Low Carb Friends  
Netrition.com - Tools - Reviews - Faces - Recipes - Home


Go Back   Low Carb Friends > Main Lowcarb Lobby
Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-30-2013, 02:07 PM   #1
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
Anyone here on a Coumadin Diet?

Sorry this is long. It's really a rant, but maybe someone here is on a Coumadin (warfarin) diet and can offer some solace or advice.

10/29 Hubby announced he had felt shortness of breath for the previous 2 days, and this is after very little exertion. He said it felt like his heart was racing. First mention of it to me. My wrist BP meter indicated his pulse was all over the place. 90, 128, 149! just moments apart. And my meter is VERY accurate as I have checked it in the doc's office myself. I told him to call his doc immediately and get worked in, which they did. Their EKG wasn't good and they admitted him immediately to the ER. They then kept him last night for "observation".

Looks like A-Fibrilation (irregular heartbeats) in both the left and right ventricles. Not good. Medication had it coming down by 5pm, but they had to give him more at 7pm as it wasn't bringing the numbers down fast enough. He's stable right now and has had no pain with this AT ALL! When I go back this morning, we'll see what all the x-rays show and what the final diagnosis/prognosis is. He had a pulmonary embolism 9 years ago and those can defo recur, so I'm sure they're suspicious of a clot, maybe. We'll know later today hopefully. Fingers crossed it's not too serious. He looked just fine when I left him last night. The nurse said infections can trigger this off, but he hasn't had any that we can think of. He had a flu shot 6 days ago, but doubt that's a factor. Well no point in my trying to second guess. I should know later today and will post what I know here.

10/30 Finally a doctor who had seen ALL of his ER tests and this morning's Echogram came in this morning and told us the skinny. It was A-Fib in both ventricles, They don't really know what causes the condition. The ER doc had already told us that much. Right side of his heart is enlarged and working hard; left is, overworking, too. When we mentioned the DVT and pulmonary embolism 9 years ago, her face lit up and she said A-fibs are pretty common after a PE, so this condition has probably silently been slowly developing over the last 9 years, ever since the PE. But back them they took him off the Coumadin after 6 months.

This cardio event, she said, will likely not correct itself like last time. He'll be put on Coumadin for the rest of his life, to thin blood to prevent stroke risk and any future clots. Will require dietary changes I'm not going to like having to accomodate.........He is to avoid as much as possible the following Vitamin K rich foods, as they reduce the effectiveness of the blood thinner: (this goes counter to a low-carb diet big-time!)

Foods to avoid as much as possible:

Kale
Spinach
Brussels sprouts
Parsley
Collard greens
Mustard greens
Chard
Green tea
broccoli
lettuce
cabbage
green onions
avocados
endive
mayonnaise
garlic
Many herbs
+many more mentioned on Q&A forums

Foods he can eat more of:

Grains
Fruits low in K
Non-green veggies low in K
Legumes, all but soybeans or soy products or green beans

Pray tell, how in the heck am I gonna cook a low-carb diet with lots of green veggies if all the green veggies just got kicked out to the curb, pretty much? How will I be able to create exciting dishes for my website readers anymore? I'm as upset as if I were the one in the hospital being told all this and I had the A-Fib event.

This will clearly mean I will have to totally change the way I cook!! I'm 100% certain it will stifle my cooking creativity to the point I just won't be able to create anything worthy of posting on my website ever EVER again. What do I do? Cook two different meals 3xdaily? Not a happy camper right now. Cutting out carbs for me and still cook for him was pretty easy. I just made my low-carb fare and he supplemented with his bread, potatoes or rice. Cutting virtually all green veggies will be extremely challenging for me.

Looks like they're not going to release hubby to come home for at least 2 more days, until he's more stable and they get him all set up for the Coumadin therapy. Injections are involved, too with the blood thinning and he's REAL unhappy about that.

When I came home from the hospital at noon I started snooping around on the net for more Coumadin diet info and OMG, cranberries, many herbs and spices, even turmeric (I love curry!) and GARLIC are high in Vitamin K! The more I read, the more depressed I'm getting. This diet news is just devastating to me. The science behind the diet's interaction with how they dose the Coumadin dosing is so complex, I don't think I can even understand how it works, college degree or not. The guide reads like a medical school textbook IMO!! And the math you really need to do on what you're eating makes the simple food tracking we do look like child's play.

The one and only ray of sunshine I see here is you CAN have 1 serving of the higher Vitamin K foods a day; 3 servings of moderate K foods a day. Reason being, keeping the levels of Vitamin K CONSISTENT is apparently more important than totally eliminating Vitamin K from the diet. the Coumadin dosage is determined by an average daily intake of K. But every time you vary from that average intake, you put yourself at great risk for clots.

Seems like the professionals would do better to tackle this disorder by having you greatly INCREASE your intake of foods with vitamin K to enhance blood thinning factors rather than introduce such a dangerous drug as warfarin (basically rat poison). Seems like that would be a much safer approach to treating this disorder. I'd much rather ADD foods to my diet than take them all away. But I'm just a lowly lay person. What do I know?

I mean, gosh, my husband, over 44 years, hasn't been willing to give up ANY foods. And over the last 4 of my low-carbing, won't even do THAT 100% with me! So I don't imagine this event will shake him up into dietary compliance anymore than the DVT and PE 9 years ago or the T2 diabetes diagnosis did 15 years ago. What's a girl to do?

Man, I really feel like I just got kicked in the gut!! I'm soooo thankful his condition is stabilizing and it looks like he's gonna be OK and out of the hospital soon. But this diet change is going to be LIFE CHANGING.............. for BOTH of us.

Any advice or tips, if you're on this diet, would be greatly appreciated. My culinary prospects are looking pretty bleak to me at the moment.
__________________
Peggy
My recipe website: http://buttoni.wordpress.com/

Last edited by buttoni; 10-30-2013 at 02:08 PM..
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old 10-30-2013, 04:49 PM   #2
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Back in Tampa Bay
Posts: 1,896
Gallery: Acor
Stats: 160/146/115 5'2
WOE: Vegan
You said before that you made your low carb dinners and he added his carby side dishes to it. Can't you just continue to make your dinners and make up an extra appropriate side dish for him?

BTW, so glad to hear that your husband is going to be fine!
Acor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 06:18 PM   #3
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
Thank you, Acor. He's feeling much better this evening. I just got back from the hospital and they're going to release him tomorrow since his blood oxygen levels have improved, no longer short of breath and his pulse is down and stabilized.

I can indeed do what you are suggesting, cooking what I need to eat and fix something extra for him, but that is virtually cooking two meals. I can do it, but really not loking forward to having to do it. But we do what we must do for the ones we love. I suppose I can make casseroles and freeze them in single serving portions, but I'll most likely have to still cook him a simply prepared meat dish at night, as I doubt I can come up with any interesting casseroles with the limited foods he is allowed. Luckily, my husband is easy to please and perfectly happy with simple fare. So this is probably gonna be a lot harder on me than him. All this change goes counter to everything I equate with good, tasty meals. I don't like bland and never have. I come from a long line of very good cooks that rarely fix simple, bland meals.

What worries me about the grains for him, is my husband is around 75# overweight and I fear all the rice, legumes, starchier veggies and whole grains he IS allowed to eat are going to mark the end of his weight loss and the beginning packing those pounds right back until he ends up right back at the 320 he started out at a year ago. I believe sincerely what we preach on these forums, that grains and carbier veggies will pack the weight right back on if we eat them regularly. I feel this diet puts both of us between a rock and a hard place nutritionally and if either of us caves and eats the other's food, we are doomed to problems.

Last edited by buttoni; 10-30-2013 at 06:20 PM..
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 06:19 PM   #4
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Nelle Belle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NNJ and Fl gulf coast when I can get there.
Posts: 4,734
Gallery: Nelle Belle
What about Pradaxa or Xarelto? No dietary restrictions.
Nelle Belle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 06:33 PM   #5
Fat Burning Machine Extraordinaire!
 
DiamondDeb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 74,804
Gallery: DiamondDeb
Stats: 125+ lbs lost
I'm glad your DH is going to be OK.

I was on Warfarin for close to a year because of a blood clot.

I was not told to avoid any foods, just to be aware of which ones are high in K. I ate most of the foods on the "bad" list. I did not eat lots of the foods on the good list and had no soy at all.

I was told it is important to eat pretty much the same things in the some amount day-to-day. Don't eat tons of foods high in K one day & then have none the next day. It is to make it easier to know how much medication you need.

Are there any other options to the Coumadin? If there is any way to avoid it I would consider it.
__________________
It’s truly remarkable how successful Madison Avenue has been at indoctrinating
eating habits that produce huge profits for giant multinational corporations
– and developing devastating health consequences for consumers –
into generations of society. ~
Mark Sisson, The Primal Blueprint
DiamondDeb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 06:38 PM   #6
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,533
Gallery: Patience
Maybe he could start preparing some of his own meals?
Sounds like you are doubling your work, and males can cook too.
Sorry that might sound snotty, I really just mean that sometimes we have to think/cook outside the box. Even just one meal would be start and you can build from there. Probably not realistic, as sounds you have you roles sorted by now. I have a friend whose hubby cleans house but will not cook anything. She likes to cook, though, and this is what I am picking up from you too. Shopping sounds as much a nightmare as the cooking to me I'd hate to have all that other stuff in the house.
Patience is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 07:18 PM   #7
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,139
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
So sorry to hear about your husband's problem. It does sound like you are both going to have to make some adjustments.

A friend who was on Coumadin always talked about keeping the intake of Vit K stable from day to day - no big fluctuations. Maybe that is more important that eliminating all Vit K rich foods??

I don't know about other medications that were mentioned above, but perhaps you could speak with the doctor about something that would not impact his diet so much. Gaining a lot of weight by adding in a lot of carbs probably wouldn't be good for him either.

Glad you will be taking him home and I hope you can sort all of this out.
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 07:45 PM   #8
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
cfine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 4,271
Gallery: cfine
Stats: 276/212/199
WOE: NK
Start Date: April 2012
I actually know about this because my DD had blood clots in her arm last year. I talked at length with the clinical pharmacist who followed her care and kept a check on her INR. He stated that you CAN eat green leafy veggies. The important thing is to keep your intake the same every week. The only thing that she didnt eat during her treatment was turnip greens because they are ridiculously high in vitamin K. You should get a sheet with the values of each green veggie. Just keep it even over the course of your week. Am I making sense?
__________________
Do or don't do, there is no try-Yoda

Dieting is hard;being fat is hard; choose your hard.
cfine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 08:03 PM   #9
Junior LCF Member
 
sweetradish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 23
Gallery: sweetradish
What an emotional roller coaster this has been for you, Peggy and to think that I just bothered you by asking what brand of whey protein you use in your recipes! This makes me feel guilty, regardless of whether I knew about your DH's health crisis or not. Please hang in there and know that I am thinking good thoughts for both you and your DH.
sweetradish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 08:25 PM   #10
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Montana
Posts: 289
Gallery: enna1477
Stats: 255/145/160
WOE: Self designed LC
Start Date: November 2010
Yikes! So sorry that you and your DH are faced with such a scary health situation. But, as a longtime fan of your culinary creations I think you have tripped into a niche market for your recipes and meal planning. There are many of us that follow a LC lifestyle but have to provide sustenance for family members who have health issues, are picky eaters, or just can't give up the bread and potatoes. Use that creative juice of yours to develop efficient, tasty, cost effective ways of putting a meal on the table that gives the "mix and match" necessary to suit everybody. I'm willing to bet that you could put this kind of material in book form and sell it as an electronic book on Amazon or some other site that publishes independent work. I'd buy it, that's for sure! If you let this stew for a little bit I think you'll see that a door may have opened for you. I wish the both of you the best of luck!
enna1477 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 09:09 PM   #11
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Back in Tampa Bay
Posts: 1,896
Gallery: Acor
Stats: 160/146/115 5'2
WOE: Vegan
Quote:
Originally Posted by enna1477 View Post
Yikes! So sorry that you and your DH are faced with such a scary health situation. But, as a longtime fan of your culinary creations I think you have tripped into a niche market for your recipes and meal planning. There are many of us that follow a LC lifestyle but have to provide sustenance for family members who have health issues, are picky eaters, or just can't give up the bread and potatoes. Use that creative juice of yours to develop efficient, tasty, cost effective ways of putting a meal on the table that gives the "mix and match" necessary to suit everybody. I'm willing to bet that you could put this kind of material in book form and sell it as an electronic book on Amazon or some other site that publishes independent work. I'd buy it, that's for sure! If you let this stew for a little bit I think you'll see that a door may have opened for you. I wish the both of you the best of luck!
What a fantastic idea!
Acor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 11:34 PM   #12
Blabbermouth!!!
 
JoLi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 5,104
Gallery: JoLi
Stats: 196/191.5/160
WOE: JUDDD
Start Date: 8/19/14
the key is to monitor what he eats and the amounts he eats. He does not need to eliminate them completely. I don't see why you would have to cook two different meals. Just vary the options. If he likes the green veggies, it shouldn't be that big of a deal. Like another poster said, keep the amounts even, avoid high volume days and low volume days. The will check his blood frequently. Maybe keep a food diary to go along with the levels. This won't be easy for him, he may feel guilty for having you change the way things are done.
__________________
.
JoLi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 09:57 AM   #13
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
I'm not very familiar with Pradaxa and Xarelta, Nelle, but I'm sure the team of docs working with him are. I will mention them and see what they way.

Yes MoBear, it seems, from all I can read on the net, that keeping the K levels consistent from day to day is more imp. than total elimination. The consistency is needed to be able to determine the right amount of Coumadin and to be sure no irratic fluctuations in K levels defeats the medicine's ability to do its job at the established dose. Fortunately, my husband isn't as fond of leafy greens as I, and I'm absolutely certain his "typical amount of K is fairly consistent on leafy greens already (low, LOL). We'lll really have to watch his more favorite culprits, however, things like lettuce, green onions, green beans and broccoli.

Enna, I like how you think, girl! Turn this crisis into a moneymaker! I'm sure I can eventually find clever ways to accomplish all this new diet stuff for him and with shortcuts, but it is defo going to be a challenge. But I love him and will do what I have to do to maintain what the docs said and he needs me to do.

Now that my phone has quit ringing, I need to take a shower and get dressed and over to see him. Talk to you guys later.

Cfine, I have already found a couple lists of most of the green veggies we eat and their K values to keep in the kitchen and at his place at the table, so we can both be reminded of how much K he consumed the day before and therefore what he can eat today. I do fear it will require him to do some logging, at least by pencil and paper, if nothing else, so he can keep track.

With BOTH of us wearing our thinking hats, I'm sure we can DO THIS!

DDeb, How you approached it is how we did last time with his DVT and PE. In other words, we just avoided the high K foods and that was it....no tracking, logging, or worring about how much we ate from day to day. Not so carefully, in other words. I am more concerned this time since he has now had an "actual A-fib event" in BOTH ventricles. It seems we will need to follow the diet much more rigidly. But I'm sure I'll find ways to make the task easier.......I usually do.

Thanks to all of you for your suggestions and ideas. They have been most helpful and greatly reassuring this won't be so impossible for me. LCF really lives up to its name in times like this. Cyber hugs to all of you. Now off for a shower, get dressed and get my rear over to the hospital. Talk to you guys later.

Last edited by buttoni; 10-31-2013 at 09:59 AM..
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 01:50 PM   #14
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,672
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/238/??? 5/10"
Start Date: LC start 2005, have tried everything...
Hang in there.

My late husband's heart started to fail not long after he turned 40. In his case, it was caused by radiation treatments. Many members of his family has heart problems. Radiation seemed to make them all come 30 years earlier.

Coumadin - the key is to be consistent in the diet and to also run medication changes or supplement changes through the medical person that is monitoring him. Believe it or not, the most dangerous person in your husband's life could be the person dosing the warfarin. If possible, have him go to someone that does ONLY this. This person can be so good at warfarin dosing that she can predict with frightening accuracy what dietary or medication changes will do and adjust accordingly. The dangerous person is a doctor that does a million things trying to dose warfarin and using blood tests to steer. If he is ever hospitalized, watch the interns like a hawk. I belong to another forum where I have read a lot of incidents of bad dosing that could have been fatal, my husband included.

Do watch out for weird places for vitamin K, like energy bars, vitamins, cereals, and other manufactured foods. You don't want him suddenly deciding to eat protein bars for lunch everyday that have a huge dose of vitamin k.

Grapefruit/juice becomes problematic - as I recall, multiple meds can be impacted. Eliminate the idea of this food.

Enlarged heart - read everything you can about statins. My late husband's cardiologist put him on a huge dose of a statin. I tried to get my husband to read about it and be wary. No luck, he trusted his doctors. I was scared. The best I could get him to do is take C0Q10. His doc did lower his dose over time anyway.

Weight Loss - believe it or not, even someone faced with near death experiences may be unable to lose weight. Low carb may not be right for someone with certain health problems, especially if the kidneys are impacted (or if the medications impact the kidneys). Tremendous fear hit me and his mom when my late husband nearly died a second time. I lost 80 pounds, his mom lost 100 pounds. My late husband lost some weight, he did well, maybe 30-ish pounds but he needed to lose much more than this. I tried everything I could but I could not influence him much.

Find the best cardiologist you can find in your area. Some cardiologists are great and some are terrible and there is everythign in between, just like everything else in life. This is the person that is going to keep him going.

Read eveything you can about heart transplant, because no one wants to bring it up. You have to be aware of the criteria and plan for years ahead if this is ever going to be an option, if needed. Weight could be an elimination factor. If he needs surgery, he will need to donate his own blood in advance to prevent a lot of antigens from forming. He could build antibodies to nearly everyone on a very broad range from surgeries where he receives blood. That means he could be eliminated from consideration because his body would reject most any heart. Don't let that happen, for just in case. He is so young.

I am so sorry, hang in there
__________________

Last edited by Key Tones; 10-31-2013 at 02:00 PM..
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 03:52 PM   #15
Major LCF Poster!
 
shunsweets's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,752
Gallery: shunsweets
Stats: maintenance
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: May 2003
Thinking of you Buttoni. My DH was on Coumadin for a year after his first heart attack and open heart surgery. Then he had a second heart attack. He now takes Brilinta and aspirin for life. The Brilinta is better in that it doesn't require the weekly lab draws he had while on Coumadin. We are hopeful that he is now stable but he also had radiation therapy which as Keytones wrote can speed up heart problems.

I do cook two different meals every night as I have diabetes and he is on a very strict diet opposite of mine. I work full time and take care of him. I'm not a great cook like you so I am sure you will come up with a plan and do far better than me. It is just a matter of getting used to it. And I agree there are lots of folks dealing with 2 diets so a cookbook to help us would be wonderful!

Just wanted to reach out to you. Hope he is doing great!
__________________
Dec goal 75 miles. 40 done
Miles walked in 2014 - 1084
shunsweets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2013, 06:24 AM   #16
Major LCF Poster!
 
mamasooze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South East Texas
Posts: 1,099
Gallery: mamasooze
Stats: 225/170's/150
WOE: Low carb, wheat-free, mostly paleo
Start Date: AUG 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by cfine View Post
I actually know about this because my DD had blood clots in her arm last year. I talked at length with the clinical pharmacist who followed her care and kept a check on her INR. He stated that you CAN eat green leafy veggies. The important thing is to keep your intake the same every week. The only thing that she didnt eat during her treatment was turnip greens because they are ridiculously high in vitamin K. You should get a sheet with the values of each green veggie. Just keep it even over the course of your week. Am I making sense?
This. And add spinach to that...
Peggy, you are a very organized and logical thinker You will figure this out. Glad hubs feels better.

Last edited by mamasooze; 11-01-2013 at 06:27 AM..
mamasooze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2013, 08:01 PM   #17
Senior LCF Member
 
Gulf Coast Girl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 415
Gallery: Gulf Coast Girl
Stats: Goal Feb '10. Lost 163 lbs.
I've been on coumadin for 13 years and will be on it the rest of my life (I have something called lupus anticoagulant...my blood doesn't clot properly because of my lupus .)

My doctors say the same thing as cfine. Consistency is the key. They've never told me to keep track of intake and they adjust the dosage around the current diet. They never said don't eat greens. Instead they got my dosage right with current diet and said to just keep it consistent.

My doc are very familiar with Pradaxa and Xarelta and said that neither would be appropriate for my condition. (I honestly don't remember their reasoning but I did beg to switch so I could avoid the blood work.)

I know each person is different but I started doing spinach juicing this year and it barely changed my PT / INR results at all. I've read where all the 'experts' claim that dosage isn't based on weight but my PT / INR has never reacted to any food the way it did with my weight-loss. It jumped all over the place until my weight finally stabilized.

Good thoughts for your husband.
__________________
~ jennifer
Gulf Coast Girl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2013, 10:10 PM   #18
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
Thanks so much for all the great information and well wishes, my friends. Lance did remember to ask his doc about Pradaxa, Xarelta and any meds that didn't require the frequent blood testing in the beginning, but she doesn't like to use them because if a patient gets too much of those meds, you can't counter them with administering Vitamin K. With Coumadin therapy, if a patient gets too much, you can counter it with Vitamin K. She also doesn't feel there's enough established research on the other meds yet either.

Thanks so much for all the useful information and tips, Keytones. Cereal and protein bars are places I never would have thought K would be, but they do fortify those. He is going to have to be a lot more careful about checking all ingredient labels for the first time in his life. Luckily, he no longer takes a statin, thanks to my low-carb cooking, as his cholesterol is so low and his doc is OK that Lance stopped it on his own. I read CoQ10 doesn't play well with Coumadin, so Lance is just going to stop that one. And when we asked the doc about whether he could continue his Glucosamine/Chondroitin for his arthritic/post surgery knee, she said it isn't absorbed well and pretty much useless. Now that response really surprised me, and hubby says his knee hurts all the time when he runs out for a few days; doesn't hurt at all when he takes it. I did find and order some Vitamin K-free multi vitamins this week.

Thank you Suzie. I'm sure I'lll get our situation into a routine soon. It' s a lot to take in FAST, though.

Thank you for your thoughts Jennifer and Sunsweets. It doesn't sound so overwhelming when I hear others' experiences with the diet. Reading about it on the net is overwhelming. I'm not the first to have to deal with it and everyone seems to have found ways to set up a routine that works for them to cope with changes in grocery buying and meal planning/cooking. I will too, I'm sure. Thank you all so much for you reassuring comments.
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 12:58 AM   #19
Senior LCF Member
 
CTIgrad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: The wet-side of WA
Posts: 949
Gallery: CTIgrad
Stats: Hi:317.5 Current:255.8
WOE: Paleo
Start Date: 12/26/2012
I've been on warfarin now for almost 3 months due to a DVT in my calf after breaking my foot. Long story......

Essentially the docs told me that I can eat whatever I want, viatmin k, high protein, you name it. What was essential was that whatever I was doing, to keep doing it. They can adjust the warfarin levels to accommodate just about any diet out there, but they can't make it work if you keep changing what you put in your body.

I penciled out a meal plan for two weeks which kept approximately the same veggies/fat/protein every day. Was it exact? No. Has it worked for the last two and a half months, yes. My INR levels have bounced between 1.9 and 3.3 and I'm on somewhere between 12-16mg of warfarin a day.

Doing LC and being on warfarin isn't as big a deal as they make it out to be. In the beginning its kinda a pain, but once you're there its no different. If anything its kind of a subliminal motivation as you remember what a PITA is was to get your numbers in check to begin with. If you want some more info let me know.
__________________
No beard?! NO REP!!!

My Weight Loss/Triathlon Training Blog: Or Die Trying...
CTIgrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 01:03 AM   #20
Senior LCF Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 254
Stats: 205/185/140
WOE: LC/Experimenting w/ NK
Start Date: Jan 2012
Peggy, so glad to here your hubs is doing better! It looks like you've had a lot of great info already. I am similar to some other's stories, I was on Warfarin for a year, and was able to eat all the foods on the "bad" list as long as I was consistent, which when you plan meals isn't too hard to do. You are such a wonderful cook your he is so lucky to have you looking after him! Sending you all good, healthy, healing vibes!
alex_in_wonderland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 06:10 AM   #21
Senior LCF Member
 
Heidinem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Georgia
Posts: 744
Gallery: Heidinem
Stats: 130/111/105 (5')
WOE: mostly pescetarian, moderate carbs
Start Date: November 1, 2009
I'm so glad your hubby is improved.
Heidinem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 05:54 PM   #22
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
Thanks so much CTIgrad. Several people have said essentially what you're saying. Eat pretty much like you have all along and they can adjust the Coumadin to accomodate that intake. I think I cook about the same amount of meat at dinner every night. We usually have our 2 eeggs with bacon or sausage every day, and he eats a sandwich at noon with cheese & ham or leftover meats. I tend to buy the same veggies every time I go to the store and we cook them alternately throughout the 2-weeks they usually last me. So maybe I should just let the Coumadin tech do HIS job and the rest will pretty much work itself out once they get Lance to the proper dosage of the stuff for the way we eat. We will avoid eating the foods HIGH in Coumadin too often, but will not totally try to eliminate them. After all, I pretty consistently serve kale, broccoli, green beans, cabbage, broccoli, and spinach once a week each. Thank God Cauliflower isn't in the HIGH K group, as I often serve that more than once a week, in some form or another. I can easily reduce the amounts of parsley, cilantro and green onions in recipes a bit when I use them, since they're in the HIGH group. I'm beginning to think the other foods on the list (in the MEDIUM K and LOW K groups) do not warrant quite so much concern. Now that I understand they can just up/down the dosage to force the PT/INR into the range they want him in and then level off at that dosage, I do think this is doable for me. I do think my general vegetable shopping list and meals are pretty consistent over a 7 day period. I just don't know if I'm so consistent from 1 day to the very next day. That's what I worry about a little.

Thank you Alex and Heidi. A good night's sleep did him a world of good. He's still a little tired today, but I think it's just from lack of sleep, like me, as his heart rate each check today is much more in line with normal. Looks like the low-dose Lopressor is finally starting to do its job on his pulse. It's finally down to 82-84 range. Hopefully we won't see anymore pulse spikes to 149-150.

Last edited by buttoni; 11-03-2013 at 05:59 PM..
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 05:58 PM   #23
Major LCF Poster!
 
mamasooze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South East Texas
Posts: 1,099
Gallery: mamasooze
Stats: 225/170's/150
WOE: Low carb, wheat-free, mostly paleo
Start Date: AUG 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by buttoni View Post
Thanks so much CTIgrad. Several people have said essentially what you're saying. Eat pretty much like you have all along and they can adjust the Coumadin to accomodate that intake. I think I cook about the same amount of meat at dinner every night. We usually have our 2 eeggs with bacon or sausage every day, and he eats a sandwich at noon with cheese & ham or leftover meats. I tend to buy the same veggies every time I go to the store and we cook them alternately throughout the 2-weeks they usually last me. So maybe I should just let the Coumadin tech do HIS job and the rest will pretty much work itself out once they get Lance to the proper dosage of the stuff for the way we eat. We will avoid eating the foods HIGH in Coumadin too often, but will not totally try to eliminate them. After all, I pretty consistently serve kale, broccoli, green beans, cabbage, broccoli, and spinach once a week each. Thank God Cauliflower isn't in the HIGH K group, as I often serve that more than once a week, in some form or another. I can easily reduce the amounts of parsley, cilantro and green onions in recipes a bit when I use them, since they're in the HIGH group. I'm beginning to think the other foods on the list (in the MEDIUM K and LOW K groups) do not warrant quite so much concern. Now that I understand they can just up/down the dosage to force the PT/INR into the range they want him in and then level off at that dosage, I do think this is doable for me. I do think my general vegetable shopping list and meals are pretty consistent throughout say over a 7 day period. I just don't know if I'm so consistent from 1 day to the very next day. That's what I worry about a little.
I told ya...logical, thoughtful and da best evah
mamasooze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 06:12 PM   #24
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
Are my foibles that transparent, Susie? LOL My brother is always telling me I don't give myself credit for my ability to accommodate whatever I have to. He says I sweat the little stuff and panic to easily. Once I hear some options, it isn't all so overwhelming. Thanks for you having more confidence in me than I do. You're a sweetheart.......Suze..........You're ALL sweethearts! Love my LCF buds! Thanks for being there, all of you who have offered tips, reassurances and well-wishes to Lance. My heartfelt thanks.
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 06:16 PM   #25
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
I have to share a funny. Lance was studying the Vitamin K lists at the dinner table this evening and saw for the first time that liver is high in Vitamin K. He quietly looked up at me, and said "I don't think there's gonna be a problem with this one in this lifetime. He pointed to the liver entry as he showed me the list. He absolutely HATES liver. I LOL'ed
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2013, 10:26 AM   #26
Senior LCF Member
 
NineOhNine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 368
Gallery: NineOhNine
Stats: 250/225/155
WOE: Generic <72 carbs/day
I've read countless articles saying that aspirin therapy is as just as effective as Coumadin. You might look into it.
NineOhNine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2013, 12:47 PM   #27
Senior LCF Member
 
paid4c4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 65
Gallery: paid4c4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bella View Post
Maybe he could start preparing some of his own meals?
Sounds like you are doubling your work, and males can cook too.
Sorry that might sound snotty, I really just mean that sometimes we have to think/cook outside the box. Even just one meal would be start and you can build from there. Probably not realistic, as sounds you have you roles sorted by now. I have a friend whose hubby cleans house but will not cook anything. She likes to cook, though, and this is what I am picking up from you too. Shopping sounds as much a nightmare as the cooking to me I'd hate to have all that other stuff in the house.
My wife has been ill for a while and is now fighting breast cancer. I've always liked to cook and have been doing almost all of our cooking for years. Now that I'm retired I enjoy having things to do, so cooking and grocery shopping keeps me busy and out and about. Good luck with hubby's heart, sounds like everything is under control.
Bill
paid4c4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2013, 05:53 AM   #28
Senior LCF Member
 
Heidinem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Georgia
Posts: 744
Gallery: Heidinem
Stats: 130/111/105 (5')
WOE: mostly pescetarian, moderate carbs
Start Date: November 1, 2009
Peggy, I just want to mention that when my grandmother was on Coumadin they did not mention watching her diet at all. I am wondering if there is a bit of wiggle room as there is with most dietary advice. I agree with your hubby about liver. ugh!!
Heidinem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2013, 08:04 AM   #29
Major LCF Poster!
 
Moonchild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: So. Ga.
Posts: 2,201
Gallery: Moonchild
Stats: (272 first go around) 219/190/180
WOE: LC
Start Date: restart Sept 02, 2013
Peggy, I hope your hubby is feeling better!

My MIL was put on coumadin after having a pulmonary embolism. She was convinced she was not allowed to have broccoli or any other foods high in Vit. K ... but it just wasn't the case. I talked with her doc and he said the only thing was to be sure and be consistent. They are able to adjust the amount of coumadin accordingly.

There is a pdf available that lists the foods that contain vit. k and the amounts in them. I wish I could post the link but I can't. Just look up vitamink.pdf and you will find it.

If he eats .. say .. 1 cup of broccoli .. it will contain 220 mcg vit k, .. so .. next day have 3/4 cup brussel sprouts to equal around the same amount. That is just an example. My MIL would have around 400 mcg vit k per day so it was easier to keep the amount of coumadin to what she needed.

I came back to add .. a LOT of the low carb veggies are pretty low in vit k .. such as cabbage .. only 58 mcg per cup. What I did was let her pick which veggies she wanted for the day .. then I would add in enough broccoli or brussel sprouts to it to keep it around the same amount of vit k per day.

I hope this helps.
__________________
"If the problem isn't hunger, food isn't the solution"

Last edited by Moonchild; 11-10-2013 at 08:08 AM.. Reason: just added a little more info.
Moonchild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2013, 12:27 PM   #30
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
buttoni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 4,285
Gallery: buttoni
Stats: 196/170/150
WOE: Atkins Start 4/09
Start Date: 4/21/09 Height 5'5", Age 64
Thanks Moonchild. I found the pdf file and printed it out. Your approach is exactly what I'm doing. 1 serving from the high K foods, 2 servings from the medium K foods and I don't fret the low K foods. I'm hoping that will keep it pretty level from day to day. Thanks so much to you and everyone for the tips. I'm not in panic mode like I was the first 2 days of reading.

He feels better everyday and they got his pt/inr in the range they wanted already. So we'll just keep eating the way we have been the last week or so.

They actually are having him keep up his low-dose aspirin daily he's done for years, right along with the Warfarin and one additional BP med (25 mg Metoprolol, coincidentally the same exact dose of the ONLY med I have to take) to the Lisinopril and HCT he was already taking. Man, his pill box compartments jut went from sparsely populated to crammed full! Hopefully they'll do the job.

On a real positive note....although Lance isn't low-carbing 100%, he does eat the meals I prepare for myself. He's lost maybe 40-50# in the last 2 years, even eating the bakery bread he has all along. Well, his pants are getting so lose lately, they actually fell off (twice at home and once in a public parking lot. Luckily, there was virtually nobody else in the parking lot. LOL). I finally said you have GOT to go buy some new pants!! Well, he went to buy some this weekend and much to his surprise, discovered he's gone from a 4X last year, to a 2X! I'm so pleased and hope he continues to lose.
buttoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:28 PM.


Copyright ©1999-2014 Friends Forums LLC. All rights reserved. - Terms of Service | Privacy Policy
LowCarbFriends® is a registered mark of Friends Forums, LLC.