Low Carb Friends  
Netrition.com - Tools - Reviews - Faces - Recipes - Home


Go Back   Low Carb Friends > Eating and Exercise Plans > Weight Loss Plans > Nutritional Ketosis / High Fat, Low Carb
Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-09-2012, 06:30 AM   #691
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulabob View Post
I just think Phinney's #s are very high. She has already had a week of no response, so adjusting downward might be a good idea. Most of us ladies have lost on quite a bit less than 1.5. I eat around 1-1.1 per kilogram total weight. If you mean of LBM that's different. For us ladies usually significantly.

Not disagreeing really, just throwing out some thoughts. Us weight loss resistant girls often have to tweek.

I even tried the low end of Rosedale's recommendations once...didn't love it but also did not lose any LBM going down to 40-45 grams per day.
I will lay out my thinking on this matter. As I've said before, everyone is N of 1.

Yes, I see that argument a lot about post-menopausal, pre-menopausal, this demographic, that demographic.

It isn't a very compelling argument to me because Phinney and Volek completely failed to address it in the Living book - a book written with a target audience of health care professionals.

That menopausal demographic is not getting smaller or staying the same either. The Baby Boom is upon us and that segment is exploding in size. Yet Phinney and Volek both stuck with 1.5g/kg in the Living book for the HC industry.

That either means they were unaware of it or they relied upon qualified health care providers to set some lower level without any guidance whatsoever.

Or... they believe 1.5g/kg is wrong for very few people indeed.

I take it for granted that they also didn't mention various demographics within the performance community in the athletic oriented Performance book which has a much more granular formula for tweaking BF% and sculpting one's body. I can't recall anyone saying, "wait! in the Performance book for post-menopause..." and to hear it told that book for exercise people is *it*. The *last* word on what is correct for NK for all people for all time forever and ever amen. I wax facetious heh.

There are a lot of bad things that come from low protein intake and few if any warning signs from what I understand.

That is why I think 1.5g/kg is correct and the best place to start and the last place to tweak downwards.

But I think I have said all that before and as convincing as it seems to me it must lack the essential je ne sais quoi.

Nothing dishes out a beat down to reason like disappointment.
reddarin is offline  

Sponsored Links
Old 12-09-2012, 06:40 AM   #692
Big Yapper!!!!
 
Buffy45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Lewisville, TX USA
Posts: 8,761
Gallery: Buffy45
Stats: Type 2 Diabetic as of 6/1/08
WOE: LC/MP/HF
Start Date: Restart 9/3/2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Morning all,been busy at my new consignment store,and auctions.
Weight this morning 162.6 a new low for me,going to work on getting protein up this week.been eating breakfast this week that helps a lot.
How many of you eat veggies? And how much?
Becky, , congrats on the new store and the new low! You are doing great!
I don't eat hardly any veggies.
Buffy45 is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:42 AM   #693
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by greedo5150 View Post
I am so excited to join you all. You have a lot of great info to share. I wanted to introduce myself. I am just starting but my initial data looks good! : ) I have tried a lot of different diets and nothing makes me lose weight and the only one that makes me feel good is a low carb one. So I am going to give NK a shot! I am using my blood ketone monitor to make sure I don't second guess my self on things-which I do.

Thanks for the tip about the Lyle book on Ketogenic Diets. Did you know it is free as a PDF file? I am glad I found that out because it is a resourceful book.

Excited to join you all,

Lori

Hi Lori! Welcome
reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:44 AM   #694
Big Yapper!!!!
 
Buffy45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Lewisville, TX USA
Posts: 8,761
Gallery: Buffy45
Stats: Type 2 Diabetic as of 6/1/08
WOE: LC/MP/HF
Start Date: Restart 9/3/2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post
Ah. This is where you need to tweak with lean protein. Have an extra egg and one less bacon strip sort of thing. Or just less bacon and a lean protein-centric snack later. Maybe have a pork chop with breakfast instead of bacon. Or turkey bacon.

See Red, that is why we HAVE to have you here daily, to catch things like that. I hadn't thought of starting the day with a leaner protein, so that I could eat more protein, . Thank you for pointing that out. Plus, I have been on this bacon kick now for over a week, about time to get tired of it and want something else for breakfast. I have a very crazy busy day today so think I might just do a J Robb protein shake, that packs like 30 grams right there. Will add some cream to up the calories b/c the shake itself is very low calorie. Thanks for catching that.
__________________
Buffy
Buffy45 is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:46 AM   #695
Blabbermouth!!!
 
paulabob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,544
Gallery: paulabob
Stats: 204/124.6/110 49%/27.4%/20% 5'2"
WOE: Atkins/hHcg/Optimal whatever works
Start Date: restart March '10
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post
That is why I think 1.5g/kg is correct and the best place to start and the last place to tweak downwards.

But I think I have said all that before and as convincing as it seems to me it must lack the essential je ne sais quoi.

Nothing dishes out a beat down to reason like disappointment.
Just want to point out that the women who started the thread back in June and July all lost at well under 1.5 g/kg. In fact I don't know any ladies who have lost at the 1.5 level continuously.

I started at the 1.5 level - that's where I was in Atkins and that's where I had stalled for the last 4 years.

These numbers may just depend on where you are coming from, and what your particular "setpoint" is for protein, and if you are coming to this plan after having stalled on lowcarb. Certainly the 1.5 level for me means burning excess protein as glucose and raising my morning blood sugar numbers.
__________________
Paula
2010 Atkins 204/191.6 HCG/hHCG 191.6/176/165.4/156.4/147.8 (4 rounds)
2011 hHCG 148.6/140.8/134.8/129.2 (3 rounds) JUDDD 125.6 (sept-dec)
2012 lowish Optimal calories, June25th 132.6/124.6/110
paulabob is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:46 AM   #696
Big Yapper!!!!
 
Buffy45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Lewisville, TX USA
Posts: 8,761
Gallery: Buffy45
Stats: Type 2 Diabetic as of 6/1/08
WOE: LC/MP/HF
Start Date: Restart 9/3/2012
Welcome Lori, glad to have you with us.
Buffy45 is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:50 AM   #697
Big Yapper!!!!
 
Buffy45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Lewisville, TX USA
Posts: 8,761
Gallery: Buffy45
Stats: Type 2 Diabetic as of 6/1/08
WOE: LC/MP/HF
Start Date: Restart 9/3/2012
Makes me wonder if it is not getting older or anything to do about menopause that slows our weight loss, but, the fact that maybe our blood sugar starts getting higher and higher as some of us age, b/c we all know women who go through those years without that dreaded weight gain that so many of us experience. Maybe in those women, either b/c of the way they naturally eat, or just their body makeup, their blood sugar stays consistently low through those years.
Buffy45 is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:54 AM   #698
Senior LCF Member
 
sasonnier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NY
Posts: 247
Gallery: sasonnier
Stats: 146/143.6/115ish
WOE: NK
Start Date: 10/24/12
Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Morning all,been busy at my new consignment store,and auctions.
Weight this morning 162.6 a new low for me,going to work on getting protein up this week.been eating breakfast this week that helps a lot.
How many of you eat veggies? And how much?
Congrats on the new low!! Have you changed anything to spur the new weightloss?
sasonnier is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 06:55 AM   #699
Senior LCF Member
 
sasonnier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NY
Posts: 247
Gallery: sasonnier
Stats: 146/143.6/115ish
WOE: NK
Start Date: 10/24/12
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizzcase View Post
Good morning, folks. I've decided not to weigh myself until next Sunday.. my eating has been crazy this week due to the nausea (saltines and popcorn last night again), plus its at this point of the month where I slowly begin piling on ~8 pounds of water weight before it whooshes off a couple weeks from now. YaknowwhatImean? Anyway, dialed back the magnesium oxide to 500mg a day, and no nausea up to this point this morning, so thats a win!

Also trying to get away from weighing every day as its causing me anxiety and I find myself going back to restrictions I'd done before, which I don't want to deal with anymore. The food weighing/tracking is making my restrictive brain scream, but I know I need to keep doing it to hit my macros.

Here's a question for y'all:
I have been bouncing between ketosis and regular glycogen burning for the past couple of weeks (ugh, stress of finals, can't wait for THAT to wrap up).. what kind of stress does this seesaw of carb burning metabolism back to fat burning metabolism have on my brain, if any? I'm thinking it can't be good to keep going back and forth, can it?





We have such intelligent people on this thread, I am amazed all the time! Come to think of it, my perfume does have a fruity base, that was probably what I was smelling.




Hey Mizzcase, i agree on the weighing...i try not to weigh myself the week before my TOM (which I just got). I also find that the fluctuations can be depressing if they go in the wrong direction.
sasonnier is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:08 AM   #700
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 1,353
Gallery: Clueless
Stats: 171/155/130
WOE: low carb/Nutritional Ketosis
Start Date: Aug-2012/Oct-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Morning all,been busy at my new consignment store,and auctions.
Weight this morning 162.6 a new low for me,going to work on getting protein up this week.been eating breakfast this week that helps a lot.
How many of you eat veggies? And how much?
wow way to go skinny!!!!!!!!!!!!

i eat veggies, just what ever I am in the mood for.
Clueless is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:27 AM   #701
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blonde with a Rose View Post
I am a bit confused about ketosis. I bought keto-stix and they do not change color AT ALL. I know I'm doing this correctly, I write down everything I eat. Is there a good time of day for this (keto-stix)?
Ketostix are famous for being unreliable. But they are inexpensive so they are popular for side of the barn type testing. If you really want to know, you need to do the blood test thing but the strips are expensive - $2 to $6 per strip - from what I've read.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blonde with a Rose View Post
Also I am currently one of the lucky ones whose appetite is almost non-existent, and yet no reading of ketosis. Is there a time frame as to how long it takes for ketosis.
Ketosis does not guarantee weight loss. Sad but true. It is just a metric. A piece of data for the weight loss puzzle but not the only piece which is why macros are part of it.

You mean NK when you say ketosis I reckon. As little as two weeks with the norm being two to four weeks and outliers as much as six months apparently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blonde with a Rose View Post
Is it possible to lose and not be in ketosis?
Yes. There are a lot of very successful diets other than LC. They all have their success stories and following.

You mean to say lose weight without having the NK range of blood ketones and I think the answer has to be yes if for no other reason than the success of non-LC diets for weight loss. It is probably more about caloric deficit than what is being eaten though although LC has the benefit of not spiking fat-retaining insulin levels.

I think the science is behind LC as being the best way to lose weight, keep it off and the most healthy way of eating (without regard to weight loss) hands down period end of sentence whoa nelly how high is the water mama she said it is five feet high and rising don't take your guns to town Bill leave your guns at home son two inches of water in a lonely ditch was a grave for ira hayes down down down in a ring of fire a ring of fire I keep a close watch on this heart of mine I keep my eyes open all the time I keep the ends out for the tie that binds because you're mine I walk the line.

reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:31 AM   #702
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
ct you are my little island of sanity on some days
reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:42 AM   #703
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by tablis View Post
Hi everyone. I've been MIA because I'm out with a bad cough/cold. I'm taking tonz of Vitamin C and D and I have ignored the comfort food carbs that are shouting out to me... so far so good.
Just wanted to say that 1) my phinney/volek books came!!! perfect timing I will read them in bed 2)turns out I'm not crazy-remember back on the november thread I was saying that I thought I'd seen a link to LCF on Jimmy's blog but then I couldn't find it so I thought I had imagined it... So its there on his 31-60 update.
Happy ketosising guys... hope to catch up later...
That is perfect timing! Hope you feel better soon!

He links to Kristn's original NK challenge thread. Very interesting and very cool!

Also interesting is that in the Matt LaLonde podcast about calories he ran the 1200 calorie number by LaLonde, which made him swoon. JM said he'd seen it being bandied about on LC forums so I bet he meant ours in particular because I saw it a lot too back then but I was always curious if JM browsed LCF's forums. Hiya Jimmy
reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:57 AM   #704
Senior LCF Member
 
sasonnier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NY
Posts: 247
Gallery: sasonnier
Stats: 146/143.6/115ish
WOE: NK
Start Date: 10/24/12
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post
Ketostix are famous for being unreliable. But they are inexpensive so they are popular for side of the barn type testing. If you really want to know, you need to do the blood test thing but the strips are expensive - $2 to $6 per strip - from what I've read.



Ketosis does not guarantee weight loss. Sad but true. It is just a metric. A piece of data for the weight loss puzzle but not the only piece which is why macros are part of it.

You mean NK when you say ketosis I reckon. As little as two weeks with the norm being two to four weeks and outliers as much as six months apparently.



Yes. There are a lot of very successful diets other than LC. They all have their success stories and following.

You mean to say lose weight without having the NK range of blood ketones and I think the answer has to be yes if for no other reason than the success of non-LC diets for weight loss. It is probably more about caloric deficit than what is being eaten though although LC has the benefit of not spiking fat-retaining insulin levels.

I think the science is behind LC as being the best way to lose weight, keep it off and the most healthy way of eating (without regard to weight loss) hands down period end of sentence whoa nelly how high is the water mama she said it is five feet high and rising don't take your guns to town Bill leave your guns at home son two inches of water in a lonely ditch was a grave for ira hayes down down down in a ring of fire a ring of fire I keep a close watch on this heart of mine I keep my eyes open all the time I keep the ends out for the tie that binds because you're mine I walk the line.

sasonnier is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:59 AM   #705
Senior LCF Member
 
sasonnier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NY
Posts: 247
Gallery: sasonnier
Stats: 146/143.6/115ish
WOE: NK
Start Date: 10/24/12
Becky- as far as eating veggies- i try to eat some veggies everyday...usually it is about 3oz of romaine lettuce or 1/2 C of another LC veggie (green beans, peppers, etc). I try to keep the veggie servings under 5-7g of carbs so I have room to play with at the end of the day
sasonnier is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:00 AM   #706
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Good morning everyone. It's beautiful and covered with snow outside, but not enough to have to shovel or plow! Just so pretty and puts me in the spirit of this time of year. Winter is here with gusto (about 4" of snow")

Major Red...thank you for you sweet comments...I really appreciate it. I am not giving in. My personal trainer is amazing and I met with her Friday. She looked at a week of fitdays (fat 80=83%) and didn't flinch. She said it looked fine to her with one exception. She wants a salad and/or dark green veggies added, and that should still keep my carbs under 20 grams/day. My exercises I'm to do daily for a week are all for rehab. And they are really different. It's going to be interesting to see what happens next, or where I am on Friday when I go in again to see her. Her price is less than 1/2 of what I paid in the Seattle area 10 years ago for a trainer with the goal of one pushup! Just one. 2 years later and I never got my pushup so he fired me. I have been unable to build muscle apparently, and this trainer said that's nonsense, and that I just need to start by rehabbing my body from all the damage from over 35 years of heavy duty dance. So, I'm sort of excited at the idea that "maybe" this is all interconnected....the body wouldn't build muscle before, and maybe the ketones thing isn't working because of all the stress I have put on my body in the past (comments by you/Major Red and also SouthernGirl)...and it's payback time. Maybe the 6 month timing by Skalderman (?) is all about this rehabbing of the body for what I've done to it for a long long time (most of my lifetime).

I am wondering what happens if you "jump around" with the grams of protein instead of keeping it consistent? I had 80 on Friday and 59 on Saturday. Big jump. I lost LBM when going to the low end, so then tried to "up it" and then this last week just got frustrated so decided to eat what I "felt like" eating but keeping within the idea of no carbs (yesterday I didn't have veggies or a salad like I'm supposed to) and moderate amounts of protein and not overdoing on the fat (which is easy to do). I gave up the BPC drinks and the fat bombs to see what would happen. Ha ha...reading was .3 the next day on the meter...guess that told me!

Yesterday I was:

1690 calories
151.5 g fat (81%)
18.8 g carbs (4%)
58.7 g protein (15%)

This was just eating what I felt like and when I got hungry. So, pretty good for no planning and no looking until the end of the day. I had a running list of foods so that I wouldn't forget.

My big addition was the Lindt 90% bar. h aha I am so NOT a chocolate person, but for some reason it just tasted good (had 3 squares - 1 afternoon and 2 after dinner). No problem sleeping!

Haven't gotten on the scale. Today is weigh/measure day.

Sorry this is so long.
__________________
Shelley
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:03 AM   #707
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blonde with a Rose View Post
Wow! Very interesting. I hot-flash like mad. I think I need to follow the clues...
Love your new photo!!!!

Re: hot-flash......I have noticed that the CO and MCT oils make that happen to me within minutes and it seems to last 24 hours!!! I think it's the thermogenic effect? Is that right everyone? I find that I am wearing "summer tshirts" in the 20 degree temps and feeling comfy (for short stints going outside for something). With poor adrenals and thyroid function in my past, I used to be bundled up indoors and was still cold. I prefer this "constant warmth"!
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:05 AM   #708
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by tablis View Post
Hi everyone. I've been MIA because I'm out with a bad cough/cold. I'm taking tonz of Vitamin C and D and I have ignored the comfort food carbs that are shouting out to me... so far so good.
Just wanted to say that 1) my phinney/volek books came!!! perfect timing I will read them in bed 2)turns out I'm not crazy-remember back on the november thread I was saying that I thought I'd seen a link to LCF on Jimmy's blog but then I couldn't find it so I thought I had imagined it... So its there on his 31-60 update.
Happy ketosising guys... hope to catch up later...
Hi Tablis.....sorry to hear you've been sick....get better soon! But delighted that you have both books to keep you busy.

I do recall you mentioning the comment by Jimmy Moore and LCF....glad you found it...now you can put your mind to rest that you aren't crazy!!
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:08 AM   #709
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Morning all,been busy at my new consignment store,and auctions.
Weight this morning 162.6 a new low for me,going to work on getting protein up this week.been eating breakfast this week that helps a lot.
How many of you eat veggies? And how much?
Congratulations Becky!!!! I love hearing of your new consignment shop. Hope it's crazy successful, especially at this time of year.

I went to a person trainer on Friday, and she said my NK eating was just fine (80-83% fat) but she wanted me eating "some veggies" and/or salad every day. Just a bit for the nutrients it offers in the form of FOOD and not pills. Also said that roughage is good for the body no matter what the trends say. She reads all the medical stuff and all the studies and knows Phinney and Volek by their medical research, but not the NK books. I loaned her my 2 books. I will report back on what she says and will pass along nutritional info as well (you can all be "with me" that way with the training sessions when it comes to nutrition)
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:11 AM   #710
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildflower View Post
Thanks southernGirl61. I've been asking "Professor Darin" lots of questions and he does always come through. But, sorry to say, stress is my middle name. There are yoga classes at the Y I go to, maybe it would help. Heck, what have I got to lose. Duh --FAT!!!!!

My dh and I don't get flu shots either. Our dr wants us to get shingles vac also but haven't yet. Need to do some more research on that.
I think we are about the same size/weight, etc., so it's fun reading your posts. I also don't get flu shots and docs/nurses always say to get them. I don't know anything about the shingles vaccine, but ANY vaccine scares the heck out of me these days. Do we know what's really in them?! Let us know what you find out. My dad's friend got shingles last year (she's going to be 90 though) and it wasn't a pretty situation for her.

Re: stress.....that's a nasty thing and I would highly recommend a slow yoga class if you could find one. My favorite was Iyengar restorative poses in a class. Oh, that was fabulous!
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:12 AM   #711
Senior LCF Member
 
sasonnier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NY
Posts: 247
Gallery: sasonnier
Stats: 146/143.6/115ish
WOE: NK
Start Date: 10/24/12
Quote:
Originally Posted by tablis View Post
Hi everyone. I've been MIA because I'm out with a bad cough/cold. I'm taking tonz of Vitamin C and D and I have ignored the comfort food carbs that are shouting out to me... so far so good.
Just wanted to say that 1) my phinney/volek books came!!! perfect timing I will read them in bed 2)turns out I'm not crazy-remember back on the november thread I was saying that I thought I'd seen a link to LCF on Jimmy's blog but then I couldn't find it so I thought I had imagined it... So its there on his 31-60 update.
Happy ketosising guys... hope to catch up later...
Hope you feel better soon! Don't forget to drink lotsa water- and enjoy the reads!
sasonnier is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:17 AM   #712
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by portcop01 View Post
Morning all,been busy at my new consignment store,and auctions.
Weight this morning 162.6 a new low for me,going to work on getting protein up this week.been eating breakfast this week that helps a lot.
How many of you eat veggies? And how much?
Wow! Congrats Becky!!!

At the moment I am eating no veggies at all. When I return to veggies I'll stay under the total 50g and probably well under shooting for the 20s or 30s.

reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:20 AM   #713
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post
Well, no sense in candy coating it Shelley, that sucks. Especially with all the time invested.

**That just made me laugh!!!!!

>>From start to now, what is your total weight delta? How much of a net gain or net loss?>>

From start to yesterday (haven't weighed today), I am up 1.4#. The lowest "down" I got was at the start and got down 2.2# and then regained it all after a few weeks. I'm guessing I will be up a bit today from yesterday.

>>How do you feel?>>

Honestly? I feel "thick". I feel lardy. I feel like my thighs and belly and upper arms are very fat and thick. Healthwise, I feel great!!!!! I sleep well (7.5 to 8.5 hours solidly at night). I am not stressed/anxious, just frustrated.

>>Did you give your new very LC friendly (hooray!!!) trainer the Performance book?>>

I gave her both books. She's amazing. I also printed off your write up at the start of this thread (remember, I asked you if I could do that) and I gave it to her too. She was very happy to read everything and anything I had and is anxious to work with me to "tweak" my plan.

>>If I had a personal trainer (that I trusted) that wanted to lead me in following the Performance book's guidelines, setting BF goals, calculating the resulting protein requirements, doing BF% measurements periodically, etc, I'd do that in a hot second Shelley. I'd want to be a partner in it and understand what we were doing and why.>>

That's what I'm doing. I do trust her. I've watched trainers over the years and this is the first one I approached as someone I wanted to work with. And when I asked who her doc is (since I still can't find one), she told me NONE within an 8 hour drive. I knew instantly who she went to....the partner of the doc I had when I lived in Seattle, and mine died about 6 years ago). I was right. So, we are even "right on" with the medical approach. An MD that also does alternative medicine and does NOT take insurance so he can run tests through the appropriate labs for each specialty thing. so, she goes once a year to Seattle for a doctors visit.

>>Don't throw away the 3.5 months you've invested. Let's see what your personal trainer adds to the mix. Don't make me send you in with a note either Missy. >>
No note required!

I don't know how to do the multiple cut/paste/answering, so hope this comes out "okay" or at least understandable. I'm not giving up on the time and "dead" keto strips invested. I'm hanging in there. I just get so frustrated at times. And I do feel "thick" and "heavy"....not the number on the scale, but I can't describe it. I feel "NOT ME"! It's like I'm wearing someone elses body!
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:24 AM   #714
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffy45 View Post
Makes me wonder if it is not getting older or anything to do about menopause that slows our weight loss, but, the fact that maybe our blood sugar starts getting higher and higher as some of us age, b/c we all know women who go through those years without that dreaded weight gain that so many of us experience. Maybe in those women, either b/c of the way they naturally eat, or just their body makeup, their blood sugar stays consistently low through those years.
Buffy...this has been true for me. But I also wonder if all the "anorexia" type eating and the society of SKINNY women/models has many of us wanting to be thin and sacrificing real food for so long that the only 'low calorie' foods we consumed were the carbs with no social redeeming qualities for nutrition for years on end being the cause for many of us...probably me. I existed on fresh squeezed carrot juice and fresh fruit (mostly bananas) and nonfat cottage cheese!

By the way...got my accu chek compact finally yesterday. They forgot to include the drum of test strips they said were included in the cost of the KIT! They are "looking into it" now. It says they were included in the cost. Phooey...so no test comparing yet!
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:26 AM   #715
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post

whoa nelly how high is the water mama she said it is five feet high and rising don't take your guns to town Bill leave your guns at home son two inches of water in a lonely ditch was a grave for ira hayes down down down in a ring of fire a ring of fire I keep a close watch on this heart of mine I keep my eyes open all the time I keep the ends out for the tie that binds because you're mine I walk the line.

shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:28 AM   #716
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by sasonnier View Post
Becky- as far as eating veggies- i try to eat some veggies everyday...usually it is about 3oz of romaine lettuce or 1/2 C of another LC veggie (green beans, peppers, etc). I try to keep the veggie servings under 5-7g of carbs so I have room to play with at the end of the day
Excellent Sophie!!! My new trainer/nutritionist said this is important and to have about 1 cup of salad and 1 cup of veggies/day. They don't add up to many carbs at all. She said dark green stuff, but not to sweat over a couple chunks of carrot or other colorful things to spice up the salad.
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:33 AM   #717
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulabob View Post
Just want to point out that the women who started the thread back in June and July all lost at well under 1.5 g/kg. In fact I don't know any ladies who have lost at the 1.5 level continuously.

I started at the 1.5 level - that's where I was in Atkins and that's where I had stalled for the last 4 years.

These numbers may just depend on where you are coming from, and what your particular "setpoint" is for protein, and if you are coming to this plan after having stalled on lowcarb. Certainly the 1.5 level for me means burning excess protein as glucose and raising my morning blood sugar numbers.
Yes but anecdotal evidence is typically confirmation bias evidence.

I'm curious to know how you know you were at 1.5g/kg for the past 4 years though? You logged for 4 years? Wow! When I stalled for just a few months I got too discouraged to log so there is a months long gap in my food journal.

But regardless, you were stalled and tweaked everything before tweaking your protein, is that not correct? Based on what you are saying it looks like you followed exactly what I outlined in my post over those 4 years. Tweak it all but protein dead last to protect LBM.

N=1 at all times.

reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 08:41 AM   #718
Blabbermouth!!!
 
reddarin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,460
Gallery: reddarin
Stats: 6' 47y/o 265/193/170
WOE: NK
Start Date: Aug 13, 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulabob View Post
Just want to point out that the women who started the thread back in June and July all lost at well under 1.5 g/kg
Yes, but did they need to be under 1.5g? We do not know because they started low. How much of their weight loss was LBM? We also don't know that because few, if any, did accurate LBM measurements before beginning and goal.

I'd be curious to know if any of the successes regained a few pounds when they increased absolute protein grams but kept the other ratios the same. The caloric increase would be negligible since protein by itself is low cal.

At any rate, I do not dispute that a lower protein level can result in weight loss.

One of the docs said that too low on protein can result in 1/4 to 1 pound of LBM a day! He said that LC woes tend to push the LBM loss towards the lower end of the scale, 1/4 pound, but wouldn't stop it if protein was too low.
reddarin is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 09:52 AM   #719
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
Quote:
Originally Posted by reddarin View Post
Yes, but did they need to be under 1.5g? We do not know because they started low. How much of their weight loss was LBM? We also don't know that because few, if any, did accurate LBM measurements before beginning and goal.

I'd be curious to know if any of the successes regained a few pounds when they increased absolute protein grams but kept the other ratios the same. The caloric increase would be negligible since protein by itself is low cal.

At any rate, I do not dispute that a lower protein level can result in weight loss.

One of the docs said that too low on protein can result in 1/4 to 1 pound of LBM a day! He said that LC woes tend to push the LBM loss towards the lower end of the scale, 1/4 pound, but wouldn't stop it if protein was too low.
I would also like to know this stuff. I know that when I was doing nonfat and keeping calories to 900-1000 a day, I was thin and felt great (or so I thought), but it ruined my endocrine system for post-menopausal issues.

When I did the low end of the scale as posted on the original NK thread, is when I did lose 2#, but it was all LBM, and not fat. I don't want to go back to that all for the almighty number on a scale.

I'm going to continue to follow the 1.5 range for protein and try harder to achieve it daily...I haven't been. And, like Buffy realized (and PC/Becky too I believe) that upping our total calories was hard, but gave good results.

I'm going to eat more!!!!

OH...and I found the Kerrygold butter finally! Oh my goodness is it wonderful. Who needs BPC when you can eat it straight from the package!
shelley is offline  
Old 12-09-2012, 09:59 AM   #720
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 850
Gallery: shelley
OK...not that it makes any difference, but Darin asked where I was from when I started to today.

Weight: up 1.6#
Bust: Up 3/4"
Waist: Up 3/4"
Abdomen: down 1/2"
Hip: Up 1/2"
Thigh: Up 3/8"

I have not met my "goal protein/calories" more than a few times...I've been more in the 1200 to 1600 range and my range should be 1773 (floor) to 2068.

So..even though my macros and grams of fat/protein/carbs have been excellent, I'm going to UP UP UP my calories and keep my protein in the 85-95 range! Wow. That should be fun! I'll give it a week and work at it consistently to see what happens. And I will be back with the trainer/nutritionist on Friday.

Note about her training for me....remember I said it's rehab to heal my body before we add back the weight lifting. Well, can't remember if I told you, but I've had this "pinch" in the back of my hip (pelvic area in back where the nerves all meat mid hip in back on the right side). It's a 24 hour a day "pinch/pain". With the first day of doing her rehab exercises, the pain went away and remains gone. This is no coincidence! I will keep you all posted and you can each send me $1 for what I pass along and I can then help pay for my sessions with her! Just kidding!!!!

I'm back to BPC this morning too. Going to get in as many calories as possible and keep them UP UP UP.

PS....Ketone reading this morning was .3 Glucose was 107. Wrong way!!!! (again or should I say "still")

Last edited by shelley; 12-09-2012 at 10:03 AM..
shelley is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:30 PM.


Copyright ©1999-2014 Friends Forums LLC. All rights reserved. - Terms of Service | Privacy Policy
LowCarbFriends® is a registered mark of Friends Forums, LLC.