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-   -   Question about Adding exercise to a Ketogenic diet (http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/nutritional-ketosis-high-fat-low-carb/808084-question-about-adding-exercise-ketogenic-diet.html)

Megan528 07-15-2013 04:52 PM

Question about Adding exercise to a Ketogenic diet
 
I've been doing a strict ketogenic diet of roughly 1-5 carbs a day for almost exactly a month now. For the first 2-3 weeks I had great results(almost 13lbs) however this past week I feel like I've been stalling or(God forbid) even gaining. I was sick this week and therefore slept a lot more than usual and also I bought some low carb foods to "indulge" in that have been pushing my carbs closer to 6-10 rather than 1-5. My overall question about this however is: I read that 1 carb is approximately 4 calories, so theoretically as long as I burn more than 40 calories a day in exercise then wouldn't that fix my issue of eating 10g of carb?

Thank you in advance, Megan

emel 07-15-2013 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Megan528 (Post 16516436)
I've been doing a strict ketogenic diet of roughly 1-5 carbs a day for almost exactly a month now. For the first 2-3 weeks I had great results(almost 13lbs) however this past week I feel like I've been stalling or(God forbid) even gaining. I was sick this week and therefore slept a lot more than usual and also I bought some low carb foods to "indulge" in that have been pushing my carbs closer to 6-10 rather than 1-5. My overall question about this however is: I read that 1 carb is approximately 4 calories, so theoretically as long as I burn more than 40 calories a day in exercise then wouldn't that fix my issue of eating 10g of carb?

Thank you in advance, Megan

Okay this part's an edit because I reread-- you said you're at 10 G of carbs..... that's not much. I thought you were talking 10% of calories from carbs. I don't think 10 carbs (whether total or net) is enough carbs to whack out your system. I would think the pause in losing comes from something else, such as not doing well with some of the ingredients of the different foods you chose that week.

Here's what I wrote at first, which I don't think applies becasue your carbs are so low.

To a degree, that will work.
But going over on carbs and then burning off the glucose they create (and then settling back into fat-burning once they are gone) is inelegant for a couple reasons:
1) switching back and forth between carb-burning and fat-burning is more likely to hamper getting/keeping the benefits (easy appetite satiation, steady fat burning) of ketogenic eating.
2) you may set yourself back, out of nutritional ketosis/fat burning by eating the carbs. Phinney says it can take weeks to get back into it after a carb excess. I think he was talking about a larger influx of carbs than you are, but it still applies, I think.

That being said, we're all different about how many carbs we can handle. I'm probably biased because I can't handle very many. It's a YMMV thing for sure, but I think all of us would be wise to not go over our personal carb limits---it's not worth it.

Megan528 07-15-2013 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emel (Post 16516490)
Okay this part's an edit because I reread-- you said you're at 10 G of carbs..... that's not much. I thought you were talking 10% of calories from carbs. I don't think 10 carbs (whether total or net) is enough carbs to whack out your system. I would think the pause in losing comes from something else, such as not doing well with some of the ingredients of the different foods you chose that week.

Here's what I wrote at first, which I don't think applies becasue your carbs are so low.

To a degree, that will work.
But going over on carbs and then burning off the glucose they create (and then settling back into fat-burning once they are gone) is inelegant for a couple reasons:
1) switching back and forth between carb-burning and fat-burning is more likely to hamper getting/keeping the benefits (easy appetite satiation, steady fat burning) of ketogenic eating.
2) you may set yourself back, out of nutritional ketosis/fat burning by eating the carbs. Phinney says it can take weeks to get back into it after a carb excess. I think he was talking about a larger influx of carbs than you are, but it still applies, I think.

That being said, we're all different about how many carbs we can handle. I'm probably biased because I can't handle very many. It's a YMMV thing for sure, but I think all of us would be wise to not go over our personal carb limits---it's not worth it.


Thanks for your reply, and those were net carbs I was referring to. My highest carb day this week was 22g, with 14g of fiber(8g net carb).

SlowSure 07-16-2013 03:34 AM

I agree with Emel about the switching, it keeps you in a hinterland between one state and another so neither meets your needs at present.

I was wondering what the low carb treats were - I'm always a little bit startled to read of the number of people who report themselves sensitive to fibre and/or sugar alcohols although others seem to be able to disregard those when making their calculations as they don't affect them.

April04 07-16-2013 07:32 AM

Megan, Congratulations on your weight loss, that's great! I agree with emel and slowsure about messing with carb count. I'd stay fully planted in ketosis is you'd like to keep losing.

I had a similar experience as you with a 13 lb weightloss in the first two weeks. Then a two week standstill. I think it's pretty normal. Don't get discouraged by the steady weight over the following period. It will be your body holding it's own, and balancing the water loss, etc (I think). And then you will begin to see the scale going down, down, down. And, you'll feel great, and not be hungry, too. Added bonus!

Great work on the four weeks progress, KUTGW :)

Megan528 07-17-2013 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlowSure (Post 16516919)
I agree with Emel about the switching, it keeps you in a hinterland between one state and another so neither meets your needs at present.

I was wondering what the low carb treats were - I'm always a little bit startled to read of the number of people who report themselves sensitive to fibre and/or sugar alcohols although others seem to be able to disregard those when making their calculations as they don't affect them.

I tried eating the Kroger carb master yogurt and milk. I also used the mission carb balance tortillas(6g per tortilla so I used 1/2 of one) to make the most delicious turkey, provolone, and bacon wrap. I have also been using quite a few stevia packets in my coffee and completely disregarding the carbs because their sugar alcohols, but I think I'm going to cut those out for about a week and also keep my carbs <5g, so we'll see if this works!

emel 07-17-2013 03:00 AM

YOu might want to think, and post, in terms of total carbs while you get a handle on this, because it is a good way to look for hidden carbs and an excess of little things (like too much sweetener). Definitely count the carbs in the stevia packets.

Are you eating veggies?
COuld you post a typical day including the extras you're currently having? (tortilla, sweetener, etc)

Megan528 07-19-2013 03:27 AM

No not really eating any veggies.
A typical day(with the low carb snacks and sweeteners):
Breakfast-
2 eggs
2 slc bacon
2 slc cheese(prov,Mozz, or Colby jack)
1 tbs CO
1/8 cup pepitas
A few teaspoons of bacon grease(I cook the eggs in it and then drizzle what's left on the eggs)
2 cups of coffee with 1.5 oz carb master milk(0.6g carb) and 3 stevias(9g sugar alcohol) per cup
1 tsp salt
Lunch-
2 oz turkey(1g carb)
1.5 slc prov
1/2 carb balance tortilla(3g carb)
1/8 cup pepitas
1 carb master yogurt(4g carb)
Dinner-
2 eggs
2 slc cheese
1 tbs CO
2 oz chicken(1g carb because I accidentally bought the wrong brand)
Total net carb:10 g
Total sugar alcohol:18g(yikes!)

Megan528 07-19-2013 03:34 AM

A typical good day now that I'm cutting back on the "LC" items and sweeteners:
Breakfast-
2 eggs
2 slc cheese
1 tbs CO
2 slc bacon
1 tsp salt
Bacon grease
2 cups of Coffee with 2-3 tbs HWC per cup
1/8 cup pepitas
Lunch-
1 oz turkey(0.5g carb)
1.5 slc provolone
1/8 cup pepitas
1/2 carb master yogurt(2g carb)
Dinner-
2 eggs
2 slc cheese
1 tbs CO
1 oz turkey or chicken(0.5g carb)
Total net carb:3g
No sugar alcohols

emel 07-19-2013 04:54 AM

Good for you for cutting back on the AS! Let us know what your results are.

If you still want to tweak, I'd say get rid of about half of your cheese and substitute celery strips, trimmed radishes, bell pepper strips, raw broccoli flowerettes, or cucumber slices with some olive oil or a full fat ranch with 1 carb per 2 tbl. I usually eat about a cup of them daily. Pea pods are nice raw, too, but mix them in with some of the ones above, which have lower carb counts.

My trick for boosting good fats and reducing commercial dressings is to mix half olive oil and half dressing, for salad dressing and for dip.

Auntie Em 07-19-2013 09:34 AM

Megan, here is how I would calculate carbs, if this were my menu:

Breakfast-
2 eggs = 1 gram CHO
2 slc cheese = if those slices are one ounce each = 2 grams CHO
1 tbs CO
2 slc bacon = could have hidden carbs, check for dextrose, maltodextrin, etc.
1 tsp salt
Bacon grease
2 cups of Coffee with 2-3 tbs HWC per cup = 2 grams CHO for the coffee and 1.8 grams for 3 Tbsps hwc
1/8 cup pepitas (Sorry, I don't know what those are.)
Lunch-
1 oz turkey(0.5g carb) = if this is deli turkey, there could be hidden carbs
1.5 slc provolone = if 1.5 ounces, then 1.5 grams CHO
1/8 cup pepitas = again, ???
1/2 carb master yogurt(2g carb)
Dinner-
2 eggs = 1 gram CHO
2 slc cheese = if each slice is one ounce, then = 2 grams CHO
1 tbs CO
1 oz turkey or chicken(0.5g carb)
Total net carb:3g
No sugar alcohols[/QUOTE]

Some of us have found that we must avoid deli meats. I am one of those who gains weight on them. Also, some of us limit protein, too. I gain weight if I go too high on protein. I try to keep an average of 60-65 grams of protein per day,-- that is protein grams, not meat grams. I reckon meat at 6 -7 grams of protein per ounce.

I do best with no additives, preservatives, colorings, etc. I use vinegar and melted butter or beef fat for salad dressing.

Hope this helps some.

I wish you successful and happy experiments. :)

emel 07-19-2013 10:00 AM

Pepitas are hulled pumpkin seeds. My box of them says 1/4 cup is 180 cal, 4 g carb, 3 g fiber, so 1 net carb for Megan's two 1/8 cup servings.

By the way, my tracker shows coffee slightly less than your figures, Auntie Em. I put in 5 8 oz mugs a day and it reads a total of
Quote:

Calories 12

% Daily Values*
Total Fat 0.24g 0%
Saturated Fat 0.024g 0%
Polyunsaturated Fat 0.012g
Monounsaturated Fat 0.142g
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Sodium 24mg 1%
Potassium 557mg
Total Carbohydrate 0.47g 0%
Dietary Fiber 0g 0%
Sugars 0g
Protein 1.42g
I checked another tracker and it says 40 oz (5 8 oz mugs) is

Quote:

Amount Per Serving
Calories12.4
Calories from Fat 1.6
Sodium 25.5 mg
Potassium 563.0 mg
16%

Carbohydrate 0.54 g

Dietary Fiber
0.0 g

Protein 1.4 g
But I drink mine black. Cream is pricey, carb-wise.

Auntie Em 07-19-2013 10:33 AM

Hi, Emel. :) Thanks for the pepitas info. I've heard various amounts about coffee, so I reckon high, just to make sure I don't go over my carb limit. Keeping my carbs really low, and my protein a bit low makes me feel so much nicer than if I go too high on either one of those. I have more leeway with fat amounts.

I wish you happy successes. :P

emel 07-19-2013 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auntie Em (Post 16522203)
Hi, Emel. :) Thanks for the pepitas info. I've heard various amounts about coffee, so I reckon high, just to make sure I don't go over my carb limit. Keeping my carbs really low, and my protein a bit low makes me feel so much nicer than if I go too high on either one of those. I have more leeway with fat amounts.

I wish you happy successes. :P

And the same to you. :)

lovetoknit 07-22-2013 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emel (Post 16521717)
Good for you for cutting back on the AS! Let us know what your results are.

If you still want to tweak, I'd say get rid of about half of your cheese and substitute celery strips, trimmed radishes, bell pepper strips, raw broccoli flowerettes, or cucumber slices with some olive oil or a full fat ranch with 1 carb per 2 tbl. I usually eat about a cup of them daily. Pea pods are nice raw, too, but mix them in with some of the ones above, which have lower carb counts.

My trick for boosting good fats and reducing commercial dressings is to mix half olive oil and half dressing, for salad dressing and for dip.

I do that with my blue cheese dressing also. I add an equal amount or more of extra virgin olive oil to it. It is very yummy that way.
Carolyn

AnnetteW 07-22-2013 03:06 PM

I had a very nice caesar dressing which I dilute half with HWC...now that was delicious.

emel 07-22-2013 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnnetteW (Post 16526587)
I had a very nice caesar dressing which I dilute half with HWC...now that was delicious.

That would be moving in the wrong direction for me lol. My goal is to do more oils and less cream and cheese and processed stuff. But I'm sure it was tasty.

Caesar dressing is a great choice. I have some but I like my stupid canola oil ranch better, darn it.

Just wanted to come back and add---
whatever it takes (within reason, of course) to get those veggies in, and to enjoy it while you're doing it, is okay by me.

Punkin 07-25-2013 10:58 AM

On a high fat diet, it is best to stick with low intensity cardio which burns all fat. Weight lifting is ok, but difficult because it does require muscle glycogen and creatine, which you wouldn't be getting a lot of. However weight lifting preserves muscle mass which you tend to lose on a ketogenic diet.

It is also recommended that you don't do more than an hour a day. The low intensity cardio, even if for a short period, helps you stay in ketosis as well, but isn't necessary to lose weight


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