High Fat NK 80/15/5 - February Version

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by Clueless

I like plenty of salt in it. YUMMM
Or lots of chicken broth to make it salty. That makes it so good.

Oh thanks for reminding me to use chicken broth! What is the recipe again real quick?

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by reddarin

Oh thanks for reminding me to use chicken broth! What is the recipe again real quick?

sorry, I went to bed.

Hamburger, cabbage, rotel, chicken broth, water.
I just brown about a pound of ground beef, or more if I like. Chop up the cabbage and dump in the pot with the rotel and broth and then add as much water as I need to cover it. If ya like more broth you can add more or less.
I have to watch myself cause I will eat too much.
a cup of cabbage has 4.8 carbs and a whole can of rotel has 12.5, so you can figure your carbs for the whole pot.
DH loves it so I make a big pot.

[Clueless]

weigh in
162

crud, I was hoping that 3 lbs would magically dissolve, disipate, evaporate. I tried to will it to an extremely thin woman I saw yesterday that I truly thought needed it, but NO, still with me.
Oh well, Valentines day is coming up, and I have directed DH as to exactly which chocolate to buy. 90% cocoa. Fingers crossed that he was listening.

[mizzcase]

Good morning all. Stuck at 131. Calories were low yesterday. Carbs were maybe a little high (21.2 net, 34 something overall).. think I need to take GROSS carbs into account on top of everything else. Have a good one!

[zgirl]

Good morning! I'm fairly new here - made my first post at the end of last month's thread so I've met some but not all of you yet. But I've been enjoying following along with your journeys and those of you that I've met have been so welcoming and supportive.

I was wondering if anyone else experiences this - every morning I wake up with water retention in my hands and feet. I know because my ring is tight and my extremities feel stiff and swollen. During the day it recedes, but it happens without fail during the night. I do supplement 800 mg magnesium and 400 mg potassium spread out in 2 doses over the day. I know many of you drink bouillon for the sodium but I thought that water retention was a sign of high sodium, so I am wary of increasing my sodium. I already salt all my food generously and have bacon every morning. I do not experience dizziness or cramps associated with low sodium. Has anyone else experienced this or have any ideas about what could be causing it?

Just to provide more info, my ratios are around 75-80% fat, 10-15% protein (try to keep it between 60-75g), and less than 20g total carbs (usually around 10-12g). I do steady cardio (distance running) and sprint intervals several times a week, and body weight resistance exercises. Thanks in advance for your input!

-zgirl

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by zgirl

Good morning! I'm fairly new here - made my first post at the end of last month's thread so I've met some but not all of you yet. But I've been enjoying following along with your journeys and those of you that I've met have been so welcoming and supportive.

I was wondering if anyone else experiences this - every morning I wake up with water retention in my hands and feet. I know because my ring is tight and my extremities feel stiff and swollen. During the day it recedes, but it happens without fail during the night. I do supplement 800 mg magnesium and 400 mg potassium spread out in 2 doses over the day. I know many of you drink bouillon for the sodium but I thought that water retention was a sign of high sodium, so I am wary of increasing my sodium. I already salt all my food generously and have bacon every morning. I do not experience dizziness or cramps associated with low sodium. Has anyone else experienced this or have any ideas about what could be causing it?

Just to provide more info, my ratios are around 75-80% fat, 10-15% protein (try to keep it between 60-75g), and less than 20g total carbs (usually around 10-12g). I do steady cardio (distance running) and sprint intervals several times a week, and body weight resistance exercises. Thanks in advance for your input!

-zgirl

800 mag may be high? I am not much help. Maybe Darin and the others have ideas. I just wanted to say hey and it's good to hear from you again.
How is the weight loss going?

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by zgirl

Good morning! I'm fairly new here - made my first post at the end of last month's thread so I've met some but not all of you yet. But I've been enjoying following along with your journeys and those of you that I've met have been so welcoming and supportive.

I was wondering if anyone else experiences this - every morning I wake up with water retention in my hands and feet. I know because my ring is tight and my extremities feel stiff and swollen. During the day it recedes, but it happens without fail during the night. I do supplement 800 mg magnesium and 400 mg potassium spread out in 2 doses over the day. I know many of you drink bouillon for the sodium but I thought that water retention was a sign of high sodium, so I am wary of increasing my sodium. I already salt all my food generously and have bacon every morning. I do not experience dizziness or cramps associated with low sodium. Has anyone else experienced this or have any ideas about what could be causing it?

Just to provide more info, my ratios are around 75-80% fat, 10-15% protein (try to keep it between 60-75g), and less than 20g total carbs (usually around 10-12g). I do steady cardio (distance running) and sprint intervals several times a week, and body weight resistance exercises. Thanks in advance for your input!

-zgirl

When did it start zgirl? Did you change anything just prior to it starting? Like supplements or drinking more water or cutting back on something other than carbs/protein?

It could be related to your sodium level if it is high enough to avoid cramps but low enough to cause the body to try to retain water to hold on to all the sodium it can. Does your food logger track sodium? I had to set up mine to do it on the 'Custom Nutrition Goals' tab. It could be as easy as adding two cups of bouillon to your daily routine.

Exercise will cause water retention. You could try to reduce the amount you are doing by, say, 20% to see if that has an beneficial effect. Most of the type of exercise you are doing will reduce your resting metabolism by 15% I think Dr. Phinney said. How many hours total a week would you say you are exercising currently? Are you alternating exercise days with rest days?

How much water are you drinking? How much fluids total? For example, I drink about 5 bottles of water a day but I also drink a ton of diet soda.

If I am guesstimating your daily calories correctly you are not eating very low calories, right?

Cheryl asking about the magnesium prompted me to double check it. 800mg is no problem outside of health or Rx issues that might affect it - kidney problems being the biggest one because the kidneys are responsible for managing levels. And, of course, Dr. Robbins recommends 800mg.

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by Clueless

weigh in
162

crud, I was hoping that 3 lbs would magically dissolve, disipate, evaporate. I tried to will it to an extremely thin woman I saw yesterday that I truly thought needed it, but NO, still with me.
Oh well, Valentines day is coming up, and I have directed DH as to exactly which chocolate to buy. 90% cocoa. Fingers crossed that he was listening.

I feel I must speak up for your husband and real men everywhere. We don't want an extremely thin chick.

This has been a Public Service Announcement brought to you by Darin - an unapologetic manly man.

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by Clueless

sorry, I went to bed.

Hamburger, cabbage, rotel, chicken broth, water.
I just brown about a pound of ground beef, or more if I like. Chop up the cabbage and dump in the pot with the rotel and broth and then add as much water as I need to cover it. If ya like more broth you can add more or less.
I have to watch myself cause I will eat too much.
a cup of cabbage has 4.8 carbs and a whole can of rotel has 12.5, so you can figure your carbs for the whole pot.
DH loves it so I make a big pot.

Thanks! I am going to make a batch today

[reddarin]

Weigh-in this morning ... 203.4 so up .1 but I remembered to check my waist measurement this morning and it was 42 so I am down from 42.5 on the 5th

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by reddarin

Cheryl asking about the magnesium prompted me to double check it. 800mg is no problem outside of health or Rx issues that might affect it - kidney problems being the biggest one because the kidneys are responsible for managing levels. And, of course, Dr. Robbins recommends 800mg.

Glad you checked on that cause I really wasn't sure.

Originally Posted by reddarin

I feel I must speak up for your husband and real men everywhere. We don't want an extremely thin chick.

This has been a Public Service Announcement brought to you by Darin - an unapologetic manly man.

Dh seconds that. But we ladies like that reminder, thanks. We have a hard time being satisfied with our weight/ appearance.

[Bernsy]

Okay guys, can somebody please help me figure out why I have a huge fat stomach and hips. I am 46, 5'51/2", just got weighed - 126lbs. Have been low carbing since 2004 and tuned into this thread and NK last fall. I've definitely upped my fat intake - maybe too much?

Yesterday's numbers
1352 cals
106 gr fat
78.7 gr pro
10.3 net gr carb

Todays will be
1336 cals
113.3 fat
63.1 pro
8.2 net gr carb

Too much of something? Not enough of something else? Last week, for the first time in my life, I actually didn't eat my lunch at work for two days - unheard of for me! I'm starving today!!!!

Not that I need the numbers on the scale to go down but I do want to lose this stomach and hips!!

Please help!

[zgirl]

Originally Posted by Clueless

800 mag may be high? I am not much help. Maybe Darin and the others have ideas. I just wanted to say hey and it's good to hear from you again.
How is the weight loss going?

Hi Clueless! Nice to hear from you too. I'm actually not trying to lose weight, but rather to correct some hormonal imbalances and improve my body composition. This WOE has already helped me so much - I used to eat high carb, almost zero fat, and primarily vegetarian and was cold all the time, hypoglycemic, and had low HR and BP. Since starting NK in October, I'm always warm, never get sugar bonks in the afternoon, and I can fit into clothes that were tight when I was 6-7 pounds lighter. So it's going really well, but obviously still a few things that need tweaking. How are you doing?

[zgirl]

Red, you asked all the right questions! I was going to reply to you in the same post to Clueless but then I realized that I'd better split it up or it might push the whole thread to the next page...

Originally Posted by reddarin

When did it start zgirl? Did you change anything just prior to it starting? Like supplements or drinking more water or cutting back on something other than carbs/protein?

It's been going on for a few months now, pretty much ever since I started. I felt really terrible at the beginning, but as soon as I started taking magnesium and potassium the carb flu eased up. I stopped taking potassium for a little while and had crazy headaches, dizziness, and even heart palpitations that vanished as soon as I added it back in. Other than that, no other changes that triggered the water retention, I think.

It could be related to your sodium level if it is high enough to avoid cramps but low enough to cause the body to try to retain water to hold on to all the sodium it can. Does your food logger track sodium? I had to set up mine to do it on the 'Custom Nutrition Goals' tab. It could be as easy as adding two cups of bouillon to your daily routine.

My tracker tracks sodium in any packaged foods but not the salt that I add. I don't have access to a kitchen or scales or anything, so I just track to get a rough idea. Depending on what I eat, I get between 1500-2000 mg not including the sea salt I add to everything before eating. But I'll try the bouillon and see if that makes a difference.

Exercise will cause water retention. You could try to reduce the amount you are doing by, say, 20% to see if that has an beneficial effect. Most of the type of exercise you are doing will reduce your resting metabolism by 15% I think Dr. Phinney said. How many hours total a week would you say you are exercising currently? Are you alternating exercise days with rest days?

This is the tough question for me and I'm glad you asked it. Exercise is something I've always struggled with and I know I do too much. I'm just afraid to stop doing it! I also like the way it makes me feel - it's a real stress reliever for me. But I am probably doing 7-8 hours a week with hardly any rest days. I know it may be relieving school or emotional stress but it's probably creating a lot of stress on my body. Do any of you have recommendations of how I can continue to reap the benefits of being active without taxing my body so much?

How much water are you drinking? How much fluids total? For example, I drink about 5 bottles of water a day but I also drink a ton of diet soda.

I drink a 16 oz herbal tea with lunch and dinner, 2 20oz bottles of soda water, and probably about 40 oz of plain water throughout the day. 16 oz coffee in the morning and no diet sodas. So a lot of fluid!

If I am guesstimating your daily calories correctly you are not eating very low calories, right?

Nope, I never eat below 1500 and it's usually closer to 1800-2000 per day.


Whew! Thanks again for your thoughtful response and for reading all these answers. An objective outside opinion is so valuable, so I'm lucky to have access to all your experience and knowledge. Congrats on the loss of inches by the way!

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by Bernsy

Okay guys, can somebody please help me figure out why I have a huge fat stomach and hips. I am 46, 5'51/2", just got weighed - 126lbs. Have been low carbing since 2004 and tuned into this thread and NK last fall. I've definitely upped my fat intake - maybe too much?

Yesterday's numbers
1352 cals
106 gr fat
78.7 gr pro
10.3 net gr carb

Todays will be
1336 cals
113.3 fat
63.1 pro
8.2 net gr carb

Too much of something? Not enough of something else? Last week, for the first time in my life, I actually didn't eat my lunch at work for two days - unheard of for me! I'm starving today!!!!

Not that I need the numbers on the scale to go down but I do want to lose this stomach and hips!!

Please help!

Maybe you are not eating enough Bernsy? According to Phinney's formula, for 126 pounds a normally active person should be burning about 2000 calories a day.

I checked the height/weight/framesize table and 126 seems to be about right for your height unless you are unusually small framed or unusually large framed - frame size info post.

Other than the low calories your macros look okay.

Perhaps your body is holding on to the fat because of the low calories? You might try pushing them up to 1500 for a week or two.

No off log snacking?

You may have to resort to exercise.

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by zgirl

Hi Clueless! Nice to hear from you too. I'm actually not trying to lose weight, but rather to correct some hormonal imbalances and improve my body composition. This WOE has already helped me so much - I used to eat high carb, almost zero fat, and primarily vegetarian and was cold all the time, hypoglycemic, and had low HR and BP. Since starting NK in October, I'm always warm, never get sugar bonks in the afternoon, and I can fit into clothes that were tight when I was 6-7 pounds lighter. So it's going really well, but obviously still a few things that need tweaking. How are you doing?

Wow, I am so glad your doing better with this WOE.
The weight loss is slow with me as it always is. I was like you, zero fat high carb. Felt terrible and had terrible thyroid issues. I have tons of energy now.
Hope you get figured out whats causeing the water retention.
A tbsp of ACV in water (with a straw!!!) helps me get rid of excess water, but sure would like to know whats causing it in your case.

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by Clueless

A tbsp of ACV in water (with a straw!!!) helps me get rid of excess water

I prefer the slam your fingers in the car door method for immediate water shedding and pants changing.

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by reddarin

I prefer the slam your fingers in the car door method for immediate water shedding and pants changing.

I almost peed my pants. hehe

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by reddarin

I feel I must speak up for your husband and real men everywhere. We don't want an extremely thin chick.

This has been a Public Service Announcement brought to you by Darin - an unapologetic manly man.

I have to say, I am reminded of a date I went on right before DH and I started dating. The Gentleman told me "you would be very cute if you lost some weight"
The best part was only snickering to myself while he managed to back up and run over himself 3 times to explain what he was trying to say.

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by zgirl

It's been going on for a few months now, pretty much ever since I started

This makes me think that you have just enough sodium to stave off the cramps but not enough to keep from retaining water. I was surprised to read that when I was looking for information on what you described but it seems to be the case. It does make sense. When you stopped the potassium the bad effects were felt within a day or so right? Not enough sodium would cause that since potassium is sacrificed first. So your potassium supplements are hiding your sodium deficiency.

Depending on what I eat, I get between 1500-2000 mg not including the sea salt I

It is very difficult to get ~3 grams of sodium in from the salt shaker even if you are very liberal with it.

I am probably doing 7-8 hours a week with hardly any rest days.

That is not excessive by any stretch. Keep it up since you enjoy it. I do not think it is stressing your body unduly

It could be responsible for the bloating but only indirectly I think. Your muscles suck up fluids after working out and it gradually seeps out overnight resulting in extremity bloating. But I doubt that would be the case with only 8 hours of exercise if your sodium was right.

So a lot of fluid!

Hmmm. But is it a lot of the right fluids? The coffee is not decaf right? It is diuretic. The herbal tea too if it isn't decaf. And possible both still are diuretic even if they are decaf. The soda too if it isn't decaf.

For comparison, I usually drink about 190 oz of liquid a day. About 70oz of pure water. Of course, I'm 6' tall and a guy.

But I do not exercise. I think you need to up your pure water by a bottle or two at least. Put some nice magazines in the bathroom lol.

Try adding two cups of bouillon and another bottle of water or two. If it is going to work it should work quickly I think. Like within a day or two.

No Rx meds? No diagnosed health conditions?

[mizzcase]

Red, I'm confused on the sodium talk. You say she has enough sodium to stave off the cramps but not enough to keep her from retaining water?

I thought too much sodium made one retain water? You're saying not enough does?

Congrats on the loss of inches, BTW.

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by mizzcase

Red, I'm confused on the sodium talk. You say she has enough sodium to stave off the cramps but not enough to keep her from retaining water?

I thought too much sodium made one retain water? You're saying not enough does?

Congrats on the loss of inches, BTW.

Right? I was surprised to read it too. If your sodium level is low but not too low the body retains water in an effort to retain sodium. It makes sense because you loose most of your sodium in America's library.

I know it is contrary but I do not think too much sodium on LC will make you retain water. Unless there is something else going on to cause it like for you girls or meds or something.

[reddarin]

Thank you guys

I still have a long way to go to get back to where I was before I quit smoking.

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by Clueless

The Gentleman told me "you would be very cute if you lost some weight"

Manly Man Rule #1: Don't put your foot in your mouth with the ladies.

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by reddarin

Thank you guys

I still have a long way to go to get back to where I was before I quit smoking.

You'll get there!

[mizzcase]

Yeah, I heard that too much sodium won't make you retain salt in ketosis because the way your kidneys process salt is completely turned on its head when you cut the carbs. Where did I read this? I have no idea.

[zgirl]

Originally Posted by Clueless

Wow, I am so glad your doing better with this WOE.
The weight loss is slow with me as it always is. I was like you, zero fat high carb. Felt terrible and had terrible thyroid issues. I have tons of energy now.
Hope you get figured out whats causeing the water retention.
A tbsp of ACV in water (with a straw!!!) helps me get rid of excess water, but sure would like to know whats causing it in your case.

Interesting - I wonder how the ACV helps with the water retention! I do have some... maybe I should give it a try. Guessing Red isn't a fan of vinegar?

Red - interesting points. Your theory makes a lot of sense. The sodium/potassium/water balance seems to be very delicate indeed! Yes, when I stopped the potassium I felt the effects almost immediately. I will definitely try the bouillon and see if that makes a difference. Also, the only caffeinated liquid I drink is my morning coffee; the herbal teas have no caffeine. But I'll also try upping my pure water intake. I just keep having to go to the bathroom!

The exercise is not excessive timewise, but it is almost all cardio. Even though I've read Taubes, I still can't seem to let go of my compulsion to keep up the cardio. Going to try to shift some of that cardio time to strength training. And the only health condition I have is chronic constipation (sorry!!!) which has persisted for years before I started NK. This WOE has definitely changed my errm... movements... but they still have not normalized. Anyway, moving on!

Mizzcase, I remember from another thread that you work out. If you don't mind, what kind of exercise and how much do you do? Nice to meet you

[mizzcase]

Hi zgirl, I strength train 3 days a week.. free weights, dip machines, lat pulldowns, and various Crossfit type moves. I also run 2-3 miles a couple times a week, but not too often, because it makes me too rungry to even be worth it.

[zgirl]

Rungry - I like that! I realized that you have all that info in your profile... and also that we are nearly the same age

[reddarin]

Originally Posted by mizzcase

because it makes me too rungry to even be worth it.

Hmmm. Can it be 'hungry'? Or in need of a shower?