We need an official Protein Power thread!

[Luvmykidz]

Hi, all---I just realized how much stuff I lifted directly from the book--I had to ask admins. about whether it would be copyright violation

I hope it is okay, but if not and this thread disappears, We can meet elsewhere. From now on, I will be careful of how much info I quote at one time. Being accurate is important, but I don't want to get sued for it!!!!

Rebecca130 If you PM me, I will help you figure out your protein needs. If it eases your mind, the formula is for figuring MINIMUM protein. the charts in the book indicate the absolute minimum for any adult is 60g per day. You can always eat more if you like. The reason you need to figure minimum is for lean body weight preservation--to be sure you lose as little as possible as you lose excess fat.

This is really important for vegetarians, people with small appetites, or those who obsess over eating too much fat (so they cut out protein because most protein foods contain some fat) The rest of us probably eat plenty without even thinking about it. But, if you would like to know for sure, give me a call and I will help you with the formulas.

Iseethelight Yes, my book is the paperback version of the original plan. I am not an expert, but it is the LC plan I am most familiar with. I am happy to help out as much as possible anyone who would like to learn more about the program. And I am NOT promoting it as a quick fix cure all--Just a sensible alternative for people who find Atkins a bit frustrating.

StrawberryYes, it is interesting! Especially if you have interest in how the body processes the food you eat. This book does an excellent job of explaining what happens on a cellular level. It makes great ammunition for someone who is new to the LC lifestyle, because then you can know exactly WHY LC works for so many people. AND you know what you are actually doing to your body when you binge on carb foods. For me, it is great incentive to stay on track!

For me, part of the beauty of this program is that although it discourages eating starches and concentrated sugars (mostly in the beginning when you are learning the plan), it does not absolutely forbid any food. Even a serving of alcohol is allowed per day, if you like it.

This helps me, because I tend to go on emotionally driven binges when I think I have 'failed' at sticking to my plan. I think just about everyone has dealt with the guilt of eating a 'forbidden' food. One slip up can turn into a month of unrestrained eating. When I don't have the constant pressure to eat 'perfectly' all the time, I recover much more quickly from a poor food choice. This is me, of course, and may not be true for everyone.

But PP can be customized pretty easily if you need a stricter plan.

[moonstruck]

I would love a Protein Power thread too. To be quite honest, last week, I was eating some proteins but am still counting Weight Watchers points and want to get out of that mentality. I'm reading the book and really don't know what I can and can't eat. In the South Beach Diet book, for example, it talks about "foods to enjoy" and "foods to avoid." I really believe low carb will be better for me, but I've never been able to stick to it for more than two weeks and have never reaped the benefits. Is plain yogurt okay? What foods can I eat on this plan? I figured I can eat what Atkins allows:

eggs
meats
poultry
all fish and shellfish
all cheeses
it looks like berries are allowed?

As far as figuring out my portions, I have no idea and the calcuations for figuring out protein, looks mathematical.

I think I'll be better off eating low carb, can someone help me?

thanks!

[Luvmykidz]

Stephanie, It looks complicated, but the whole point of figuring this out is simply to estimate your lean body mass. This is what determines your minimum protein needs.

Your height is 5' 10"=70"
You need to get your abdomen (not waist) and hip measures--the book recommends taking 3 measures and averaging the numbers and round to the nearest half inch. For getting my ab measure, I would measure just above, at and just below the belly button. Add the numbers together and divide by 3.
Say, for instance, you get an average of 32.5" for your abs and 40" for your hips.

Height, waist and Ab measures are converted to get what is called the 'constants'.

There is a chart in the book to help you do this. You just look up the measurement and right next to it is the 'constant' that you use to plug into the formula they provide. When I use the chart, the numbers I used convert to Constant A (hips) 40"=47.44 Constant B (abs) 32.5"=22.93 Constant C (height) 70"=42.64
So, assuming the numbers I have above, you would first figure approximate body fat %

47.44 (constant A)
+22.93 (constant B)
70.37 (total)
-42.64 (constant C)
27.73 % (percentage of body fat)

You then use this last number to figure your lean body weight

this formula is total wt. x % body fat = wt of fat in pounds

So we plug in our hypothetical numbers 180 x .2773= 49.8140 pounds of fat

This rounds to 50 whole pounds of fat.

Then subtract 50 from 180 to get 130 pounds of lean body wt.

Then you take this number to page 92 and continue. On p 93 there is an activity guide that you choose your level of activity and the corresponding number. Assuming you are moderately active, the number would be .6, for .6 grams of protein needed to maintain the lean body mass of a moderately active person.

Then you just multiply your LBM number times the acivity category number

130 x .6 = 78 So, a person with these measurements would need at least 78g protein per day to maintain their lean body mass. You would round up to 80. Then, choose your proteins from the 80g per day chart on p155.

[Luvmykidz]

Also, cheese is allowed, but curd cheeses are preferred over hard or soft cheeses when you are just eating cheese as a protein source. The harder cheeses are considered too high in fat to eat alone.

Yes, berries are allowed, even at the beginning. In fact, as a fruit choice, they appear to be prefered because they are typically high in fiber and lower in sugars. I believe strawberries are at the top of the list for being the lowest net carb berry.


The original book does not specifically have yogurt listed as a do or don't food, as far as I can see. BUT it is used as an ingredient in the Breakfast Fruit Smoothie on p231 and in a curried chicken salad on p235. So, I believe it is fine to eat yogurt as long as you count the carbs.

There are charts in the book that list quite a few food options under 5, 10,15, 20 and 25g portions (with actual carb counts listed beside the foods) to make choosing which foods to eat easier.

It takes a bit of getting used to, but I find I have favorite foods that I eat regularly, in the same measures each time, and after a while, can remember how many carbs certain foods contain without checking the book all the time.

[moonstruck]

Originally Posted by Luvmykidz

Stephanie, It looks complicated, but the whole point of figuring this out is simply to estimate your lean body mass. This is what determines your minimum protein needs.

Your height is 5' 10"=70"
You need to get your abdomen (not waist) and hip measures--the book recommends taking 3 measures and averaging the numbers and round to the nearest half inch. For getting my ab measure, I would measure just above, at and just below the belly button. Add the numbers together and divide by 3.
Say, for instance, you get an average of 32.5" for your abs and 40" for your hips.

Height, waist and Ab measures are converted to get what is called the 'constants'.

There is a chart in the book to help you do this. You just look up the measurement and right next to it is the 'constant' that you use to plug into the formula they provide. When I use the chart, the numbers I used convert to Constant A (hips) 40"=47.44 Constant B (abs) 32.5"=22.93 Constant C (height) 70"=42.64
So, assuming the numbers I have above, you would first figure approximate body fat %

47.44 (constant A)
+22.93 (constant B)
70.37 (total)
-42.64 (constant C)
27.73 % (percentage of body fat)

You then use this last number to figure your lean body weight

this formula is total wt. x % body fat = wt of fat in pounds

So we plug in our hypothetical numbers 180 x .2773= 49.8140 pounds of fat

This rounds to 50 whole pounds of fat.

Then subtract 50 from 180 to get 130 pounds of lean body wt.

Then you take this number to page 92 and continue. On p 93 there is an activity guide that you choose your level of activity and the corresponding number. Assuming you are moderately active, the number would be .6, for .6 grams of protein needed to maintain the lean body mass of a moderately active person.

Then you just multiply your LBM number times the acivity category number

130 x .6 = 78 So, a person with these measurements would need at least 78g protein per day to maintain their lean body mass. You would round up to 80. Then, choose your proteins from the 80g per day chart on p155.

Thanks Heather for your help. This sounds like a little too much math for me, but maybe I'm looking at it from a different angle. Is Protein Power full fat? Beginning tomorrow, I'm starting South Beach (again). It has meal plans with portions and I can incorpoate Protein Power's foods with it as well. It just seems very simple to me, but I'll post here too. Are we getting an official Protein Power thread?

[Luvmykidz]

Stephanie. Hehe, I know what you mean about math. I hate it myself. But after the initial formulating, it isn't too bad. I usually get about 100g of protein most days even though my minimum is actually 60g. It is really easy to fulfil the minimum for most people.

Yes, PP is full fat foods. I don't know about an official thread, but I will continue to watch this one unless it gets deleted.

[Luvmykidz]

I just had a thought about estimating body fat for figuring lean body mass so you can determine minimum protein.

If you have one of those scales that give a body fat estimate, you could use that number and bypass all the charts and stuff in the first part.

Say, if your body fat reading is 26.5%, you could figure it this way:

Subtract 26.5 (fat percent) from 100 (total weight percent). This gives you 73.5 (lean weight percent).

Then, simply multiply the (lean wt percent as a decimal) x (total body wt.) If you weigh 150 lb, the formula looks like this:

.735 x 150=109.25

109.35 lbs lean body wt.

Then just multiply that number by activity level to get protein requirements.

[lynnejava]

I would love a protein power thread. I just started the 30 day plan and it seems pretty simple. I prefer this over Atkins because you have more choices.

[moonstruck]

Originally Posted by Luvmykidz

I just had a thought about estimating body fat for figuring lean body mass so you can determine minimum protein.

If you have one of those scales that give a body fat estimate, you could use that number and bypass all the charts and stuff in the first part.

Say, if your body fat reading is 26.5%, you could figure it this way:

Subtract 26.5 (fat percent) from 100 (total weight percent). This gives you 73.5 (lean weight percent).

Then, simply multiply the (lean wt percent as a decimal) x (total body wt.) If you weigh 150 lb, the formula looks like this:

.735 x 150=109.25

109.35 lbs lean body wt.

Then just multiply that number by activity level to get protein requirements.

Thanks Heather. I have a Tanita scale that I believe measures body fat.

[Luvmykidz]

Hey, here is another interesting bit I found while browsing. I noticed a lot of people around the board have questions about ketosis, and although I feel I understand it, I have a hard time explaining. So, using the info in the book (but paraphrasing except where in quotes) I thought I would share.

P 148-150

Ketones are made when fat breaks down. This is a natural function of the human body. And ketones exist even in people who are not low carbing. They are an intermediate stage of fat metabolism, and are not dangerous as some have suggested.

They are actually "used as fuel by most of the body's tissues including the brain. The heart, in fact, prefers ketones to all other fuel. The body must have sufficient carbohydrates to completely burn for energy all the ketones produced. "(My emphasis bold)

Low carb dieting causes fat to be broken down and an overabundance of ketones are produced--because of the absence of carbs, these ketone bodies are not completely burned up. So, the body must eliminate them through the urine, waste, and breath. This overabundance of ketones is what we know as ketosis.

As the ketones are basically partially burned fat, any ketones you release in the above manner means you are eliminating fat without having to actually completely 'burn' it off . I believe this is the "metabolic advantage" that Dr. Atkins speaks of.

Ketosis breath: When you understand the ways ketones are eliminated from the body, it makes sense that there will be weird breath as they escape that way. According to the Eades, this can be reduced if there is plenty of urine output, because most of the ketones will flush out that way.

The Eades maintain that there are different levels of ketosis, and, often, heavy ketosis can interfere with restful sleep. The solution is to increase carbs a bit to lessen the amount of ketones that are being released.

My note- Moderate intake of fat should not be a problem. But if someone eats a diet extremely high in fat, I think it is possible to sabotage yourself. You will still be burning fat for fuel, and be in ketosis, but the fat you are burning may very well be simply dietary fat, rather than fat stores. This energy will already be floating around and readily available for use. If you use sticks to check for ketosis, and they turn dark, but you don't seem to be losing, it might be a good idea to check your fat intake. Although fat does not appear to activate a hormonal response, Protein Power seems to encourage protein as a 'free' food rather than fat. If you have a big appetite, it might be better to eat more lean protein rather than more fat in order to satisfy. Just my thought, based on the above info.

[lynnport]

I've never posted before... I've always lurked in the shadows, but I agree...we need to have a Protein Power thread. How do we do this?

[Luvmykidz]

I'm not sure. I guess, either someone takes the initiative and just starts it...Or would have to contact administration for permission. It looks like there are others who would benefit from it--even though it is apparently not as popular as Atkins. I'll see if I can snag one of the moderators to ask.

[Luvmykidz]

Originally Posted by lynnport

I've never posted before... I've always lurked in the shadows, but I agree...we need to have a Protein Power thread. How do we do this?

[lynnport]

PP is a much more "liveable" approach to low carbing. It would be great to be able to share ideas and recipes. Let me know if I can help at all with starting a thread.

[Luvmykidz]

I just pm'd one of the moderators. She said we could just post an "official" thread in the other plan forum for now, and if enough people are interested, we can eventually have our own forum, like the Atkins one.

So, we can either keep posting here for now, or someone else can start a fresh thread.

I totally agree that PP is a great plan. It would be wonderful if more people were aware of it as an option.

[faithgirl]

How are people doing with this plan? Is the weight loss a lot slower, or about the same as with atkins? I am trying to decide between this one and CAD. I like that CAD allows that reward meal, but I am wondering if it significantly slows the weight loss down. I also like that PP allows more carbs with each meal than atkins does.

[moonstruck]

I would love a Protein Power thread. I'm doing Weight Watchers right now because I made a deal with my husband. Having been thin my entire life, I gained 75 pounds during my pregnancy, losing 31 pounds with WW in about six months four years ago. Since then, I've backslid gaining twelve pounds back and just having a difficult time ever since. I am currently reading the Protein Power book and am eliminating frozen dinners and other processed foods from my menu.

Thankfully, my husband does all the cooking and is extremely supportive. I've been in tears about the whole weight gain (which is my own fault) and just doing it now. I've stuck with WW faithfullly since August 1st and it really isn't hard, but I'd like to use the points with low carb foods. I've never done any kind of low carb plan for longer than two weeks - losing seven pounds in that amount of time two years ago. I've been having eggs for breakfast and feel so much better than when I eat cereal.

Currently, I exercise four days a week for at least thirty minutes, drink a gallon of pure water every day and don't eat after 7pm.

I would love to do Protein Power exclusively, but for now am counting the points. I would love an official thread for us though.

[Luvmykidz]

I am doing well, in my opinion. But I view my weight loss a bit differently than others might.

Interestingly, one of the questions the Eades say they get asked frequently is "How fast can I lose and how quickly will it take me to get to my goal?"

I think the answer can be found in their book on page 123, where they address FAT loss versus WEIGHT loss. A lot of people have a misconception that if the scale number drops, they are doing well---but the drop could just be due to water loss, moving bowels or bladder, or loss of muscle, as well as fat.

They use the example of a woman who is cycling and retaining water. She could have lost 2 pounds of fat, but be retaining 3 pounds of water, and the scale will show a 1 lb increase.

There are a lot of factors that affect the numbers. They actually recommend using a measuring tape, or a pair of jeans or something to track your progress, because you may not see the scale move for a while.

PP loss is probably comparable to Atkins, as far as long term progress is concerned. I have read post after post where people report week or longer stalls on Atkins. I think this can happen on any plan.

I think the question is whether the plan is right for you. If you need to have certain foods cut out completely because of allergies or cravings, you could certainly adapt PP to be a more strict, Atkins-like program, but still include things that Atkins forbids.

Some people do not do well with the freedom, though, and end up eating things that cause problems.

The 30g net carb start point in Phase 1 is for maximum carb load, but you do not have to eat all of them. However, the Eades also believe that dropping your carbs lower than about 7 per meal probably will not give you much of an advantage as far as speeding up loss.

I did read and try CAD once. I liked the idea of keeping carbs low all day by just eating certain legal foods, and then having anything I wanted for one meal. I like that CAD did not seem to focus strongly on counting grams or calories. Eating all the carbs within one hour at one meal a day seemed to make sense. But, for me, having all my carbs clumped together seemed to make me crave. If I had my dinner and a modest size piece of cake for dessert, I always ended up wanting more. I don't understand why that happened, but it did not work for me. Others may have had oustanding success. It just depends on your personality and body's needs, I think.

PP does not encourage daily desserts, but does allow for the occasional treat. Healthy, natural foods should be favored. Day to day food choices are best kept to lower carb veggies and fruits for the most part-especially at first. But I sometimes have a bit of oatmeal, or a bite of real cheesecake, or higher carb fruit. They are allowed, you just cannot eat much of them. It is harder to meet the daily fiber recommendation if you choose higer carb foods, too. You should shoot for about 25g of fiber daily. It is easier to get to this amount eating larger amounts of LC produce.

I hope this is addressing your question adequately. Did I just make your decision harder?

[faithgirl]

Thanks Heather! No, you didn't make it harder. I am sort of thinking I should do PP and maybe doing CAD on certain days (not very frequently). Like when there's a holiday or something. I was also thinking maybe doing CAD and keeping to 30 Grams of carbs for the reward meal. I don't know yet.

[faithgirl]

Heather, do you count the fractional carbs in stuff like eggs, chream cheese and heavy cream at each meal? Or just stuff like fruit, veggies and starches?

[Luvmykidz]

You definitely could combine the two programs. I don't think they would be that hard to blend. Really, you could use the PP program and just follow some of the CAD principles when you need to. I have "saved" carbs on days that I knew I would need to have them available at one meal. It didn't seem to cause a problem as long as I did not eat too much junk and kept the total within the daily limit.

I do not count carbs in eggs or hard aged cheeses (like cheddar), but I do in cream, cream cheese, cottage cheese, etc.. So many dairy things are high in fat it is wise not to overeat them. For things like heavy cream, that have unlisted fractions of carbs, I decided I would count two servings as one carb. That is not in the book, but it is easy for me to remember. The book actually counts carbs to the nearest tenth, anyway, and has several basic lists of carb foods with their net counts.

Also, PP does not advocate eating just cheese or all whole eggs as a protein option because of fat content. For instance, I need 60 minimum g protein per day (20 per meal). I could get this as 3 oz lean-moderate fat meat per meal, or 2 eggs plus 2 whites, or 1 egg plus 2 whites plus 1 oz cheese, or 3/4 cup cottage cheese, or one of several different combinations. There are charts in the book which give the appropriate amounts for a meal. I find it very handy, and once I am familiar with the most common combinations, I don't have to keep running back to the book. It helps to have a copy of the favorites on the fridge for quick reference.

I think even a lacto-ovo vegatarian would do great on this plan, as it allows eggs, modest amounts of cheese and even tofu as protein sources.

[Luvmykidz]

Here is a comparison of foods that contain roughly an equal amount of carbs. It is a visual aid intended to help make wise carb choices.

Each listed item contains about 10g net carbs


2 Starburst chews
1 tablespoon of white sugar
4 saltine crackers
1/4 cup cooked macaroni
1/3 cup mashed potatoes
10 small jelly beans
10 Skittles
1/2 slice bread
1/2 Reeses peanut butter cup
1/3 medium banana
1 medium raw carrot
1/2 cup grapes or pineapple
3/4 cup melon
1 cup mashed cooked pumpkin
1 cup fresh raspberries
4 cups sliced raw mushrooms
5 cups sliced raw zucchini
3 1/2 cups fresh broccoli
14 cups fresh lettuce

[Shantony]

I don't get it. Can someone put it in a "peanut" shell for me? The hooked on phonics version.

Thx

[Luvmykidz]

Originally Posted by Shantony

I don't get it. Can someone put it in a "peanut" shell for me? The hooked on phonics version.

Thx

Shay, this isn't the peanut thread

Okay, the condensed version.
Insulin is secreted by the body as a response to sugar in the blood.

Insulin is the hormone responsible for 'opening' fat cells so they can store fat.

LC (any LC plan) works because it causes the body to stop over producing insulin, and therefore, fat cells remain 'locked'. And the body is forced to use the fat rather than store it.


Protein is important for providing muscle building material while losing, and helps the body produce the hormone glucagon*, which helps balance the effects of insulin. I can help you figure your minimum protein needs if you decide to try the program. More protein than minimum is always okay, but it is best to not get less.

*Glucagon is responsible for opening the fat cells so stored fat can be used for fuel.

PP Phase I

Determine base protein needs for a day. 60g is minimum for all adults. If you want exact, I can help.

30 grams of net carbs. Total carbs-fiber. This only works with fiber, not sugar alcohols. It works best to split up the net carbs into 3 10g portions, 1 for each main meal.

25 grams of fiber each day. So the total carbs per day is 55, but 25 of them are fiber, which does not cause an insulin response.

Don't obsess over counting fat, but choose healthy fats like olive oil, butter, avacado, nuts.

Never let yourself get hungry. Basically, 3 meals, plus 2 snacks is fine--no guilt.

8 glasses of water

one serving of wine or lite beer per day is allowed if you like alcohol

Use a high quality vitamin supplement

artificial sweeteners are allowed, but in moderation.

temporarily cut out starches and most sugars in the beginning. LC fruits or sugar free jell-o are allowed with a bit of whipped cream if you want something sweet.

If you eat carbs in your snack be sure to subtract them from your next meal. It is fine to just eat protein for a snack.

resistance exercise is recommended, but anything that makes you sweat is fine.

if you don't know the carb content of something, opt for basic lean (not fat free) meat and salad, if possible.

That is about it, simplified, but if you have specific questions ask away!