September Nutritional Ketosis Thread!

[mom_2_4]

Originally Posted by theLossgirl

Mom_2, I think it was yesterday you said you had a lunch that was mostly fat? It could have been today; this thread moves fast. What did you have? I am always always always looking for more ways to get my fat up.

Most of my fat comes from the hwc I drink in my dang coffee! I gotta quit that crap before I starve to death now that I am keeping track! Lunch wasn't very high in fat, just salad, avocado, dressing, feta cheese and 3 oz chicken breast.

[mom_2_4]

My numbers are a little higher than I think they need to be on the protein for today but I was hungry LOL

Fat: 149.8
Protein:69.2
Carbs: 10
Calories:1501.8

The hwc in my coffee is killing it on the fat for me all day because I drink so much coffee!
Had coffee and 4 pieces of turkey bacon for breakfast, coffee for lunch and dinner is 8 oz broiled tilapia w/ homemade tarter sAuce, 2 cups salad, feta cheese, avocado and dressing. At least I'm not so hungry today!!

Made some "fat bombs" this evening with hwc and sugar free chocolate yoohoo mix, omg I didn't have one but I licked my finger, YUMMY YUMMY YUMMY!!!!

[Buffy45]

Originally Posted by mom_2_4

My numbers are a little higher than I think they need to be on the protein for today but I was hungry LOL

Fat: 149.8
Protein:69.2
Carbs: 10
Calories:1501.8

The hwc in my coffee is killing it on the fat for me all day because I drink so much coffee!
Had coffee and 4 pieces of turkey bacon for breakfast, coffee for lunch and dinner is 8 oz broiled tilapia w/ homemade tarter sAuce, 2 cups salad, feta cheese, avocado and dressing. At least I'm not so hungry today!!

Made some "fat bombs" this evening with hwc and sugar free chocolate yoohoo mix, omg I didn't have one but I licked my finger, YUMMY YUMMY YUMMY!!!!

I don't see a problem with your fat unless you aren't losing.

[Buffy45]

Just posted a recipe I created tonight for hot chocolate over on our recipe thread

[mom_2_4]

Originally Posted by Buffy45

I don't see a problem with your fat unless you aren't losing.

I think my fat is good today, but I think protein may be to high? The problem with the fat is that soooooooo dang much of it seems to be consumed in my coffee LOL I think I may try almond milk in the morning with my coffee instead and see how I like that. Leave more room in my daily fat for food.

[Buffy45]

Originally Posted by mom_2_4

I think my fat is good today, but I think protein may be to high? The problem with the fat is that soooooooo dang much of it seems to be consumed in my coffee LOL I think I may try almond milk in the morning with my coffee instead and see how I like that. Leave more room in my daily fat for food.

You would have to post what your range is per day of fat/protein/carbs. Your number might be high for you or low for you, depends on what your nutritional goals are per day.

[mom_2_4]

Originally Posted by Buffy45

You would have to post what your range is per day of fat/protein/carbs. Your number might be high for you or low for you, depends on what your nutritional goals are per day.

I am shooting for
Fat: 140 ish
Carbs: less than 20
Protein: 55-70

I Am over my fat but that's not too concerning to me but definitely on the high end of protein since I just started I'm not sure what my threshold is, but I'm trying to stay on the lower end of protein. Although I'd imagine that after going from consuming copious amounts of protein while doing only LC what I had today is still SIGNIFICANTLY less than usual and probably a pretty good shock to my system

TOM came today so I'm curious to see how this will affect the scale in the morning. I also need to work hard at consuming more water, I'm bad about that.

I ordered the free meter online but it hasn't come in, I'm really curious what my reading will be. The urine strips have been barely anything in the morning most days until this morning now at a steady moderate reading which is good I hope, even though they aren't very accurate! I am wondering if I can use them as an indicator of when to test blood ketones?

[route66]

Here's what I ate yesterday:

B - Smoothie with 1T CO, 1/3 C strawberries, 1/4 c Almond Milk, 1/2 C full fat greek yogurt, 1 pkt splenda

Snack - 1.5 oz Macadamia Nuts, 3 T HWC with decaf

L- 1 C salad with 2 oz each of pork tenderloin, avocado and cherry tomatoes, 2 T olive oil and 1 bologna/american cheese roll up (no mayo)

D - 3.5 oz leftover beef brisket fried in CO, 4T Salsa, 2T Sour Cream

Dessert - 2 cream cheese clouds

Cals: 1864
C - 36
P - 60
F - 167

[portcop01]

Well lost 1/2 lb of the 1 lb I gained.still ok complain.5 lb lost for week..that's 2.5 lbs over what I planed .my goal is 2.2 a week.10 lbs a month...

We're what hate with a 1/2 lb lost.

B-1 lg.egg 1 tbs co...coffee 1 oz hwc

L- fat bomb

S- coffee ..1 tbs hwc..2fat bombs

D- 5.1 oz talipa .small cucumber in Briggs vinegar . 2 tbs evol.

Sf jello 1 tsp hwc.

I think I can't eat late it makes me not sleep well.i had jello at 8 to late for me I like to eat around 4-5 and not again till breakfast around 9.. That seems to work for me.

[laceymichelle]

You all have been very thankful as I learn about NK....thank u I have a question about my menu today.
B coffee w hwc. 2 HB eggs 1TB mayo
L 3 1-2 oz ground beef w onion and 2TB sour cream
Ok that puts my numbers at:
Prot 46, carbs 6, fat 69

My total #protein should only be at 60 (I'm even trying to aim for only 50-55g). So with that said what do u suggest my having for dinner? Or should I have fat only for breakfast and no eggs? Thanks so much!!!

[portcop01]

Lacey...I like to start my day off with protein and fat like eggs and co,hwc
If I do that I'm not hungry at lunch so I grabb me a fat bomb
For dinner I eat 4-5 oz meat and fats with that small salad or a veg cooked in butter or co

[laceymichelle]

Originally Posted by portcop01

Lacey...I like to start my day off with protein and fat like eggs and co,hwc
If I do that I'm not hungry at lunch so I grabb me a fat bomb
For dinner I eat 4-5 oz meat and fats with that small salad or a veg cooked in butter or co

Thanks portcop! I'll try doing this

[clackley]

Lacy, your figures seem a bit high (without knowing the specifics or fat ratios of your food). It looks like less than 40g so far.

What I have been doing is eating a pretty large breakfast of bacon and a portion of my favorite casserole - mac and cheese cauli. I am full until late afternoon or even later and then I have a smaller meal with a small portion of protein.

It has taken some time to get used to the changes but I have to say, I am loving it now. There is a recipe thread that has been started for other ideas... here is a link....

High fat, low to moderate protein recipes?

[paulabob]

Buffy, I'm also warm on this plan. Not feeling hot flashy, just no cold hands. At the game Friday night I kept my 12 yo daughter warmed up hugging her when the temps dropped. She's commented that I'm her personal furnace lately.

Last night's dinner was okay...then they brought free dessert. Took a couple bites, checked my blood sugar and it looked like I got 20-25 carbs from dinner just based on the numbers (had too many chips before the meal!). Definitely too much for me! I definitely have an easier time with fast food on this plan than with restaurant meals. With fast food I can always get a burger with several packets of mayo. Meals out are always a guess!

[Buffy45]

Morning! Day 14, feeling great, totally ready to keep going on this. I am going to just post my weight once a week and that is on Mondays. Of course I peek each morning and am showing a loss again this week but very small one as compared to the first week where I had that nice water swoosh.

Ketone reading 1.4 this AM, I think that is the highest I have gotten the the AM so now I might just stop testing at night, when it is usually the highest and just test in the AM, if I am in the zone in the AM then I know I am on track. My BS readings have consistently been below 100 since I started this but of course I am still on my diabetic meds, have cut them back just a little but will work closely with Dr. on that.

For those of you just starting, be sure and calculate your nutritional needs based on the links to use in the first post on this thread, Kristn has posted links to ways to calculate these numbers. The most important is your protein needs, too high and you won't lose but too low and you will lose LBM which is what you absolutely do not want to do. Second, your amount of carbs. Most people are starting out keeping them 20 or below. I set my goal to 20-30 but am counting all carbs, not just net carbs. Then, let the fat make up the rest. I hope you don't just look at the thread and think low protein and just guess at that because your body needs a certain amount. Please, any of you who have been doing this longer, correct me on these statements if I am wrong, I won't be offended. I just don't want people jumping on this bandwagon and thinking they shouldn't eat protein hardly at all.

If you are coming off of high protein, low carb, it will take you awhile to get used to the lower amounts of protein but that is where the lovely fat comes into play. It is what satisfys your hunger and makes you feel full and happy. Add CO to your coffee, or last night I made a lovely hot chocolate with coconut cream concentrate. Use butter and CO for cooking, add CO to your smoothies, the fat bombs are the BOMB!!! I have to hold back on those to keep my calories in check, I have eaten as many as 4 in one day and could have eaten more. Cream cheese muffins, Cream Cheese clouds, heck, just cream cheese with a little flavoring and some sweetner is divine.

Paula, eating out is hard, especially if it is really good food. I can easily say no to mediocre food but fine food, keep it away from me now if it has sugar or carbs. Same way with really really good bread!!

[Buffy45]

Here is one formula to figure daily needs:

The formula created by Dr. Jan Kwasniewski, is:

((Height in cm)-100) +/-10% = Protein Grams [ I use the -10% number]
Fat grams = P*2.5
Carb grams = P*.5

This is the one Reddarin uses and he is having great success.

[cfine]

Ok, I THINK I may have finally figured this out, but I'm having a horrible time coming up with real meals.

Yesterday's menu:
B-coffee w/4tbsp.HWC, 2tbsp.CO
L-6oz.salmon cooked in CO w/butter, 1cup broccoli w/1/4cup cheese and 1tbsp.butter
S-coffee w/4tbsp.HWC 2tbsp/CO(I didn't drink all of this one though)
S-1/3cup mac. nuts
S-two CC clouds

I felt like I just snacked all day long. I really like to have regular meals, but because I have to keep my protein so low I'm finding it very hard. Also, I can't drink coffee like this daily because I have interstitial cystititis and my bladder is on fire today. How can I get my fat in without the coffee?
Today I am going to make some creamed spinach to try and get my fat in.
Yesterday my weight was 232.5, today is was 229.8 so I know this is what I need to do. I am just at a loss with my menu.

[nitenurse]

Question to those who have been doing this awhile, does the pattern of weight loss any different than with Atkins? I used to have a fast 10# loss with lowcarb, then kind of bounce up and down with a gradual loss.
This high fat plan seems to work a little different, but I feel good most days. Really nice not to be hungry all the time.

[mom_2_4]

Woohoo, scale is still showing a loss even though TOM is here! Maybe I'll drop more once that's gone. Trying almond milk in my coffee this morning rather than hwc to allow for more fat throughout the day in my meals. Hopefully that will leave me not feeling soooooooo hungry throughout the day!

[maybelle]

Wow - this thread is moving fast!

I made butter tea for the first time yesterday. OMG so good. I used "oriental express" loose tea (basically apple&cinnamon flavored blakc tea), around 3/4 tablespoon kerrygold butter and around 2-3tablespoons HWC. Sooooo good!

Small question - I'm getting the impression that CO makes me feel a little jittery. Has anyone else experienced this?

On weight: I overshot my calories yesterday, but the scale was nice this morning- down 100g (0.2 lbs). I know I could be in for a suprise tomorrow, but we'll see.

So far today:

B: 1 slice flax foccacia with a little cream cheese, slice of ham, two soft boiled eggs
S: coffee w 1T CO, 2T HWC
L/Afternoon snack: 1 Fage greek yoghurt with a little bit of mascarpone mixed in, 4 pecan nuts, 2oz salami
D: will most likely consist of baked camembert with some zuchinni and then a treat of small apple poached in red wine, stuffed with coconut & baked (probably will bring up cabrs a bit more today...)

[Buffy45]

Originally Posted by cfine

Ok, I THINK I may have finally figured this out, but I'm having a horrible time coming up with real meals.

Yesterday's menu:
B-coffee w/4tbsp.HWC, 2tbsp.CO
L-6oz.salmon cooked in CO w/butter, 1cup broccoli w/1/4cup cheese and 1tbsp.butter
S-coffee w/4tbsp.HWC 2tbsp/CO(I didn't drink all of this one though)
S-1/3cup mac. nuts
S-two CC clouds

I felt like I just snacked all day long. I really like to have regular meals, but because I have to keep my protein so low I'm finding it very hard. Also, I can't drink coffee like this daily because I have interstitial cystititis and my bladder is on fire today. How can I get my fat in without the coffee?
Today I am going to make some creamed spinach to try and get my fat in.
Yesterday my weight was 232.5, today is was 229.8 so I know this is what I need to do. I am just at a loss with my menu.

You get used to smaller servings of protein per meal. So, you would just have half of what you had for lunch and that again for dinner.

Make some of Rebecca's fat bombs, they are delish and easy wonderful way to get your fats in. They are on her blog My Low Carb Road to Better Health. You don't have to drink that much coffee.

[Buffy45]

Rebecca, if you check in or see this, would you mind posting your fat bomb recipe on our HF/MP/LC recipe thread? Or, I would be glad to do it and give you credit, just don't want to overstep.

[3Kids4me]

So my fasted morning BG was 110. I'm trying to decide if that's a problem.

I found this information:

Dawn Phenomenon

The dawn phenomenon is a term which describes an unexplained rise in blood sugar levels overnight, due to a decrease in insulin or its effects.
The result is that fasting blood sugars in the morning are more elevated than would be expected over individual baseline readings. For example, if you experience this phenomenona, and your average blood sugar is around 90 when you go to bed, your fasting blood sugar may be 100 -110 when you wake up in the morning, even though you didn't eat all through the night.

Normally, elevated blood sugar is the result of eating carbohydrates or too much protein. However, the overnight blood sugar increase is not associated with food consumption.

It starts with a process called gluconeogenesis in the liver. Some researchers believe that a release of cortisol or other hormones during the night initiates the process, and weakens the action of insulin between 2 AM and 8 AM.

The actual mechanism is not well understood, but the extra sugar comes from the breakdown of glycogen and other substrates in the liver, while you sleep.

In some people, the blood sugar elevation is significant, and for others, barely noticeable. This phenomenon is of particular interest to Type 1 diabetics, because more insulin must be injected before bedtime in preparation for handling the extra blood sugar throughout the night.

In a paper published in Endocrine Practice, the authors define the increase in blood sugar at dawn as such:


"To be clinically relevant, the magnitude of the dawn increase in blood glucose level should be more than 10 mg/dL or the increase in insulin requirement should be at least 20% from the overnight nadir...Approximately 54% of patients with type 1 diabetes and 55% of patients with type 2 diabetes experience the phenomenon when the foregoing quantitative definition is used."


It was at the Ketogenic Diet Resource website.

I didn't really eat anything different last night, lunch was mostly veggies, less fat and protein, but dinner was high fat, low carbs.

???

My ketones were 3.3, so whatever affected my BG didn't affect ketones.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by Buffy45

Morning! Day 14, feeling great, totally ready to keep going on this. I am going to just post my weight once a week and that is on Mondays. Of course I peek each morning and am showing a loss again this week but very small one as compared to the first week where I had that nice water swoosh.

Ketone reading 1.4 this AM, I think that is the highest I have gotten the the AM so now I might just stop testing at night, when it is usually the highest and just test in the AM, if I am in the zone in the AM then I know I am on track. My BS readings have consistently been below 100 since I started this but of course I am still on my diabetic meds, have cut them back just a little but will work closely with Dr. on that.

Congratulations on getting those great ketone readings. I can't wait to see your results tomorrow!

For those of you just starting, be sure and calculate your nutritional needs based on the links to use in the first post on this thread, Kristn has posted links to ways to calculate these numbers. The most important is your protein needs, too high and you won't lose but too low and you will lose LBM which is what you absolutely do not want to do. Second, your amount of carbs. Most people are starting out keeping them 20 or below. I set my goal to 20-30 but am counting all carbs, not just net carbs. Then, let the fat make up the rest. I hope you don't just look at the thread and think low protein and just guess at that because your body needs a certain amount. Please, any of you who have been doing this longer, correct me on these statements if I am wrong, I won't be offended. I just don't want people jumping on this bandwagon and thinking they shouldn't eat protein hardly at all.

If you are coming off of high protein, low carb, it will take you awhile to get used to the lower amounts of protein but that is where the lovely fat comes into play. It is what satisfys your hunger and makes you feel full and happy. Add CO to your coffee, or last night I made a lovely hot chocolate with coconut cream concentrate. Use butter and CO for cooking, add CO to your smoothies, the fat bombs are the BOMB!!! I have to hold back on those to keep my calories in check, I have eaten as many as 4 in one day and could have eaten more. Cream cheese muffins, Cream Cheese clouds, heck, just cream cheese with a little flavoring and some sweetner is divine.

Here is one formula to figure daily needs:

The formula created by Dr. Jan Kwasniewski, is:

Height in cm +/-10% = Protein Grams [ I use the -10% number]
Fat grams = P*2.5
Carb grams = P*.5

This is the one Reddarin uses and he is having great success.

Oops, you have a typo.
The formula is:
Height in cm-100 +/-10% = Protein Grams [ I use the -10% number]
Fat grams = P*2.5
Carb grams = P*.5

And I think this is a great starting point, but would be too much fat and carbs for me to lose. Protein is spot on.

Thanks for posting this information Buffy! It's great to have

[Flavia]

Originally Posted by Buffy45

Rebecca, if you check in or see this, would you mind posting your fat bomb recipe on our HF/MP/LC recipe thread? Or, I would be glad to do it and give you credit, just don't want to overstep.

I am pretty sure its already there....ppl just have to look

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by 3Kids4me

So my fasted morning BG was 110. I'm trying to decide if that's a problem.
<snip>
My ketones were 3.3, so whatever affected my BG didn't affect ketones.

Jamie--I've had a few days this month with high (for me-in the 90s) am fasted BG. I think mine was due to stress and TOM. As my stress has abated and TOM has left the building my am BG has gone back to normal.

I don't have much experience in this area, but I would try to see if there's a pattern (food, stress, etc.) and adjust accordingly (if possible).

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by nitenurse

Question to those who have been doing this awhile, does the pattern of weight loss any different than with Atkins? I used to have a fast 10# loss with lowcarb, then kind of bounce up and down with a gradual loss.
This high fat plan seems to work a little different, but I feel good most days. Really nice not to be hungry all the time.

My experience on this plan is that I would bounce around for a few weeks and then have a whoosh week where I'd lose 2-4 pounds. So losing in fits-and-starts rather than a steady loss every week.

[clackley]

Originally Posted by 3Kids4me

So my fasted morning BG was 110. I'm trying to decide if that's a problem.

I found this information:

Dawn Phenomenon

The dawn phenomenon is a term which describes an unexplained rise in blood sugar levels overnight, due to a decrease in insulin or its effects.
The result is that fasting blood sugars in the morning are more elevated than would be expected over individual baseline readings. For example, if you experience this phenomenona, and your average blood sugar is around 90 when you go to bed, your fasting blood sugar may be 100 -110 when you wake up in the morning, even though you didn't eat all through the night.

Normally, elevated blood sugar is the result of eating carbohydrates or too much protein. However, the overnight blood sugar increase is not associated with food consumption.

It starts with a process called gluconeogenesis in the liver. Some researchers believe that a release of cortisol or other hormones during the night initiates the process, and weakens the action of insulin between 2 AM and 8 AM.

The actual mechanism is not well understood, but the extra sugar comes from the breakdown of glycogen and other substrates in the liver, while you sleep.

In some people, the blood sugar elevation is significant, and for others, barely noticeable. This phenomenon is of particular interest to Type 1 diabetics, because more insulin must be injected before bedtime in preparation for handling the extra blood sugar throughout the night.

In a paper published in Endocrine Practice, the authors define the increase in blood sugar at dawn as such:


"To be clinically relevant, the magnitude of the dawn increase in blood glucose level should be more than 10 mg/dL or the increase in insulin requirement should be at least 20% from the overnight nadir...Approximately 54% of patients with type 1 diabetes and 55% of patients with type 2 diabetes experience the phenomenon when the foregoing quantitative definition is used."


It was at the Ketogenic Diet Resource website.

I didn't really eat anything different last night, lunch was mostly veggies, less fat and protein, but dinner was high fat, low carbs.

???

My ketones were 3.3, so whatever affected my BG didn't affect ketones.

If you are not diabetic, this is likely what is known as physiological insulin resistance and is something that appears to happen to long term low carbers. It is discussed at some length over at Hyperlipid and else where. The important thing is that it is normal. It will be of great interest to me (and likely lots of others) what happens to your b.g. as you continue with NK woe.

Jimmy Moore has posted his results after months of NK and his b.g. levels appear to have 'normalized' over time. One note - he is taking a supplement that is geared toward lowering b.g..

[clackley]

Newbie question
You all have been very thankful as I learn about NK....thank u I have a question about my menu today.
B coffee w hwc. 2 HB eggs 1TB mayo
L 3 1-2 oz ground beef w onion and 2TB sour cream
Ok that puts my numbers at:
Prot 46, carbs 6, fat 69

My total #protein should only be at 60 (I'm even trying to aim for only 50-55g). So with that said what do u suggest my having for dinner? Or should I have fat only for breakfast and no eggs? Thanks so much!!!

Ok, I THINK I may have finally figured this out, but I'm having a horrible time coming up with real meals.

Yesterday's menu:
B-coffee w/4tbsp.HWC, 2tbsp.CO
L-6oz.salmon cooked in CO w/butter, 1cup broccoli w/1/4cup cheese and 1tbsp.butter
S-coffee w/4tbsp.HWC 2tbsp/CO(I didn't drink all of this one though)
S-1/3cup mac. nuts
S-two CC clouds

I felt like I just snacked all day long. I really like to have regular meals, but because I have to keep my protein so low I'm finding it very hard. Also, I can't drink coffee like this daily because I have interstitial cystititis and my bladder is on fire today. How can I get my fat in without the coffee?
Today I am going to make some creamed spinach to try and get my fat in.
Yesterday my weight was 232.5, today is was 229.8 so I know this is what I need to do. I am just at a loss with my menu.

I wonder if it would be useful to start a NK 'what are you eating?' thread for those that are searching for daily menus?

[Buffy45]

Originally Posted by clackley

If you are not diabetic, this is likely what is known as physiological insulin resistance and is something that appears to happen to long term low carbers. It is discussed at some length over at Hyperlipid and else where. The important thing is that it is normal. It will be of great interest to me (and likely lots of others) what happens to your b.g. as you continue with NK woe.

Jimmy Moore has posted his results after months of NK and his b.g. levels appear to have 'normalized' over time. One note - he is taking a supplement that is geared toward lowering b.g..

I can go over and look but can you tell us what supplement he is taking toward lowering BG? TIA