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Old 03-09-2010, 10:31 AM   #571
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Posting somewhat hurriedly, as I don't have a lot of time till I'm called back to the courtroom.

Jami, you're pics look great. You have SO VERY LITTLE weight to lose. It's all body comp for you, Sistah! And in that regard, you're doing all the right things and making progress!

Laura, your question:

Quote:
ITA agree that very low calorie dieting does all of the things that Venuto states. But what does he constitute as very low calorie? Everything I've ever heard about regarding the absolute lows in calories for women is 1200. I'm not arguing with you at all, just wondering if there is new info out there that is now setting that bar higher.
To summarize, think of it this way. When calories are cut below basal metabolic needs, the body will accommodate and slow its metabolism, so it becomes difficult to lose fat even on low calories. 1200 calories for you is DEFINITELY below basal needs. Can you lose weight, and have you lost weight, on 1200 cals? Sure. But by forcing your body to "get by" on that amount of cals over a long period of time, you are damaging your metabolism. You by forcing that have created your sluggish metabolism, thus little or no progress.

I just read a stastic the other day (should have saved it) from some research that proved that people who keep their deficits between 300-500 (no more!) lose better and keep it off easier than those who try to force larger deficits. The cookie-cutter formula for cals while dieting is 10-12 x your body weight in calories. (That's for weight LOSS.) So do the math. You're forcing a large deficit, and over a long period of time, which equals: A SLOWER AND SLOWER METABOLISM.

Not saying you can't lose on 1200. But it will become increasingly more difficult to lose on that amount of calories day after day after day.

Nice to see all the newcomers.

Gotta run.

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Old 03-09-2010, 11:01 AM   #572
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Dear Twyla,

Always LOVE your posts.

BUT.......why do you use such a small typeface? You're straining my eyes, girlfriend!
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Old 03-09-2010, 11:33 AM   #573
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Sunday 03-07-2010 Max Effort Dip Test

Hi All,

We got a reprieve from the impending trial date and I have been posting away after coming up for air, so I wanted to stop in and contribute.

I decided to do a Dip test Sunday instead of a Push-Up test.

I got 34 Dips (at bodyweight; no vest or other extra weight). Wanted to hit 40, but I'll take it, as I am once again on the fool's errand of trying to lose bodyfat and get significantly stronger at the same time.

Weighed in at 196.5 on Monday after carbing up over the weekend for the Dip test.

My tri's were "swole" after the dip test. Usually more defined, but the carb bloat was in full effect.
IMG_0886.jpg
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Old 03-09-2010, 12:00 PM   #574
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HOLY CRAP Stack! Now THAT is a pump!!
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Old 03-09-2010, 12:32 PM   #575
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayberryfan View Post
Dear Twyla,

Always LOVE your posts.

BUT.......why do you use such a small typeface? You're straining my eyes, girlfriend!
Celeste,You're kidding, right?

The Century font (Size 1) that I used in my last post -- on my screen anyway -- is the same size as the default font for LCF threads....

Century Gothic standard
Century Gothic Size 2
Century Gothic Size 1

I don't like the default font, so I always use Franklin or Century (typically), but if I fear I'm "billboarding" it if I don't specify Size 1.

This, by the way, is default font at Size 4.

I'm using a lot of words right now and saying nuthin a'tall! So I'm gonna shut up.

Last edited by WATCH-ME-SHRINK; 03-09-2010 at 12:36 PM..
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Old 03-09-2010, 12:34 PM   #576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stackdiesel View Post

I got 34 Dips (at bodyweight; no vest or other extra weight). Wanted to hit 40, but I'll take it, as I am once again on the fool's errand of trying to lose bodyfat and get significantly stronger at the same time.

Weighed in at 196.5 on Monday after carbing up over the weekend for the Dip test.

My tri's were "swole" after the dip test. Usually more defined, but the carb bloat was in full effect.
Attachment 28806

STACK:




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Old 03-09-2010, 12:40 PM   #577
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twyla. that one is much better! LOL It was hard to read your posts darlin'. Although it is a little bit too big. Can you make it smaller, and also, double space your lines. LOL JUST KIDDING!!!

Last edited by jamistar77; 03-09-2010 at 12:41 PM..
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Old 03-09-2010, 12:51 PM   #578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamistar77 View Post
twyla. that one is much better! LOL It was hard to read your posts darlin'. Although it is a little bit too big. Can you make it smaller, and also, double space your lines. LOL JUST KIDDING!!!
With a penchant to please, any other requests? Underline? Bold? Italicize? Quotation Marks? Alignment parameters? Extra emoticons (Lord no, please)?

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Old 03-09-2010, 12:56 PM   #579
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HA! Perfect!! Thanks Twyla HEHE
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:01 PM   #580
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Need help/advice please!

I began LC'ing 9 days ago. Today was my first gym workout with my carbs at 30net and at that time of day my calories were at 660. Protein was 27, fat 42. I was weak and got the shakes after the workout... What's that all about????

Help oh experienced ones...
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:07 PM   #581
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Your only 9 days in... I just think that your body has to get used to this WOE. I remember that when I started LCing I could only get through 1/2 of a cardio kick boxing dvd, and before I started LCing I was running 6 miles a few times a week. Its a transition. Your body is having to pull from fat, and it takes more energy for you body to do that, than it does from glycogen.
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:10 PM   #582
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Thanks for the props, Jami and Twyla.
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:15 PM   #583
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Much better, Twyla! You get a gold star today.

Stack ~ check out those guns! Lookin' good!!

And now.../drumroll/...the moment is here. Time for me to give details on today's workout. (What? I can insert a little drama?? )

warm-up - 1st 6 minutes of Crunch Fat Burning Pilates DVD
24 squats @ 62 lbs.
60 bird dogs
24 dead lifts @ 62 lbs.
24 rows @ 20 lbs.
24 bench press @ 40 lbs.
20 planks @ 10 counts each
20 tricep ext. @ 20 lbs.

Did about 20 minutes of the fat burning pilates dvd after, and about 5-6 minutes of the matwork and I was D.O.N.E. done! Didn't finish it today. But, it was a good HARD workout just the same.
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:42 PM   #584
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Thanks Celeste. Looks like you are doing great and have implemented carb-ups/refeeds into your program. How is that working out?
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:51 PM   #585
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WATCH-ME-SHRINK View Post
Posting somewhat hurriedly, as I don't have a lot of time till I'm called back to the courtroom.

Jami, you're pics look great. You have SO VERY LITTLE weight to lose. It's all body comp for you, Sistah! And in that regard, you're doing all the right things and making progress!

Laura, your question:



To summarize, think of it this way. When calories are cut below basal metabolic needs, the body will accommodate and slow its metabolism, so it becomes difficult to lose fat even on low calories. 1200 calories for you is DEFINITELY below basal needs. Can you lose weight, and have you lost weight, on 1200 cals? Sure. But by forcing your body to "get by" on that amount of cals over a long period of time, you are damaging your metabolism. You by forcing that have created your sluggish metabolism, thus little or no progress.

I just read a stastic the other day (should have saved it) from some research that proved that people who keep their deficits between 300-500 (no more!) lose better and keep it off easier than those who try to force larger deficits. The cookie-cutter formula for cals while dieting is 10-12 x your body weight in calories. (That's for weight LOSS.) So do the math. You're forcing a large deficit, and over a long period of time, which equals: A SLOWER AND SLOWER METABOLISM.

Not saying you can't lose on 1200. But it will become increasingly more difficult to lose on that amount of calories day after day after day.

Nice to see all the newcomers.

Gotta run.

Jami - ITA, your pics look fabulous! I can see so much difference, especially in your abs!

Twyla - I just changed your post to size 2, just to see if it's easier to read, because I too have to squint like crazy - size 1 is tiny!

Great explanation on the calorie minimum info. If you ever do find that link to the newest info you talked about it, I'd love to see it. I guess for now I'll just stick to body weight x 10-12 for weight loss, and not go under that. I hope adding those extra calories makes the difference. Thank you again for all of the great info!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayberryfan View Post
Dear Twyla,

Always LOVE your posts.

BUT.......why do you use such a small typeface? You're straining my eyes, girlfriend!
I'm glad I wasn't the only one - I felt like an old lady trying to read Twyla's posts!

Quote:
Originally Posted by WATCH-ME-SHRINK View Post
Celeste,You're kidding, right?

The Century font (Size 1) that I used in my last post -- on my screen anyway -- is the same size as the default font for LCF threads....

Century Gothic standard
Century Gothic Size 2
Century Gothic Size 1

I don't like the default font, so I always use Franklin or Century (typically), but if I fear I'm "billboarding" it if I don't specify Size 1.

This, by the way, is default font at Size 4.

I'm using a lot of words right now and saying nuthin a'tall! So I'm gonna shut up.
Size 2 is definitely the way to go, Twyla. We all want to read what you have to say without going blind in the process!

Stack - looking good!

Last edited by Firm Hottie; 03-09-2010 at 02:52 PM..
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:23 PM   #586
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mornin' everyone.

Stack - doin' great (insert wolf whistle here )!!

Jami - also doin' great, your are looking much slimmer & more defined already .

So I kinda had an apiphony yesterday. I've been struggling to get up Tuesday mornings, after a late night dancing Mondays, for my LBWO. So instead of doing my 4-day split as UB Monday/Thursday & LB Tuesday/Friday my schedule will now look like this (including the dancing):-

Monday
AM - UB Weights + Cardio (HIIT or S/state depending on my energy level) & yoga/streches
PM - Latin Dance Class

Tuesday
PM - Bellydance Class

Wednesday
AM - LB Weights + cardio & yoga/streches

Thursday
AM - UB Weights + cardio & yoga/streches
PM - Latin Dance Class

Friday
AM - HIIT + s/state cardio & yoga/streches
{or DOR - will see how this works out}

Saturday
AM - LB Weights + cardio & yoga/streches

Sunday
DOR {except for dance instructor training in the afternoon, but this barely rates }

Picked up 5kg (11#) weight plates yesterday afternoon so this mornings workout was:-

Squats / Straight-leg Dead Lifts (legs together & legs apart) 12.5kg (27.5#)/dumbbell - having trouble holding on to the dumbbells and I need new gloves!
* set 1 - 6 reps; sets 2 & 3 - 4 reps

Wide-leg Squats (full & small ones at the bottom of the squat - name ??) 25kg/55# Barbel
* 3 sets @ 10 reps of each style

Lunges 25kg/55# Barbel
* set 1 - 10 reps; set 2 & 3 - 8 reps

Calf Raises 25kg/55# Barbel
* 3 sets @ 10 reps

Starting to feel is in my glutes already! Just to clarify, I do 5 min warm up on the eliptical, one set of each exercise (kinda like a circuit) then 2min on the eliptical between circuits. Today I did 10min steady state cardio on the eliptical after the weights, then my yoga sequence including abs and streching.

Don't like the barbel I picked up 2nd hand. The weights rotate on the ends and it feels very unsteady. I'm going to look at picking up a new one that is more like my dumbbells where the weights are held on by screw on ends rather than the clips on this one. Not sure if I should just get a straight barbel like this one or a bent one - what's the advise from you guys? I think if I get a bent one it needs to be bent for the neck as well as an other bends it has??? Is this right? I feel I'm gonna get a very sore neck using the straight bar, but it just might be a matter of getting used to it - hopefully.

I will also be putting some more weight plates on lay away as soon as I can so I don't have to keep changing them from the barbell to the dumbbells and back again - takes too darn long when I am already time poor in the mornings.

OK this is a really long post - sorry .
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:30 PM   #587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stackdiesel View Post

My tri's were "swole" after the dip test. Usually more defined, but the carb bloat was in full effect.
Attachment 28806
Great triceps Stack, but where did your traps go? You know I'm just kidding you on that one. Wanted to rib you a little about that. You're built man - keep up the good work.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:35 PM   #588
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*pouts*

Missed my workout today. Work is crazy.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:53 PM   #589
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Thanks Laura, Matt, and Oz. Actually not a very flattering picture, but I got a kick out of how pumped my triceps were. Typical guy thing. I'll get some better progress photos up after I get a little leaner.

Jami, you look great and are making substantial progress. You're 1/3 of the way through the BFL Challenge?
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Old 03-09-2010, 04:08 PM   #590
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Thank you everyone! Its amazing how the right foods can help.

Stack. Um,,, Yes, I have 2 months left.. Yesterday was my 1st month in the program.
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Old 03-09-2010, 05:20 PM   #591
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Wow, great pics, Stack (pumped!) and Jami (look how lean you are all ready!)

It's so great to have so much activity on this thread. I love coming here and reading each day!

I'm just back from my workout. It's circuit training this week. I'm a bit miffed at the scale today for being up, but I am bloated. My jeans that usually fall off fit today. I don't like that very much. I'm not going to freak out about it...I know that my body does not lose weight in a linear fashion...all I can do is eat clean and work hard.

We'll see what my consultant says tomorrow...I am taking after photos in one week and then my sessions with him end, and I am going to be on my own!
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Old 03-09-2010, 06:15 PM   #592
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamistar77 View Post
Your only 9 days in... I just think that your body has to get used to this WOE. I remember that when I started LCing I could only get through 1/2 of a cardio kick boxing dvd, and before I started LCing I was running 6 miles a few times a week. Its a transition. Your body is having to pull from fat, and it takes more energy for you body to do that, than it does from glycogen.
Thanks, Jami. I'll just keep up what I'm doing and watch for the changes.
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Old 03-09-2010, 07:21 PM   #593
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stackdiesel View Post
Thanks Celeste. Looks like you are doing great and have implemented carb-ups/refeeds into your program. How is that working out?
I think it's going well. A pair of jeans that I've been trying to get into comfortably - you know, wear them and breathe at the same time - have gotten much looser. I'm also not having trouble getting back on LC after having a refeed day or a refeed meal. I think this is gonna be great for me. Thanks.

Laura ~ I really need to consider what Twyla posted for you earlier. I may not be eating enough. Some days, I just don't want much. Other days... well, I want to eat all day. But, for the most part, I'm keeping my calories in the 1200-1400 range and when you add in a workout, that cuts things WAY down. So, you and I will work on this!

Jami ~ awesome pics. I'll say it again, if I looked like you, I wouldn't have the motivation you obviously have. Good job!
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Old 03-09-2010, 07:32 PM   #594
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Found a great article tonight about lifting and trying to lose weight. I'm thinking someone here mentioned this guy before, Illene maybe?

Anyway here's the info. Enjoy!:

Quote:
Optimal Weight Training While Dieting
How should I lift weights while dieting? Everyone at the gym and all the magazines say to go high rep to burn the fat. Does high rep training really burn fat better? Is this the best approach to training while dieting?

While high rep, short rest interval training does have the potential to burn a fair number of calories, training during a fat loss stage should be used to preserve (or even increase) muscle mass as opposed to stimulating fat loss. Fat loss is going to, or should, come primarily from nutrition, with the rest coming from various forms of cardiovascular work (HIIT, interval training, some steady state cardio, etc.) Your weight training should be focused primarily on getting strong, and keeping the muscle you have, not fat loss. Let the other 23 hours of the day take care of the fat loss.

Your best bet is to avoid a lot of high-rep, low-load training while dieting. Your body already has a limited capacity to recover due to a lack of fuel/substrate when on reduced calories. Light weights while in caloric deficit will likely result in more muscle loss, as your body, while attempting to adapt to a caloric deficit will try to 'slow down' over time. This happens via various hormonal responses as well as by eliminating the more metabolically active tissue - muscle. Your body will always attempt to adapt to any change you throw at it - and this includes a caloric deficit. The more you deviate from your 'set point', the more your body will respond to bring you back.

Hormones respond to over and undereating. On reduced calories and as your bodyfat drops, catabolic hormones rise, promoting increased amino acid oxidation (protein breakdown) and anabolic hormones fall. Net protein accretion/retention decreases, protein oxidation increases, cell volume generally decreases, leptin production decreases, etc., etc. Remember, what builds muscle is what keeps muscle, and if you don't use it, you'll lose it. You need to give your body a reason to hold onto the muscle and this requires you to be training above a minimum intensity threshold. So, quite simply don't bother with these 15-20 rep sets. Train heavy and try to get and/or stay strong.

The other thing to consider when comparing heavy versus light training while dieting is the effect each has on the look, or quality, of the muscles. Training with heavy weights improves both myogenic and neurogenic tone. The first refers to your muscle tone at rest while the second refers to muscle tone that is expressed when movements occur. Neurogenic tone is improved due to the effect lower rep training has on the sensitivity of various motor neurons. Myogenic tone is affected by the density of your muscles and is improved by stimulation of the contractile proteins, again via heavy low, low rep training. Higher rep ranges unfortunately do not offer these benefits, and let's be honest, high rep training just isn't fun anyway. When a body is stripped of much of its fat, muscle density and hardness go a long way to enhancing the quality of a person's physique. Excluding the heavy, low rep work in favour of the oft prescribed high rep, short rest interval work for fat loss training will not have nearly the same effect that focusing your training on heavy loads will have.

The last thing to keep in mind and this was touched on earlier, is that your capacity to recover from training is decreased on reduced calories. As a result, the volume of your training (sets x reps) needs to be reduced. Always keep in mind the goals of resistance training while dieting - maintenance of strength and muscle size. You're simply not going to be making significant muscular gains while in a caloric deficit - no matter what anyone tells you. If you try to keep the volume as high as you might have it when your calories are above maintenance, you're going to find yourself burning out, getting weaker, and regressing. You can decrease volume by as much as 2/3 when dieting. I'd typically err on the side of caution and do less when you want to do more.

Remember what builds muscle, is what keeps muscle.
Source: Optimal Weight Training While Dieting | Q&A | Lean Bodies Consulting
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Old 03-09-2010, 08:47 PM   #595
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Originally Posted by LouieLouie2007 View Post
Are you bruised? Did you feel any pops? .
No bruising. Heard and felt the pop. I have a visible knot. My ankle is more stiff than painful. Doesn't hurt to walk on it. Does hurt if I push it.
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Old 03-09-2010, 08:53 PM   #596
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Originally Posted by Firm Hottie View Post
Siggie, old school floorwork is great for when you can't do any weight-bearing lower body exercises. The stuff that I'm doing seems harder to me than doing the normal squats, lunges, etc with weights.

I have a couple of good workout DVDs that I use for my floorwork. They include leg lifts while lying on your side, clamshells, and corkscrews. You can also do a number of things on your hands and knees - straight legs lifts out to the side, to the rear, at a 45 degree angle, bent leg lifts at different angles, etc.

I'll be doing my floorwork DVD today, so I'll write all of the exercises down and post them here for you if you'd like.
Yes Please. Thanks.

RICE (Rest-Ice-Compression-Elevation) is good for my ankle!

Last edited by Siggie; 03-09-2010 at 08:57 PM..
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Old 03-09-2010, 10:40 PM   #597
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Okay, here's a question for you more experienced exercisers..may seem silly, but it's a point of confusion for me.

So, let's say I'm supposed to eat 2000 calories per day to maintain, 1500 to lose. So, if I calculate my workout to burn 250 calories, does that mean it's okay to still eat 1500 calories or should I eat 1750 calories so I maintain the same deficit?

This may be obvious, but it truly confuses me. The more I read about proper training and eating, the more I wonder about this! TIA!!!
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Old 03-10-2010, 02:38 AM   #598
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Originally Posted by Mayberryfan View Post
Okay, here's a question for you more experienced exercisers..may seem silly, but it's a point of confusion for me.

So, let's say I'm supposed to eat 2000 calories per day to maintain, 1500 to lose. So, if I calculate my workout to burn 250 calories, does that mean it's okay to still eat 1500 calories or should I eat 1750 calories so I maintain the same deficit?

This may be obvious, but it truly confuses me. The more I read about proper training and eating, the more I wonder about this! TIA!!!
Technically, the activity factors into the deficit. However, I was told to not think of it that way in the strictest terms, and to think of the deficit created by our workouts as "bonus."

With that said, depending on your level of intensity, you want to tap into your sensory perceptors often to know when it's time for fuel. That's the fun part, learning to "hear" those signals from our body and acting accordingly.

So you can safely shoot for that 1600-1700 range, just be sure to "listen."

There are varying schools of thought on this. Just voicing my personal understanding.
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Old 03-10-2010, 02:40 AM   #599
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Old 03-10-2010, 06:48 AM   #600
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WATCH-ME-SHRINK View Post
Technically, the activity factors into the deficit. However, I was told to not think of it that way in the strictest terms, and to think of the deficit created by our workouts as "bonus."

With that said, depending on your level of intensity, you want to tap into your sensory perceptors often to know when it's time for fuel. That's the fun part, learning to "hear" those signals from our body and acting accordingly.

So you can safely shoot for that 1600-1700 range, just be sure to "listen."

There are varying schools of thought on this. Just voicing my personal understanding.
my coach says the same.. most peoples activity doesnt burn what they think it does and cardio machines LIE
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