very advanced either..just a matter of a couple of years).

Paget's is not rare...and almost ALWAYS is there when a patient has hyperparathyroidism young. I don't 'battle calcification'...it's just there...they found a golf ball sized calcification on my uterus when they did my hysterectomy..not much I can do about it. Except work out, eat clean, and take my vitamins/supplements.

Doctors (and many patients...I've had women tell me "OH, it can't be THAT bad...just take your little bitty T4 only med and shut up..it must be something ELSE!!!..cuz thyroid just means you get fat") don't realize a lot of times that unbalanced hormones and thyroid disease can really ruin our everyday lives with symptoms.

Hang in there, and don't expect to feel 'all better' right away either. I'd say..about a year and a half into getting Armour Thyroid and moving up in dosage (you have to go very slow moving up...with thyroid, and work at balancing other hormones too..it's a slow process..the body only tolerates a little thyroid hormone at a time) I started to feel 'human' again.

I know it's scary...and that were in disbelief when we feel SO horrible...and yet there's a doctor telling us "Lots of women have this..come back when you've gained 100 lbs. and your TSH is over 10 blah blah blah" cuz there ARE doctors who DO tell you that! You know by now you do NOT have cancer...and calcification caused by Hashimoto's and nodules do happen frequently..some docs remove the thyroid (and then proceed to give you only enough T4 only to get you out of bed, but not functioning) if it is impinging on airway.

Air hunger is a COMMON symptom of under/untreated Hashimoto's. About four out of every ten women complain of it before they are treated sufficiently. HTH So is anxiety, depression...etc. And all of it is WORSE if your sex hormones aren't addressed/balanced too.

Pam

[nonstickpam107]

Originally Posted by loveslife

Hi Pam. I am new to this group and have spent the last 5 hours reading the forums. What a wealth of information you are. I am so glad I found this site. I was diagnosed with a thyroid nodule in early 2007. Had two ultrasounds and was told it was actually a goiter and my endo was not concerned. I told him I thought I was borderline hypothyroid, but he said no. Last few years I have gained weight even though I am on a very healthy organic whole food diet, get cold easily, very dry skin, and low body temp (97.4). So, six months ago I saw a doctor who specializes in thyroid issues and uses a natural approach. When he first saw me he immediately said I had a thyroid problem and I never even mentioned that when I made the appointment. He doesn't believe in blood tests for thyroid, he goes by symptoms. He put me on 65 mg. of Naturethroid. A week or so later I had blood tests.
TSH 0.95 Range 0.35-5.50 (Prior TSH was 3.1)
Free T3 3.32 Range 2.30-4.20
Free T4 1.11 Range 0.89-1.76
T3 Total 1.48 Range 0.60-1.81
T4 Total 6.5 Range 4.5-10.9
Thyroxine Binding Glob 21 Range 11-27
TIBC 319 Range 260-430
Iron 102 Range 40-170
Transferrin 256 Range 200-380

(My endo received a copy of the tests, sent me a note that said these results were excellent.) I did not take Naturethroid before the test. The new doctor put me on 25 mcg of Cytomel in addition to the Naturethroid, because I told him I still cannot lose weight, skin still dry, and body temp is even lower (96.4). But, I have severe PVC's and skin rash while taking Cytomel. I cut the dose in half and still have the PVC's. Doc said to keep taking it, but I had to stop the Cytomel today. I see the natural doctor next week...but am so confused. I actually felt much better before taking the meds. What do you think?

That battery of tests should have been done about six WEEKS after starting one grain of Naturethroid. Then again in about three months..you are moving much too fast..that's why you feel like crud in a basket.

If it were ME I'd want to see results on JUST the one grain of Naturethroid...about four to five hours after taking HALF of it..(and split it, half in am, half early afternoon). Depending on those results, I'd prolly want another half grain added (to the am dose, still split the one grain) and then re test in about six to eight weeks, go from there. HTH

Pam

[loveslife]

Thanks Pam for the super quick reply. I do take half of the Naturethroid in the AM and the other half before bed. I see you mentioned early afternoon. I will start taking it then instead of bedtime. I started feeling really worse after the addition of Cytomel. The PVC's have me worried. I guess I just have to start at square one again. Something just doesn't feel right.

[nonstickpam107]

Yeah, too much T3 too fast, that's what's not right. You need to realize that T3 only has a half life of 4 hours (so you're taking it in the am..the half...and that amount of T3 is carrying you for four hours...then...um..you're waiting ALL that time to take the 2nd half and it's prolly interfering with sleep...it would be like sucking down a few cups of coffee before bed KWIM?).

This way, the second split taken around 2pm or so...will be giving you energy (but not TOO much) up till bedtime. Try it, might work better for you. 25mg of Cytomel would about rattle me out of my skin!! WAYYYYY too much.

Do you know that MOST folks on Cytomel take 10mg. am, 5 early afternoon, and 5 again late afternoon..now SEE how much you were trying to add?? Oh my! And some doctors, who aren't used to giving Cytomel go to the PDR to get dose..and they see that there is only 25mg. dosage..but that's not true...doc's who Rx. it routinely KNOW you can get it in 5mg. dosage.

Just think, your one grain Naturethroid contains 37mcg. T4 and 9 mg. T3...and you're SPLITTING it...so putting 25mg. of T3 synthetic added to it? Wonder you're not so hyper you have to start ALL OVER AGAIN from scratch. Terrible!!

And then..the fact you thought that one grain of Naturethroid was going to work in less than a few MONTHS?? Not. Took me a whole year to go from 1/2 grain up to 1.25 grains. Don't think it will 'make you' lose weight either...until you are completely healed (depending on how long you had hypothyroidism, that might be a year or longer). It's not a weight loss aid.

We hypothyroid folks lose weight if we eat clean and get regular exercise. The thyroid hormone just 'evens the playing field' and brings us up to normal.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, again many thanks. While all of this is so hard to deal with, you are truly inspirational with your words. I think it goes for most people that when you know what your dealing with, you can manage, its the unknown that sets our mind racing. I love the way you described the shortness of breath - "air hunger", how perfect a description. You know how many times I have had this and sometimes so severe that I was taken to hospital only to be looked at like I was an idiot and told to "calm myself down" - like I could control this? I know I am not alone in what I am experiencing, it just seems so wrong that so many of us are forced to endure these things and the many blind-sided dr's that prefer to dismiss rather than to treat. I thought about what you wrote on the hormone balancing and sourced a dr through the compounding pharmacy (thought it was a good place to start to find any dr that believes in hormone balancing and especially to find one) I found one that is only 20 minutes away and apparently is a big fan of Dr. Lee's hormone methods. I am going to call the office on Monday and get some more information. I already know my progesterone has been essentially non-existent for the past 6 years and now my estrogen has recently slipped below that so-called normal range too. I recall reading somewhere that if you treat the thryoid, your should also support the other hormones too. Is there truth in that? I mean it seems to make sense to keep all the glands working at their optimal levels. On the Pagets, I can't believe they took out such a large clump. You have certainly experienced so much, I sincerely hope that you are doing well. I know the importance of eating well, have always tried to, doing the organic thing - more veggies & fruit, my body just seems to feel better. I also make a green soup that is suppose to be a good liver cleanser - I know for several years all my liver tests kept coming back high with of course no explanation, so I did some research and started eating this green soup and while it took two years, all my liver tests are now back to normal (or what is considered normal). Will definitely post anything that I can find on some good dr's and treatments from this side of the border. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

I would NOT want a 'separate' doctor for my thyroid and BHRT. Get the thyroid looked at FIRST...keep that appt. in Toronto..that doc may well do both.

I'm not a big fan of Dr. Lee's methods. I ran into a couple of doctors that WERE and ended up being given soy and EPO and further bound my thyroid up....I found a doc that does thyroid AND BHRT...and he did thyroid FIRST. Anyone can get Wild Yam cream (Dr. Lee's recommendation) OTC...and Lee calls it 'estrogen dominance'...progesterone goes away FIRST...then estrogen...all the hormones need balanced.

But for you...start with the thyroid FIRST...wait on the doc in Toronto and see him, he might make all the difference in the world for you.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, will definitely take your advice and move forward with the dr in Toronto. What you said makes a lot of sense. Take care of the thyroid FIRST. I weighed myself this morning for the first time in a few weeks - with the weight gain and not being able to lose it I just couldn't bare to step back onto a scale. To my surprise I have lost 3 lbs in the past few weeks (and nothing intake wise has changed). I have been sensing that shift again from hypo to hyper (again not exactly a pleasant experience), also my husband pointed out that my hair has grown alot too, skin clearing etc. So now is definitely the time frame to get my thyroid treated. Thanks again Pam -will keep you posted. Bk.

[Butterflyk]

Hi Pam, just a quick question, I was reading an older post about adrenal tests, what specifically should be tested here? I did do a 4 pt cortisol test that should within the norm at each test point, but there was a sharp decline in-between each point - the test came back stating that my T3 should be checked. Thought I should also know about the adrenal tests too. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

Adrenals should be higher in am than pm...and as long as you've been tested...that's good. Yes..that decline in between times (mid day) IS an indication that it's thyroid...not necessarily all adrenal. Good call. Most folks with untreated thyroid disease will run adrenals down too...it's when adrenals are VERY low in am, barely there, and WAY high at night that you want to address adrenals FIRST, then thyroid.

Pam

[Butterflyk]

Thanks again Pam. I am very fortunate that I have a pharmacist who is very knowledgeable. My adrenal test on two separate ocassions showed my adrenal levels high in the morning and then lowering towards night, but all within that "norm" range. It was only the drop in between that they noted as being thyroid connected. I also read that book (hope its ok to mention on site) Adrenal Fatigue - and so I have been incorporating support that way into my diet - always trying to find natural support to help the body. Have a great one, will be get back with progress. Bk.

[Butterflyk]

Hello again, was so hoping to say that I had found a dr close to home, tried the one that is within my city this morning (who got great reviews and who is suppose to be on top of things like Dr. D in Toronto) - sadly this didn't pan out. While the dr. in my city was nice, he was highly suggestive that I needed to have a sleep apnea test done because I'm tired all the time and experiencing that "air hunger" etc., and that I should be taking 1,000 mg of Vitamin D every day. Other than those two things - (after reviewing all my test results), he wasn't offering me anything. Infact he was leaning totally away from my thyroid being even related to my symptoms. Still waiting to see Dr. D. Bk.

[nonstickpam107]

I'm not a bit surprised though (sadly to say) that the doctor did that. Very few doctors in the USA are great thyroid docs, and even fewer in your country. Here's hoping AND praying that Dr. D sets you on the right path.

Pam