October Nutritional Ketosis Thread!

[svenskamae]

Originally Posted by mom_2_4

Good morning everyone!!! I was down a pound this morning which puts me exactly at 210 so that is pretty darn good!!! It seems like in the last week I have been averaging about a pound a day so I guess my ratios are where they need to be!

I got an email last night saying that my meter has shipped, although I have seen some of you discussing there accuracy. I have still been using the urine strips at lest once a day and usually twice if I think about it. I went completely out of ketosis according to them when I went off track, took a couple of days to get back into ketosis but now that I have I've been getting a constant "moderate" reading and it was even high once! I know everyone says there not accurate either but I think it gives some kind of indication I'm doing something right Hope everyone has a FABULOUS day!!!

And Kristin congrats on getting your CPA, you go girl cause that math crap blows my mind LOL

You are making wonderful progress, Mom_2_4! Don't get discouraged if your rate of losing slows down; losing about a pound a day is amazing. I'm pretty thrilled if I lose a pound a week, staying completely on plan and limiting carbs and calories and protein simultaneously. It won't be long until you are in onderland!

[happymissm]

Hi everyone! I have enjoyed reading through the older threads the past couple of weeks and decided to finally introduce myself and join the thread .

I have a story probably the same as many of you. I am just trying to find what works best for my body. i have PCOS and insulin resistance so I went from vegan to LCHF and have noticed a marked increase in energy. Yay!!

Sadly I have not noticed much on the scale front and I find myself obsessing over spreadsheets and numbers lately . I know it may take time for the body to switch over, and I should probably just hide the scale from myself for a few weeks!

However, I do not want to have to measure and add up everything I put in my mouth everyday, and was wondering if any of you just kind of go with recommended foods and make sure you are below a certain number of carbs?

Thank you all for the great and informative posts, and I look forward to this month's thread .

[svenskamae]

I brought the Skaldeman book to work with me. I looked through the book again to see what he said about taking time to adapt to fat burning. He refers to 3 phases: 1) Phase I lasts about a week, when your brain gets used to running on ketones; 2) Phase II may go on for up to 6 months, during which your body gets used to burning fat ; 3) Phase III, where your body primarily runs on fat and expects a fat-based diet (which is what the author has followed for years). He thinks that he finished Phase II in about 4 months, and was then fully adapted to fat-burning, but some people take longer.

He says that perhaps 1 out 5 people has difficult adapting to the fatburning diet and losing weight, despite following the plan diligently. Here are the most likely causes and his proposed solutions:
1) "Your body is uncertain about what is happening ... and has responded by saving its fat." Solution: Be patient and stay with the program. "The solution is to establish stable habits and convince your body that enough food is available--the right kind of food!"
2) "You eat too little fat." "A high amount of fat in the diet induces the body to burn fat. Low fat food does the opposite. The more fat that you eat, the more fat you burn." (Fat should comprise at least 70 percent of calories, saturated fats are best and polyunsaturated fats are worst.)
3) "You eat too many carbohydrates." His plan allows for only 12 net carbs per day for the strictest plan. "Avoid all manufactured food!" (to avoid hidden carbs).
4) "You don't sleep well ... An exhausted body saves its reserves."
5) "You eat something that hinders your weight loss." This varies across individuals; likely suspects are cheese, nuts, coffee, and fruit. The author says he can eat cheese but can't lose weight eating nuts; you have to experiment.

[mom_2_4]

Originally Posted by happymissm

Hi everyone! I have enjoyed reading through the older threads the past couple of weeks and decided to finally introduce myself and join the thread .

I have a story probably the same as many of you. I am just trying to find what works best for my body. i have PCOS and insulin resistance so I went from vegan to LCHF and have noticed a marked increase in energy. Yay!!

Sadly I have not noticed much on the scale front and I find myself obsessing over spreadsheets and numbers lately . I know it may take time for the body to switch over, and I should probably just hide the scale from myself for a few weeks!

However, I do not want to have to measure and add up everything I put in my mouth everyday, and was wondering if any of you just kind of go with recommended foods and make sure you are below a certain number of carbs?

Thank you all for the great and informative posts, and I look forward to this month's thread .

My story is very similar to yours as I also have PCOS and IR, lost 113 punds in 2006 on LC then gained a few pounda back so I went back to induction LC and the scale didn't budge! I am happy with this WOE so far, it definitely takes more thought and discipline that strictly LC, in my opinion anyway, but well worth it since I'm seeing results.

I haven't found any way to "eye" my food and I meassure EVERYTHING that I put in my mouth. Sometimes it gets to be time consuming with everything else I have going on but since I am just beginning and still have quite a bit to lose I want to be as accurate as I can. After I've lost 50 pounds then I may feel differently about just eyeing my foods or going back to LC for maintenance??

For obvious reasons this makes going out difficult, which we don't do very often at all, but when it has come up I do my best at guestimating the amount and put it in my daily log. I have never regressed as far as weight etc. be doing that once here and there. But as far as doing it for every meal I'm thinking it probably wouldn't be as effective.

[svenskamae]

Just a bit of background about Sten Skaldeman: Here's what the blurb on his book says:
"He is the author of several books on nutrition which have been bestsellers across Scandinavia. When Skaldeman was 60 years old, he weighed 150 kilos (300 lb). He had pre-diabetes, the highest blood pressure ever measured at his local hospital--and he had tried everything to make himself better. Finally defeated, he decided to give up. He just wanted to eat steaks, beef, eggs, and bacon for the little time he had left to live. To his surprise, this 'crazy' decision saved his life. One and a half years later, he had lost 60 kilos. He now shares the secrets of this effective diet with his readers and students." (Something gives me the impression that he was a journalist before writing about this diet he adopted, but I could be wrong.) This approach is VERY popular in Scandinavia.

[Buffy45]

Congrats, Mom 2 4

[Buffy45]

Had one of my highest morning ketone readings yet, 1.7. I did eat a lot of fat last night which might have attributed to that,usually it has been around 1.4.

[JMCM1]

Originally Posted by drjlocarb

My liver thinks it's being a real hero and will pump out too much glucose for everyone even if they want to use ketones. So the poor little ketones get shuttled back into the fat cells.

Like Buffy, I copied and kept this entire post, but that part is pretty funny right there.

[shelley]

Originally Posted by drjlocarb

Shelly, these^^^ are re-prints of 2 past posts I made to try to explain what I feel is the problem for those of us who are long time LC, stalled(years), have high f/g, and low b/k readings on NK.

Bless your heart for putting all that in writing for us! I see others are as happy as I am to have it! Thank you.

Yesterday I made some of Rebecca's spice cakes that she created (in her NK loss website) and at a whole one. I know that almond meal/flour triggers cravings for me, but I can't have the flax seed due to hypothyroidism, so used the almond meal.

I was very nervous about taking my fasting B/G and ketones this morning. I was surprised to find the glucose at 88 and the ketones were the "usual" .9 (range of usually .6 to .9 regularly).

I also realized from a post from reddarin that I am consuming too much protein. I did the wrong calculations apparently and have been trying to stay around 60, and he feels I should be around 47! Yikes...that's a huge difference and that also may be why I am not losing rapidly. I'm happy with a 2# loss for the month of September, but wish it was double that each month! :-)

So, for me, I'll try lowering the protein and see if that helps. The other "thing" was that like you, drjlocarb, I had those carbs from the almond meal yesterday and what happened...the fasting glucose went *down* and not *up*. That made me wonder. Even with that flour, my total carbs were 12.1 grams (net 5.5)...but that's pretty typical for me to have very low total carbs compared to most of you.

Thanks again for the great post!

[shelley]

Originally Posted by svenskamae

I brought the Skaldeman book to work with me. I looked through the book again to see what he said about taking time to adapt to fat burning. He refers to 3 phases: 1) Phase I lasts about a week, when your brain gets used to running on ketones; 2) Phase II may go on for up to 6 months, during which your body gets used to burning fat ; 3) Phase III, where your body primarily runs on fat and expects a fat-based diet (which is what the author has followed for years). He thinks that he finished Phase II in about 4 months, and was then fully adapted to fat-burning, but some people take longer.

He says that perhaps 1 out 5 people has difficult adapting to the fatburning diet and losing weight, despite following the plan diligently. Here are the most likely causes and his proposed solutions:
1) "Your body is uncertain about what is happening ... and has responded by saving its fat." Solution: Be patient and stay with the program. "The solution is to establish stable habits and convince your body that enough food is available--the right kind of food!"
2) "You eat too little fat." "A high amount of fat in the diet induces the body to burn fat. Low fat food does the opposite. The more fat that you eat, the more fat you burn." (Fat should comprise at least 70 percent of calories, saturated fats are best and polyunsaturated fats are worst.)
3) "You eat too many carbohydrates." His plan allows for only 12 net carbs per day for the strictest plan. "Avoid all manufactured food!" (to avoid hidden carbs).
4) "You don't sleep well ... An exhausted body saves its reserves."
5) "You eat something that hinders your weight loss." This varies across individuals; likely suspects are cheese, nuts, coffee, and fruit. The author says he can eat cheese but can't lose weight eating nuts; you have to experiment.

Oh this is such fabulous information. Thank you so much for posting this. So, those of us that have been doing NK for a month or so have to really keep on trucking and wait it out for possibly 4-6 months. For me it's easy to eat this way, so I have no problem doing that. And then when I have my VAP cholesterol test at my annual physical around March, I should have really good news!!! Woo hoo. Thank you for doing this for us svenskamae!

[ravenrose]

I'm trying hard to eat enough fat, little enough of anything else, and few enough overall calories to get firmly into ketosis. It's helping, but I still don't think I'm there yet. I need to reorder those ketone strips. So expensive, I keep putting it off.

As I said just now elsewhere, I find I can only eat two meals a day of "normal food" and then get the rest of my calories from fat bombs, to keep my protein low enough. Who would have thought there is so much protein in everything. golly!

I really really hate the term "fat bomb." There are so many creative people around here, can't we come up with something better? that just sounds disgusting. *sigh*

I recommend the peppermint patty fat bomb: coconut oil, cocoa powder, sweetener, and peppermint extract. I actually use peppermint essential oil and it's lovely. sometimes I mix cream cheese into this, but it's difficult to get it incorporated well. you need to stir again when it's half hard or else just accept it looks sort of... gross. but the taste is heavenly and without the creamcheese doesn't have the extra protein nut butters or other ingredients often supply.

do you all find that when you eat a very high fat/very low everything else meal that it takes a LONG time to feel satiety? I find if I actually let myself get hungry before I eat something like that, and I TRY to let myself get really hungry, it can take two hours for that hunger to go away after eating sometimes. regularly at least an hour.

I'm not sure that's a good thing. I don't recall where I read this, but it was one of those medical journal article thingies that seemed pretty authoritative, that when you FEEL real hunger, that is when your body is revving up the gluconeogenesis. that the same thing that triggers the hunger triggers gluconeogenesis because that's defending your brain against too low a blood sugar level.

so I am thinking I need to stop relying so much on hunger and start looking at the clock to decide when to eat, contrary to all the good advice we have had not to do that... but then most of the other good advice was wrong too, so why not this? LOL

any thoughts, ladies? (are there men here too? don't want to exclude you, if so, I am just reading female comments mostly, I believe.)

[ravenrose]

From my reading, I believe that ingesting coconut oil will skew the results of ketone monitoring, since the digestion of the coconut oil puts ketones in the blood totally independent of whether one is in ketosis. I guess the breakdown product of digestion of the coconut oil is similar enough to the ketones our bodies produce that they are both counted by the test.

What do you all think? Have you tried testing when you eat a lot of CO and then when you eat none to see how much of the result is a "false" reading?

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with having the CO ketones in our systems, I do believe they are a great fuel, but it's obviously not the same as being in ketosis.

[Buffy45]

Originally Posted by ravenrose

From my reading, I believe that ingesting coconut oil will skew the results of ketone monitoring, since the digestion of the coconut oil puts ketones in the blood totally independent of whether one is in ketosis. I guess the breakdown product of digestion of the coconut oil is similar enough to the ketones our bodies produce that they are both counted by the test.

What do you all think? Have you tried testing when you eat a lot of CO and then when you eat none to see how much of the result is a "false" reading?

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with having the CO ketones in our systems, I do believe they are a great fuel, but it's obviously not the same as being in ketosis.

Don't know for sure but over the 4 days I recently was on a trip, my consumption of CO went way, way down, I probably had a teaspoon a day at the most, compared to 2-3 T at home. My blood ketones measured right at 1.4 each AM, just like they do at home. FWIW

[ravenrose]

Originally Posted by Buffy45

Don't know for sure but over the 4 days I recently was on a trip, my consumption of CO went way, way down, I probably had a teaspoon a day at the most, compared to 2-3 T at home. My blood ketones measured right at 1.4 each AM, just like they do at home. FWIW

sounds like you did the experiment then!

[JMCM1]

When I started NK in June I was definitely eating coconut oil. My ketones a couple of days ago were 1.6 - with no coconut oil in the last few days.

I kind of think it was mentioned that adding coconut oil might help spur you into NK.

[drjlocarb]

I do think CO will give false high levels, but most of us are testing our blood first thing in the morning and any CO we ate the night before should have been used up. (unless you ate 1/2 a jar). Same with alcohol and MCT oil.

[drjlocarb]

Raven, I make "peppermint freezer CANDY" the same way you do.

I find the "hunger spurs gluconeogenesis" very interesting. I kinda had in my mind the hunger was my body trying to find fuel and had decided that was a sign I wasn't fully keto-adapted (NK) and I was letting it "find" my fat. If what you say is true, that might mean hunger should be fed with a small amount of peppermint candy (fat).

What I mean is, when I know I am eating the same amount of calories as I was and I drop the protein, maybe those hunger signals should be satisfied with dietary fat until the day when LC/HF/MP meals are enough.?? I only eat twice a day and have been for years. When I dropped the protein, I found hunger has become a problem I haven't seen in years.

I have tested b/g at times when I was over hungry and it was not lower than normal.. Maybe it was already too late. I know I can "gluco-neo" better that most.

[joyfulmomto3]

Originally Posted by svenskamae

I brought the Skaldeman book to work with me. I looked through the book again to see what he said about taking time to adapt to fat burning. He refers to 3 phases: 1) Phase I lasts about a week, when your brain gets used to running on ketones; 2) Phase II may go on for up to 6 months, during which your body gets used to burning fat ; 3) Phase III, where your body primarily runs on fat and expects a fat-based diet (which is what the author has followed for years). He thinks that he finished Phase II in about 4 months, and was then fully adapted to fat-burning, but some people take longer.

He says that perhaps 1 out 5 people has difficult adapting to the fatburning diet and losing weight, despite following the plan diligently. Here are the most likely causes and his proposed solutions:
1) "Your body is uncertain about what is happening ... and has responded by saving its fat." Solution: Be patient and stay with the program. "The solution is to establish stable habits and convince your body that enough food is available--the right kind of food!"
2) "You eat too little fat." "A high amount of fat in the diet induces the body to burn fat. Low fat food does the opposite. The more fat that you eat, the more fat you burn." (Fat should comprise at least 70 percent of calories, saturated fats are best and polyunsaturated fats are worst.)
3) "You eat too many carbohydrates." His plan allows for only 12 net carbs per day for the strictest plan. "Avoid all manufactured food!" (to avoid hidden carbs).
4) "You don't sleep well ... An exhausted body saves its reserves."
5) "You eat something that hinders your weight loss." This varies across individuals; likely suspects are cheese, nuts, coffee, and fruit. The author says he can eat cheese but can't lose weight eating nuts; you have to experiment.

Thanks for this info! I've joined this October thread since my strips are on the way. There's no way for me to do this NK without the strips and logging my foods.

[JoeEO]

Originally Posted by mom2zeke

Okay, I know that it's totally off topic but I just have to share with all my NK friends. Some of you know that I am divorced. The ex and I split up not long after I lost my initial weight. At the time I had been a SAH mom for 11+ years and wasn't sure what to do about a career. Over the years I've tried a few different paths, but 4 years ago I started the process that culminated today with my CPA license! I can't tell you how good it feels to have made it to this goal. And I'm at my goal weight too!

That is fantastic, good for you!

You know I am really amazed at the sense of "community" that you ladies share on this thread. You are all so supportive of each other...When I am reading this thread, I sometime I feel like I am eavesdropping on a private conversation.

So lesson's learned most recently:
1) I have been supplementing with sodium and potassium as per the Phinney/Volek book by drinking some home-made "keto-aide" (Lime, salt, lite-salt, stevia) and also drinking Powerade Zero (zero carb sports drink).
I think I have been drinking too much sweetened drinks - which I think is
stimulating my hunger to some degree...I am switching to drinking a couple of bullion cubes instead.
2) Jimmy Moore had an interesting blog post comparing the Precision Xtra and NovaMax Plus...Basically the NovaMax Plus is less accurate than the Precision Xtra. I recalled read a couple of posts on one of the NK threads about how the NovaMax is inaccurate in reporting blood glucose.
3) I hardest think about NK is limiting my protein.Before starting this woe I was easily eating 150 to 200 grams of protein daily....not I am down to 75 to 100 grams.....

Peace,

Joe E O

[Pot Pie]

Originally Posted by JoeEO

Powerade Zero

I love this stuff especially the orange kind. I wish they would make a few more flavors I have been drinking the same few flavors for years now. I still had to take supplements to avoid leg cramps though, even when I was drinking Powerade Zero almost exclusively.

I was a big protein eater too, not as much as you but I love the stuff. I'm eating ~60g down from 90-110 now not much of a drop but still feels tough.

[svenskamae]

Originally Posted by JoeEO

That is fantastic, good for you!

You know I am really amazed at the sense of "community" that you ladies share on this thread. You are all so supportive of each other...When I am reading this thread, I sometime I feel like I am eavesdropping on a private conversation.

So lesson's learned most recently:
1) I have been supplementing with sodium and potassium as per the Phinney/Volek book by drinking some home-made "keto-aide" (Lime, salt, lite-salt, stevia) and also drinking Powerade Zero (zero carb sports drink).
I think I have been drinking too much sweetened drinks - which I think is
stimulating my hunger to some degree...I am switching to drinking a couple of bullion cubes instead.
2) Jimmy Moore had an interesting blog post comparing the Precision Xtra and NovaMax Plus...Basically the NovaMax Plus is less accurate than the Precision Xtra. I recalled read a couple of posts on one of the NK threads about how the NovaMax is inaccurate in reporting blood glucose.
3) I hardest think about NK is limiting my protein.Before starting this woe I was easily eating 150 to 200 grams of protein daily....not I am down to 75 to 100 grams.....

Peace,

Joe E O

Hi, Joe, welcome to the community on this thread. It's good to have you as a member, too.

Some people don't have any obvious negative effect from using artificial sweeteners in diet sodas, etc., but they increase my hunger (and also make my tastebuds less sensitive, so I enjoy food less if I drink them).

I think a lot of us found the switch to lower protein hard, but now I am finding that my appetite levels are down, my energy and mood stability are up, and my hunger is very manageable when eating mostly fat. Planning meals can still be a bit tricky; I seem to end up eating small highfat/high calorie meals that look like just a snack--but they do satisfy me. When I feel like I need a MEAL, I saute some vegetables (like spinach or chard or cabbage) in butter and/or with bacon or make a big salad with lots of dressing, to get volume with added fat and not much added protein.

[SouthernGirl61]

Originally Posted by mom2zeke

I'm so sorry to hear about all the craziness with steroids and BCP! Give yourself and your body some time to even out--I'm sure it is water.

We can't post links, but Rebecca likes the calculator at about.com in the low carb diets section. I thought it was reading high for me and that was confirmed by the hydrostatic testing that I did. I searched around and there are many to choose from. I don't think any one is the best, but the one that was closest for me at that time was the bf calculator at bmi-calculator.net. I now doubt its accuracy because of the limited data points. Depending on your body type they can be wildly inaccurate.

I think that just plain old measuring and looking in the mirror are more useful if you don't have access to DXA, Bodpod, or hydrostatic testing for BF.

I have been on a mission the last few days, tried 15 of them...good grief! I think I may sign up for the dunking test after all. Was it long when you did it? do they put you underwater?

Yes, my body is not happy, I am going to remain calm and let it work out. Now my doc said a month off BPC, I'm 51, and she may say enough. I think everything just changed. Sigh.

How do you get ****** to copy over previous day? How do you post a custom you made? I finally got in gear to log this stuff!

[SouthernGirl61]

Originally Posted by mom2zeke

Okay, I know that it's totally off topic but I just have to share with all my NK friends. Some of you know that I am divorced. The ex and I split up not long after I lost my initial weight. At the time I had been a SAH mom for 11+ years and wasn't sure what to do about a career. Over the years I've tried a few different paths, but 4 years ago I started the process that culminated today with my CPA license! I can't tell you how good it feels to have made it to this goal. And I'm at my goal weight too!

Kristn, that is awesome! One hard test. I have a few CPA friends and remember the sweat of the test! You have inspired us all, hitting goal, giving us great info, and this is "icing" for you! Hanging your hat out or working corporate? consider healthcare accounting, we need lots of you that the firms get!

[SouthernGirl61]

Originally Posted by JoeEO

That is fantastic, good for you!

You know I am really amazed at the sense of "community" that you ladies share on this thread. You are all so supportive of each other...When I am reading this thread, I sometime I feel like I am eavesdropping on a private conversation.

So lesson's learned most recently:
1) I have been supplementing with sodium and potassium as per the Phinney/Volek book by drinking some home-made "keto-aide" (Lime, salt, lite-salt, stevia) and also drinking Powerade Zero (zero carb sports drink).
I think I have been drinking too much sweetened drinks - which I think is
stimulating my hunger to some degree...I am switching to drinking a couple of bullion cubes instead.
2) Jimmy Moore had an interesting blog post comparing the Precision Xtra and NovaMax Plus...Basically the NovaMax Plus is less accurate than the Precision Xtra. I recalled read a couple of posts on one of the NK threads about how the NovaMax is inaccurate in reporting blood glucose.
3) I hardest think about NK is limiting my protein.Before starting this woe I was easily eating 150 to 200 grams of protein daily....not I am down to 75 to 100 grams.....

Peace,

Joe E O

Hey JoeE, I was HP for nearly 10years, then went too low...now found perfect, we are all different so keep working with it, that's what they all told me and it worked out after a couple weeks. I am slow learner, hate to measure!

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by SouthernGirl61

Kristn, that is awesome! One hard test. I have a few CPA friends and remember the sweat of the test! You have inspired us all, hitting goal, giving us great info, and this is "icing" for you! Hanging your hat out or working corporate? consider healthcare accounting, we need lots of you that the firms get!

Thanks! I've been working in corporate accounting at a biotech company for 2 years (kind of related to healthcare). I don't know if I'll stay in biotech, it's a pretty volatile business, but I love corporate accounting.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by SouthernGirl61

I have been on a mission the last few days, tried 15 of them...good grief! I think I may sign up for the dunking test after all. Was it long when you did it? do they put you underwater?

Yes, my body is not happy, I am going to remain calm and let it work out. Now my doc said a month off BPC, I'm 51, and she may say enough. I think everything just changed. Sigh.

How do you get ****** to copy over previous day? How do you post a custom you made? I finally got in gear to log this stuff!

For the dunking test you do go underwater and blow out all of the air from your lungs. You have to do it a few times and it's actually quite disconcerting. There are youtube videos of the process. I think I might try to do the DXA scan next time.

I hope that your hormones stabilize soon!

For copying previous days food on the tracker you mentioned there's a drop-down menu "recent foods" on the left. Drop all the way down to the bottom to "more". This will open up a window that has all of the foods listed for previous days. You can check the boxes you want and then hit "add all checked foods".

[drjlocarb]

For all those who thanked me for the post; This is MY interpretation of the problem at hand.

I don't know that this is the solution.

I am trying to find a solution for those of us who are STUMPED!

I would hope that someone with the RIGHT answers will chime in on MY interpretation of the problem.

I can only hope I am seeing this in the right perspective.

[Buffy45]

Originally Posted by JoeEO

That is fantastic, good for you!

You know I am really amazed at the sense of "community" that you ladies share on this thread. You are all so supportive of each other...When I am reading this thread, I sometime I feel like I am eavesdropping on a private conversation.

So lesson's learned most recently:
1) I have been supplementing with sodium and potassium as per the Phinney/Volek book by drinking some home-made "keto-aide" (Lime, salt, lite-salt, stevia) and also drinking Powerade Zero (zero carb sports drink).
I think I have been drinking too much sweetened drinks - which I think is
stimulating my hunger to some degree...I am switching to drinking a couple of bullion cubes instead.
2) Jimmy Moore had an interesting blog post comparing the Precision Xtra and NovaMax Plus...Basically the NovaMax Plus is less accurate than the Precision Xtra. I recalled read a couple of posts on one of the NK threads about how the NovaMax is inaccurate in reporting blood glucose.
3) I hardest think about NK is limiting my protein.Before starting this woe I was easily eating 150 to 200 grams of protein daily....not I am down to 75 to 100 grams.....

Peace,

Joe E O

You are very welcome to join in, keep posting and asking questions and sharing info, we are all learning.

I didn't have trouble adapting to the lower protein but probably wasn' eating that much before. I have heard others mention that you can just work you way down in steps, makes it a little easier than dropping that much suddenly!

[svenskamae]

Originally Posted by drjlocarb

For all those who thanked me for the post; This is MY interpretation of the problem at hand.

I don't know that this is the solution.

I am trying to find a solution for those of us who are STUMPED!

I would hope that someone with the RIGHT answers will chime in on MY interpretation of the problem.

I can only hope I am seeing this in the right perspective.

Your interpretation seems very consistent with the reasoning in the book translated from Swedish, which I've been summarizing. The book has a very pragmatic focus (do this, it works), without much explanatory framework other than insulin resistence. But the author seems to firmly believe that you have to train your body to burn fat, by eating a high fat diet, and to acknowledge that the process of adapting can take people many months (much longer than a few days of "induction flu").

[Mobear]

from Ravenrose:
"I'm not sure that's a good thing. I don't recall where I read this, but it was one of those medical journal article thingies that seemed pretty authoritative, that when you FEEL real hunger, that is when your body is revving up the gluconeogenesis. that the same thing that triggers the hunger triggers gluconeogenesis because that's defending your brain against too low a blood sugar level.

so I am thinking I need to stop relying so much on hunger and start looking at the clock to decide when to eat, contrary to all the good advice we have had not to do that... but then most of the other good advice was wrong too, so why not this?"

I believe from my own experience that this is correct. Usually on Saturday mornings I get up a little later than normal. I take my bg (85-90), take my insulin 5u Regular and buzz out of the house for a short errand. Usually I'm not hungry and think I'll be ok bg wise. I get to the bank, feel hungry, a little dizzy and then a warm flush. By the time I get back to my car and take my bg it has usually gone up at least 20 points! Since July I've been limiting my protein, but as per Dr. Bernstein I was trying to eat a consistent amount of protein day to day and meal to meal. This week I have dropped from 8-10g of protein at breakfast to fat bombs and coconut oil in coffee. I've also reduced my morning insulin to 3u.

So far this week I have not had a big rise in bg from fasting to lunch. I do think that gluconeogenesis is what triggered the bg rise and that was preceded by the feeling of hunger.