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Old 07-27-2013, 06:12 AM   #151
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I am an avocado lover. I make my fav guaco by mixing my fav ever salsa quemada with avocado, lime juice, and garlic. Bits of bacon make it just perfect.

Scanning PHD and Kresser's site this morning and ran across this article that states, "Statin medication use in postmenopausal women is associated with an increased risk for Diabetes Mellitus. This may be a medication class effect. Further study by statin type and dose may reveal varying risk levels for new-onset DM in this population."
I have not taken statins and don't need to yet. My last blood tests showed good readings, but high cholesterol is something that I always watch for. Keeping my diet PHD should help prevent this from happening. One more reason that taters, RS, and safe starches are so good for our daily diet.

JAMA Network | JAMA Internal Medicine | Statin Use and Risk of Diabetes Mellitus in Postmenopausal Women in the Women's Health Initiative

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Old 07-27-2013, 10:27 AM   #152
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Morning all,
Sorry I've been totally out of pocket. Missed you ladies.
Sunday, I went to my local veggie stand place I was talking about. They had good heirloom veggies and I stocked up. Really proud of my baby long white eggplants. And wow, I bought 8# or so of pastured chicken livers @ $2 #. I almost cleaned her out. Going back after payday. I think I want to try to barter with her with some kombucha starters. Maybe?.... They sold 8 freezers full of beef and chicken in just a couple of weeks. Still have plenty of pork. Man... There's a crying need for good local produce and meats.
I've decided that since my health is getting so good, I'm going to start gardening. I've never tried it before but I've been researching it and it doesn't look that hard. Raised beds, of course. We have a lot of garden space so I will try to set up several 4x8 beds and just get started on heirlooms. I can't get quality organic foods down here in La. (that I can afford), so I'm gonna do it myself. My mom, God love her, used to raise Orchids. For years I watched her potting things and fertilizing them and I had NO interest. Funny how life can change for you.

New update on Jenny's little Nikki. She has been on kefir (with tryptophan) for about a week and is doing well. No outbursts and really mellow. Love it. So does Jenny. Thrilled with outcome. More to come..Love you guys.
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Old 07-27-2013, 12:11 PM   #153
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Sunday - We're having avocado salad tonight with the trimmings from the Nuns' Salad I'm making to take to MiL's tomorrow. (It's a black and white salad: chicken breast, new potatoes, white of scallion/spring onions, black olive, black grapes, dressed in a mayonnaise that I made.)

I was going to make a watermelon dessert but DH left the puree I'd made out of the fridge and it's accidentally fermented so that won't work. I've made a red grapefruit sorbet to be served with raspberries and some vanilla meringues that I've just put in the dehydrator. I think we'll also have some of the creme fraiche that I fermented as that will be a good contrast.

Lindy, I'm so pleased to read about Nikki
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:51 AM   #154
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Lindy, Can't wait to hear about the heirlooms! Also, great to hear that DD and Nikki are loving the kefir. Do you know why this is so healing for autism? I would like to share this with others.

OMG! SlowSure, I have to try this! It sounds absolutely delightful and full of RS as well.

I picked up seabuck thorn oil and want to give it a trial. Does anyone else use this? Will keep everyone updated on my flavorless oil trial. I have lost about 5 lbs and will keep it up. It works wonderfully well with the PHD plan, nothing changes in my method and daily food diary, except that instead of drinking the mct oil in my coffee, I take it one hour before eating sans any food or drink. Easy, peasy. One big warning though, don't try and take the oil with you unless you have the right container. I tried to use an eye dropper bottle and it leaked in my purse. So, now I have a big oily spot on the inside of my beautiful purse.

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Old 07-28-2013, 10:28 AM   #155
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Sunday, I use SeaBuck Thorn Oil, but only in a goat milk face lotion I make for extra dry skin which btw I don't have anymore since starting PhD Last night I managed to get to whole foods where I purchased some collagen. It is bovine based, but surely not the great lakes brand they don't carry it. I will use this up and order some from online. My big hangup is cost. if you order from great lakes you have to buy like 6 or 8...online it is like $25 for one container vs. the $15 or $16 from the manufacturer. Grrmmm...Well I should be making my own broth, but I have been making a ton of salve lately and it takes 3 days too infuse oils, so my crockpot has been busy Fall maybe I will make a bunch and can it...Ya, I'm figuring out the whole canning business too I put up 14 quarts of stewed tomatoes yesterday

Been doing really good eating PhD style, but I can't help but to look at the scale boo hoo... I'm trying not too...I look great, but the scale is a bummer. I've been really bloated lately too! Dealing with it Maybe I will eat some taters for a day or two and flatten my tum tum...gotta love the tatter flattening effects Hope everyone is enjoying their day...gonna go chase the calf (I'm tryin to win her over, she is such a bratt), and trim some hooves
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Old 07-28-2013, 03:07 PM   #156
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Mama,
I would think that your weight is going to come back to regular. It is strange, but a lot of people gain at first. I even see this on the FB group. I heard Paul say that it seems that some have been malnourished and our body is holding on to the nourishment and as we stay with it, we lose effortlessly. I know that adding RS seems to be helping me with this, but the MCT oil may even been better with my losses.

Have you ever tried eating your food plain without spice? Try this for a couple of days and watch what the scale does.

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Old 07-28-2013, 04:49 PM   #157
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Sarcopenia - I would like to discuss sarcopenia as it pertains to Perfect Health. Sarcopenia is the loss of lean muscle mass as we age. I have an LBM (Lean Body Mass) test scheduled at the University coming up in the next couple of weeks. And I am not going to lie, I am a bit frightened. Thanking SlowSure for bringing this up to me and linking her post about her LBM test with the BodPod and graciously letting us know her results. My body fat assessment (SlowSure)

I decided to see what I can find out to help or at least get the discussion going here. I know that we lose lean muscle mass as we age, but I truly believe that physical activity and the way we eat can help us to circumvent the loss.

I found this article, which SlowSure may have linked this as well in your thread, but was wondering if while doing the Keto version of PHD, if you have been supplementing with leucine and BCAAs? Only because I remember Paul saying that both were going to be important while doing Keto PHD.

Dietary protein recommendations and the prevention of sarcopenia

Quote:
Leucine supplementation to prevent sarcopenia
The rationale for the use of a nutritional supplement to slow or prevent sarcopenic muscle loss is based on the assumption that it will improve net muscle protein synthesis above that afforded by regular meals alone. In addition to this direct anabolic effect, the additional energy/nutrient content of a supplement should not interfere with the normal anabolic response to protein consumed as part of daily meals [39]. Many attempts have been made to combat muscle and strength loss in elderly via protein or amino acid supplementation see review by Milne et al., [40]. In some cases, protein–energy supplementation has been shown to be effective. However, other trials, particularly those involving acutely ill or frail patient populations, have been unsuccessful (11–13). In some instances protein supplementation increases satiety and simply replaces voluntary ingestion of regular menu items [39,41]. For others, cost, availability or medical complications such as dysphagia or impaired kidney function may limit the applicability or efficacy of protein supplementation regimens. In such instances, maximizing protein anabolism whereas minimizing the amount or volume of supplementation ingested would be desirable.

Leucine is an insulin secretagogue with well described effects on translation initiation and muscle protein synthesis [22,42–44]. Notably, leucine is a potent activator of the mammalian target of rapamycin (mTOR) nutrient and energy-sensing signaling pathway, in skeletal muscle. Increased insulin availability increases muscle protein synthesis by e

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Old 07-28-2013, 05:15 PM   #158
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Paul also tells us...

Quote:
With carb intakes below 600 calories/day, additional dietary protein would be needed, because protein would be consumed nearly 1-for-1 with the missing carbs. So we can summarize these results as follows: On a high-carb diet (>600 calories/day), 600 protein calories/day maximizes muscle gain. On a low-carb diet (<600 calories/day), 1200 carb+protein calories/day maximizes muscle gain. Leucine supplementation would reduce protein needs a bit. -
He goes on to say...

Quote:
Can You Be Lean on a Low-Protein Diet?

Tuesday’s post cited research indicating that we have a set point for protein intake: humans are genetically programmed to seek around 360 protein calories per day, and appetite becomes satiated once that is achieved.

But if protein intake determines appetite, then it seems those eating a low-protein diet face a Hobson’s choice:
•If total calories are not increased, then the low protein dieter can expect to have a chronically unsatisfied appetite.
•If total calories are increased, so that appetite is satisfied, then the low protein dieter can expect a higher equilibrium weight and a slightly less lean body.

Is it possible, then, to restrict protein, eat mostly carbs and fat which we know are the ingredients of appetizing desserts – and still achieve a lean healthy body, and feel comfortable?

Yes, I believe so.
I have to go, but I will be back with more.
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:47 AM   #159
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I would hope that nobody else's assessment is as bad as mine. It isn't just that I have a high degree of body fat, it's what it says about the scant amount of lean body mass.

I have a ridiculous degree of sarcopenia for someone my age, seriously, this would be cause for concern for someone who is 25 years older than I am never mind my age.

I have to continue the MCT because it's working so well with the migraine control. I need to eat more protein if I'm going to support more resistance-based workouts and strength training. I can't do both of those within a DD kcal allowance, as PJ's text would support.

I'm at the point where although I know it will disrupt my JUDDD, I'm going to have to increase my kcals, even if I gain 'weight'.
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:43 AM   #160
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SlowSure,
I have a concern that I could be in a similar situation with low LBM. I have been working at a desk job for 30 years and although, I have been quite active, the last 5 years I would say things have really slowed down. I JUDDD for eight months plus and didn't take maintenance breaks as often as I should have. I became concerned when my thyroid tests weren't coming back as they should even though I was medicated with thyroid hormone.

You know the only reason that my doctor convinced me to completely let go of ADF and try a different type of fast is because she saw that I was malnourished. I did it gradually. She became concerned about my thyroid stress and about what she determined was malnutrition w/ continuous low cals. I was losing hair and staying cold to the point that it wasn't only during the fasting day.

I am able to receive autophagy in 16 hours daily which allows me to nourish myself optimally every day. I love fasting, but I also had to listen to what my body was trying to tell me.

According to the Osteoporosis Foundation, Sarcopenia appears to begin in the fourth decade of life and accelerates after the age of approximately 75 years. Fortunately, it is partly reversible.

Quote:
Resistance training (RT) has been shown to be a powerful intervention in the prevention and treatment of sarcopenia (Roth, Ferrel & Hurley 2000). RT has been reported to positively influence the neuromuscular system, hormone concentrations, and protein synthesis rates.

Aging is associated with several changes in hormonal levels, including a decrease in the concentrations of growth hormone (GH), testosterone (T), and insulin-like growth factor (IGF-1). A decrease in the concentrations of these hormones may be linked to the development of sarcopenia. GH and IGF-1 play a dominant role in the regulation of protein metabolism; GH and T are required for protein maintenance; and IGF-1 levels are positively correlated with muscle protein synthesis rates, specifically myofibrillar protein (actin and myosin filaments) and myosin heavy chain synthesis (part of the myosin containing cross-bridges).
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:47 AM   #161
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I can't remember if I gained when I first left ADF, but I tend to think that it was minimal and I gradually let go fully as I continued to nourish myself according to PHD. Believe me, I struggled with the decision because I knew that I was doing better in many ways, but I continued to eat the way that I knew my health needed.
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:53 AM   #162
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One of the reasons that I'm so disturbed is that I already do some resistance training and even weight training, Sunday (albeit the latter is with isolated groups of muscles rather than the so-called compound because of my mobility issues).

I know that I spent some time being exceptionally sedentary (post-accident), particularly compared to how I used to be, and I'm still more sedentary than I'd like now (although I'm relatively active judging by other women that I know). It's why I'm so horrified at my results - I just seem to have eaten my muscle when it wasn't being used.

As far as I can tell, even women who are a lot older than I am, at this range of body fat, they have approx. 28lbs or more lean body mass than I do (of course, they tend to be a lot heavier).

But as you, Jaminet, and other people here would say, my health is far more important than other considerations - it has to be. If I disregard this, I'm 15-20yrs away from retirement but what sort of independence or retirement would I have if I were to lose even more LBM?
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Old 07-29-2013, 06:06 AM   #163
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I believe you and I can turn this around now. I can imagine how you must have been so blown away by the results. You are probably more active than I with your kayaking. You reached your goal, which I have yet to do. I am impressed at your healthy food choices which is exactly what PHD has been teaching me this last 7 months.

Thank you for bringing it to my attention. I tend to ignore my own health, but for once I am determined to try to conquer my deficiencies.
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Old 07-29-2013, 06:14 AM   #164
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SlowSure, do you have resistance bands? I do kettlebells, but I also have resistance bands for working all muscles. I have received a lifetime gym membership at the University as part of my retirement, and was looking forward to learning weight training.
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Old 07-29-2013, 08:00 PM   #165
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Old 07-29-2013, 09:18 PM   #166
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Hey! Blonde! Do you feel like your old self yet??? I miss your funny posts, can't wait to run over and read the journal.


Ever since SlowSure told me of her dilemma I have been researching the PHD site for info. I found this gem and although, it doesn't speak to her particular issue on LBM, it does explain something that I have been thinking.

Quote:
Persistent Alterations in the Formerly Obese

The article points to other sources of evidence for metabolic differences between the obese and the never-obese.

[O]ne woman who entered the Columbia studies [of Drs Rudolph Leibel and Michael Rosenbaum] at 230 pounds was eating about 3,000 calories to maintain that weight. Once she dropped to 190 pounds, losing 17 percent of her body weight, metabolic studies determined that she needed about 2,300 daily calories to maintain the new lower weight. That may sound like plenty, but the typical 30-year-old 190-pound woman can consume about 2,600 calories to maintain her weight — 300 more calories than the woman who dieted to get there.

Presumably 190 pounds is still obese for the “typical” 30-year-old woman. So the reduced-weight obese woman is burning fewer calories than a same-size obese woman who never reduced her weight.

So obesity followed by a malnourishing weight loss diet often creates persistent changes that hinder further weight loss, or even maintenance of the lower weight. One observation:

Muscle biopsies taken before, during and after weight loss show that once a person drops weight, their muscle fibers undergo a transformation, making them more like highly efficient “slow twitch” muscle fibers. A result is that after losing weight, your muscles burn 20 to 25 percent fewer calories during everyday activity and moderate aerobic exercise than those of a person who is naturally at the same weight.

Another observation in these patients is persistent hunger. Self-reported hunger is confirmed by observable changes in the brain:

After weight loss, when the dieter looked at food, the scans showed a bigger response in the parts of the brain associated with reward and a lower response in the areas associated with control.

In the Columbia patients, the effect is highly persistent:

How long this state lasts isn’t known, but preliminary research at Columbia suggests that for as many as six years after weight loss, the body continues to defend the old, higher weight by burning off far fewer calories than would be expected. The problem could persist indefinitely.

What Caused the Metabolic Alterations?

Are these persistent alterations to the body caused by the original obesity, or by the malnourishing diet that produced the weight loss? Dr. Leibel believes that the cause was the obesity, but that it is slow-acting – requiring an extended period of fatness:

What’s not clear from the research is whether there is a window during which we can gain weight and then lose it without creating biological backlash…. [R]esearchers don’t know how long it takes for the body to reset itself permanently to a higher weight. The good news is that it doesn’t seem to happen overnight.

“For a mouse, I know the time period is somewhere around eight months,” Leibel says. “Before that time, a fat mouse can come back to being a skinny mouse again without too much adjustment. For a human we don’t know, but I’m pretty sure it’s not measured in months, but in years.”

However, other researchers are exploring the possibility that it was the malnourishing weight loss diet that was at fault:

One question many researchers think about is whether losing weight more slowly would make it more sustainable than the fast weight loss often used in scientific studies. Leibel says the pace of weight loss is unlikely to make a difference, because the body’s warning system is based solely on how much fat a person loses, not how quickly he or she loses it. Even so, Proietto is now conducting a study using a slower weight-loss method and following dieters for three years instead of one.

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Old 07-29-2013, 09:30 PM   #167
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This is so interesting and to think I scanned this back in January when beginning PHD and didn't really digest...

Quote:
My Theory of Obesity: Lean Tissue Feedback

I’m going to be spelling out my theory of obesity over coming months, but let me introduce here a few hypotheses which can account for the data reported in Ms. Parker-Pope’s article.

I believe the brain defends not only (or primarily) an amount of fat mass, but also the health of the body, as reflected by the quantity and quality of lean tissue.

So it is plausible to speak in terms of set points, but there are two set points: a “fat mass set point”, and a “lean tissue quality set point.” The second is dominant: Lean tissue is essential to life, while gains in fat mass may diminish fitness in some environments but will increase fitness in others and are rarely catastrophic. So the tissue-quality set point usually dominates the fat mass set point in its influence upon the brain and behavior.

Feedback to the brain about the quantity of fat mass comes to the brain through a hormone, leptin, that researchers can easily monitor; but feedback about the state of lean tissue comes through the nerves, which sense the state of tissues throughout the body. Lean tissue is too important for health, and can be degraded in so many different ways, that signals about its state cannot be entrusted to a fragile, low-bandwidth mechanism like a hormone. Lean tissue signaling uses the high-bandwidth communications of the nervous system. This feedback system is hard for researchers to monitor.

So the “fat mass set point” is visible to researchers, but the “lean tissue quality set point” is invisible. This is why researchers focus on the fat mass set point, while actual dieters, who know their own experiences are not explained by a simple fat mass set point theory, resist the idea.

Malnutrition will decrease tissue quality, triggering the brain to increase appetite (to get more nutrients) and diminish resource utilization (to conserve nutrients).

If the diet is deficient in the nutrients needed to build tissue, but rich in calories, then tissue-driven increases in appetite and reductions in nutrient utilization may (not necessarily, because the body has many resources for optimizing lean tissue and fat mass independently) lead to an increase in fat mass. Eventually a rise in leptin counterbalances the tissue-driven signals, but this occurs at a new equilibrium featuring higher fat mass, higher appetite, and reduced nutrient utilization compared to the pre-obese state.

Leptin signaling is responsible for the resistance to fat mass increases. The degree to which this resistance affects outcomes depends on the quality of lean tissue. The higher the quality of lean tissue, the less the brain needs to protect it and the more sensitive it is to leptin. The lower the quality of lean tissue, the more lean-tissue drives dominate and the more the brain ignores leptin signals (is “leptin resistant”).

Malnourishing “starvation” weight loss diets degrade lean tissue, and therefore they make the brain hungrier then it was before the weight loss, more eager to conserve resources that might be useful to lean tissue, and more leptin resistant.

However, weight loss diets that restrict calories, but improve the nourishment of lean tissue, should have the opposite effect. They should make the brain less hungry, less focused on conserving resources, and more leptin sensitive.

How much has to be eaten to provide adequate nourishment to lean tissue? In Perfect Health Diet: Weight Loss Version (Feb 1, 2011), I explored this question. Just to provide the necessary macronutrients to maintain lean tissue, I believe it’s necessary to consume at least 1200 calories per day. To optimize micronutrients as well, it’s probably necessary to supplement, even on a 1200 calorie diet. This is on a perfectly-designed diet. The less nourishing the diet, the more calories will be needed to eliminate tissue-driven hunger.
This explains a whole lot where I am concerned. I lived for almost a year on 950 cals per day by eating 1600/300. I wish I had listened to my inner voice and raised my DD to 500 and allowed myself maintenance breaks.

Jaminet further touches on ~

Quote:
The Experiences of Perfect Health Dieters

A few Perfect Health Dieters have been using our diet for weight loss for a long enough period of time – 9-12 months – to test this hypothesis.

Jay Wright’s Weight Loss Journey (Dec 1, 2011) is a carefully chronicled account. Jay became overweight in college, obese by age 28, and had been obese for 10 years by the time he started our diet. He described his weight loss history:



I was a yo-yo dieter – I could lose weight but it always ended up even higher. I tried meal shake replacements, frozen dinners to limit calories, no meat/meat, no dairy/dairy, acid/alkaline, exercise/no exercise while dieting, no cash or credit cards in my wallet going to work so I wouldn’t stop at a fast food, punishment where I had to eat a raw tomato if I cheat (I hate raw tomatoes), and many other vegetarian leaning and mental tricks. A pattern emerged with these diets. I would starve with low energy for about a week or two until my will power ran out. Then, I would go eat something “bad.” If I continued to repeat the pattern and managed to be “successful,” I stayed hungry even once I reached my goal weight. I tried to transition to a “regular” amount of food to stop starving and just maintain but to no avail. My weight went right back up even higher than before even without cheating on the diets.

This yo-yo pattern of hunger followed by weight regain exactly fits the experiences described in Tara Parker-Pope’s article.

However, Jay’s experience on PHD breaks the pattern. Jay went from 250 pounds to 170 pounds – his normal weight – in six months. Weight loss was steady and he experienced little hunger. He’s maintained his normal weight without regain for 3 months.

This is just as my theory predicts. PHD is a lean-tissue supporting diet, and if his lean tissue is well nourished, he should feel little hunger. If his lean tissue heals fast enough, then his lean-tissue drive will decrease faster than his leptin signaling, his equilibrium weight determined by the balance of these two drives will always be below his actual weight, and he should experience smooth weight loss. Which he did
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Old 07-30-2013, 12:27 AM   #168
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I have resistance bands, tubes etc. I've done a fair amount of my rehab work with them but now realise that most of this was isolated muscle groups rather than compound, so they won't have had the overall beneficial impact that I've needed.

I also have a good set of workout straps but again, for mobility reasons, they've been used to target specific muscle sets not compound work.

I'm beginning to understand why I might have lost so much of my overall muscle mass - that in conjunction with my habitually low protein intake although, overall, my nutrition has been conventionally very good.

That's an intriguing theory about lean tissue signalling as a hunger driver in addition to fat mass defence signalling. I must read into this further as it sounds very plausible.

As ever, thank you, Sunday.
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Old 07-30-2013, 05:50 AM   #169
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Yes, I thought you have been eating very healthy paleo-ish, much longer than I have. And, if I am not mistaken, you have been eating bone broth and liver for quite some time. Both of the two additions, have changed my life quite a bit.

I am also very concerned with my mother's diet because after reading up on Sarcopenia, I know she lives under nourished. Especially with protein. I spend a lot of time speaking to her about how good this plan has been for me, but I can't change her WOE, just hope to influence her.
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Old 07-30-2013, 09:53 AM   #170
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Originally Posted by sunday View Post
And, if I am not mistaken, you have been eating bone broth and liver for quite some time....
I can't change her WOE, just hope to influence her.
Yes - bone broth and offal were staples of my childhood and subsequently. Much tho' both initially startled my DH who was unaccustomed to them, he now accepts them with equanimity although he still prefers kidney/heart to be well concealed in any dish.

DH still finds it odd when I'm boiling pigs' trotters or cow heels for their gelatine or stock but he eats them readily enough.

That is all that you can do with your mother, Sunday. Dietary change stresses some people enormously, even to think about it. If she sees you flourishing, maybe she will come around - who knows.
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Old 07-30-2013, 09:58 AM   #171
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Yes - bone broth and offal were staples of my childhood and subsequently. Much tho' both initially startled my DH who was unaccustomed to them, he now accepts them with equanimity although he still prefers kidney/heart to be well concealed in any dish.

DH still finds it odd when I'm boiling pigs' trotters or cow heels for their gelatine or stock but he eats them readily enough.

That is all that you can do with your mother, Sunday. Dietary change stresses some people enormously, even to think about it. If she sees you flourishing, maybe she will come around - who knows.
She did start eating a couple of tbsp. of coconut oil per day, because her sister is slipping with dementia and she remembered that I had sent her some for Christmas.

I love to hear that DH is becoming healthy with you. I know you have heard me lament about my own grumpy ol man. He thinks I have jumped off the deep end and just shakes his head when I make liver or broth.
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