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Old 12-11-2012, 06:29 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goolash View Post
- .3 again.... that was day 7 or 8 or NK attemtpts -
- fasting blood sugar was as low as its been at 4.0 (72) (and i do not have diabetes)
- weight the same'ish (like 323)



Yesterday:

Breakfast 6:30 AM : 4 Bacon, 2 eggs W/ 1 Havarti slice, and sour cream on top + coffee w/ hwc
Lunch 11 AM : 2 chicken thighs covered with costco jalapeno/artichoke dip, 2 bacon, some sour cream and a diet root beer
Snack: 3PM: a whole 90% LINDT
Dinner 7:30PM ish : mushrooms sauteed in butter mixed with chopped chipotle pepper and sour cream and some cream cheese

daily totals: 2482 cal, 226.3 fat, 92.1 prot, 24.7 carb (81/15/4)
Your macros sound good to me, it's a bummer that you are having such a hard time getting good ketone readings. Maybe try keeping carbs way low for a week or so- like 10 or below? Or try a fat fast to see if that would kick start ketosis.

It's odd to me how some ppl don't struggle getting into ketosis whereas others really do.
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:44 AM   #92
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maybe i'm allergic to all foods
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:03 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goolash View Post
- .3 again.... that was day 7 or 8 or NK attemtpts -
- fasting blood sugar was as low as its been at 4.0 (72) (and i do not have diabetes)
- weight the same'ish (like 323)



Yesterday:

Breakfast 6:30 AM : 4 Bacon, 2 eggs W/ 1 Havarti slice, and sour cream on top + coffee w/ hwc
Lunch 11 AM : 2 chicken thighs covered with costco jalapeno/artichoke dip, 2 bacon, some sour cream and a diet root beer
Snack: 3PM: a whole 90% LINDT
Dinner 7:30PM ish : mushrooms sauteed in butter mixed with chopped chipotle pepper and sour cream and some cream cheese

daily totals: 2482 cal, 226.3 fat, 92.1 prot, 24.7 carb (81/15/4)
I have to be 100% on plan for 7 to 10 days to get where I want to go (n.k.). Eating on plan 'most of the time' doesn't do it for me. You have expressed the notion that you have exceeded your goals here and there and that may be enough to keep you from getting into n.k.. Some of us are just that resistant it seems.

I think you may want to reduce your overall macro amounts as well.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:07 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clackley View Post
I have to be 100% on plan for 7 to 10 days to get where I want to go (n.k.). Eating on plan 'most of the time' doesn't do it for me. You have expressed the notion that you have exceeded your goals here and there and that may be enough to keep you from getting into n.k.. Some of us are just that resistant it seems.

I think you may want to reduce your overall macro amounts as well.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:15 AM   #95
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Good morning all!
Ketones this morning were .9, weight holding steady at 145.

I think I mentioned this yesterday, but my appetite seems to have finally been reduced after following NK since June! I'm hungry before meals, but then I just hit a spot where I don't feel like I can eat any more. This is really new for me and very exciting!

How is everyone else doing?
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:33 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by wrigglycate View Post
Thanks for posting this link Kristn --- will try it out first chance I get.
I believe that Ella was the person who first posted the link here. I think it's a great resource!
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:57 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by clackley View Post
I have to be 100% on plan for 7 to 10 days to get where I want to go (n.k.). Eating on plan 'most of the time' doesn't do it for me. You have expressed the notion that you have exceeded your goals here and there and that may be enough to keep you from getting into n.k.. Some of us are just that resistant it seems.

I think you may want to reduce your overall macro amounts as well.
Does that mean eat less or change the proportions?
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:12 AM   #98
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I am sorry but I can`t remember your exact details in terms of what you were doing before starting N.K. .... It makes a difference because standard low carbing can work well for many people and it provides clues to what constitutes a well formulated low carb, woe. When attempting to do N.K., I think it is important to remember that it can take up to 6 wks. of adherence to become fully keto-adapted and every time a person strays (even a bit), it can set back the process.

To directly answer your question, I don`t know but it looks to me like too much over all.....
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:13 AM   #99
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Quote:
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Congrats Kristn and Buffy!

My ketones were at .8 this morning- a bit low for me, but I'm not complaining b/c my carbs were up to about 40g yesterday (too much carrot)! I plan to get back on track today (I keep saying this...)
I want to focus on getting my fat grams lower- while maintaining my protein/carbs. I think I need to eat fewer calories- b/w 1500-1600 as opposed to 1800+

I'll weigh again next week.
Just struck me funny that Sophia is pigging out on ???carrots!???
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:14 AM   #100
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Congratulations Kristn and Buffy!!!!!

Myles...post your foods/grams/amounts, etc. You would be amazed at what people can find. For me it was something as simple as making fat bombs with sunflower seed butter! PUFA fats which Major Red caught (a no no...wrong fat!)

Today I am happy to report that my fasting B/G was 100 and my ketone reading was .6!!! Woo hoo...finally made it back into ketosis. 3.5 months later....in and out and back in. Hope it stays!
Very very cool, you are such "our" science project
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:22 AM   #101
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A couple of things I noticed in your menu Myles. You have quite a bit of dairy products in there, maybe not large amounts but with each meal. Most of us are lucky we can have dairy but it does not work well for everyone. And another is the entire lindt bar, while probably low in carbs I would probably not include that until you get firmly in ketosis and then maybe a square or two. Neither of these items may apply to the problem you are having, but those are the 2 that I noticed.
You might try having a few days of just meat, eggs and fat to see if that gets you into a good level of ketosis, then slowly add in some dairy and see what happens, then some LC veggies if you are wanting them.
I am no expert by any means so just take this with a grain of salt, oh, make that plenty of salt to ward off the leg cramps . Also, remember you can have broth daily.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:25 AM   #102
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Originally Posted by clackley View Post
I am sorry but I can`t remember your exact details in terms of what you were doing before starting N.K. .... It makes a difference because standard low carbing can work well for many people and it provides clues to what constitutes a well formulated low carb, woe. When attempting to do N.K., I think it is important to remember that it can take up to 6 wks. of adherence to become fully keto-adapted and every time a person strays (even a bit), it can set back the process.

To directly answer your question, I don`t know but it looks to me like too much over all.....
I was basically doing atkins induction but with some veggies.
Ok

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffy45 View Post
A couple of things I noticed in your menu Myles. You have quite a bit of dairy products in there, maybe not large amounts but with each meal. Most of us are lucky we can have dairy but it does not work well for everyone. And another is the entire lindt bar, while probably low in carbs I would probably not include that until you get firmly in ketosis and then maybe a square or two. Neither of these items may apply to the problem you are having, but those are the 2 that I noticed.
You might try having a few days of just meat, eggs and fat to see if that gets you into a good level of ketosis, then slowly add in some dairy and see what happens, then some LC veggies if you are wanting them.
I am no expert by any means so just take this with a grain of salt, oh, make that plenty of salt to ward off the leg cramps . Also, remember you can have broth daily.
Is Butter Dairy? If i buy Ghee instead is it still Dairy? Just asking cuz i think i want to try cutting out the dairy for a few days and see if it works, but i eat eggs in the morning that are fried in buttah. So trying to think of ways to get all my fat without dairy, because the dairy ones have been so convenient and easy

Last edited by Myles; 12-11-2012 at 09:29 AM..
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:39 AM   #103
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Some of us are extremely weight loss challenged and that makes it really important to be precise with what you are consuming (i.e. weighing, measuring and logging) in order to have a clear idea of what is going on.

I would not be inclined to begin eliminating dairy at this point as it makes thing even more restrictive and may not be necessary. Instead, I would make it a goal to strictly adhere to the macro nutrient goals and make these a clear gram count - not percentages. In time, you may well experience a natural appetite suppression and that will help over all.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:40 AM   #104
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Myles--I agree with ditching the Lindt bar. I don't know if losing the dairy will be helpful or not--it depends on if you're sensitive.

The macros that determine ketosis are protein and carbs so these may need to be lowered for you to really get into ketosis. It's unclear if you actually need to lower these because from what you have posted you really haven't been consistent with either for the past 7 days. One good day will not get you into ketosis. You need to stick to a consistent plan for at least two weeks (and as some have posted it has taken 6 months!) to see if this is working for you.

Good luck!
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:43 AM   #105
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Some of us are extremely weight loss challenged and that makes it really important to be precise with what you are consuming (i.e. weighing, measuring and logging) in order to have a clear idea of what is going on.

I would not be inclined to begin eliminating dairy at this point as it makes thing even more restrictive and may not be necessary. Instead, I would make it a goal to strictly adhere to the macro nutrient goals and make these a clear gram count - not percentages. In time, you may well experience a natural appetite suppression and that will help over all.
I hear you that cutting out Dairy would be restrictive Cathy, but if i were to just try it for 2 days (surely i could do 2 days?) wouldn't the results (if any) be a tell tale sign about a potential dairy reaction (which apparently is very difficult to diagnose) ?

What do you think about that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2zeke View Post
Myles--I agree with ditching the Lindt bar. I don't know if losing the dairy will be helpful or not--it depends on if you're sensitive.

The macros that determine ketosis are protein and carbs so these may need to be lowered for you to really get into ketosis. It's unclear if you actually need to lower these because from what you have posted you really haven't been consistent with either for the past 7 days. One good day will not get you into ketosis. You need to stick to a consistent plan for at least two weeks (and as some have posted it has taken 6 months!) to see if this is working for you.

Good luck!

True Kristn. Well yesterday you saw my macros, i thought they were pretty good, but others thought maybe too much food. I didn't over-eat at any meal, and i ate when i was hungry. I will be as close to perfect as i can for 7 days and see what happens. I'm on the fence about this Dairy business. Maybe out of desperation.

The problem with me is that i'm a travelling salesman, and when i travel for work I find it easy to eat low carb, but it tends to be higher protein. I will need to figure out a way to keep the protein lower and the fat higher on the road.

Fortunately, i'm home until Jan 21st tho, so i've got 5+ weeks or so to try and figure it out and prepare all my meals myself.

Last edited by Myles; 12-11-2012 at 09:48 AM..
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:45 AM   #106
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You guys might be right about not ditching the dairy yet, but, wanted to point out that bacon grease is great to fry eggs in. When you finish cooking your bacon, pour the grease through a strainer into a glass jar and keep in the fridge, great to use for frying meats and to season green beans and other veggies.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:47 AM   #107
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Dairy can be problematic but at this point it is premature to take this position in my opinon. Two days would not really tell you much. You wouldn`t know what the change (if any would be the result of). You need to have a consistent diet with the appropriate amount of protein and fat. Weigh and measure and track. It is hard in the beginning but gets easier over time. It is so much better than taking a stab at this and that and never really knowing what the heck is going on.....
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:52 AM   #108
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Will do.
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:04 AM   #109
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Dairy can be problematic but at this point it is premature to take this position in my opinon. Two days would not really tell you much. You wouldn`t know what the change (if any would be the result of). You need to have a consistent diet with the appropriate amount of protein and fat. Weigh and measure and track. It is hard in the beginning but gets easier over time. It is so much better than taking a stab at this and that and never really knowing what the heck is going on.....
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:31 AM   #110
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Good morning all!
Ketones this morning were .9, weight holding steady at 145.

I think I mentioned this yesterday, but my appetite seems to have finally been reduced after following NK since June! I'm hungry before meals, but then I just hit a spot where I don't feel like I can eat any more. This is really new for me and very exciting!

How is everyone else doing?
Kristn- it's comforting to hear that you are just now reaching that point. I thought I was never gonna get there, I guess there is still hope for me yet. Many others express that they have diminished hunger- not true for me- yet. I'm hopeful. i just ate my lunch, and boy, i could eat the whole thing again! I'm gonna take a big glass of water and get out of the house to distract myself.

Ketones at 1.4 today (yay), after being lower yesterday.
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:33 AM   #111
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Just struck me funny that Sophia is pigging out on ???carrots!???
I don't know if you know what latkes are (traditional potato pancakes for the holiday of hanukah)- well I don't eat potatoes, so I made them w/carrots and scallions- whew...too Darnn good...last time I make those!
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:35 AM   #112
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I was basically doing atkins induction but with some veggies.
Ok



Is Butter Dairy? If i buy Ghee instead is it still Dairy? Just asking cuz i think i want to try cutting out the dairy for a few days and see if it works, but i eat eggs in the morning that are fried in buttah. So trying to think of ways to get all my fat without dairy, because the dairy ones have been so convenient and easy
I think ghee is fine- from what I have heard
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:37 AM   #113
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Many others express that they have diminished hunger- not true for me- yet. I'm hopeful. i just ate my lunch, and boy, i could eat the whole thing again! I'm gonna take a big glass of water and get out of the house to distract myself.

Ketones at 1.4 today (yay), after being lower yesterday.
Me too Sophie, i ate breakfast at 7 and had to eat lunch just now at 11 cuz i was really hungry!

Congrats on your reading!
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:41 AM   #114
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I think you may want to reduce your overall macro amounts as well.
That keto calculator says my daily KCAL expenditure is 2900, so i thought 24-2500 was safe, but maybe i'll try reducing it more and seeing if can do it without being famished.

Last edited by Myles; 12-11-2012 at 10:43 AM..
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:49 AM   #115
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:50 AM   #116
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That keto calculator says my daily KCAL expenditure is 2900, so i thought 24-2500 was safe, but maybe i'll try reducing it more and seeing if can do it without being famished.
This breaks my heart from everything I have read/learned and the 2 nutritionists in lowcarb I trust the most. For some (especially women with hormone issues I think), going lower in calories might do the trick, but it also forces the body to feel it's starving! My opinion, even though it's probably totally off from others, is that you start with the HIGH calories of the range for you. Then you should not be hungry. You can focus on the correct foods and grams of protein and grams of carbs and let the fat fall where it may. For me, the hunger goes away with tons of fat, and I've recently converted to kerrygold butter as it's grassfed and doesn't cause me issues with lactose intolerance like other dairy products. Ghee should be just fine.

I like Buffy's idea of doing your eggs in bacon grease. I love my eggs in CO more than butter and bacon grease.

I can only relate a story I know of "firsthand" from the nutritionist who is a genius.....she had a referred client to her who could not lose weight at all. I think he was 35 or so years of age and was about 350#. She did a program for him and he was shocked at the food. Everyone else had CUT his calories. She upped them. For lunch he would have a whole chicken lathered in fat/butter. He ate a TON of food and was never hungry. And, in a months time he lost a TON of weight and became a "leader" in the weightloss group at his hospital to teach others how to eat.

The most important thing to me is that you eat "real food" and not a bunch of fat bombs, cream cheese clouds and call that a "meal". Myles, your breakfast is very nice...maybe add in another egg and another piece of bacon to see how that makes you feel.

Lunch has to be more than 2 tiny little chicken thighs! Good grief...that is not enough food for a person your size! (again, my opinion)

Where is your protein for dinner?! And where is a small salad or a nice nutritious veggie? FOOD....you need FOOD!!!!!! (she says jumping up and down)

OK...I'm off my soap box...and I am not the pro. I only know what the pros have told their clients and it worked for them. I'm too close to goal to have any miraculous happenings at the moment....my goal now is just to be healthy and avoid type 2 diabetes which is definitely where I was headed.

Sorry if I offend anyone by these comments. I am not a doctor nor am I a nutritionist...but I know 2 of the best!

OH...almost forgot....Buffy's little science experiment, me, had a fasting B/G of 96 and my ketones were .9 today. Woo hoo!!! It's about time!
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:03 PM   #117
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little science experiment!
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:08 PM   #118
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what experiment! tell !
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:13 PM   #119
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what experiment! tell !
ha ha....Buffy calls me the science experiment because, until you came along, and SouthernGirl, everyone else has done so well with this. So, I'm experimenting with what works and doesn't work and I finally got INTO ketosis after a long long time of not being there (like you).

So...you can be a science experiment too...we can have a female and male experiment....okay?!?!!?
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:16 PM   #120
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It won't be the first time some ladies have experimented with me. K that is not how that sounded before i typed it. Aieee!
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