Low Carb Friends  
Netrition.com - Tools - Reviews - Faces - Recipes - Home


Go Back   Low Carb Friends > Eating and Exercise Plans > Weight Loss Plans > Nutritional Ketosis / High Fat, Low Carb
Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-07-2012, 12:48 PM   #1
Major LCF Poster!
 
tiva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: UP, Michigan
Posts: 2,930
Gallery: tiva
Stats: 5"6", 157/136/135, 53 yo
WOE: Paleo/Whole30
Start Date: 12/02
Calories? Help!

Hi-
I'm confused about calories. I've been sticking to between 1200 and 1400 calories a day, and losing 5 lbs of menopausal weight gain very slowly. But from skimming through the long, long, long December thread, it sounds as if 30 to 35 cals/kg of goal weight is a good goal. Hmm. This would put me between 1800 and 2100 calories each day (my goal weight is 135; right now I'm at 138; I'd really like to be back down at 130, but I can't imagine having the patience for that, since I have to eat soooo little to lose weight now).

A little background: I've been low-carbing for 10 years, stayed at 130 for 5 of those years, then slowly went up to 134. When I hit menopause a few years ago, my weight went up above 140, so I set my goal at 135 and I've mostly been able to stay at that, but only if I keep carbs to less than 20 grams and calories to about 1500. To lose weight if I go above 135, I essentially need to do fast-5 (eat in a 5 hour window), no veggies except a cup of arugula or other dark greens, and calories under 1300 most days. I exercise an hour or more a day--commuting via mountain bike to work, cross country skiing every other day, going to the gym on nasty days, biking and kayaking and hiking in the summer, and weight training a few days a week).

Anyway, I fear that I've trained my body to need very few calories. I'd like to eat more without gaining.

Right now I'm aiming at:
60 to 75 grams of protein/day
less than 20 grams of carbs/day
the rest in fat (usually coconut oil or heavy cream or butter; some cheese, which I love, but I worry that it stalls me). But this is usually not more than 50 to 75 grams/day, since I'm trying to lose weight and my calories about usually under 1200.

I'm hungry! And it takes me forever to lose a lb or two, and I gain it back in a second if I eat much dairy or nuts.

So: can some people give me their perspective on calories? Why the 30-35 g/kg recommended in the first post on this thread?

And if anyone wants to give me advice on how I can raise calories and fat without gaining, I'm all ears. I don't want to spend the rest of my post-menopausal life hungry and avoiding cheese/nuts/veggies/more fat, even though I'm perfectly happy to continue avoiding other carbs and excessive protein forever.

Last edited by tiva; 12-07-2012 at 01:16 PM..
tiva is offline   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old 12-07-2012, 02:13 PM   #2
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: GA
Posts: 673
Gallery: mizzcase
Stats: 5'4 141/130.2/113
WOE: LCHF
Start Date: March 20, 2012
Hi there! I am no expert, but I have found I have lost fastest when I eat around 1700 calories. I'm 5'4 and 122ish right now, and I drop weight like crazy when I eat (omg soooo many, it seeemed like before) calories. I used to be SO hungry eating 1200 a day, and my body would cling to every bit of nourishment. The scale only budged a half pound or so every month, so I'm definitely in the "quality over quantity" boat.

Like you, I eat about 60-75g protein a day and aim for less than 20 grams total carbs. I love that I do not go hungry and am losing weight. I almost always eat above 80% fat, and I think the % of fat you eat plays a big role in how you lose weight..

I wonder if you might be exercising too much? I ran alot before NK (20 miles a week, about), and I think it caused my body to more efficiently use calories. Also, I was RUNGRY. I had an IT band injury around the same time, so my running was reduced to nil, and I think that was an important factor when it comes to the ease of losing my weight.

Please don't worry that your body has adjusted to this limited caloric intake. I was eating 500 calories a day for about a year before doing LC, and my body has adjusted.

Definitely look for red, and also mom2zeke, to chime in here, as they are very authoritative on all things NK.
mizzcase is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2012, 03:09 PM   #3
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
drjlocarb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,340
Gallery: drjlocarb
Stats: 274 /219/190
WOE: vlc/NK
Start Date: LC-1999,jan2010 274 NK 1-1-13 at 244
I think that recommendation is from the high fat thread, not Nutritional Ketosis. The calories have to be higher in order to get the ratios to come out right. I would gain everything back if I followed that advice.
drjlocarb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2012, 05:14 PM   #4
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,925
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiva View Post
Hi-

And if anyone wants to give me advice on how I can raise calories and fat without gaining, I'm all ears. I don't want to spend the rest of my post-menopausal life hungry and avoiding cheese/nuts/veggies/more fat, even though I'm perfectly happy to continue avoiding other carbs and excessive protein forever.
Have you considered combining the LCHF approach with JUDDD (alternate day calorie cycling)? I'm eating 300-500 calories per day on down days with JUDDD and eating around 2000-22000 calories on up days (never going above my carb or protein gram daily limits), so it works out to around 1200-1400 calories per day. But I am losing much better when I alternate low and higher calorie days than when I aimed for 1200 calories every day. Supposedly eating maintenance level or a bit higher calories half the time keeps your body from downsizing your metabolic calorie demands, but you still lose weight. The JUDDD threads, especially those about the benefits of JUDDD and the book (Johnson's Alternate Day Diet) explain this better than I can in a post. And it is perfectly possible to combine JUDDD with LCHF--plus, I have more energy and better mood on JUDDD plus LCHF than on just LCHF alone.
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2012, 11:06 PM   #5
Major LCF Poster!
 
tiva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: UP, Michigan
Posts: 2,930
Gallery: tiva
Stats: 5"6", 157/136/135, 53 yo
WOE: Paleo/Whole30
Start Date: 12/02
THanks for the suggestions so far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by svenskamae View Post
Have you considered combining the LCHF approach with JUDDD (alternate day calorie cycling)?
I did try JUDDD for 3 months last fall, and I still lurk on their board, but it didn't work for me at all. The DDs made me miserable, even when I ate almost only fat, and I never adjusted to them. Plus I became obsessed with food and couldn't get any work done.

Mom2Zeke, I'm trying to follow the guidelines for NK, but I may be confused by the High Fat-NK December thread as well. At 135 lbs, I calculated my protein needs as 60 to 75 grams and my carbs at under 20. The rest is fat. But "eat fat to satiety" is hard for me, since I don't know what that means.

Thanks for the keto calculator link. Putting in my data, it recommended:
1500 kcal Net Calories Consumed
20 g Carbohydrates (5%)
80 g Protein (21%)
122 g Fat

The calories it suggests are a good deal lower than the range that Phinney suggests (but still higher than what I typically eat):

On the first post of the High Fat-NK thread for December, Red gave guidelines for calories from Phinney:
"Dr. Phinney gives a range of 30-35kCal per goal kg weight. He states that 35kCal is *the* norm and 30kCal is for a very obese person that cannot be active because of weight/health problems and is very sedentary.
Phinney's formula for daily calories: ((goal_weight/2.2)*30) or ((goal_weight/2.2)*35).
So, if your goal weight is 150 then (150/2.2)*35 = 2386"

I hope Red will chime in. It's interesting that all of you aren't following these guidelines for calories--I had thought they were for all NK, and I hadn't realized that High Fat-NK was a different critter.

In terms of exercise--a lot of it is my commute to work (I'm in Sweden for the year, no car, so we mountain bike or walk everywhere in the deep snow. Good exercise.) I can't imagine not skiing whenever I get the chance, but I am trying to keep it to every other day. This city in Sweden is a pretty hyper gym/training culture--everyone seems to go to the gym constantly (it's the biggest gym in Europe or something). I'm not much into gyms, but I am addicted to being outside as much as possible.

I feel like my metabolism is pretty high--I can't sit still; I'm always hot (menopause!); and I usually feel very energetic.

But I'm hungry! Yesterday instead of 1200 calories, I ate 1500 calories (57 g protein/16 g carbs/109 g fat). I was still very hungry all evening, after my eating window closed at 5 pm. Today I'm up a lb. (and I know those fluctuations may be meaningless).

Last edited by tiva; 12-07-2012 at 11:12 PM..
tiva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2012, 11:16 PM   #6
Major LCF Poster!
 
tiva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: UP, Michigan
Posts: 2,930
Gallery: tiva
Stats: 5"6", 157/136/135, 53 yo
WOE: Paleo/Whole30
Start Date: 12/02
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizzcase View Post
Hi there! I am no expert, but I have found I have lost fastest when I eat around 1700 calories. I'm 5'4 and 122ish right now, and I drop weight like crazy when I eat (omg soooo many, it seeemed like before) calories. I used to be SO hungry eating 1200 a day, and my body would cling to every bit of nourishment. The scale only budged a half pound or so every month, so I'm definitely in the "quality over quantity" boat.

Like you, I eat about 60-75g protein a day and aim for less than 20 grams total carbs. I love that I do not go hungry and am losing weight. I almost always eat above 80% fat, and I think the % of fat you eat plays a big role in how you lose weight..

I wonder if you might be exercising too much? I ran alot before NK (20 miles a week, about), and I think it caused my body to more efficiently use calories. Also, I was RUNGRY. I had an IT band injury around the same time, so my running was reduced to nil, and I think that was an important factor when it comes to the ease of losing my weight.

Please don't worry that your body has adjusted to this limited caloric intake. I was eating 500 calories a day for about a year before doing LC, and my body has adjusted.

Definitely look for red, and also mom2zeke, to chime in here, as they are very authoritative on all things NK.
Thanks for all these suggestions! We sound pretty similar. Maybe I should try skiing every other day, not every day, and up my fat calories a bit. The Swedish coconut oil isn't as yummy as Nutiva, but it still makes nice coconut bark, and I could happily live on coconut alone. Coconut green curries (some chicken, some veggies, a little bone broth, and lots of coconut milk and green curry paste) are my favorite meal.
tiva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 06:19 AM   #7
Major LCF Poster!
 
mom2zeke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,591
Gallery: mom2zeke
Stats: 257/144.8/150
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis--Maintenance!
Start Date: August 6, 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiva View Post
Mom2Zeke, I'm trying to follow the guidelines for NK, but I may be confused by the High Fat-NK December thread as well. At 135 lbs, I calculated my protein needs as 60 to 75 grams and my carbs at under 20. The rest is fat. But "eat fat to satiety" is hard for me, since I don't know what that means.

Thanks for the keto calculator link. Putting in my data, it recommended:
1500 kcal Net Calories Consumed
20 g Carbohydrates (5%)
80 g Protein (21%)
122 g Fat

The calories it suggests are a good deal lower than the range that Phinney suggests (but still higher than what I typically eat):
I think that calculator uses a different formula for resting metabolic rate. These are all estimates of what your actual rate is. I am finding that in maintenance if I eat to the 35kcal/kg I slowly gain. The kcal maintenance level on this calculator seems more accurate for me. YMMV.

Quote:
On the first post of the High Fat-NK thread for December, Red gave guidelines for calories from Phinney:
"Dr. Phinney gives a range of 30-35kCal per goal kg weight. He states that 35kCal is *the* norm and 30kCal is for a very obese person that cannot be active because of weight/health problems and is very sedentary.
Phinney's formula for daily calories: ((goal_weight/2.2)*30) or ((goal_weight/2.2)*35).
So, if your goal weight is 150 then (150/2.2)*35 = 2386"

I hope Red will chime in. It's interesting that all of you aren't following these guidelines for calories--I had thought they were for all NK, and I hadn't realized that High Fat-NK was a different critter.
I hope that Red chimes in on the calorie issue also because I'm not exactly sure where these numbers for weight-loss came from.

From what I can gather, in the Living book in The Importance of Dietary Fat in Long-Term Maintenance chapter it does say: "As an aside, the casual reader might protest that these energy expenditure numbers look pretty high. But for anyone who has worked with obese humans in a metabolic research ward, 30 kcal per kg of actual body weight in the sedentary obese and 35 kcal/kg in the post-obese moderately active adult are actually quite conservative expenditure values."

But they also refer to quite a large calorie deficit when describing weight-loss: "a typical male with a BMI of 34 might start out eating 1600 kcal in induction while his body burns 3200 kcal per day (thus weight loss)."

Also, I can't find any place where the good doctors prescribe a specific calorie level for weight loss for anyone. In fact in the long-term stalls podcast Dr. Phinney stated at least once that he doesn't like to give specific calorie advice. I think that's because it's so individual (as you have found). Some people can lose on lots of calories and some of us need to restrict rather severely (especially when you're so close to goal weight).

I also don't understand is how one calculation (30-35kcal/kg) can work for everyone from active young men to sedentary menopausal women. It doesn't ring true to me.

Quote:
In terms of exercise--a lot of it is my commute to work (I'm in Sweden for the year, no car, so we mountain bike or walk everywhere in the deep snow. Good exercise.) I can't imagine not skiing whenever I get the chance, but I am trying to keep it to every other day. This city in Sweden is a pretty hyper gym/training culture--everyone seems to go to the gym constantly (it's the biggest gym in Europe or something). I'm not much into gyms, but I am addicted to being outside as much as possible.

I feel like my metabolism is pretty high--I can't sit still; I'm always hot (menopause!); and I usually feel very energetic.

But I'm hungry! Yesterday instead of 1200 calories, I ate 1500 calories (57 g protein/16 g carbs/109 g fat). I was still very hungry all evening, after my eating window closed at 5 pm. Today I'm up a lb. (and I know those fluctuations may be meaningless).
Hormones are probably playing into all of this too.

From what I'm hearing you say, you have found something that works (fast 5, VLC, less than 1200 calories) but you're unhappy because you're hungry. Anything you try with higher caloric intake may make you gain weight.

You could give NK with a moderate amount of calories (1500ish) a try for a few weeks to see if it works for you. It's just a few weeks and if it doesn't work you can always go back to what you were doing.

OTOH, if you're okay with what you're doing you can keep it up until you're at goal and then play around with more fat and calories once you're in maintenance.
__________________
Kristn
50 yo
LC since 2001
257/144.8/150
BF% Goal 26%/20%/20%
February Nutritional Ketosis...Are you in the zone?
Nutritional Ketosis Thread Information and Posts of Interest
My Maintenance Journal
Original weight 2001--257 Maintaining 165-175 from 2002-March 2012
March 2012 to August 2012--175/150 Made Goal 8/27/12!
mom2zeke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2012, 07:49 AM   #8
Major LCF Poster!
 
tiva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: UP, Michigan
Posts: 2,930
Gallery: tiva
Stats: 5"6", 157/136/135, 53 yo
WOE: Paleo/Whole30
Start Date: 12/02
Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2zeke View Post
I think that calculator uses a different formula for resting metabolic rate. These are all estimates of what your actual rate is. I am finding that in maintenance if I eat to the 35kcal/kg I slowly gain. The kcal maintenance level on this calculator seems more accurate for me. YMMV.

...
Hormones are probably playing into all of this too.

From what I'm hearing you say, you have found something that works (fast 5, VLC, less than 1200 calories) but you're unhappy because you're hungry. Anything you try with higher caloric intake may make you gain weight.

You could give NK with a moderate amount of calories (1500ish) a try for a few weeks to see if it works for you. It's just a few weeks and if it doesn't work you can always go back to what you were doing.

OTOH, if you're okay with what you're doing you can keep it up until you're at goal and then play around with more fat and calories once you're in maintenance.
Thanks for all the suggestions and ideas. Much appreciated!
tiva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 12:16 PM   #9
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 124
Gallery: Bernsy
WOE: Atkins/Gary Taubes
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizzcase View Post
Hi there! I am no expert, but I have found I have lost fastest when I eat around 1700 calories. I'm 5'4 and 122ish right now, and I drop weight like crazy when I eat (omg soooo many, it seeemed like before) calories. I used to be SO hungry eating 1200 a day, and my body would cling to every bit of nourishment. The scale only budged a half pound or so every month, so I'm definitely in the "quality over quantity" boat.

Like you, I eat about 60-75g protein a day and aim for less than 20 grams total carbs. I love that I do not go hungry and am losing weight. I almost always eat above 80% fat, and I think the % of fat you eat plays a big role in how you lose weight..

I wonder if you might be exercising too much? I ran alot before NK (20 miles a week, about), and I think it caused my body to more efficiently use calories. Also, I was RUNGRY. I had an IT band injury around the same time, so my running was reduced to nil, and I think that was an important factor when it comes to the ease of losing my weight.

Please don't worry that your body has adjusted to this limited caloric intake. I was eating 500 calories a day for about a year before doing LC, and my body has adjusted.

Definitely look for red, and also mom2zeke, to chime in here, as they are very authoritative on all things NK.
I find that so amazing! Maybe I am eating too few calories. I can't figure out why, not only can I not lose fat weight/inches, but stop belly fat from increasing. I get between 1200 - 1400 cals and I am constantly lowering my coconut oil or raising it - trying to figure out if I'm getting too much fat 100gr to 120gr/day.

I'm 5'51/2" - about 130 - 46yrs and at my wits end. I am afraid to increase calories/fat. What do you think?
Bernsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 06:43 AM   #10
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 16,608
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by drjlocarb View Post
I think that recommendation is from the high fat thread, not Nutritional Ketosis. The calories have to be higher in order to get the ratios to come out right. I would gain everything back if I followed that advice.
I agree. I don't really count calories but it does seem that eating to my protein and carb gram limits, they (calories) seem to fall to about 1100 - 1200 on average. I was hungry in the beginning and am still but not so much once I got my protein grams figured out and learned to keep carbs low at the same time. There was a big learning curve for me.

If I ever achieve my goal weight, I don't expect that I will be eating much differently. That part is crucial in my mind. If it is not sustainable, then why bother?

Quote:
I find that so amazing! Maybe I am eating too few calories. I can't figure out why, not only can I not lose fat weight/inches, but stop belly fat from increasing. I get between 1200 - 1400 cals and I am constantly lowering my coconut oil or raising it - trying to figure out if I'm getting too much fat 100gr to 120gr/day.

I'm 5'51/2" - about 130 - 46yrs and at my wits end. I am afraid to increase calories/fat. What do you think?
Dr. Phinney said quite clearly that if you are not losing and eating low carb and moderate protein, then to lower fat.
__________________
Cathy
Original start - Feb. 2000 180/125

"The energy content of food (calories) matters, but it is less important than the metabolic effect of food on our body." Dr. P. Attia

"dumping carbohydrates on your broken metabolism is tantamount to doing jumping jacks on two broken legs" -The Spark of Reason

“Eat animals. Mostly fat. Enjoy!

Last edited by clackley; 12-18-2012 at 06:44 AM..
clackley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 06:48 AM   #11
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 16,608
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by drjlocarb View Post
I think that recommendation is from the high fat thread, not Nutritional Ketosis. The calories have to be higher in order to get the ratios to come out right. I would gain everything back if I followed that advice.
I agree. I don't really count calories but it does seem that eating to my protein and carb gram limits, they (calories) seem to fall to about 1100 - 1200 on average. I was hungry in the beginning and am still but not so much once I got my protein grams figured out and learned to keep carbs low at the same time. There was a big learning curve for me.

If I ever achieve my goal weight, I don't expect that I will be eating much differently. That part is crucial in my mind. If it is not sustainable, then why bother?

Quote:
I find that so amazing! Maybe I am eating too few calories. I can't figure out why, not only can I not lose fat weight/inches, but stop belly fat from increasing. I get between 1200 - 1400 cals and I am constantly lowering my coconut oil or raising it - trying to figure out if I'm getting too much fat 100gr to 120gr/day.

I'm 5'51/2" - about 130 - 46yrs and at my wits end. I am afraid to increase calories/fat. What do you think?
It may be that you need to eat this way for a while. Are you testing for ketones? How long have you been eating this way? You also may be at your ideal weight. It is never discussed but if a too thin person eats a well formulated l/c,mp,hf woe, they will become 'normal weight' (Life Without Bread is my reference).
clackley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 09:01 AM   #12
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 124
Gallery: Bernsy
WOE: Atkins/Gary Taubes
I'm not new to LC. Started Nov 2004 and lost 50lbs and kept it off for quite some time. Felt unhealthy and weight coming back on and thought that I was getting next to nothing in fat and probably too much protein so I moved over to Atkins and now I've found you guys. A typical day is:
15gr Ground Flax Seed
1tsp Cod Liver Oil
1Tbsp Coconut Oil
B = 2 eggs + 6 or 12gr butter, coffee w/stevia or splenda
L =
70gr Avocado
59gr Mushrooms
48gr Green Pepper
4oz Ground Chicken Meat Loaf (homemade)
1Tbsp Olive oil, a spritz of Lemon and some Franks Red Hot
D =
1Tbsp Coconut Oil
6oz Chicken Thigh
88gr Broccoli
maybe 6gr butter

5 or 6 bottles of water/day
Push ups, crunches and some weights - not enough to do anything (I don't think)
400mg Magnesium Bisglycinate

Your help is most appreciated. I feel like I am going crazy!
Bernsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 06:57 PM   #13
Major LCF Poster!
 
mom2zeke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,591
Gallery: mom2zeke
Stats: 257/144.8/150
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis--Maintenance!
Start Date: August 6, 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
I'm not new to LC. Started Nov 2004 and lost 50lbs and kept it off for quite some time. Felt unhealthy and weight coming back on and thought that I was getting next to nothing in fat and probably too much protein so I moved over to Atkins and now I've found you guys. A typical day is:
15gr Ground Flax Seed
1tsp Cod Liver Oil
1Tbsp Coconut Oil
B = 2 eggs + 6 or 12gr butter, coffee w/stevia or splenda
L =
70gr Avocado
59gr Mushrooms
48gr Green Pepper
4oz Ground Chicken Meat Loaf (homemade)
1Tbsp Olive oil, a spritz of Lemon and some Franks Red Hot
D =
1Tbsp Coconut Oil
6oz Chicken Thigh
88gr Broccoli
maybe 6gr butter

5 or 6 bottles of water/day
Push ups, crunches and some weights - not enough to do anything (I don't think)
400mg Magnesium Bisglycinate

Your help is most appreciated. I feel like I am going crazy!
Do you have a breakdown of protein, carb, and fat grams and total calories for this menu? Have you always eaten the flax?
mom2zeke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2012, 10:28 AM   #14
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,925
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
I'm not new to LC. Started Nov 2004 and lost 50lbs and kept it off for quite some time. Felt unhealthy and weight coming back on and thought that I was getting next to nothing in fat and probably too much protein so I moved over to Atkins and now I've found you guys. A typical day is:
15gr Ground Flax Seed
1tsp Cod Liver Oil
1Tbsp Coconut Oil
B = 2 eggs + 6 or 12gr butter, coffee w/stevia or splenda
L =
70gr Avocado
59gr Mushrooms
48gr Green Pepper
4oz Ground Chicken Meat Loaf (homemade)
1Tbsp Olive oil, a spritz of Lemon and some Franks Red Hot
D =
1Tbsp Coconut Oil
6oz Chicken Thigh
88gr Broccoli
maybe 6gr butter

5 or 6 bottles of water/day
Push ups, crunches and some weights - not enough to do anything (I don't think)
400mg Magnesium Bisglycinate

Your help is most appreciated. I feel like I am going crazy!
My back of the envelope calculation is that your menu contains at least 72 grams of protein between the eggs, the chicken thighs, and meat loaf. That would be on the high side for me, personally; I'm 5'3'' and aiming for more like 50 grams of protein per day, but your requirements may be different from mine. How tall are you? How old are you and are you male or female? Does your body have a high proportion of muscle or not much muscle? All those things can affect how much protein you need to maintain lean muscle mass.

I agree with Kristen that it would be helpful if you used a tracker and told us the results in grams of fat, protein, and carbs and calories. Also, it's not clear to me if this is how you are eating when aiming for nutritional ketosis or how you were eating on Atkins without regard to protein versus fat amounts. The more information you provide, the more people here can provide appropriate advice.
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2012, 12:41 PM   #15
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 124
Gallery: Bernsy
WOE: Atkins/Gary Taubes
Quote:
Originally Posted by svenskamae View Post
My back of the envelope calculation is that your menu contains at least 72 grams of protein between the eggs, the chicken thighs, and meat loaf. That would be on the high side for me, personally; I'm 5'3'' and aiming for more like 50 grams of protein per day, but your requirements may be different from mine. How tall are you? How old are you and are you male or female? Does your body have a high proportion of muscle or not much muscle? All those things can affect how much protein you need to maintain lean muscle mass.

I agree with Kristen that it would be helpful if you used a tracker and told us the results in grams of fat, protein, and carbs and calories. Also, it's not clear to me if this is how you are eating when aiming for nutritional ketosis or how you were eating on Atkins without regard to protein versus fat amounts. The more information you provide, the more people here can provide appropriate advice.

I am female - 46yrs, 5'5 1/2" - I am using ****** to log my daily food intake.

My macros for a typical day around:
Yesterday = cals-1282, fat-106.4 gr, carb-20.5 gr (8.1 net) and pro-67.3 gr
Typical = cals-1231, fat-104.2 gr, carb-20.2 gr (8 net) and pro-60 gr
Bernsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2012, 12:50 PM   #16
Major LCF Poster!
 
mom2zeke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,591
Gallery: mom2zeke
Stats: 257/144.8/150
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis--Maintenance!
Start Date: August 6, 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
I am female - 46yrs, 5'5 1/2" - I am using ****** to log my daily food intake.

My macros for a typical day around:
Yesterday = cals-1282, fat-106.4 gr, carb-20.5 gr (8.1 net) and pro-67.3 gr
Typical = cals-1231, fat-104.2 gr, carb-20.2 gr (8 net) and pro-60 gr
Your numbers look pretty good. I'm not sure what to change.

What is your goal weight? And have you had your body fat tested? I ask because I am your same height and 130 does not seem overweight to me (21.3 BMI). If you are trying to lose vanity pounds you may find that it is a very slow and difficult process which may require very tight calorie restriction.
mom2zeke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 06:16 AM   #17
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 124
Gallery: Bernsy
WOE: Atkins/Gary Taubes
Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2zeke View Post
Your numbers look pretty good. I'm not sure what to change.

What is your goal weight? And have you had your body fat tested? I ask because I am your same height and 130 does not seem overweight to me (21.3 BMI). If you are trying to lose vanity pounds you may find that it is a very slow and difficult process which may require very tight calorie restriction.
I seem to have put on inches / fat and can't understand why. It may be that I was taking in too much protein and not nearly enough fat last year. I made the switch to the Atkins approach and now this, increasing fat. I eat no sugar, gave up chewing gum - just can't figure out why I am growing out of my pants and gaining belly fat. Everything I read says that you don't get fat from eating fat, so what is happening????? I would like to lose the extra fat I've put on and just maintain. Maybe I am taking in too much fat - is it possible? I like the health benefits of Coconut Oil (haven't been getting sick) so I would like to continue it but I wonder if it is too much for me? I take 2Tbsp/day along with butter and olive oil through the day. Do you think I am not eating enough calories?
Bernsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 09:50 AM   #18
Major LCF Poster!
 
tiva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: UP, Michigan
Posts: 2,930
Gallery: tiva
Stats: 5"6", 157/136/135, 53 yo
WOE: Paleo/Whole30
Start Date: 12/02
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
I seem to have put on inches / fat and can't understand why. It may be that I was taking in too much protein and not nearly enough fat last year. I made the switch to the Atkins approach and now this, increasing fat. I eat no sugar, gave up chewing gum - just can't figure out why I am growing out of my pants and gaining belly fat. Everything I read says that you don't get fat from eating fat, so what is happening????? I would like to lose the extra fat I've put on and just maintain. Maybe I am taking in too much fat - is it possible? I like the health benefits of Coconut Oil (haven't been getting sick) so I would like to continue it but I wonder if it is too much for me? I take 2Tbsp/day along with butter and olive oil through the day. Do you think I am not eating enough calories?
My guess is: welcome to perimenopause! You're 46, at a thin weight already for your height, but redistributing fat. Yep, that's often what happens to women. Exercise--particularly weight lifting, NOT light weights--good sleep, and less stress are ideal. Your diet sounds fine, and it doesn't sound as if you're eating too many calories or too few calories. Take measurements, and try not to worry about temporary gains. During perimenopause, your ovarian hormones are fluctuating wildly, and it's those rapid changes that can lead to strange (but often temporary) water retention.
tiva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 11:04 AM   #19
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 124
Gallery: Bernsy
WOE: Atkins/Gary Taubes
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiva View Post
My guess is: welcome to perimenopause! You're 46, at a thin weight already for your height, but redistributing fat. Yep, that's often what happens to women. Exercise--particularly weight lifting, NOT light weights--good sleep, and less stress are ideal. Your diet sounds fine, and it doesn't sound as if you're eating too many calories or too few calories. Take measurements, and try not to worry about temporary gains. During perimenopause, your ovarian hormones are fluctuating wildly, and it's those rapid changes that can lead to strange (but often temporary) water retention.
Actually, I just had a miscarriage. My doctor did a whole blood work up on me and I am not peri as yet. TOM is usually spot on. So it's got to be something else ....?
Bernsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 03:18 PM   #20
Senior LCF Member
 
natosha120's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 740
Gallery: natosha120
calories

bacon+grease
butter
cheese
eggs

and meats
porkekins

i tend to eat alot of those items am i ok plus been doing running and jump rope for cardio sedetary rest of day is this ok?
natosha120 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 05:14 PM   #21
Major LCF Poster!
 
mom2zeke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,591
Gallery: mom2zeke
Stats: 257/144.8/150
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis--Maintenance!
Start Date: August 6, 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
Actually, I just had a miscarriage. My doctor did a whole blood work up on me and I am not peri as yet. TOM is usually spot on. So it's got to be something else ....?
Fluctuating hormones aren't usually caught on just one test--and you can be regular and still have this going on.

The other thing that I would wonder about is if you're doing enough exercise to maintain and/or build LBM. The older we get the harder it is to maintain. It takes working out smartly (intensely, but not too often) to keep up that LBM. Stress and cortisol can also work against you--I'm not sure if that's a factor with you.
mom2zeke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 05:17 PM   #22
Major LCF Poster!
 
mom2zeke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,591
Gallery: mom2zeke
Stats: 257/144.8/150
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis--Maintenance!
Start Date: August 6, 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by natosha120 View Post
bacon+grease
butter
cheese
eggs

and meats
porkekins

i tend to eat alot of those items am i ok plus been doing running and jump rope for cardio sedetary rest of day is this ok?
Are you following a specific plan? Are you losing weight?

It doesn't look like you have any vegetables in your menu. Are you eating any?
mom2zeke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 06:56 PM   #23
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 16,608
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
I seem to have put on inches / fat and can't understand why. It may be that I was taking in too much protein and not nearly enough fat last year. I made the switch to the Atkins approach and now this, increasing fat. I eat no sugar, gave up chewing gum - just can't figure out why I am growing out of my pants and gaining belly fat. Everything I read says that you don't get fat from eating fat, so what is happening????? I would like to lose the extra fat I've put on and just maintain. Maybe I am taking in too much fat - is it possible? I like the health benefits of Coconut Oil (haven't been getting sick) so I would like to continue it but I wonder if it is too much for me? I take 2Tbsp/day along with butter and olive oil through the day. Do you think I am not eating enough calories?
What is the status of your thyroid? How much protein do you consume?

Nice to see another Torontonian!!

Last edited by clackley; 12-20-2012 at 06:57 PM..
clackley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 05:30 AM   #24
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 124
Gallery: Bernsy
WOE: Atkins/Gary Taubes
Quote:
Originally Posted by clackley View Post
What is the status of your thyroid? How much protein do you consume?

Nice to see another Torontonian!!
Hey fellow Torontonian!

My thyroid is good - just had some bloodwork done. I'm getting between 67 and 80 grams of protein/day - 100 - 110 grams of fat. Just don't get it! So uncomfortable in my clothes. Never thought I would feel this way again!! HELP please ...
Bernsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 05:38 AM   #25
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 16,608
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Problem with thyroid testing here is that they only test TSH and sometime they will test for antibodies but that appears to be the extent of testing and it is wholly inadequate in my opinion. Do you have an endo or are you seeing a practical care physician? I don't have an answer for you but there is some good information on stopthethyroidmadness which may help.
clackley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 05:45 AM   #26
Major LCF Poster!
 
mom2zeke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2,591
Gallery: mom2zeke
Stats: 257/144.8/150
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis--Maintenance!
Start Date: August 6, 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernsy View Post
Hey fellow Torontonian!

My thyroid is good - just had some bloodwork done. I'm getting between 67 and 80 grams of protein/day - 100 - 110 grams of fat. Just don't get it! So uncomfortable in my clothes. Never thought I would feel this way again!! HELP please ...
Just to dig in a little on this, what thyroid tests did you get with your bloodwork? I was told for years I was "fine" when actually my thyroid was not working correctly. My previous doctors were using the old range for TSH and not doing any further tests. It took a doctor up on the latest TSH range (.3 to 3.0--which is still way too wide according to my new endo) who listened to my symptoms to catch my thyroid issues. And even then I had to switch doctors and press to get the correct tests. TSH is a pituitary hormone, to really know what's going on you need to test free T3 and free T4.
mom2zeke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 10:37 AM   #27
Senior LCF Member
 
natosha120's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 740
Gallery: natosha120
spinach, but very lo carb plan carnivore type...today tried to go 3 meals

butter chik breast,spinach, 3cups water 2 sf 2carb fiber chews, cheese 2 thin slices, 2 eggs

lil snaple diet n 2oz cream cheese n 4strips bacon. n 3eggs, lil spinach..

and guts now sounding like a storm had liquid but no help..

weight stalled and just added cheese was not doing till yesterday

what to do eat or not
natosha120 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:56 AM.


Copyright ©1999-2014 Friends Forums LLC. All rights reserved. - Terms of Service | Privacy Policy
LowCarbFriends® is a registered mark of Friends Forums, LLC.