Nutritional Ketosis (LC/HF/MP) Challenge Anyone?

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by loop4yah

mom2zeke: Is there a specific reason you want to switch macadamia nut butter for the almond butter... Or is it more so a taste preference?

Taste preference and better fat profile. I love mac nuts!

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by RebeccaLatham

The fat bombs are very melty pretty quickly! I take one in a little plastic container to work each day, and my drive is about 20 minutes. But as soon as I get there, I put it in the freezer until I need to eat it. I would suggest maybe putting it in a zip lock bag with an ice cube or two..

I will give this a try, although now I'm a bit worried about having them in the house...

As far as using them for a "cheat" suppressor, I eat them as part of my scheduled food. If I ate them when I am tempted to eat, I would overeat them..

Darn! I was hoping that the high fat content would be extremely filling and help stop overeating.

I haven't really eaten off of plan for many years. I do have a once-a-year carbfest on my birthday, but I don't seem to have any problem eating clean at the next meal. I do, however, eat too much on-plan food. And I rarely do LC treats because I can really over do it.

I find that when I am eating this way, I am not tempted to cheat. I feel pretty satisfied all the time.

I also find this to be mostly true. It's definitely gotten easier since I started.

[RebeccaLatham]

I think that when you become keto-adapted, those horrible food cravings go away, as long as you don't have it shoved in your face all the time. I have NO DESIRE for cake and ice cream. Unless I am at a party and everyone is eating cake and ice cream. Then I want it.

99.9% of the time, I eat in my own home, where I control the food atmosphere. It's when I go to other people's homes or to a restaurant that I can get in trouble.

We all do what we have to do. My MO is to just keep healthy foods in my house and eat at home. If there is a food in my house that I want that is not good for me, I find it hard to resist, just on an emotional level.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by RebeccaLatham

99.9% of the time, I eat in my own home, where I control the food atmosphere. It's when I go to other people's homes or to a restaurant that I can get in trouble.

This is my downfall too! Lately when I go out I look at the menu beforehand and try to choose what I'll eat before I go. If I just go out without a plan I'm doomed.

[mom2zeke]

Happy Friday everyone! No changes for me today. How is everyone else doing?

I am always challenged going into the weekend, and this one is no different. Tonight should be fine, but tomorrow evening we're meeting up with winemaker friends here on a sales trip. Not sure if it's dinner or just drinks. It seems rude not to sample the wares. I guess I'll have to jimmy with my menu for tomorrow to include a couple of glasses of vino. I'll probably test Sunday morning to see the effects.

[paulabob]

I'm back up to 126 today but it's just ovulation weight. At least I know what it is and don't have to second guess myself!

Hope everyone's ready for a good weekend. Sending my 12 yo DD off with her grandparents for a trip to Missouri. Going to miss her like mad!

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by paulabob

I'm back up to 126 today but it's just ovulation weight. At least I know what it is and don't have to second guess myself!

Hope everyone's ready for a good weekend. Sending my 12 yo DD off with her grandparents for a trip to Missouri. Going to miss her like mad!

Isn't it lovely how hormones effect our weight! For some of us it seems like there are only a couple of windows a month where weight loss can occur.

How long is your DD gone for?

[paulabob]

Originally Posted by mom2zeke

Isn't it lovely how hormones effect our weight! For some of us it seems like there are only a couple of windows a month where weight loss can occur.

How long is your DD gone for?

Almost a week! She's never been gone more than 1 day from me. But she's spent the night with the grandparents before, and she'll be with her cousin.

LOL, sending a bottle of benedryl with them just in case. She's NOT a good sleeper, even at 12!

[RebeccaLatham]

I passed the mirror test again this morning, and sure enough, I lost 1/8" around my waist and 1/8" around my hips. I thought I looked thinner!

I have now gone from 37.2% body fat on July 9, 2012 to 33.9% body fat today, 25 days later.

I only need to lose another 7.7 pounds of body fat and gain another 0.7 pounds of lean body mass to reach my goal.



And I'm beginning to think it might actually happen!

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by paulabob

Almost a week! She's never been gone more than 1 day from me. But she's spent the night with the grandparents before, and she'll be with her cousin.

LOL, sending a bottle of benedryl with them just in case. She's NOT a good sleeper, even at 12!

I'm sure she'll have a great time. What an adventure for her (and you)!

Originally Posted by RebeccaLatham

I passed the mirror test again this morning, and sure enough, I lost 1/8" around my waist and 1/8" around my hips. I thought I looked thinner!

I have now gone from 37.2% body fat on July 9, 2012 to 33.9% body fat today, 25 days later.

I only need to lose another 7.7 pounds of body fat and gain another 0.7 pounds of lean body mass to reach my goal.

And I'm beginning to think it might actually happen!

Great news Rebecca!!

[RebeccaLatham]

Thanks, Kristn!

[RebeccaLatham]

By the way, I asked a little while ago if anyone knew where I can find the thread about Rodale. I could not find it. If someone already answered, I guess I missed it.

Anyone? Bueller?

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by RebeccaLatham

By the way, I asked a little while ago if anyone knew where I can find the thread about Rodale. I could not find it. If someone already answered, I guess I missed it.

Anyone? Bueller?

Did you mean Rosedale?

Here are some threads:

Anyone doing the Rosedale diet?

Rosedale Diet

It doesn't look like there's much action on this diet. I got the book from the library but didn't find it all that enlightening. He's against saturated fat which I don't really understand. Basically it's moderate protein, low carb, higher fat. I see a theme here.

[RebeccaLatham]

Thanks, and yes, I made a typo on the name!

[RebeccaLatham]

I read his book a while back, and was surprised that he would only allow eggs soft boiled or poached. No scrambled or fried eggs? Puh-lease!

I was curious what he had to say about the amount of protein to eat.

[Alessandre]

Rebecca: I guessed I missed it. What were you looking for in terms of Rodale?

...

I received my ketone meter and just tested: 0.6. I'm surprised it is this low. I haven't had anything to eat since last night when I had chicken salad (chicken with mayo and nothing else). Today I have had SF, decaf iced tea with Splenda, which has maltodextrin, but the quantity of Splenda was really small. I would hate to cut out iced tea: I would find it hard to drink enough plain water as I need on a ketogenic diet, and I avoid Crystal Light because it is so acidic. I haven't had breakfast or lunch yet, but it will be more chicken.

Any experiences with Splenda affecting your ketone level?

And I blew through several ketone strips just doing the control as it kept giving me an error message. I think the battery might need replacing. I ordered extra strips, but I think I will be testing much more frequently than I planned!

[RebeccaLatham]

I just read this on that thread:

He also recommended limiting saturated fat, and on JM's forum I asked why. He replied that he only recommends limiting it for the first few weeks until you're firmly into ketosis, because if you're eating dietary saturated fat, the body will use that first before it starts to burn off your own stores. After you are firmly in ketosis, saturated fat is OK becasue your metabolism is primed to burn fat.

[RebeccaLatham]

Originally Posted by Alessandre

Rebecca: I guessed I missed it. What were you looking for in terms of Rodale

I was curious what his protein recommendations are.

[Alessandre]

I think I repeated the typo. Sorry!

Rosedale says 1 gm protein per every kilogram of lean body mass. He suggests taking your ideal weight in kilograms and estimating your daily protein needs as 1 gm per kilo, minus 10%. He also says you can add 5 or 10 grams a day if you are highly active. HTH.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by RebeccaLatham

I was curious what his protein recommendations are.

I got this off of his website:

On average, you want to have approximately one gram of protein for every kilogram of lean body mass (that is, the weight of your body minus the fat - we all have some fat). The easiest way to calculate your daily protein requirement is to take your ideal weight in kilograms (that is, what you would like to weigh if you could weigh anything) and have roughly one gram of protein per kilogram, minus 10%. For example, if you were a woman who is 5.4 ft (165 centimeters) tall, your ‘ideal’ weight would likely be in the neighborhood of 110 lbs (50 kilograms). Thus, your protein intake per day should be somewhere around the 50g - 10% = 45 grams of protein, split approximately evenly between meals.

Almost all the information about the diet is there. You can google it.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by Alessandre

Rebecca: I guessed I missed it. What were you looking for in terms of Rodale?

...

I received my ketone meter and just tested: 0.6. I'm surprised it is this low. I haven't had anything to eat since last night when I had chicken salad (chicken with mayo and nothing else). Today I have had SF, decaf iced tea with Splenda, which has maltodextrin, but the quantity of Splenda was really small. I would hate to cut out iced tea: I would find it hard to drink enough plain water as I need on a ketogenic diet, and I avoid Crystal Light because it is so acidic. I haven't had breakfast or lunch yet, but it will be more chicken.

Any experiences with Splenda affecting your ketone level?

And I blew through several ketone strips just doing the control as it kept giving me an error message. I think the battery might need replacing. I ordered extra strips, but I think I will be testing much more frequently than I planned!

Sorry to hear about the lost strips. You might call them for replacements.

I haven't had anything effect my ketosis so far (even artificial sweeteners). Can you give us your menu so that we can trouble-shoot? svenskemae had that great list of things to help get into ketosis.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by Alessandre

I think I repeated the typo. Sorry!

Rosedale says 1 gm protein per every kilogram of lean body mass. He suggests taking your ideal weight in kilograms and estimating your daily protein needs as 1 gm per kilo, minus 10%. He also says you can add 5 or 10 grams a day if you are highly active. HTH.

Mine is ~60 per Dr. Rosedale. I think that I'm moderately active so it seems pretty much on track for me--60-70 per day.

[svenskamae]

My meter and strips arrived yesterday, but I'm not testing until for another week or so. I had to eat breaded chicken breast and fruit (best available choices) at a professional dinner last night, and I have to be out of town at a conference for a week starting Sunday, so it will be harder to stay strictly on plan. I'll start posting my results once I actually start testing. Have a good weekend, everyone.

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by svenskamae

My meter and strips arrived yesterday, but I'm not testing until for another week or so. I had to eat breaded chicken breast and fruit (best available choices) at a professional dinner last night, and I have to be out of town at a conference for a week starting Sunday, so it will be harder to stay strictly on plan. I'll start posting my results once I actually start testing. Have a good weekend, everyone.

At least it wasn't pasta! It will be interesting to see your results once you start testing. Hopefully your conference will go well.

[Alessandre]

Originally Posted by mom2zeke

Sorry to hear about the lost strips. You might call them for replacements.

I haven't had anything effect my ketosis so far (even artificial sweeteners). Can you give us your menu so that we can trouble-shoot? svenskemae had that great list of things to help get into ketosis.

In terms of a menu, the last three days haven't been much:

- cheese (0 carbs)
- turkey sticks (0 carbs)
- chicken
- cabbage (probably a quarter cup, cooked)
- onion (about a tablespoon per day, cooked)
- celery (about a tablespoon per day, cooked)
- cauliflower soup (pureed cauliflower, chicken broth, hwc, pepper, salt)
- ham (0 carbs)
- scrambled eggs (eggs, chicken broth, no-carb sour cream)
- no added-sugar pickles (less than a quarter cup a day)
- beef (cooked in coconut oil)

There were two types of chicken: roasted and sauteed in coconut oil. Oil or carb-free mayo, salt, and some spices are all that were added.

I really wonder if it is the Splenda. I saw a 1.7 pound loss over the last two weeks, which was much smaller than I anticipated. I think part of the low losses came from not getting enough calories and protein. I didn't plan that; the last week or so has been chaotic, with a family member in crisis. So I know I didn't eat anywhere near enough protein to feed gluconeogenesis. But I wonder if the Splenda has been adding to the low ketone problem.

I tested about an hour after dinner (beef, with a small amount of cabbage, onions, and celery), and my ketones were 0.4 mmol/L. I had been drinking Splenda-sweetened tea during this time. I have switched to Crystal Light, using a flavor that has maltodextrin listed third. I can't imagine there's much more than a trace as the carbs are zero and it doesn't need a filler, unlike granulated Splenda. I will retest tomorrow after sticking to a similar food intake. If I see an increase, I'm blaming the maltodextrin in Splenda for my initial low values.

I will probably burn through too many ketone strips trying to get it right, but I figure that is better than saving them and heading off in the wrong direction.

[paulabob]

Originally Posted by Alessandre

I will probably burn through too many ketone strips trying to get it right, but I figure that is better than saving them and heading off in the wrong direction.

Do you know how many grams of protein per day you are averaging? I think it does have an effect on ketosis for some of us.

I also have been doing some Diet soda and crystal lite and still losing...it may be an individual thing. I've given it up before but it's never helped my losses.

[RebeccaLatham]

Originally Posted by svenskamae

My meter and strips arrived yesterday, but I'm not testing until for another week or so. I had to eat breaded chicken breast and fruit (best available choices) at a professional dinner last night, and I have to be out of town at a conference for a week starting Sunday, so it will be harder to stay strictly on plan. I'll start posting my results once I actually start testing.

If it were me, I would test at least once before you enter ketosis, so that you something to compare it to. I did not get my strips until I had been eating this way for several days, and I wished I had gotten them sooner so that I would see if eating this way made any improvement in my ketone levels.

The first time I tested, it was 3.1, in the morning before eating. Since then, my average has been 2.2. I'm really sorry I don't know what it was before I changed my eating pattern.

My only choice was to put off making the eating change until after the strips arrived, but I was just to anxious to start losing weight!

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by Alessandre

In terms of a menu, the last three days haven't been much:

- cheese (0 carbs)
- turkey sticks (0 carbs)
- chicken
- cabbage (probably a quarter cup, cooked)
- onion (about a tablespoon per day, cooked)
- celery (about a tablespoon per day, cooked)
- cauliflower soup (pureed cauliflower, chicken broth, hwc, pepper, salt)
- ham (0 carbs)
- scrambled eggs (eggs, chicken broth, no-carb sour cream)
- no added-sugar pickles (less than a quarter cup a day)
- beef (cooked in coconut oil)

There were two types of chicken: roasted and sauteed in coconut oil. Oil or carb-free mayo, salt, and some spices are all that were added.

Do you know the number of grams of protein and carbs you have been eating? The protein should be limited to an amount based on either your goal weight or lean body mass. Too much protein will keep you out of ketosis.

So I know I didn't eat anywhere near enough protein to feed gluconeogenesis.

This may be part of the problem. You do not want to induce gluconeogenesis. It will keep you from getting fully keto-adapted. As long as your body is using glucose instead of ketones for fuel you are not adapting. You want to make sure that you are only eating enough protein for your body's needs.

I will probably burn through too many ketone strips trying to get it right, but I figure that is better than saving them and heading off in the wrong direction.

Seems like a good plan. How are you doing today?

[mom2zeke]

Originally Posted by Alessandre

I really wonder if it is the Splenda. I saw a 1.7 pound loss over the last two weeks, which was much smaller than I anticipated. I think part of the low losses came from not getting enough calories and protein. I didn't plan that; the last week or so has been chaotic, with a family member in crisis. So I know I didn't eat anywhere near enough protein to feed gluconeogenesis. But I wonder if the Splenda has been adding to the low ketone problem.

I don't have a problem with splenda, but I never use the powdered type. I either use DaVinci syrups or the concentrated drops.

Stress (and cortisol) can also keep you from losing. I'm not sure what effect it has on ketosis.

[mom2zeke]

Ugh. Serious PMS yesterday--I wish TOM would start again already! I was ravenous when I got home from work yesterday and ate a lot more than I had planned. I ended up eating 91 grams of protein, 20 grams of carbs, and 165 grams of fat for the day. Protein and fat were high for me. I tested for blood glucose and ketones this morning to see how I was effected.

Ketones: 1.8
Glucose: 81

So my little protein fest didn't kick me out of ketosis. I am off the scale for about the next week until TOM subsides. It's too volatile and will make me cranky. I'm just going to stay on the plan without worrying about the scale for now.