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Old 08-23-2011, 05:45 AM   #1
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New and confused on paleo

ok. i have been on atkins for 2 years and 1/2 years. i lost 50lbs the first 6 mon. then nothing. i stayed the same bouncing around a few lbs. so i started paleo and i lost 9 lbs so far in 2 weeks. i am confused as to what is allowed and what area you can play with. i had to can the no salt thing. i have cut down but i had to have some. i have one low carb off meal a week and that is working out well. i eat all kinds of (and lots of ) fruit. but i have added protein powder (no fat and 1 carb) and coconut oil though the book i read said no to saturated fats. i eat very lean meat and no dairy...boo hoo no butter on veggies. i can't figure out is this low carb low calorie what? atkins science makes sense to me. this i am not so sure. i eat a lot of fruit. i have alway had a hard time losing and have been on a diet since i was 8 (i am 45). anything you got would help
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Old 08-23-2011, 08:14 AM   #2
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There are loads of differing opinions.
Basically paleo cuts out all grains, most dairy (I've seen a lot of blogs that allow for hard cheeses, fermented things like kefir), and limited foods like bacon and deli meats with nitrates. If you're lucky you can find un-nitrated forms of these!
So think of it like this: eat clean, real foods. Meats, veggies, limited fruits. It may not be "by the book" paleo, but it's a good starting point
Google "whole30 allowed foods" for a strict version, or "marks daily apple" for some good ongoing conversation (not as good as here, of course ).
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Old 08-23-2011, 02:14 PM   #3
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thanks for the heads up. i read the 30 paleo thing and she may be a tad crazy. i figure as long as i am losing i will have my protein powder and coconut oil. if i stop i will give it a try. without the protein powder i tend to eat lot of fruit. i am hungry all of the time...i mean stomach growling which i never had with atkins. I also stopped losing too. thanks again
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Old 08-23-2011, 04:18 PM   #4
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have you picked up a book and read it yet? I might suggest Robb wolfs book..
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Old 08-23-2011, 06:04 PM   #5
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Coconut oil is fine. Mostly get your protein from eating rather than powder. I like the eat clean, real food idea and think that is the concept in an easy form. Meat, veggies, fats. I do no dairy, since I'm allergic not really an issue, no grains, as organic as I can.

I'm not an expert and agree that you should do some reading. I like Mark's daily apple and have read his book. Robb Wolf's book is good too.
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Old 08-24-2011, 07:49 AM   #6
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you have to keep it simple and clean--back down to basics, no powders, don't try to "paleo" baked goods, etc. Hungry, eat meat then a veggie-hungry again, eat meat and then a veggie. If you are trying to lose weight, I would not worry about the fat but I would not eat nuts or fruit at all.

Robb Wolf's book is really good-I like it better than cordain, who is more "lower fat", "lean meat" than Robb.

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Old 08-24-2011, 07:52 AM   #7
I'm not fat, I'm fluffy
 
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Originally Posted by lauraleeor View Post
you have to keep it simple and clean--back down to basics, no powders, don't try to "paleo" baked goods, etc. Hungry, eat meat then a veggie-hungry again, eat meat and then a veggie. If you are trying to lose weight, I would not worry about the fat but I would not eat nuts or fruit at all.

Robb Wolf's book is really good-I like it better than cordain, who is more "lower fat", "lean meat" than Robb.

Laura Lee
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Old 08-24-2011, 04:43 PM   #8
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i read the book on my kindle. i added the protein powder that is low fat no carbs so that my fruit will fill me up. if i just eat fruit i can pack it away (no mindless eating just hunger). the powder added helps me to eat less fruit. does the other book allow milk products? i would need something other then just meat and veggies. i don't make the dessert stuff other than smoothies with coconut milk and frozen fruit. i know i could not sustain on just meat and veggies for long and i was looking for a life change. thanks for the information and may try the other book suggested. the one i read cover to cover was the low fat protein fruit veggies no milk but nuts allowed with healthy fats one. its hard but i am doing it. again thanks for the responses.
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Old 08-26-2011, 02:58 PM   #9
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Where can grok get protein powder? This isn't really even paleo if you start fudging around with the most basic premise. Also, coconut oil is saturated. Not that is means anything. Remember, keeping it simple is the best plan. Whole foods as much as possible. Processed foods only on occasion. Keeps the gut healthy, the inflameation down and the appetite at bay.
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Old 08-26-2011, 03:05 PM   #10
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Now I'm confused? Both Robb Wolf and Mark Sisson recommend coconut oil, as long as it's not the highly refined variety?
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Old 08-26-2011, 06:31 PM   #11
I'm not fat, I'm fluffy
 
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Quote:
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Now I'm confused? Both Robb Wolf and Mark Sisson recommend coconut oil, as long as it's not the highly refined variety?
Cordain doesnt though....
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Old 08-26-2011, 08:13 PM   #12
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It doesn't matter if it's saturated or not. It's a healthy fat. It doesn't readily oxidize and it is used up for fuel very quickly.
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Old 08-27-2011, 08:14 AM   #13
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Quote:
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Cordain doesnt though....
Now I have another author to look up lol
So is his beef that it's a saturated fat?
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Old 08-27-2011, 09:29 AM   #14
I'm not fat, I'm fluffy
 
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Yeah I'm not much of a fan of his low fat paleo
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Old 08-27-2011, 09:53 AM   #15
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I hate to keep asking questions but I have one more: ghee?
I downloaded the whole30 pdf thing, just the free version. It doesn't mention ghee, but all the blogs I've read say it's ok? Some technicality that it starts are dairy but you only extract the fat, not the dairy?
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Old 08-27-2011, 10:47 AM   #16
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The Whole30 guide says not to use Ghee for the initial 30 days - then add it back in if you want and see if it causes you problems.
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Old 08-27-2011, 12:05 PM   #17
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Ty for the info
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Old 08-27-2011, 01:09 PM   #18
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I agree it is confusing. Some sites say limit protein to 200 calories a day (Perfect health diet) and allow rice and potatoes, some recommend no starchs and very low carb, and some recommend a calculation based on size and activity (Primal Blueprint) and keeping carbs below 100 for losing weight. My protein would be 50-75grams a day on this plan.

What I do is:
Clean simple foods, as organic as I can.
Carbs below 100
Protein 75-100
good fats.
I also rarely eat before 11-12 and try to cycle my calories.

My biggest issue is that I can't do dairy due to allergies so a good source of fat is gone along with cooking with butter. I use coconut and olive oil.
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Old 08-28-2011, 01:39 PM   #19
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An answer in my life

Hi - new to the forum but a 50 year veteran of diets - all of them - literally.
My daughter and I have both changed lifestyles recently and use what is apparently a paleo or primal or whatever kind of diet is the current buzzword. However I stumbled on the style, not by a diet book, but by my health problems driving me to it:
Obese for most of my adult life.
Asthmatic since childhood.
chronic systemic hives.
Arthritis.
Inflamed itchy ears.
Enlarged, fatty liver - not a drinker.
Lung disease of various diagnoses - emphysema, cystic lung, PEG, LAM, LIP (names to long to bother to write them here). After 8 years the doctors still can't decide just what is the diagnosis. At this point I don't care.
Finally - heart failure.

My daughter has had problems with PCOS, a child with autism spectrum symptoms, a nephew and husband with severe neuropathy, diabetes, and ulcerative colitis, mother with heart disease, IBS and kidney failure - the list could go on.

My daughter convinced me after the heart failure diagnosis to start a gluten free, sugar free, dairy free, organic diet. At first I tried to add a little of this or that from a box - cookies once in awhile. I also was taking a lot of supplements from the Dr. Sinatra Metabolic Cardiology book to restore my heart function. Although my heart function was improving, I still had constant hives and the lung problems were requiring 8 liters of oxygen just to walk. Then we started juicing vegetables.

Bottom line - after years of listening to the litany of doctors, gulping prescriptions by the handful, having devastating surgeries, and getting sicker, we all in one method or another changed our food to a more natural (nothing processed), organic (no hormones, antibiotics, pesticides), and no gluten. We eat meat, vegetables and fruit. We never diet.
Diets are something you do for a short term fix to get into a dress, fell better about the mirror, etc. But if you want to stop feeling hungry, stop worrying about being on the plan or off the plan, stop hating yourself because you slipped up, you would be better off to eat - lots of food. All good, wholesome, natural, fresh food. We juice a huge amount of vegetables every week. Usually have 20 to 40 ounces or more every day. There are micronutrients in the vegetables that cannot be duplicated by anything else you eat.

We then make a huge vegetable stir fry with olive oil and put three eggs in it each and have an amazing filling lunch. We eat chicken, fish, rarely beef, and only hormone free, antibiotic free, grass fed. Lots of fruit in between, nuts, berries, and nothing from a can, bottle or box.

Here are the results so far.
Have lost nearly fifty pounds.
Joint pain nearly gone.
Itchy ears gone
60 years of hives are GONE!
Liver functions dramatically improved.
Heart failure symptoms have disappeared. Base heart rate dropped from 95 to 64. Blood pressure down from 150/90 to 120/70.
Lungs are clear
Any my oxygen requirements have been cut in half and are still going down.

As for the rest of the family:
The stimming and other autism symptoms disappeared in the toddler.
The diabetic neuropathy all but disappeared,
the PCOS disappeared,
kidney function has improved by dozens of points.

I am always full. I have never once had a need to cheat. Toast, cookies, pie, mac and cheese, spagetti, or other processed carbohydrates don't interest me any more. As long as I have my vegetable juice in the morning and eat a full protein and vegetable meal at noon, plus protein and vegetables early evening I am fine. I pay no attention to portions, meal plans, calories or any other modern device. Paleo people didn't have scales or mirrors either. Take it from a woman who has been continuously hungry for sixty years. This is amazing!

I have stopped all medications from the western medical practice. I am now a proponent of eastern medicine which states that food is your medicine. What was not told to me by doctors is the cause of most illness inflammation, oxidation or nutritional deficiency. A drug doesn't cure, it covers symptoms.
Food cures. It reduces inflammation, oxidation and provides micronutrients, many that science hasn't even discovered yet.

I do take supplements specific for the inflammation - those being mostly the natural spices such as turmeric, garlic, oregano, red reishi mushrooms, but that is a separate discussion.

I hope this helps for those who are thinking of "going on this diet". I sincerely hope you can see it as a way out of the diet mill. That was so damaging to my life. This is so restorative.
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Old 08-28-2011, 02:24 PM   #20
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Sounds like you've found your niche And your family has too!
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Old 08-28-2011, 08:05 PM   #21
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What a wonderful report/post!

Well wishes for a continued, positive life change
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Old 08-28-2011, 09:36 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Organelle View Post
Hi - new to the forum but a 50 year veteran of diets - all of them - literally.
My daughter and I have both changed lifestyles recently and use what is apparently a paleo or primal or whatever kind of diet is the current buzzword. However I stumbled on the style, not by a diet book, but by my health problems driving me to it:
Obese for most of my adult life.
Asthmatic since childhood.
chronic systemic hives.
Arthritis.
Inflamed itchy ears.
Enlarged, fatty liver - not a drinker.
Lung disease of various diagnoses - emphysema, cystic lung, PEG, LAM, LIP (names to long to bother to write them here). After 8 years the doctors still can't decide just what is the diagnosis. At this point I don't care.
Finally - heart failure.

My daughter has had problems with PCOS, a child with autism spectrum symptoms, a nephew and husband with severe neuropathy, diabetes, and ulcerative colitis, mother with heart disease, IBS and kidney failure - the list could go on.

My daughter convinced me after the heart failure diagnosis to start a gluten free, sugar free, dairy free, organic diet. At first I tried to add a little of this or that from a box - cookies once in awhile. I also was taking a lot of supplements from the Dr. Sinatra Metabolic Cardiology book to restore my heart function. Although my heart function was improving, I still had constant hives and the lung problems were requiring 8 liters of oxygen just to walk. Then we started juicing vegetables.

Bottom line - after years of listening to the litany of doctors, gulping prescriptions by the handful, having devastating surgeries, and getting sicker, we all in one method or another changed our food to a more natural (nothing processed), organic (no hormones, antibiotics, pesticides), and no gluten. We eat meat, vegetables and fruit. We never diet.
Diets are something you do for a short term fix to get into a dress, fell better about the mirror, etc. But if you want to stop feeling hungry, stop worrying about being on the plan or off the plan, stop hating yourself because you slipped up, you would be better off to eat - lots of food. All good, wholesome, natural, fresh food. We juice a huge amount of vegetables every week. Usually have 20 to 40 ounces or more every day. There are micronutrients in the vegetables that cannot be duplicated by anything else you eat.

We then make a huge vegetable stir fry with olive oil and put three eggs in it each and have an amazing filling lunch. We eat chicken, fish, rarely beef, and only hormone free, antibiotic free, grass fed. Lots of fruit in between, nuts, berries, and nothing from a can, bottle or box.

Here are the results so far.
Have lost nearly fifty pounds.
Joint pain nearly gone.
Itchy ears gone
60 years of hives are GONE!
Liver functions dramatically improved.
Heart failure symptoms have disappeared. Base heart rate dropped from 95 to 64. Blood pressure down from 150/90 to 120/70.
Lungs are clear
Any my oxygen requirements have been cut in half and are still going down.

As for the rest of the family:
The stimming and other autism symptoms disappeared in the toddler.
The diabetic neuropathy all but disappeared,
the PCOS disappeared,
kidney function has improved by dozens of points.

I am always full. I have never once had a need to cheat. Toast, cookies, pie, mac and cheese, spagetti, or other processed carbohydrates don't interest me any more. As long as I have my vegetable juice in the morning and eat a full protein and vegetable meal at noon, plus protein and vegetables early evening I am fine. I pay no attention to portions, meal plans, calories or any other modern device. Paleo people didn't have scales or mirrors either. Take it from a woman who has been continuously hungry for sixty years. This is amazing!

I have stopped all medications from the western medical practice. I am now a proponent of eastern medicine which states that food is your medicine. What was not told to me by doctors is the cause of most illness inflammation, oxidation or nutritional deficiency. A drug doesn't cure, it covers symptoms.
Food cures. It reduces inflammation, oxidation and provides micronutrients, many that science hasn't even discovered yet.

I do take supplements specific for the inflammation - those being mostly the natural spices such as turmeric, garlic, oregano, red reishi mushrooms, but that is a separate discussion.

I hope this helps for those who are thinking of "going on this diet". I sincerely hope you can see it as a way out of the diet mill. That was so damaging to my life. This is so restorative.
this is one of the best posts I have EVER read at low carb friends, although its about Paleo/Primal. I also stumbled upon paleo not really knowing it was any paticular plan I was following. I researched how to help my arthritis pain in my knees.
Congratulations on everything Organelle, so glad you are healing!
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Old 08-29-2011, 07:12 PM   #23
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Thanks Sadie. I just had another pulmonary test and have come down another liter on oxygen needs. The therapist and doctor have now asked me what I'm doing. Cool.

What got me started on this was the documentary type movie "Fat, Sick and Nearly Dead". I watched it and was crying by the end, but I knew I could change my life. I didn't fast, but the veggie juice became a big part of my meals. I highly recommend watching it for anyone struggling with weight or disease.
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Old 08-30-2011, 01:34 AM   #24
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Hi Organelle, when you say that you have changed diet recently, may I ask how long you have been doing this for?

And many congratulations, it sounds like you have really turned your life around.
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Old 08-30-2011, 08:30 AM   #25
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Organelle, do you mind sharing your recipes for your stir fry and also your juice mixtures? I don't have much experience with either. It's great to hear a success story
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