How did we get in this situation anyway?

[Pami]

I'm sitting here, it's after 9PM and I've just finished forcing myself to eat a bowl
of fried apples with brown sugar flavor Ideal, cinnamon and raisins, because up
until I ate the apples, my calories for today were at only 697. AND the past two
days have been DDs (not intentionally- yesterday was supposed to be MD, but
I didn't really know what I was doing, and I guess I did it wrong). I've seen others
talking about not getting enough calories, or not having an appetite, or whatever,
so if it's THAT hard to eat enough to LOSE weight, how did we manage to GAIN
enough to put us here in the first place??

JUDDD calculator recommendation for me: 1670/334
Thursday- 0 calories
Friday- 624 calories
Saturday- 1042 calories

I know it's important to not go too low, but I'm not sure how to figure out what
is too low? Am I OK for today? I can hardly wait for this to all come together
for me, and I can figure out things for myself. Until then, I'm very thankful for
all of you.

[SoHappy]

First of all, do you have any idea of why you are having a hard time consuming enough food to remotely reach your calorie numbers day after day after day? Do you feel you are having any emotional issues that are making you avoid eating? Physical illness or pain issues? Illness that is putting you off a normal appetite? Fears or worries?

Because otherwise, it would be nice for you to eat every other day at UD and then DD numbers. And eat about 1650-1700 for UDs and 500 calories for DDs. Or lower on the DDs if you want.

In addition to dieting for weight loss, you are hoping to accomplish a few other things from this plan as well. One of the most important is to heal/improve your metabolism, if at all possible, and that seems to work out for us when we eat up at that UD calorie number and then way low on the DDs that follow. And if you can improve your metabolism by keeping to this Up/Down cycle, that will be one of the best gifts you can give to yourself forevermore.

What do you think is making this problem happen for you?

[sophiethecat]

Originally Posted by Pami

I'm sitting here, it's after 9PM and I've just finished forcing myself to eat a bowl
of fried apples with brown sugar flavor Ideal, cinnamon and raisins, because up
until I ate the apples, my calories for today were at only 697. AND the past two
days have been DDs (not intentionally- yesterday was supposed to be MD, but
I didn't really know what I was doing, and I guess I did it wrong). I've seen others
talking about not getting enough calories, or not having an appetite, or whatever,
so if it's THAT hard to eat enough to LOSE weight, how did we manage to GAIN
enough to put us here in the first place??

JUDDD calculator recommendation for me: 1670/334
Thursday- 0 calories
Friday- 624 calories
Saturday- 1042 calories

I know it's important to not go too low, but I'm not sure how to figure out what
is too low? Am I OK for today? I can hardly wait for this to all come together
for me, and I can figure out things for myself. Until then, I'm very thankful for
all of you.

Is this due to appetite suppression?

Because we all deal with this at times on our UDs, and some of us wonder how we'll get the calories in sometimes.

There are plenty of ways to get in high calories if this is what's causing your low calorie days. Let us know and we can make suggestions.

[sophiethecat]

I think some of it is appetite suppression, and some of it is our minds and bodies calming down a bit when it realizes nothing is off limits forever. Because there is that old human nature of wanting something more when we can't have it, and when we can have it every other day it starts to become more "common" and we aren't so frantic about must.have.now.

[WWC]

Pami, what time do you eat breakfast on your UD? I find when I first wake up, I'm not all that hungry, but if I sit and eat my breakfast by 8:30 it kind of gets me going. I definitely feel less hungry than a couple of weeks ago, but not adverse to food. KWIM? Also, pick nutritionally and calories dense foods if you have trouble eating a lot. Full fat yogurt or cottage cheese--even a glass of milk. Plan out your up days so you at least have a rough idea of what you are eating. Then don't let too many hours pass without something in your stomach. I try to be done eating for the day by 7-7:30 os I can get a full 36 hour DD. Finally, I wouldn't go to 0 on your DD when you are struggling to get calories in. Concentrate on protein--if you can't do food than sip on a protein shake.

[Pami]

I basically don't have much appetite, and I really don't like journaling my food, so
I think I just would rather NOT eat than eat something and have to go write it
down. I made a mistake last week, and got off schedule, so had to try to fix that
this week (I need next Friday to be an UD), so I tried to do a DD Thursday, a MD
yesterday and UD today. I really like the 0-calorie DDs, so that's how I ended up
with 0 calories for Thursday. My MD (first one, had no clue what I was supposed
to eat) turned into a 30% day. Then today I was so busy (management, algebra-
had tests in both classes) I really didn't think about eating after breakfast, went
to church at 5, got home around 7:30 and that was the next time I thought about
eating something. Here's an idea- we used to enjoy a cigarette after meals, but
we quit smoking 2 weeks ago. Now that after-dinner ritual is gone, so what's the
point of dinner? I dunno- maybe that's not it... just trying to figure things out...
Oh, and breakfast is within 2 hours of waking if I don't have school, or within one
hour if it's a school day.

[SoHappy]

You are living inside a whirlwind for sure!

Are you the kind of person who can eat just a couple of different menus for breakfast and a couple of different menus for lunch and be perfectly content doing so?

If so, you can figure out a breakfast that will be the exact same thing every time you fix it, figure out the calories for it as you plan it, and never have to figure it again. And the same for lunch. Same few things, every UD.

On DDs, fasting is great. On UD, fasting will bring down your rate of metabolism, sometimes so fast it will make your head spin.

So if you can always have a couple of breakfast choices available, and two or three lunch choices available to make fast and not have to figure, that just leaves supper, and even if you don't like to journal your food and would rather not eat than have to go write it down, maybe you can just get away with not having to account for evening calories if you already know you've held to your previously accounted morning and noon meals.

'Cause it's harder to do a diet plan that is built on calorie awareness and a strong up/down cycling of calories, when you don't want to bother with the calories part of it. LOL

Just offering these suggestions in case they may be of help. Not pushing.. just offering.

[sophiethecat]

Originally Posted by Pami

I'm sitting here, it's after 9PM and I've just finished forcing myself to eat a bowl
of fried apples with brown sugar flavor Ideal, cinnamon and raisins, because up
until I ate the apples, my calories for today were at only 697. AND the past two
days have been DDs (not intentionally- yesterday was supposed to be MD, but
I didn't really know what I was doing, and I guess I did it wrong). I've seen others
talking about not getting enough calories, or not having an appetite, or whatever,
so if it's THAT hard to eat enough to LOSE weight, how did we manage to GAIN
enough to put us here in the first place??

JUDDD calculator recommendation for me: 1670/334
Thursday- 0 calories
Friday- 624 calories
Saturday- 1042 calories

I know it's important to not go too low, but I'm not sure how to figure out what
is too low? Am I OK for today? I can hardly wait for this to all come together
for me, and I can figure out things for myself. Until then, I'm very thankful for
all of you.

You said your calories are 1670 on UD, so that's what you are aiming for on UDs. If you had 1042 today, then you are roughly 600 calories short. So you would need to eat as close to that amount as you can to be on target.

If you don't do this day after day, you risk short-changing yourself of the benefits of JUDDD. Because this will start to be just any old low calorie diet, and your body will start to adjust to low calories. You have to get some high calorie days in there to shake things up and make JUDDD work.

[sophiethecat]

Originally Posted by Pami

I basically don't have much appetite, and I really don't like journaling my food, so
I think I just would rather NOT eat than eat something and have to go write it
down. I made a mistake last week, and got off schedule, so had to try to fix that
this week (I need next Friday to be an UD), so I tried to do a DD Thursday, a MD
yesterday and UD today. I really like the 0-calorie DDs, so that's how I ended up
with 0 calories for Thursday. My MD (first one, had no clue what I was supposed
to eat) turned into a 30% day. Then today I was so busy (management, algebra-
had tests in both classes) I really didn't think about eating after breakfast, went
to church at 5, got home around 7:30 and that was the next time I thought about
eating something. Here's an idea- we used to enjoy a cigarette after meals, but
we quit smoking 2 weeks ago. Now that after-dinner ritual is gone, so what's the
point of dinner? I dunno- maybe that's not it... just trying to figure things out...
Oh, and breakfast is within 2 hours of waking if I don't have school, or within one
hour if it's a school day.

If you feel you are off schedule, and you had roughtly 1000 calories today, call it a MD and have a real UD tomorrow. Just a suggestion, but do what you feel is best.

But you do need to eat to fuel yourself or you could experience your metabolism slowing down. Even if you don't reach your exact UD calorie limit, try to get there or as close as you can. JUDDD needs you to eat well on UDs and maintain a nice DD in order for it to work optimally. Do this for yourself, even if you feel busy. Nourish yourself.

I understand some days the appetite isn't always there, but try not to do this day after day. Eat well.

[gotsomeold]

Oh Pami, I join you in really enjoying DDs and having trouble on UDs. But too many low-cal days really do slow down the metabolism, which stalls both weight loss and all the good, healing things JUDDD magic does for our bodies.

I have to remind myself that I am on a 'diet' on UD. So I add butter, cream, or cheese to everything (and occasionally find myself shrieking, 'What do you mean that only added 200 calories?? I need 600!!!!).

I have to plan my UDs in advance. To the point of writing on my to-do list, I have to have eaten x-y-z by 02:00 PM, and a-b-c by 07:00 PM.

Rituals do help. Short of starting to smoke again, can you find a new way to complete a meal? A glass of wine? A chocolate? - not enough calories to make a difference, just something to make the meal an important time in your day.

[itsmeshelly01]

Pami i feel for you but sometimes i wish i had that problem...lol
You really need to try to get in those UD numbers though or as close as possible. You dont want to go into starvation mode or this just be another restricted diet. I agree that your metabolism will end up being hurt by this and you will stall or even start gaining. I totally agree that maybe you need to plan out your day before hand. I usually what im going to eat on my UDs and DDs a week in advance. I plan on the weekend so I know what i need to get at the store and what i need to make over the weekend, if anything. Like this week im planning on tuna salad with mayo and boiled eggs on whole grain bread for lunches on UD's. Use full fat mayo and evoo, add some nuts!!! Nuts have tons of calories for just 1 serving. Maybe in the evening have a serving on almonds with some good full fat cheese. If you can try to get into the habit of maybe planning things out on the weekend you wotn have to worry so much about it during the week since i knwo you dont like counting all the time. Im obsessive about counting and it doesnt bother me but i still plan out everything.

[SoHappy]

Originally Posted by gotsomeold

..........I have to plan my UDs in advance. To the point of writing on my to-do list, I have to have eaten x-y-z by 02:00 PM, and a-b-c by 07:00 PM..........

..........can you find a new way to complete a meal? A glass of wine? A chocolate? - not enough calories to make a difference, just something to make the meal an important time in your day..........

Two very good ideas and suggestions, Nancy! I'm bumping this up on the page so that any others who might be needing this get a chance to read it before it gets pushed too far down the page.

[Pami]

I just added up all my calories for the first 28 days of January- and divided by 28,
I came up with a daily average of 893.64. Now, if I had ALL true fasting DDs, that
would have made my UDs worth about 1787 cals. each. It doesn't sound so bad if
you look at it that way.

I'm working on my food plan for this week. I do so much better when my UDs fall
on school days (Monday and Wednesday), because I have two breaks and I usually
bring something in my back pack to eat between classes. Dollar Tree granola bars
and cereal bars are 100 cals. each, and boxes of 6 are only $1. I was craving a
Reuben last week, so may plan that for supper tomorrow or Wednesday.

[Kissa]

Sounds like a great plan. And, like you say, in spite of everything it doesn't look as bad as you thought.

[SoHappy]

Originally Posted by Pami

I just added up all my calories for the first 28 days of January- and divided by 28,
I came up with a daily average of 893.64. Now, if I had ALL true fasting DDs, that
would have made my UDs worth about 1787 cals. each. It doesn't sound so bad if
you look at it that way.

I'm working on my food plan for this week. I do so much better when my UDs fall
on school days (Monday and Wednesday), because I have two breaks and I usually
bring something in my back pack to eat between classes. Dollar Tree granola bars
and cereal bars are 100 cals. each, and boxes of 6 are only $1. I was craving a
Reuben last week, so may plan that for supper tomorrow or Wednesday.

You've got me inspired to expand my menu planning to an entire week now too!

Just this morning DH said he wants me to help him lose a few pounds, so if he's serious, this will take some planning on my part. Now I'm going to plan more of it out like you are doing.

And, Pami.. You have me laughing.. YES.. it still sounds too little! LOL Nice try, Girl!

But working out a plan for the week will probably be a great help. And regardless of all of this.. calories big or small.. the BEST thing you are doing is quitting the smoking, as you well know. I am SO happy for you and proud of what you are doing for yourselves! I started smoking at age 18 after high school graduation, because I was now All Grown Up. I tried over and over and over to quit for many years before I was successful, finally, at age 58.. a decade ago. Hardest thing I've ever done. WAY-Y-Y-Y harder then doing a weight loss diet plan of any kind!!!!!!!!!!

I'm going to be focusing on you for some of my inspiration these days now. I'll work on my plan for the week yet this morning!

Good job taking charge of your life, Pami! Doing whatever it takes. Even the hard stuff. When you're finally over the hump and rolling along smoothly with both the quitting smoking and the eating on plan days, you're going to be reaping such immense rewards.

[gotsomeold]

MMMMMMMMM ... a really good, no-holds-barred, forget the words low-fat and low-cal REUBEN!!! ( I think I am foreseeing my own future )

[Pami]

Originally Posted by SoHappy

So if you can always have a couple of breakfast choices available, and two or three lunch choices available to make fast and not have to figure, that just leaves supper, and even if you don't like to journal your food and would rather not eat than have to go write it down, maybe you can just get away with not having to account for evening calories if you already know you've held to your previously accounted morning and noon meals.

'Cause it's harder to do a diet plan that is built on calorie awareness and a strong up/down cycling of calories, when you don't want to bother with the calories part of it. LOL

I don't mind keeping track of my calories, this isn't going to be so easy to explain
but it's more like I'll eat something when I can eat the whole package, and just
mentally add those calories to my daily total (like I know my yogurt is 60 calories
and I don't have to measure it or anything, it's the whole container), but if I eat
something like pasta sauce, I have to add the beef, the mushrooms, the onion,
the tomatoes, the peppers, etc, then DIVIDE by the serving size to get an estimate
of my caloric intake, THEN I can add it to my day. THAT is when it becomes easier
to just not eat. Granted, once I've done it, it's done, and leftovers don't have to
be calculated again, the amount is ready to be added already. I know exactly what
I'm talking about, but I'm probably the only one who understands what I'm saying.
When you cook by throwing stuff in the pan, instead of using recipes, this becomes
a little tiresome.

I've already figured out my Reuben, it's going to count as 400 cals (it comes to 385
in MFP) and I added it as a "recipe" in MFP so all I have to do it choose it, and I
won't be tempted to skip dinner so I don't have to calculate my calories- lol!
I have a few things like that- dishes with all the components already added in,
so tracking doesn't involve a lot of entries, add this, divide by that, blah, blah, blah

[Kissa]

Great work Pami. I am a bit slap dash with my numbers. But I am in maintenance.....

[MLE]

Originally Posted by Pami

I don't mind keeping track of my calories, this isn't going to be so easy to explain
but it's more like I'll eat something when I can eat the whole package, and just
mentally add those calories to my daily total (like I know my yogurt is 60 calories
and I don't have to measure it or anything, it's the whole container), but if I eat
something like pasta sauce, I have to add the beef, the mushrooms, the onion,
the tomatoes, the peppers, etc, then DIVIDE by the serving size to get an estimate
of my caloric intake, THEN I can add it to my day. THAT is when it becomes easier
to just not eat. Granted, once I've done it, it's done, and leftovers don't have to
be calculated again, the amount is ready to be added already. I know exactly what
I'm talking about, but I'm probably the only one who understands what I'm saying.
When you cook by throwing stuff in the pan, instead of using recipes, this becomes
a little tiresome.

Pami, I can understand where you are coming from. I have a similar problem. Here, in France, it is difficult to find the caloric values of some foods. Sure, the packaged items in a store list the nutritional value, but for items at the local outdoor markets or restaurants, getting that info is practically impossible. So, what I've justified in my mind is using the Livestrong Daily Plate site to find something similar and use those values. In my mind, it is better to have a rough approximation than nothing at all.

So, instead of calculating each ingredient in whatever you are throwing together, maybe you can find something close that is already profiled that you can use as a "representative" of whatever your making. Just a thought...

[Bonnie]

Another useful tab in MyFitnessPal is the Meals option. I tend to eat the same meal combinations so I have quite a few set up. This a huge time saver when inputting my menus. The thing I like about that option is that it lists them all separate (as opposed to just giving one entry for the entire recipe) in the diary. Then it is easy to change amounts or even change an item totally. For example on my Hamburger/Cauliflower meal I can change out the cauliflower for broccoli but all my hamburger condiments are still there.