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Old 12-01-2012, 09:42 AM   #1
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High Fat NK 80/15/5 - December Version

Hello Everyone!

Welcome to December's High Fat 80/15/5 NK thread!

Our goal is a healthy LC high fat macro and mandatory daily protein regimen resulting in a state of Nutritional Ketosis. The ideal ratios would be 80/15/5 F/P/C but the execution is to eat the required protein amount in grams and filling out the rest of your calories in fat with carbs being as low as possible.

So as long as you are eating your required protein, any day that results in 70+% Fat macro is a win. If you can reach 80%+ so much the better but it is only a goal to strive for not a mandate.

Protein
First determine your protein requirements. There are several ways to do it. You need to know the appropriate goal weight for a person of your height and frame size. Your protein is calculated from it so it is important.

Here are 3 ways to calculate your daily protein requirements.

------

Dr. Phinney (the guy that co-Authored 3 books on LC) recommends 1.5g per goal kg weight.

Your goal kg is (goal_weight/2.2) so this formula is (goal_weight/2.2)*1.5 = protein grams daily.

------

The Kwasniewski formula:

((Height in cm)-100) +/-10% = Protein Grams

Technical note: This formula results in about .9 to 1.1 spread in protein grams per goal kg. This is actually based on goal weight for a person of your height because Kwasniewski's calculation gives you your approximate ideal/goal weight in kg. The results are a bit low particularly if you go with the -10% figure.

------

And the formula used in the thread that started it all, Kristn's first NK thread back in September:

Multiply your goal weight times your desired body fat percentage. This will give you your desired Lean Body Mass (LBM).

Multiply your LBM by 0.6. This will give you the low end of daily protein consumption. Your LBM in grams is the high end of your consumption.

For example, if I desire to weigh 150 lbs with 18% body fat, my target LBM is 150 * (1-.18) = 123 lbs. This means I should consume between 73.8g of protein (123 * 0.6) and 123g of protein per day.

Technical note: This gives you a range of 1.1 to 1.8g per goal kg weight.
Protein Part II
As you can see from the three different methods there is a wide range of guesstimated protein requirements for an individual. The USRDA, for contrast, recommends about 40g of protein a day! Unless your goal weight is very low or you are very short 40g of protein is not enough protein. Take care to get enough protein in every day to protect your lean body mass (everything that is not fat) while losing or maintaining weight.

A frequent question is how to get protein right and get fat high. Probably the easiest approach is to eat fatty protein. And don't restrict your calories too much.
Calories
You can't lose weight if you are consuming far more calories than expending. That is true although it is usually used as a pejorative by the anti-LC crowd as some sort of a gotcha.

There are a lot of BMR (Basal Metabolic Rate) calorie calculators on the web. These calculators can give you a guesstimate on a daily calorie goal but they are very much just a guess.

Dr. Phinney gives a range of 30-35kCal per goal kg weight. He states that 35kCal is *the* norm and 30kCal is for a very obese person that cannot be active because of weight/health problems and is very sedentary.

Phinney's formula for daily calories: ((goal_weight/2.2)*30) or ((goal_weight/2.2)*35).

So, if your goal weight is 150 then (150/2.2)*35 = 2386

Once you know your protein grams and have an idea of your daily calorie goal you can work on getting there with a combination of protein and fat.

On calories, consider this post if you think that you have to have very low calories to lose weight.
Macros
Hear me loud and clear on this because it is important - macro ratios are an important tool but they can be very deceptive because relative percentages are deceptive. The three macros and the fourth control (calories) form a rubber band that can stretch into some surprising shapes but still look like a well formulated LC regimen when it is not. So read this part carefully.

You know your protein and you know what Phinney has to say about calories so how do you get your macros?

Phinney states that NK is reached with 65-85% Fat / ideal protein consumption / under 50g Total Carbs a day.

Going with Phinney's daily caloric floor of 35*kg and using our 150 pound example:

(150/2.2)*35 = 2386 calories.
(150/2.2)*1.5 = 102g protein.

Protein is 4 calories per gram so...

(102*4)= 408
408/2386= 17% for our protein macro percentage.

If we commit all remaining calories to fat... 2386-408 = 1978 -> 1978/9 = 220 grams of fat. Stay with me.

How much, as a percentage, is that of total calories? 1978/2386 = ~83%

Right now your macros look like this: 83/17/0

Phinney gave the range of fat ratio for NK as 65 to 85 percent. That range is where your total carb grams come from. It is very difficult to actually eat zero carbs so it is unlikely that you'll hit 83% fat on any given day without a herculean effort or risking your LBM by shorting yourself on protein grams.

This fat macro % range is also where you get your flexibility on calorie goals too.

You can eat ~30g total carbs and still be in the 70% bracket for your fat macro. Pushing closer to the ceiling of 50 total grams pushes your fat macro down to the 65% area.

Remember that the calorie intake we are describing in this example is for your *goal* weight. That means that until you reach goal you are in fact eating a calorie deficit at your current weight. Think about that for a minute.

It can be confusing at first, second and third glance. Don't be put off by that. I'll be happy to help you figure it out if you post to the thread or PM me. I'm giving a whole lot of information for the folks that want to give it a shot without having to post unless they want to post. Hi there lurkers.
Macros II
Having worked through how to figure out your macros I wanted to reiterate what I said earlier about them. They are a tool. Use them to inform you but recognize their weakness and potential to mislead you.

For example, say you are planning what you are about to eat or what you will eat for the day. You get your protein grams right but your fat macro is 60%. You can see right there that either your calories are too low or your carbs are too high. Or your carbs are too high if your calories are right.

On the other hand your percentages could look spiffy, say 73/20/7, but your calories are way too low which means you are very low on protein and your LBM is at risk. See what I mean?

You could forego the whole rigmarole and just use absolute grams for fat, protein and carbs and be good too.
Fat
A quick word about Fat because it is important. Not all Fat is created equal. Soy oil is not a good fat - it is a highly polyunsaturated fat. Use mono-unsaturated and saturated fats. Coconut oil, real butter, olive oil, animal fats, etc. If you aren't sure about the oil google it. Don't sabotage yourself by assuming what the Standard American Diet considers a 'healthy fat' is actually a healthy fat for LC.
Food Logging
There are several really good food loggers. Direct linking is not possible per the TOS of LCF so just google around. Try at least 3, using them at the same time, so you can get a feel for which one suits you best. Most of them have smart phone companion apps if that is important to you.

You really have to log your food if you are going to be successful at the challenge of 80/15/5. That doesn't make it a ball and chain that you are forever saddled with, but your short term goal is virtually undoable without accurately logging what you eat.
Daily/Weekly Weigh-Ins
Do you weigh in daily or weekly? Totally up to you! I weigh in daily because I like the constant feedback. *BUT*, if you choose to do daily weigh-ins you have to accept that daily weights are a snapshot in time only. They are interesting data points but that is all and they are meaningless without the context of time. In other words, weigh in daily if you want but pay attention to the trend not the individual snapshot of weight.

Consider the fact that per Phinney your body maintains about a 4 pound water weight window. Zero to 4 pounds of liquids sloshing around inside you. See this post for a pretty good explanation about this window and how it affects weigh-ins daily, weekly, even monthly.
Links of Interest
November's 80/15/5 thread.
October's 80/15/5 thread.

The original Nutritional Ketosis thread - very, very long but lots of good posts all throughout it and it was where I discovered the protein requirements element of the big picture. Kudos and a warm, warm thanks to Kristn for starting that thread! The last post in that thread chains to the next thread and so on as new threads are created.

An NK oriented menu thread.
Sodium
Low carb - it is not a low sodium way of eating or living. You *must* get your sodium in or your body will suffer. It might suffer silently for a long time before it finally breaks. Or it might express itself as agonizing leg cramps. Those cramps are caused by dehydration and/or a potassium deficiency but if you are a low sodium consumer then your sodium deficiency is contributing to your potassium loss and dehydration. The body throws potassium overboard if it has to choose between potassium and sodium. That is how important sodium is to your body. Phinney advises 5 Grams of sodium daily! That is a lot of sodium. Fear not! Unless you are going out of your way to eat low sodium you are probably getting 2 to 4 grams in your food every day. A little extra use of the salt shaker will fix up most people just fine. It is worth taking a look at how much sodium you are getting if you use a food logger. Table salt is not one for one on sodium grams. Google for the conversion 'how much sodium in table salt'. If you've been a casual low sodium person then you should pay careful attention to what you are eating and shun your former salt scoffing ways.

Consider whatever health conditions you might have when contemplating how to address the sodium issue with your way of eating.
Supplements
If you aren't supplementing start now. It is important. Here are a few tips on it to get you started.

Most Americans, probably most people worldwide, are magnesium deficient. Magnesium is a wonder mineral that has far ranging benefits. For LC'rs, on top of all of the other wonderful things it does, it also helps with regularity. It is a must. Go easy! Here me now and avoid an unpleasant reaction. Don't go full dose all at once. Ramp up to whatever dose you set for yourself. Start at 1/4 to 1/2 the RDA and slowly go up over a week or two's time. If you react to your dose don't panic. It will pass. Lower the dose and take a little more time. I currently take 2xRDA.

Google 'LLVLC-ep-602-morley-robbins', it should be the first hit, for an excellent free podcast about this very important mineral.

Potassium. All LC'rs should probably be supplementing with potassium. Dr. Eades of Protein Power advises 4 of the 99mg pills while on induction and then 2 of the 99mg pills, I believe, afterwards. If you are experiencing cramps don't overlook water intake. Dehydration causes awful cramps too. The best thing is pure water. Even if your sodium is right you probably should still supplement with potassium because LC is a water shedding way of eating and that is where a lot of potassium exits the body.

Multi-vitamin. I doubt there are many LC'rs not taking a multivitamin but if you happen to be one, go to the store now and buy some. Really.

The rest. There are others that you probably should be taking daily too. Google 'atlcx-26-dr-jonny-bowden', it should be the first hit, for a free podcast that is excellent about supplements in general for LC. Jimmy Moore asks the fantastic question 'what are your trapped on a desert island choices'.
Notes
Join in the conversation any time. Feel free to ask any questions you have. We are all happy to help you. Lurkers are welcome too.

Last edited by reddarin; 12-01-2012 at 09:49 AM..
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:42 AM   #2
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Frame Size

Measuring Your Frame Size


Take your measurement on the forearm side (rather than the hand/finger side) of the wrist bone using a tape measure. Below are the various frame sizes per measurements for men and women. Once you know your frame size you can google 'height weight frame size chart' and find an appropriate goal weight for someone of your height and frame size.

Don't take it for granted that you are small framed or large framed. Measure it.

Women:

Height under 5'2"
Small = wrist size less than 5.5"
Medium = wrist size 5.5" to 5.75"
Large = wrist size over 5.75"

Height 5'2" to 5' 5"
Small = wrist size less than 6"
Medium = wrist size 6" to 6.25"
Large = wrist size over 6.25"

Height over 5' 5"
Small = wrist size less than 6.25"
Medium = wrist size 6.25" to 6.5"
Large = wrist size over 6.5"


Men:

Height over 5' 5"
Small = wrist size 5.5" to 6.5"
Medium = wrist size 6.5" to 7.5"
Large = wrist size over 7.5"
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:43 AM   #3
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Calories

Original Post:
Here is an interesting thought for those of you consuming very low calories daily.

A ketogenic diet like the one we are doing makes the body think it is starving. I mean, the body reacts to a VLC diet in many ways the same way it would react to your actually being starved. That is one reason that you burn body fat once you are keto-adapted.

Now, follow me on this...

Your body is already 'starving'.

You choose to eat too few calories.

What will your body do? It is going to try hard to not lose weight because you are restricting calories too much for *you*. The body doesn't know what is going on or that you are tightly controlling calories - it just knows that the last x number of days it needed 3000 calories and you gave it 1400 calories. It panics. It releases cortisol which inhibits body fat usage. It does everything it can to survive this mysterious low calorie period.

So. If you are watching your calories and your body is not responding, try bumping up your calories a bit for a few days to see what happens. Remember that a daily scale reading is a snapshot not a trend and watch the trend.
------------

Original Post(Shelley posted this):
Re: calories.....I had a very good friend that went from 270# to 110# and she's a nutritionist (low carb/keto-adapted for years). She warned me to NEVER EVER lower my calories below 1550. Said that it will take away my LBM. For the last couple weeks or so, I lowered my calories from 1600 to the 1200 range (950-1350 or so) and then did my weekly average of LBM and fat %age per the Tanita. I lost 3# of LBM ad gained 3# of FAT!!!!!! And that was at the lower calories. So, I believe Major Red told us that he listened to a podcast that said just that....too low of calories will take away your lean body mass....and I am proof of that for the last 2 weeks calculations. It also trains the body to "need" less calories, so if you want to always stay that low for the rest of your life, you can lose weight now, and then will be stuck at those low calories.

Last edited by reddarin; 12-01-2012 at 09:45 AM..
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:44 AM   #4
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Weight and weighing in

Weight Fluctuations

To paraphrase the esteemed Dr. Phinney....

Everyone has a 'window' of weight. The body is fairly lax about how much fluid it retains at any given time and this is generally about 4 pounds worth.

Think of it as one of those horizontal lava doodads with the blue fluid doing a seesaw motion.

So.

You are kicking butt and shedding weight. You weigh in at the low point on the seesaw with your fluid balance low.

A day or a week goes by and you weigh in again. You *have* lost 2 pounds. *But* the seesaw of fluid is now at its high end completely masking your 2 pounds and possibly even showing a gain.

The next day you weigh in again, having lost another .5 pound off your body for real but the blue fluid has tilted to its low end this time and WHOOSH you see a 5 pound drop!

That is why daily weigh ins are interesting but if you happen to be blessed with a wildly tilting blue doodad you are gonna have baffling daily, even weekly, weigh ins. Depending on how fine tuned your way of eating is and how fast or slow you lose weight, Phinney even pushed it out to a full month of this phenomenon masking a net loss - 1 pound a week lost for 4 pounds total for the month but your lava machine is tilted to the high point and you see a disappointing scale reading. No weight lost on the scale or even a few ounces gained.

Last edited by reddarin; 12-01-2012 at 09:51 AM..
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:58 AM   #5
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Hello December, how on earth did you get here so fast???? I can't believe how times flys and the older you get, the faster it goes. I always say I feel like I am hurtling towards death

Looks like officially I lost 1 1/2 lbs in Nov. I am ok with that, I know it isn't much but I swear, by my clothing you would think it would be at least 5 lbs or more. And, I have been lazy about logging recently, maybe after the holidays I will get back to that. Does that mean I am eating more carbs, etc? Nope, I eat very few carbs but I know my ratios aren't as good as they are when I log. We will see how I do in December and if I feel like I must, I will get back to logging, I KNOW it helps and is very important to do until you get used to eating this way and know what you can and can't eat.

Red, so happy you feel like you are ready to get totally back on board. We missed you while you were suffering the pain of stopping the smoking.

Welcome to all our newcomers and lurkers who have joined in, this thread and group are great and great help and support and filled with knowledge, well, not me, I am not filled with knowledge but I am good at support and as I have said, I just copy off Reds homework.

Welcome to December dear friends, it can be a very stressful month and a hard one to keep our WOE in check, but you can do it, you will be ever so happy on January 1 if you stick to your guns.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:23 AM   #6
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Great job red!!did you see my post I gained another 1.8 lbs what do you think is going on??i only lost .4 last month...
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:27 AM   #7
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Red youas always.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:28 AM   #8
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Hi ya'll
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:29 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Great job red!!did you see my post I gained another 1.8 lbs what do you think is going on??i only lost .4 last month...
I'm not sure Becky. Were you logging your food?

I think the 1.8 is just post trip stuff. I wouldn't worry about that too much till you get back to a steady state of NK.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:29 AM   #10
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AMAZING intro Red. Thanks again for all that you do for us. It is so appreciated!
Glad you are back in the game and congratulations on licking the cigarettes.
Happy December to all of us. Looks like we are all on track for healthy new year!
Thanks to all of you for sharing your journey - it is helpful in so many ways!
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:31 AM   #11
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Fit day...
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:33 AM   #12
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Do you think the nuts and cheese took me out of NK ? Do you think it will take me long to get back there.if I keep my NK at 80-85 fat? Thanks for all you do..
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:34 AM   #13
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Hi everyone,
Ive been lurking for a while and really appreciate all your information, insights and encouraging posts. I tried this a couple weeks ago with a little success, though admittedly short term. Im ready for a longer term commitment. I would appreciate if you could run my numbers for me reddarin just to verify Im on the right track.
Current weight 135.9
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Height 51-1/2
Exercise Light to Moderate
Wrist 6-1/2

Thanks in advance!
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:35 AM   #14
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Becky, I can only answer this based on myself and testing for ketones daily. Nuts and cheese do not take me out of ketosis. They may slow weight loss or I guess could cause a gain b/c of high calories, depending on whatever else I ate. Did you eat out quite a bit, you never know for sure what is in restaurant food.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:43 AM   #15
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Yes I did eat lots of extra nuts!,,guess ill have to figure out what to do for Xmas since I'm going to d for 12 days but it will be easer there cause they let me do all the cooking.but in feb.i go to Puerto Rico . I hate eating out any more.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:44 AM   #16
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:46 AM   #17
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Terri this is a great place..
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:47 AM   #18
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Yay! I've been so excited to check in...

Hello Everybody!

Down 1.6 today. My weight has not budged for weeks and weeks. I didn't hit my numbers yesterday. Came in low in fat and calories. Went like this:

Protein: 92.5 (92)
Fat g 57 (198)
Calories 1227 (1800+ floor)

Today I got a head start by adding butter and HWC to my 1st cup of coffee and HWC and VCO to my 2nd.

I slept well, no hip pain. That started to get better with no wheat, almost gone at night now.

Funny, right in the middle of posting this my laptop shut down (low bat). Obstacles have thrown themselves in my way this morning, keeping me from this thread. HAH! I'm in.

Thanks Red, you DO rock!!
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:49 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blonde with a Rose View Post
Yay! I've been so excited to check in...

Hello Everybody!

Down 1.6 today. My weight has not budged for weeks and weeks. I didn't hit my numbers yesterday. Came in low in fat and calories. Went like this:

Protein: 92.5 (92)
Fat g 57 (198)
Calories 1227 (1800+ floor)

Today I got a head start by adding butter and HWC to my 1st cup of coffee and HWC and VCO to my 2nd.

I slept well, no hip pain. That started to get better with no wheat, almost gone at night now.

Funny, right in the middle of posting this my laptop shut down (low bat). Obstacles have thrown themselves in my way this morning, keeping me from this thread. HAH! I'm in.

Thanks Red, you DO rock!!
so happy for the new low!!! Congrats
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:52 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffy45 View Post
Hello December, how on earth did you get here so fast???? I can't believe how times flys and the older you get, the faster it goes. I always say I feel like I am hurtling towards death

Looks like officially I lost 1 1/2 lbs in Nov. I am ok with that, I know it isn't much but I swear, by my clothing you would think it would be at least 5 lbs or more. And, I have been lazy about logging recently, maybe after the holidays I will get back to that. Does that mean I am eating more carbs, etc? Nope, I eat very few carbs but I know my ratios aren't as good as they are when I log. We will see how I do in December and if I feel like I must, I will get back to logging, I KNOW it helps and is very important to do until you get used to eating this way and know what you can and can't eat.
Buffy, a loss is a loss! Do you take your measurements?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerriMM View Post
Hi everyone,
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:56 AM   #21
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Wow.....Major Red, you outdid yourself on the start of the December thread. I am printing off all you wrote as it's just fantastic.

I had my meeting yesterday with the woman at the gym that I plan to work with. She's the new "head" person that helps people with programs, how to use the equipment, etc. and she takes on very few personal training people. She took me after our 45 min consultation. I took both Phinney/Volek books for her to read. She was very familiar with Volek and had read many of his journal studies over the years and she eats moderate protein and moderate to high fat and was curious about NK. She was excited to work with me and we discussed doctors, food consumption and obviously exercise. She agrees that weight lifting is THE way to reduce fat, strengthen the body/bones, etc.

Anyway, bottom line is that she is going to "tweak" my life program of exercise/food and rehab of my many dance injuries. I"m so excited.

Major Red...would you mind if I printed her off a copy of all that you wrote above? I can just "tell her" to read the books, but you have written a manuscript worthy of publication in my opinion and I think she would greatly enjoy reading it.

Becky/PC.....for me, it's the nuts and cheese and you are just now readjusting to being back home and getting to eat the way you want to/should. Don't worry about that gain just yet. Stress also causes gain and all the traveling and not being home is stressful even if you are having a grand time. Not to worry. It will come back off. I can't eat any nuts or seeds other than a small amount of macadamia nuts...waiting for them to hit the stores for the "holidays" which is when I buy them.

Fabulous start to December!!!!! Another note on me. I upped my protein and calories and have started losing on the scale. And, for Buffy, loved your Liz Claiborne shorts story, so I got out my "goal cords" and put them on and zipped them up yesterday! How can that be with 20# extra on my body?? Well, 18# now. I wouldn't wear them out (a bit of a lifter feeling if you know what I mean!), but, like you, they zipped and buttoned. What a shock of surprise and encouragement that it's not about the number on the scale AT ALL, but how we fit in our clothing.

Another thing (sorry this is so long). Major Red...I am so happy for you and so proud of you for kicking the cigarettes and hanging in there...and not leaving us! I can hear it in your emails that you are back!!!!! And we are every so happy for you and for ourselves as well. Welcome home!!!!! Big hugs of appreciation.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:56 AM   #22
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Hi everyone! I have to agree with all the advice here - at least in a theoretical sense.

However, after 20 years on an extraordinarily low-fat diet and becoming quite overweight/obese, I have developed severe metabolic derangement. I have been testing ketones, body weight and %bf for several months now. I test ketones and weight every morning in a fasted state. After many trials and various diet combinations, I have finally hit on one that is resulting in weight loss for me.

While too low calories likely will be counterproductive for many, for those of us with extremely stubborn fat cells and resting metabolic rates that move at a snail's pace, dropping calories very low may be the only thing that prompts fat loss. I must keep my calories below 900/day. Usually I stay around 800. I feel fine, too. I am generally 80-85% f, 3-5% c, and the rest protein. I have also had to cut out the vast majority of dairy and nuts. Thank goodness I suffer no ill effects from bacon!!

Once I reach my goal weight - about 10-12 more lbs, I will begin to experiment with gaining muscle. One of the other problems I have is weight training throwing off the scales something terrible. It is very disheartening to work hard then see an extra 5 lbs on the scale the next day. I understand it's obviously not fat, but it makes it very hard to track weight loss. So, now that I have weight loss working for me (about 1.5 - 2 lbs/week), I can stay the course. When I am at my ideal, I can experiment again with added protein and calories to see what works best to increase muscle and decrease %bf.

BTW - my ketones range from about .7 as a low in the morning to about 2.2 as a high for in the evening.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:57 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by TerriMM View Post
Hi everyone,
Ive been lurking for a while and really appreciate all your information, insights and encouraging posts. I tried this a couple weeks ago with a little success, though admittedly short term. Im ready for a longer term commitment. I would appreciate if you could run my numbers for me reddarin just to verify Im on the right track.
Current weight 135.9
Goal weight 122
Height 51-1/2
Exercise Light to Moderate
Wrist 6-1/2

Thanks in advance!
Terri
Hi Terri and welcome!

Your height and frame size puts your current weight in the right range for you.

Here is what the spreadsheet comes up with though...

Goal Weight: 122

NK Page:
(x*(1-.18)*0.6 = 60-100

Exercise Page:
(x/2.2)*0.8 = 44
(x/2.2)*1.2 = 67
(x/2.2)*1.5 = 83
(x/2.2)*1.8 = 100

Dr. Phinney's recommendation is 1.5g/kg that results in 83g protein daily.

For a goal weight of 122 the calorie goal would be : 1941 (35kCal/kg) with a floor of 1664 (30kCal/kg - for an obese and/or very sedentary person).

Calories: 1941

Protein grams: 83 (332 ~ calories)
Fat grams: 179 (1611 ~ calories)
Carb grams: ??

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Old 12-01-2012, 11:00 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by mizzcase View Post
Buffy, a loss is a loss! Do you take your measurements?



I measure every Monday morning, inches go down as slowly as my weight but they are going down and clothes getting looser every week.
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:02 AM   #25
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so happy for the new low!!! Congrats
Thank Buffy ! I'm looking forward to getting under 200 and staying under! I haven't been there since last November, for about 5 minutes.

Red, congrats on kicking cigs. I quit (again) in July, I used nicotine patches and I'm never gonna do it again.
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:02 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shelley View Post
Fabulous start to December!!!!! Another note on me. I upped my protein and calories and have started losing on the scale. And, for Buffy, loved your Liz Claiborne shorts story, so I got out my "goal cords" and put them on and zipped them up yesterday! How can that be with 20# extra on my body?? Well, 18# now. I wouldn't wear them out (a bit of a lifter feeling if you know what I mean!), but, like you, they zipped and buttoned. What a shock of surprise and encouragement that it's not about the number on the scale AT ALL, but how we fit in our clothing.

.
Wow Shelley, so glad to hear that you have a weight loss and got into your goal cords!!! Fantastic!! Amazing that upping calories helps us lose weight, I LOVE IT.
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:06 AM   #27
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Do you think the nuts and cheese took me out of NK ? Do you think it will take me long to get back there.if I keep my NK at 80-85 fat? Thanks for all you do..
Yes, absolutely since you ate too many. Not very many nuts are LC friendly either because they are high carb. So easy to over eat on those tasty things.

When I quit smoking I got a 3 pound bag of almonds from Sams (really great price on them there) and I ate that sucker in about 3 days! heh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Yes I did eat lots of extra nuts!,,guess ill have to figure out what to do for Xmas since I'm going to d for 12 days but it will be easer there cause they let me do all the cooking.but in feb.i go to Puerto Rico . I hate eating out any more.
Well, if it weren't for the trip I'd say just don't worry too much about the gain. But you are a bit of a slow loser, isn't that right?

Try to figure out a few things you can snack on that are as close to zero carb as possible. You might go over on protein and calories but I think you'll recover from that a lot faster than plain old carbs.

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Old 12-01-2012, 11:09 AM   #28
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Looks like officially I lost 1 1/2 lbs in Nov.
Congrats!!!
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:09 AM   #29
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Amen red??thanks so much,I'm feeling better already, I just love those almonds.and cheese.
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:10 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post
Protein
And the formula used in the thread that started it all, Kristn's first NK thread back in September:

Multiply your goal weight times your desired body fat percentage. This will give you your desired Lean Body Mass (LBM).

Multiply your LBM by 0.6. This will give you the low end of daily protein consumption. Your LBM in grams is the high end of your consumption.

For example, if I desire to weigh 150 lbs with 18% body fat, my target LBM is 150 * (1-.18) = 123 lbs. This means I should consume between 73.8g of protein (123 * 0.6) and 123g of protein per day.

Technical note: This gives you a range of 1.1 to 1.8g per goal kg weight.[/indent]
Hi fat burners! I'm just popping in here to let you all know that I'm thinking about not continuing the original NK thread for December. Because of that I feel the need to clarify this attribution to the NK thread.

This equation actually comes from Chapter 7, Protein in the Phinney/Volek book, The Art and Science of Low Carb Performance. I understand that it contradicts some of what Dr. Phinney has said in earlier books and interviews, but it isn't something that we made up over in NK--it actually comes from the latest book by these guys. I encourage everyone to read this book--this is the book that Jimmy Moore used as his blueprint for his NK experiment also.

I would also suggest that using 18% as the default body fat percentage for women, especially middle aged women, is a bit misleading. Most women's goal body fat% will fall in the 20-30% range.
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50 yo
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257/144.8/150
BF% Goal 26%/20%/20%
February Nutritional Ketosis...Are you in the zone?
Nutritional Ketosis Thread Information and Posts of Interest
My Maintenance Journal
Original weight 2001--257 Maintaining 165-175 from 2002-March 2012
March 2012 to August 2012--175/150 Made Goal 8/27/12!
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