The Diet Cure

[inatic]

chantel you are correct on that calcuim competes . One should not take calcuim with in 4 hours of taking iron or thyroid meds. I too am under the belief that calcuim should be taken with magnesium AND vitamin d. THey all help each other to absorb the most benefical way.l

So I do divide up how I take my supplements. Also unless you specifically know your iron deficicient, most people do not need extra iron and probably have an overload of iron in their systems. Here is a great thread about that posted by Kasta diva. She is EXTREMELY knowledgable about diabetes and lab work.

Low Iron Scores

ADA: Iron Predicts Diabetes Risk
and a few more threads that were posted about that as well.
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/se...der=descending

[babalu]

I agree Chantel - it seems like a bit of a challenge to figure out what to take when - well, at least to get it down to a manageable routine!

I also have trouble in the evening - eating the wrong things - I am hoping that this balances my system out. I am very interested in keeping up with other people's progress..

[Chantel]

Hi girls

I had my thyroid labs done - thanks to Non Stick Pam - and my endo doc said I could afford to take an iron pill. I am really apprehensive about this.I have been anemic for years.

Anyway, will read those links - I agree, KD is very smart and research savvy! lol


I agree, lets post how we do on the new supplememts. Will pick mine up on Thursday.

Edited to add...I just started reading the first link and WOW - somuch to earn about iron. I am glad I did not just jump into that supplement. This calls for more reading. Thanks a million!

[babalu]

Is anyone taking the supplements to refuel brain chemistry? I can't figure out where to plug in the phenylalanine and how much - it says in the book that it competes with tyrosine, so maybe mid morning and afternoon - but doesn't say how much - have i missed the info somewhere?

[Chantel]

A quick update. I was kind of confused when I went to go look for B vitamins. I ended up buying kind of a mulit B vit - and all I can say is "WOW" Who needs coffee (which I gave up this week) - I feel pretty good taking these so far all in all.

Because I have been eating small meals, I get unsure about when to take the amino's. Anyway, all is well here.

I not only gave up coffee and artificial sweetners but I have not had any desire to raid the kitchen at night this week. AMAZING. Makes me think coffee and sweetners play a big part in that problem.

Thanks again Deb for starting this. I feel a renewed sense of hope again.

[jwardell]

Hey Diet Curers,

Can you give us an update on your progress? I have recently read the book and am adding supps., but am doing a modified schedule (only taking them in the morning and before bed.) Do you think I will be wasting my time with such a compressed schedule? I won't take competing things together. Also, do you take the max or min she suggested? (I am adding glutamine, tyrosine, DLPA, GABA (as needed), and have been taking 5-htp all along.)

Chantel suggested I hop in here for some input. Thanks, Chantel.

Jwardell

[babalu]

Hi jwardell - I'm not much of a test case for you as it has only been a couple of days that I have been on - but i do notice that it helps with feeling full and removing the need for sugar/snacking. Something I am taking is making me slightly nauseous, though and I need to figure out what - but I will stick with it and post more progress as time goes by.

[kittypaws79]

Just thought I would let everyone know what Julia Ross charges for consultations if you were interested.

I called her office today to find out more information about her clinic, since I live in San Francisco and her office is just 10 miles North of the Golden Gate Bridge.

Her clinic charges $35 for an initial phone consultation and then an in-person consultation for $600 and then 12 weekly visits at $100/visit with a nutritionist.

I personally decided to forgo any consultation with her clinic for now, as it seems a bit steep in price. I will start taking the supplements once I receive them tomorrow and see if I can feel any results. Maybe down the road I will consult with her clinic....but for now it seems like way too much money.

[DiamondDeb]

Arlene, thanks so much for the spreadsheet! It's going to be a big help! I was doing good, then got the individual aminos instead of the Mass Aminos and things got a bit complicated. I really AM taking a boatload of supps! lol... I know I feel better when I'm taking them as recommended so it's worth the extra trouble. Just need to fit in an extra 45 minutes to set out the pills for the day and 15 minutes at breakfast alone to take them all! That's the time when I have the most to take.

Just how big is that supplement box you have? Mine isn't nearly big enough; it's about 6x2 inches. I've got a few smaller ones and I'm going to keep one of them on my nightstand with my bedtime supps in it so I don't forget.

Also, on timing, when are you guys fitting in your mid-morning & mid-afternoon supps? As I understand it, they are not to be taken with meals, but they seem to fall when it's time for meals for me. You know how it is when you eat 5-6 times a day...

Also, Arlene, it looked to me like you're taking 5-HTP mid-morning & mid-afternoon at the same time as you're taking L-tyrosine? Is that right? They compete and are best taken at different times; 5-HTP should be taken at least 30 minutes before the other aminos. The book suggests taking L-tyrosine & DLPA in the AM & mid-morning and taking 5-HTP mid-afternoon & at bedtime. That's what I'm doing. You'll still get benefits if you take them at the same time, just not as much.

Did you get over your initial side effects from some of your supps?

BTW, for those of you who don't know, I'm taking supps recommended for 1. Depleted Brain Chemistry, 3. Unstable Blood Sugar, 4. Unrecognized Low Thyroid Fuction and 6. Hormonal Havoc.

Kitty, that does sound awfully expensive for a consultation!

There's no doubt in my mind...I must have been a drug lord in a previous life and I'm destined to be CEO of a pharmaceutical company in a future life!

[kittypaws79]

Ok I got my pills this morning and started taking them immediately. However (don't want to gross you out), but I seem to have the worst gas right now and I don't think it is from anything I ate today. Did anyone else have the same problem???

[DiamondDeb]

This still amazes me! I feel so much better (not perfect, mind you, but a noticable improvement) after just one day that there is just no doubt that the supps, taken in the amounts and when recommended are responsible! Actually , I could tell a big difference yesterday afternoon.

One thing I find interesting is that calcium & magnesium are to be taken at different times even though they work together. I would think that you'd take them together for that reason. A lot of people take a combo pill of the two. I always used to take my magnesium at bedtime along with my calcium. I am curious as to why she wants them taken at diffeerent times. Maybe she mentions that in the book & I missed it?

Kitty, I've never had anything but positive results from adding the supps. You may be adding different ones than I am. I do think Arlene said she had a few negative side effects when she started taking hers. Don't recall what they were...

[Chantel]

Kitty,
hmmm, the only prob I had was taking the mag twice a day, breakfast and lunch. It was like taking a laxative. Better now tho.

Deb,
on page 243, she discusses mag & calcium and goes into how they work as a team but then has us take them seperate. So, I am confused!lol

I was wondering how everyone is managing the aminos if you do eat 6 meals as well - it is a balance act for sure.

The 5HTP makes me sleepy. I can only take it in the evening and I am ok with that.

This book inspired me to stop coffee and sweetners and so my insomnia has subsided a bit until yesterday....I had a huge Diet Coke. Slept terrible. So back to the abstinance! lol

[Leenie]

I'm way behind here

I've not been good about taking supps the past two days and I can feel it today.

This is a book you have to read or refer back to several times, I can tell I've missed a few good points.

Deb & Chantel, I was confused about the calcium/mag part too. The supp I already had on hand was combo of both, so I'm taking that until it runs out.

Kitty, I did have some detox like symptoms when I first started. Wow that consultation is expensive. I guess that is consultation only and doesn't include any supps?

Deb, I missed that part about the 5HTP & Tyrosine, thanks for the reminder. I also started taking the 5htp just in evenings as it was making me tired also.

It is difficult to time the supps and food. I get it right some days and some days I don't

Babalu, are you still getting nauseous or did you figure out what it was?

[inatic]

I havent added any supplements from the book to my daily routine as of yet. I need to re read the book and see what I would actually need to add in the first place! Didnt take notes the first time around..
I have been taking Cal/mag /vit D combo pills at night before bed for almost a year now.. as recommended in the schwarzbein principle book. Now I too am confused!

LOL is there EVER a time when our stomachs are empty eating as often as we do!

better go and find my book!

[babalu]

My nausea has subsided, thankfully - when I take the midmorning and midafternoon batch of supplements, I get a very full feeling. Which I am not complaining about - I have been tired this week, too - maybe I will try 5 Htp at bedtime, too - I thought maybe it was the calcium/magnesium throughout the day. I am not feeling a huge difference yet, but am giving it time.

[DiamondDeb]

This is a correction about magnesium that was posted on the website. It still doesn't answer our questions about the timing though.

Magnesium 200 mg, called for in the Basic Supplement Plan shows an incorrect dosage. The recommended dose is one (1, not 2) at breakfast and one (1, not 2) at lunch.

Chantel, yes, I saw that and am still wondering why they should be taken separately. That's the opposite of what most tell us to do. There must be an explanation. I'll try to find it...

Found this on a Harvard discussion board where someone had the same question (most were confused like us):

But the articles in "The Natural Parmacist" state "While it is sometimes said that calcium interferes with magnesium absorption, it apparently has no significant effect on overall magnesium status." Two studies are cited.

The National Institute of Health article only states that both magnesium and calcium are needed for health. The Medline article on magnesium has a section on interactions, and doesn't mention calcium. NOW Nutrition recommends a mixed calcium/magnesium tablet.

The site mentions calcium and magnesium competing for absorbtion, but goes on to say that shouldn't be a problem if taken with meals. I'll add to that by saying all supplement except sublingual should be taken at the start of meal, and high quality mineral formulations have easily absorbed salts.

Finally, this site has more than you'll ever want to know about calcium and magnesium: http://www.krispin.com/magnes.html . The absorption paragraph is a little confusing, but basically, the article recommends taking chelated minerals with meals.

From the site in the above post:

SPECIAL NOTE ON CALCIUM-High calcium intake may block uptake and utilization of magnesium. Current available research seems to indicate that calcium intake be twice than or equal to magnesium intake. In spite of publicized research proclaiming high calcium intake as a positive health factor, in-depth review of research shows that high calcium intake contributes to many degenerative diseases and is a health risk factor.

Calcium/magnesium ratios are critical. Research continues in this area. It is probable Albion chelate calcium is a preferred source of calcium. When macro-mineral absorption is being consider there is clear indication that absorption is increased by taking smaller doses two to four times a day. See chart below. While the study indicated in this chart was on calcium, research seems to indicate the same may be true for magnesium. Current research seems to indicate that optimal amounts of calcium are 500-800 mg. total supplemental calcium daily in a divided dose plus calcium from food sources. More is needed if pregnant or nursing.

Magnesium should be taken with your other supplements and/or food. Split up your supplemental intake into 2 or more doses daily. Magnesium supplements should usually not be consumed late in the day. Some magnesium supplements can be energizing and in some persons may have a negative impact on getting to sleep and staying asleep when taken near bedtime. If taken in the correct dose and early enough in the day magnesium often corrects insomnia. Taking magnesium late in the day is not a problem if it does not adversely affect your sleep.

Magnesium is available in chelated (bound to) combinations such as alpha-ketogluconate, aspartate, glycinate, lysinate, orotate, taurate and others. Inorganic or ionic magnesiums include sulphate, oxide, citrate, carbonate, bicarbonate and chloride. Some supplement companies make so-called chelated magnesiums but the chelate (bound to) is partial and the raw material contains some percentage of ionized, unbound or inorganic magnesium. Ionized magnesium may cause diarrhea in many users and therefore not correct a cellular magnesium deficiency. Diarrhea, or soft stools, caused by any form of magnesium can make a magnesium deficiency worse.


Edit: The info about not taking magnesium at bedtime makes me wonder...The Drs. Eades, who consider magnesium to be an important supplement that everyone should take, even devoting an entire chapter of their book to it, said to take magnesium at bedtime. I always thought they knew their supps very well. Makes you wonder...

[inatic]

Deb thanks for looking up all that info.. As you stated it is confusing. Even dr. shwarzbein recommends the combo pill at bed to aid with sleeping/insomia..

*sigh* I am still confused!

[DiamondDeb]

Chantel, good luck giving up the coffee/sweetners! I gave up caffeinated coffee a year ago & only recently started having decaf once in a while. I never did drink coffee everday though. I stopped drinking diet cola a couple years ago. My reason was it kept me from drinking my water.

I use stevia instead of the other sweeteners but I do get a bit of them in things I buy occasionally...like flavored water. I really need to stop buying that! It's no better than soda; it's got aspartame and it's carbonated, which is supposed to leach calcium.

I was planning to take 5-HTP mid-afternoon & bedtime as suggested, but there are other aminos I take then so I'd have to take the 5-HTP 30 minutes earier. I don't think that is going to work. I am popping pills every time I turn around as it is right now!

Ileen, I still haven't read the book all the way through. I don't see it as that kind of book. I just took the test and read the chapters that were recommended from that. There are charts that show the recommended supps. I am about to start defacing my copy, I think. Some things just need to be highlighted. I've got so many bookmarks in the book they aren't helping much.

Yes, the Eades said magnesium helps with sleep, too, I think, and here they are saying some will keep you awake? I never did use cal/mag supps because they didn't seem to have the rright amounts/types per PP.

What did you guys think of Chapter 2, Malnutrition Due to Low-Calorie Dieting? I'm finding some things hard to agree with, like...

"It has been established that starvation begins under 2,100 calories per day."

"... the United States Deptartment of Agriculture (USDA) standards indicate that 2,500 calories is the minimum amount of calories an adolescent or adult woman needs to get the minimum amounts of life-sustaining nutrients such as iron."

That would mean that everyone on this forum and almost everyone on this entire board is undereating and many (including me) are starving themselves???

[DiamondDeb]

OMGosh! Listen to this!

I've really never had much problem with cravings...until a few months ago, that is. Must have something to do with this loverly time of life. Anyway, I started getting hit with the world's worst cravings when TOM was due and they didn't necessarily go away when he (yes, TOM is definitely male) did. I had a lot of trouble sticking to plan. Well, when I started back on the supps this time, just a few days ago, I started taking L-Glutamine & chromium regularly, as recommended in the book. Every time I took supps, I would take one or the other. Guess what? No cravings!

So, yesterday I was in a rush to get to the laundromat and just as I was about to head out the door I realized I hadn't taken my scheduled L-Glutamine yet. I didn't want to take the time to mix it up & drink it so decided to when I got back home. No big deal, right? Wrong! Uh, hello cravings! While at the laundromat, the evil voices in my head reminded me that now was the perfect time to try that Girl Scout cookie ice cream and/or indulge in some of my favorite Ben & Jerry's. After all, both are on sale. Somehow, the evil voices convinced me that I should actually try 2 (Yep, not 1, TWO!!!) flavors of the GS cookie ice cream! The plan was to go home, take my clothes into the apartment & get back on my bike for a quick trip to the grocery store. Anyone else's evil voices still try to con them into that "you can start fresh on Monday" thing? It's the weekend so it doesn't count?

When I got home I went to the bathroom & realized TOM was visiting. Then I remembered I hadn't had my L-Glutamine. There is nothing I hate more than letting TOM get the better of me so I took my glutamine & forgot all about the cravings. Not a single craving since! It really does amaze me how well this works! Knowing when to take the supps you buy really does make a difference. I'll bet that's why I never noticed results from lots of the supps I've taken over the years.

All these pills may be a bit of a hassle but they are definitely worth the effort for me!

[TEG]

Just read this Thread and the book looks very interesting!

Leenie how are the supplements helping you now since your last post was 2/24? Just curious?
Need to make a trip out to buys some supplements I think.
Looking at those quizes I qualify for supplements.
Haven't read the book yet either.
This sounds like a good one for the Library!

Thanks for the information
Tracy

[Chantel]

Deb
you are right, that flavored h2O is easy to over due - what helped me was I just do not buy anything but water now. If I want to indulge in a coffee or a diet pop or even the flavored carbonated water, I do it in a small size, outside of the house.

I am so thrilled for you for taking the L-Glut and chromium - I too have a big "wohoo" and that is night eating and actually waking up from a dead sleep feeling the need to raid the kitchen. Since I have started this regimant, cut the diet pop out and sweetners down to a low roar, my sleeping habit is better, my cravings are under control. Wowee.

I too agree that having the Diet pop in the house interferes with drinking good ol' water.


So, that is my latest - I will continue taking the mag for breakfast and lunch and get my calcium in at night.


Oh, and yes, I do not agree about the her calorie level - oh well. Every book I have ever read, there is always something that I just don't buy into. That is one of them.

Have a wonderful Saturday people!

I am have been doing the Firm and man am I sore. Just goes to show how out of shape I am! lol - Feels good to pick up weights again too.

[Leenie]

Hope this isn't TMI, but it might help someone else that has the same problem.

I had some issues this week so I stopped all of the supplements Wednesday. My issue was severe constipation. It started two or three weeks ago (can't remember exactly) and has progressively gotten worse. By Wednesday of this week, after not going for like 5 days, I was miserable. The only thing I could attribute it to is one or more of the supplements as that is the only thing that has changed recently in my diet.

After reading and reading and trying to figure out which one it might be (sort of hard to tell when you start taking 12 at once), I've concluded that it must be the glutamine. L-glutamine is useful for people with diarrhea as it eliminates water from the stools. I'm back to normal 5 days after discontinuing the supps.

I'm now going to start back with just the basic supps first + GABA & 5 HTP, then add in the tyrosine, DLPA, aminos if everything seems to be ok. I'll eliminate the glutamine (which really stinks because that's the one I really need).

So, does anyone know of any other of the supps that might cause constipation?

Interestingly enough, the day after I eliminated all the supps, my night sweats came back.

[liteweight]

Leenie - I read all of this thread last night. I haven't been keeping up as I don't qualify for the majority of it but still find it interesting. After reading your post this morning, it made me wonder if since last Wed you were on pain meds for your back? Pain meds including lots of aspirin/tylenol/ibruprophen etc can all cause consitipation. Just thought I'd throw that out there before you nix the supps. Given that, I still think you have a good plan to incorporate the supps more individually to see what is working and what isn't for you.

[DiamondDeb]

Is anyone taking the supplements to refuel brain chemistry? I can't figure out where to plug in the