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Old 10-24-2012, 08:54 AM   #1591
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Thanks all just order mine,I've been using the refind not as healthy for you.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:58 AM   #1592
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I am pretty sure you will love it PC
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Old 10-24-2012, 09:38 AM   #1593
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I am pretty sure you will love it PC
I second this. I really dislike coconut but can eat the Nutiva out of the jar if I have to (I normally get it a little melty and take a tbsp of the liquidy part).
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:49 AM   #1594
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I got 54oz for 37.99 no shipping charge is that good?
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Old 10-24-2012, 02:11 PM   #1595
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Jilly, forgot to respond to you on question on Vit B12. Some is not “new” info; but the interesting part I found recently researching on the FDA website is that the big PHARMA are trying to develop a “drug” that includes the “big three” B Vitamins, and patent it, because of many positive clinical trials results. Of course, it was rejected early by FDA, as you cannot patent Vitamins! But they will try again to convert something and make it a drug, as they did with “fish oil.” Aggravates me to no end.

New studies from Oxford University showed that seniors with cognitive impairment given a blend of B Vitamins, had a 31% slower rate of shrinkage than those given a placebo over two years. A quarter of the patients who responded best to the vitamins managed to show a 53% shrink rate. They also did 70% better on memory tests. The blend is 800 mc folic acid; 500 mc B12; and 20 mg of B6. These are actually low does and very safe for most folks. You are correct that there is no upper limit on B12.

Vitamin B12 deficiency causes tiredness, exhaustion, headaches, weakness, constipation, loss of appetite, weight loss, and megaloblastic anemia. Nerve problems, such as numbness and tingling in the hands and feet, can also occur. Vitamin B6 (50 to 150 mg a day) and B12 (1,000 to 3,000 mcg) are especially helpful in protecting against diabetic neuropathy or nerve damage

Other symptoms of vitamin B12 deficiency include problems with balance, depression, confusion, dementia, poor memory, and soreness of the mouth or tongue. Vitamin B12 deficiency can damage the nervous system even in people who don't have anemia, so it is important to treat a deficiency as soon as possible. The look at data on more than 2,000 people found that those with the lowest concentrations of vitamin B12 had higher scores (on a scale) used to rate depression and lower scores on cognitive tests. A shortage of vitamin B12 can create Alzheimer's-like symptoms in an otherwise healthy individual. Those who had low B6 levels also had lower cognitive scores, although it didn't seem to have an impact on depression (that's why B12 is that main nutrient recommended for mood disorders).

Other studies reveal that B12 is known to slash levels of homocysteine, an inflammation marker which is linked to a number of diseases, especially cognitive impairment and dementia. And it's so well established that B vitamins in general support the brain that more and more neurologists now recommend them. Remember the recent hoop-la over the cardiac drugs? When the docs are coming out and saying that they now know it’s the inflammation, not the cholesterol. Inflammation is the new frontier on “what’s up inside us.”

And yes, B12 is one of the nutrients that can be difficult to absorb, especially after we hit 40s. You need tummy acid to get it to aborb.

Recommendation is to discuss with your health care professional, doc, nurse practitioner, what does would work for you; and get checked for any deficiencies! That way, you can nail it with your special needs.
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Old 10-24-2012, 02:17 PM   #1596
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I got 54oz for 37.99 no shipping charge is that good?
Sounds good!
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Old 10-24-2012, 02:42 PM   #1597
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Almonds and lots of water controlled my hunger this morning. And this afternoon, I had a bloated, gassy feeling, which is how I would feel after having starchy carbs (not sugar, which doesn't bother me at all), but all I had for lunch was a cup of french onion soup (no croutons, just ate the broth and cheese, left the onions in the bottom of the dish) and a salad with no bread, no croutons, no other carby components (grilled chicken, lettuce, bacon, cheese, garlic ranch dressing, and a few pecans). So, weird day for my insides. Hope tomorrow goes a bit better since I have a training session again tomorrow morning. Not good to have a rumbly tummy, gas, or be starving during a lecture!
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OH and today I QUIT smoking!

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I just ordered a 59 oz container of it, LOL.
I just got my order in today that included a 54 oz jar of extra virgin co
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Vitamin B6 (50 to 150 mg a day) and B12 (1,000 to 3,000 mcg) are especially helpful in protecting against diabetic neuropathy or nerve damage
So much information, thanks! I did actually just have extensive labs run in early September, as I have them run annually due to my surgery. And I do mean extensive - they usually draw 12-18 vials of blood, and the tech is always asking if I feel faint B12 wasn't low, but it was dropping from my last labs, and I'd stopped supplementing. I actually had the problem before of HIGH B6, which can actually cause neuropathy, so I've had to do quite a bit of adjusting on individual bits and pieces, so I'm not a fan of combination pills like the one you said pharma's working on
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:39 PM   #1598
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Jilly, forgot to respond to you on question on Vit B12. Some is not “new” info; but the interesting part I found recently researching on the FDA website is that the big PHARMA are trying to develop a “drug” that includes the “big three” B Vitamins, and patent it, because of many positive clinical trials results. Of course, it was rejected early by FDA, as you cannot patent Vitamins! But they will try again to convert something and make it a drug, as they did with “fish oil.” Aggravates me to no end.

New studies from Oxford University showed that seniors with cognitive impairment given a blend of B Vitamins, had a 31% slower rate of shrinkage than those given a placebo over two years. A quarter of the patients who responded best to the vitamins managed to show a 53% shrink rate. They also did 70% better on memory tests. The blend is 800 mc folic acid; 500 mc B12; and 20 mg of B6. These are actually low does and very safe for most folks. You are correct that there is no upper limit on B12.

Vitamin B12 deficiency causes tiredness, exhaustion, headaches, weakness, constipation, loss of appetite, weight loss, and megaloblastic anemia. Nerve problems, such as numbness and tingling in the hands and feet, can also occur. Vitamin B6 (50 to 150 mg a day) and B12 (1,000 to 3,000 mcg) are especially helpful in protecting against diabetic neuropathy or nerve damage

Other symptoms of vitamin B12 deficiency include problems with balance, depression, confusion, dementia, poor memory, and soreness of the mouth or tongue. Vitamin B12 deficiency can damage the nervous system even in people who don't have anemia, so it is important to treat a deficiency as soon as possible. The look at data on more than 2,000 people found that those with the lowest concentrations of vitamin B12 had higher scores (on a scale) used to rate depression and lower scores on cognitive tests. A shortage of vitamin B12 can create Alzheimer's-like symptoms in an otherwise healthy individual. Those who had low B6 levels also had lower cognitive scores, although it didn't seem to have an impact on depression (that's why B12 is that main nutrient recommended for mood disorders).

Other studies reveal that B12 is known to slash levels of homocysteine, an inflammation marker which is linked to a number of diseases, especially cognitive impairment and dementia. And it's so well established that B vitamins in general support the brain that more and more neurologists now recommend them. Remember the recent hoop-la over the cardiac drugs? When the docs are coming out and saying that they now know it’s the inflammation, not the cholesterol. Inflammation is the new frontier on “what’s up inside us.”

And yes, B12 is one of the nutrients that can be difficult to absorb, especially after we hit 40s. You need tummy acid to get it to aborb.

Recommendation is to discuss with your health care professional, doc, nurse practitioner, what does would work for you; and get checked for any deficiencies! That way, you can nail it with your special needs.


I went to an alternative MD years ago that had me giving myself weekly injections of what he called the "little B's" since it was just B6, B12 and Folic Acid. Yup..learned to give myself injections in the hip back then, but haven't for years! Like sublingual B12 myself.
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:41 PM   #1599
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PC....great news on not regaining into the 170's! That's a big deal to "hold" and not go back up. Congratulations! You will love the Nutiva CO......

Congratulations to the weightloss people....so lovely to see such great results.

I went to the gym this morning...did the elliptical for 15 minutes, did 45 min of heavy (for me) weights, and then 15 more minutes on the elliptical. Got home and got a call that my neighbor were going to walk in 15 minutes!! Oh my. So, I bundled up and off I went. My body is going to be sore tomorrow!

And yes...whoever wrote Go Giants!!! tee hee hee That's who we're rooting for too!
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:43 PM   #1600
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Major Red!!!! WE all miss you and your great posts. I hope that you are feeling a bit better and will be coming up for air soon to report in! Just saying "hi"!!!
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:48 PM   #1601
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Buffy, you are too funny! Body scanners that we could afford to tell us all, ha, put folks out of business....not certain they are covered in our new healthcare program! How's recovering DD? Up and walking around more?

Amy, that is wonderful news! I am amazed at the portions too. Sometimes 3 or 4 bites is it, I am learning how to listen to the "full-o-meter" and stop. The slip in fat later. All I am good to monitor is carb/protein. I have no clue my total calories.

PC, sorry you didn't feel good. Maybe a 24 hr virus? Good news it's better. Holding steady is great too. I have both, but it wasn't planned....I haven't found much difference yet. someone posted what the difference is on one of the post....no clue.

Deborah, that would be so cool! App to wave over us and make our diagnosis! We need the 12-13 yo boys to take this own! They rule on the computers!

Aliz - congrats!! you are doing great. Dance of Joy on Day 1 non-smoker status!

Jilly, I love jerky, but have been more careful on the sugar counts in them. Seems this is a new "designer" foods area. The packages are funny, heard they are targeting women now. I take no more than 50mg B6, and watch the combo vitamins. Even worse on the "Combo" they are trying to make it prescription! That is madness!

Shelly, I had to take allergy injections for 9 years, my thighs are pure scar tissue....well, not pure, that's a "fat pack area" for this shorty!! B12 under the tongue is wonderful!

Red, I hope you are doing okay....we won't push for better. We miss your funny side and wisdom, but will try to be patient while you are healing!
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Old 10-25-2012, 06:58 AM   #1602
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I finally found this thread! I didn't know there was a thread for 80/15/5 until I heard someone refer to it somewhere, so I searched it out. Hooray! This is how I have to eat. I kept trying to find success other ways, only to binge and gain. So far this is the only version of low-carb that seems to work for me. I'll hang out here and try to get to know you all a little.
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Old 10-25-2012, 07:59 AM   #1603
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I finally found this thread! I didn't know there was a thread for 80/15/5 until I heard someone refer to it somewhere, so I searched it out. Hooray! This is how I have to eat. I kept trying to find success other ways, only to binge and gain. So far this is the only version of low-carb that seems to work for me. I'll hang out here and try to get to know you all a little.
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Old 10-25-2012, 08:29 AM   #1604
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I finally found this thread! I didn't know there was a thread for 80/15/5 until I heard someone refer to it somewhere, so I searched it out. Hooray! This is how I have to eat. I kept trying to find success other ways, only to binge and gain. So far this is the only version of low-carb that seems to work for me. I'll hang out here and try to get to know you all a little.


Lots of great support here!
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Old 10-25-2012, 08:45 AM   #1605
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Went out with friends last night and then had a training this morning, so just now getting a chance to come post my log for yesterday:
  • chili with cheese and sour cream
  • cocoa and cinnamon roast almonds
  • Houlihan's (lunch date with my husband!): French onion soup broth and cheese; salad of lettuce, grilled chicken, cheese, bacon, pecans, red onions, and garlic ranch dressing
  • 2 T butter
  • Moms' Night Out at a local Mexican restaurant: grilled chicken topped with melted cheese (the menu said melted cheese, but it appeared to actually be their queso, which I assume has a few more carbs than regular cheese since it's more sauce-like) with lettuce, sour cream, and fresh guacamole
  • vanilla coconut bark

Totals unknown, as I won't even begin to try to estimate when most of it was restaurant food. I think I made pretty good choices, though.

Welcome, Yvonne!

SouthernGirl, when it comes to beef jerky, I always check the labels for carbs. My heart lies with teriyaki flavor, but that's just not happening with all the sugar. But some plain varieties still have quite a bit of sugar, so I'm careful to read. My problem with jerky is that the serving sizes are usually quite small, so I need to be careful not to overindulge, as even a few carbs can add up quickly when you start throwing back multiple servings! I have to nod at your statemnt about marketing to women now, as I have noticed a brand called "Perky Jerky" becoming more widely available (and, of course, the lower fat version, Turkey Perky Jerky)

On B12, that is what I take, the sublingual form. By having it absorb sublingually, I don't have to worry about the adjustments to my digestive tract. It took me a while, though, to find a sublingual that is NOT cherry flavored. I can't stand cherry flavored things, and that seems to be the most popular option

Positive vibes out to our recovering EX-smokers
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Old 10-25-2012, 09:32 AM   #1606
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Good morning ALL!

So I posted in the main lobby yesterday about my "FLU" never going away.
Well I ate some dreamfields pasta last night to get some bulk in my stomach and today I actually feel much better!!
Dreamfields is NOT something I eat often, but I had a feeling it would do the trick. I was kinda desparate to feel better and would have almost eaten anything (bad) at that point. I've never gained or even stalled while eating dreamfields and I usually cook it less that 10 min anways.
I came to the realization that it might take a little longer to lose the last 5lbs and I'm ok with that now.

So I said I would just stick to VLC for a few days and not worry about percentages too much.

But after thinking about it and already feeling a lil better, I'm gonna try to jump back into it by tomorrow

I was up a lb today but i know it's water and I haven't been able to use the bathroom for a couple days cause I ran out of my special fiber (TMI sorry)

Anyways I hope everyone here has an amazing day!

OH annnnddd I haven't really thought about smoking! So I guess I am really done with that mess!
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Old 10-25-2012, 09:56 AM   #1607
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Welcome. YV2000. This is a great group always here to answer questions!!
Staying at 169.4 that's ok I usually go in whoosies any way..I sleep so good last night.i was reading my calcium bottle yesterday it has d3 in it so I decided not to take it last night,wow that is what was stopping me from sleeping.
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Old 10-25-2012, 01:50 PM   #1608
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Cutting out AFs cuts out the two high fat snacks I fall back on - CO bark and fat bombs. Both have to have AFs. I'm sure some of the others will chime in when they come online

Probably fatty protein is how you'll have to approach it though. Buttered bacon? Slices of beef as a CO or butter vehicle?
again, i'm several days behind in the thread but one of my favourite things to eat is roast beef, ground up in the food processor and then mixed with lots of softened butter(NOT melted), mix in salt (I use a lot because I'm a "salt waster" and get tremors if my salt is low) black pepper and hot horseradish. I mix it up like I would tuna salad and just eat if from the bowl with a fork. I even chill it a bit because I prefer it not to be mushy(like with mayo) but with a bit more body and firmness to it. It;s delicious and gets in the protein and the high fat in a tasy way.
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Old 10-25-2012, 02:11 PM   #1609
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again, i'm several days behind in the thread but one of my favourite things to eat is roast beef, ground up in the food processor and then mixed with lots of softened butter(NOT melted), mix in salt (I use a lot because I'm a "salt waster" and get tremors if my salt is low) black pepper and hot horseradish. I mix it up like I would tuna salad and just eat if from the bowl with a fork. I even chill it a bit because I prefer it not to be mushy(like with mayo) but with a bit more body and firmness to it. It;s delicious and gets in the protein and the high fat in a tasy way.
Wow! How did you even come up with that recipe? lol I kind of want to try it, but I don't have any kid of food processor or anything to grind. It sounds perfect for this woe.

Liz, When I saw your other thread I forgot that you had just quit smoking. Is there any chance that's what was making you feel crappy?

I'm having trouble getting food down, which has been an issue for me since I lost that 40 pounds a while back. I went off that woe because I couldn't stand to put the food in my mouth anymore. I'm doing somewhat better on this plan, but it seems to be the protein that I can't stomach. It seems like the fat, because pretty much everything I eat has a fatty feel to it. But I was just eating some pork that wasn't very fatty -- not fatty enough! -- and blech. I think I'm going to have a couple of fat bombs for lunch instead. I did get some down, so got a little protein in and I'll have to think of something for my later meal.

Other than that... I'm doing pretty well. Today is my third day back on and I'm pretty sure I'm squarely in ketosis. I have so much more energy than when I eat carbs. Woot! And I'm feeling very committed.

I picked up some tahini today and I'm wondering if it would make a yummy fat bomb. I think maybe. It would be a little like halvah, I think. Yum!
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Old 10-25-2012, 02:42 PM   #1610
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Hello to all! Welcome Yvonnem2000! Glad you found us!

Jilly, LOL! I saw the Perky Jerky and just laughed at the store. Really! I have been eating jerky since I was a kid, but I do admit to being a tom-boyish type, no girly-girl here. We had to eat it to survive swim team too. Now, yes, we got the donut on the way to practice, that held for 10 min, then we ate our jerky! I found some tasteless B12s, can't remember the name....will look at the store the next time I am there. I put them in the bottle with the cherry ones, which I do like ok.

Aliz, do you think you had the "low carb flu"...we all experienced symptoms when converting from regular, high protein LC to NK. I did, had a miserable three-four days, then it lifted. Hooray on your not smoking nor thinking about it! That is a bonus! The flu started before quiting smoking, yes? Could have contributed in the withdrawal to lingering flu-like symptoms. But if the carbs made you feel better, then just go with it, and do what you need to. we are all different here!

Hi PC. I have never had issues with D3 preventing sleep...but I take my last dose at around 6pm. I just have sleep issues since about age 48....and stress adds to it too. But now, taking the magnesium later, at 8pm, I sleep so much better. Melantonin added too, 5mg. At 51 I think some of these issues are related to the big "M".

Hey Deb! I do that with beef too, especially if it is drying out a bit. Add butter, and anything else to spark it up.

Jayne, I use my Oscar for all chopping. Had a big wonderful food processor, but it was too complicated, so I put it in the garage, then one of those darned hurricanes took care of it. I also lightly chop up any dried up beef, chicken, whatever, and pan-sear it in oils, add veggies, and oils/butter, then Rol-Tel and cheese too.

Hey Red! Hope you are feeling okay enough to keep up with us while lurking. You are in our hearts!

Last edited by SouthernGirl61; 10-25-2012 at 02:44 PM..
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Old 10-25-2012, 03:12 PM   #1611
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Hello to all! Welcome Yvonnem2000! Glad you found us!

Jilly, LOL! I saw the Perky Jerky and just laughed at the store. Really! I have been eating jerky since I was a kid, but I do admit to being a tom-boyish type, no girly-girl here. We had to eat it to survive swim team too. Now, yes, we got the donut on the way to practice, that held for 10 min, then we ate our jerky! I found some tasteless B12s, can't remember the name....will look at the store the next time I am there. I put them in the bottle with the cherry ones, which I do like ok.

Aliz, do you think you had the "low carb flu"...we all experienced symptoms when converting from regular, high protein LC to NK. I did, had a miserable three-four days, then it lifted. Hooray on your not smoking nor thinking about it! That is a bonus! The flu started before quiting smoking, yes? Could have contributed in the withdrawal to lingering flu-like symptoms. But if the carbs made you feel better, then just go with it, and do what you need to. we are all different here!

Hi PC. I have never had issues with D3 preventing sleep...but I take my last dose at around 6pm. I just have sleep issues since about age 48....and stress adds to it too. But now, taking the magnesium later, at 8pm, I sleep so much better. Melantonin added too, 5mg. At 51 I think some of these issues are related to the big "M".

Hey Deb! I do that with beef too, especially if it is drying out a bit. Add butter, and anything else to spark it up.

Jayne, I use my Oscar for all chopping. Had a big wonderful food processor, but it was too complicated, so I put it in the garage, then one of those darned hurricanes took care of it. I also lightly chop up any dried up beef, chicken, whatever, and pan-sear it in oils, add veggies, and oils/butter, then Rol-Tel and cheese too.

Hey Red! Hope you are feeling okay enough to keep up with us while lurking. You are in our hearts!
I'm pretty sure it was the low carb flu. Must have been the switch to high fat that did it?
I just quit smoking yesterday and only smoked a few cigs a day so I don't think it will cause much discomfort at all.
I'm craving meat big time right now so I'm gonna go for it and eat as much protein as I want tonight, which won't be an excessive amount anyway.
I just have this lingering bad feeling so maybe I really do have some kind of bug? Haha clearly I'm confused about it
Tomorrows a new day and I'm sure it will be a better one
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Old 10-25-2012, 06:21 PM   #1612
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I'm pretty sure it was the low carb flu. Must have been the switch to high fat that did it?
I just quit smoking yesterday and only smoked a few cigs a day so I don't think it will cause much discomfort at all.
I'm craving meat big time right now so I'm gonna go for it and eat as much protein as I want tonight, which won't be an excessive amount anyway.
I just have this lingering bad feeling so maybe I really do have some kind of bug? Haha clearly I'm confused about it
Tomorrows a new day and I'm sure it will be a better one
Well....it's likely two things, either you have a virus and flu-like viruses can go 5 days; or you are in LC to NK "flu"...which most experience. I felt like a bus hit me; brain fog; headaches; generalized body aches; and no energy for three days. I am usually a bit like the "energizer bunny" all day; but those three days, Fri, Sat, Sunday...were like I hit a wall. Then it cleared, and the energy came back, and I felt so much better.

Go with your cravings, take it one day at a time making changes.
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Old 10-25-2012, 08:27 PM   #1613
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Ok now I'm getting worried about Red!!im saying a little prayer for him.
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Old 10-25-2012, 08:32 PM   #1614
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Ok now I'm getting worried about Red!!im saying a little prayer for him.
I was thinking the same thing....too many days have gone by for him to not just say "I'm here....and now I'm submerging again". Please Major Red...just let us know you are okay!
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Old 10-26-2012, 03:48 AM   #1615
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I'm back!

Tonight at 7pm is eight full days. This morning at 7am will be 7.5 days or 180 hours since I quit cold turkey.

I have to say it has been a lot harder than I thought it would be.

My solution to the cravings has been to intentionally eat a lot. That sounds pretty crazy but my experience with NK over the last few weeks makes me think that regaining control of myself is possible and shedding the resulting pounds is possible. Also, I cannot eat wheat so it is a huge restraining factor on just how out of control I could get.

How interesting that something that has been such a curse like wheat for so many decades for me turns out to be a blessing in so many other ways once I found out about it.

Anyway, I'm trying t catch up on the posts.

Gonna post my new start weight real quick though.
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Old 10-26-2012, 03:54 AM   #1616
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weigh-in 10262012

Weigh-in this morning ... ... ... 194.7

8.6 pounds gained since I quit smoking ~8 days ago. I reckon 4 to 6 pounds is just water weight since I know that ~50g carbs is the nominal signal level for the kidneys to begin retaining fluid per Phinney and I have been at or well over that level for most of the past 8 days.

To combat the cravings from quitting, I was hoping to pig out but keep the carbs under 50g/day. I blew that pretty much on day one lol.

Gonna change my profile weight in the morning and consider tomorrow morning's weigh-in my first stable weigh-in so to speak for restart.

=)
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Old 10-26-2012, 04:24 AM   #1617
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I think I'm caught up and I didn't see anything in particular to respond to so if you all want me to look at anything specific hollar.

Sorry about being totally absent. LCF was one of my smoking triggers - I'd be puffing away while reading and posting. So I completely dropped off the radar because the cravings were pretty intense for a few days there.

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Old 10-26-2012, 04:29 AM   #1618
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Originally Posted by Deb34 View Post
again, i'm several days behind in the thread but one of my favourite things to eat is roast beef, ground up in the food processor and then mixed with lots of softened butter(NOT melted), mix in salt (I use a lot because I'm a "salt waster" and get tremors if my salt is low) black pepper and hot horseradish. I mix it up like I would tuna salad and just eat if from the bowl with a fork. I even chill it a bit because I prefer it not to be mushy(like with mayo) but with a bit more body and firmness to it. It;s delicious and gets in the protein and the high fat in a tasy way.
Wow! How did you even come up with that recipe? lol I kind of want to try it, but I don't have any kid of food processor or anything to grind. It sounds perfect for this woe.
lol exactly my reaction too - Wow! Sounds very tasty



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I'm having trouble getting food down, which has been an issue for me since I lost that 40 pounds a while back. I went off that woe because I couldn't stand to put the food in my mouth anymore. I'm doing somewhat better on this plan, but it seems to be the protein that I can't stomach. It seems like the fat, because pretty much everything I eat has a fatty feel to it. But I was just eating some pork that wasn't very fatty -- not fatty enough! -- and blech. I think I'm going to have a couple of fat bombs for lunch instead. I did get some down, so got a little protein in and I'll have to think of something for my later meal.
Be real careful here Jayne that you are getting in enough protein every day. Your body will do awful things to itself for protein - you must have it.

By the way, how do you pronounce your name? Jaynee or Jane?
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Old 10-26-2012, 04:31 AM   #1619
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Do y'all use refind or unrefined co?
Both. Refined for cooking - the cheaper LouAnn for cooking and the unrefined Nutiva for pretty much everything else.
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Old 10-26-2012, 04:39 AM   #1620
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Someone asked about the difference between 80/15/5 and NK but I didn't make a note of the post so now I am not sure where that was asked.

Anyway --- the answer is that we are not doing 80/15/5 the way it was thought of even just a few months ago because the 80/15/5 of 'old' had nothing to say about protein other than macro percentage.

But as Kristn pointed out in the first NK thread in September, macro percentages do not reveal very much useful information and easily (slash inadvertently) hide problems.

For example, you can get to a nominal 85/10/5 macro but what exactly does that tell you that is truly useful? Nothing. You don't know how much absolute protein grams you have eaten nor how much absolute carb grams and although the %s look stellar you may be eating in a very unhealthy non-NK way. That is, macro percentages make badly formulated LC menus look good.

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