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2001MaryT 08-29-2013 12:26 AM

LC, Diabetes, Breast Cancer -- Ketogenic?
 
Going in for second chemo tomorrow. Trying to adjust to all this scary stuff going on. First chemo threw sugar readings way up there -- 250 to 330. Since then, I have started a ketogenic diet, and sugar readings are 140-155. Doc says that might be the best I can do during this five months of chemo, then a lumpectomy, followed by seven weeks of radiation. I've dropped six pounds in the last two weeks, but mainly because food doesn't taste so good. Can't believe I even typed that! LOL

Anyone out there walking a similar path that can share their experience or advice? I know LC is the answer, but just not sure how to eat right with this problem. Thanks. :)

clackley 08-29-2013 05:10 AM

Mary, so sorry you are going through this.

I do think ketogenic is the best thing you can do nutritionally and there are a ton of recipes etc. for when you are feeling well with no nausea but the things that are appealing and feel good are hard to predict.

One food I think is a really good one for anyone who is feeling under the weather is bone broth and this is because it has some many minerals and nutrients and it is easy to consume and tastes good.

Can you get someone who wants to help, make you up a big batch? It can be frozen as well. I use the large size silicone muffin pans.

Sending you good vibes for a complete recovery.

shmabby 08-29-2013 05:23 AM

no words of advice just encouragement.
I have diabetes and was recently treated for breast cancer. In fact, tomorrow is my LAST day of radiation.
Did several surgeries, then chemo, then radiation.

I find the literature confusing. yes some people advocate for cancer low sugar, others advocate low fat. Seems no different than what is pushed for people w/o cancer.

If there's anything I can do for you, feel free to pm me.

the biggest problem i experienced with my sugars had to do with the days around chemo when I had to take steroids - they raised my bs crazy high to the point where several times I had to take insulin in addition to my metformin.

E.W. 08-29-2013 05:30 AM

Mary you may want to look at taking Metformin if you arn't already taking it. I believe
some new studies say taking it inproves the odds of your chemo working.

rndiane 08-29-2013 06:40 AM

I posted this on the health page and it was very interesting article. Informational only.


This was on CBN this morning
This article was on the CBN news this morning and my husband asked me if I have heard this before..hehe. Yes! It is my WOE now. Starving Cancer: Ketogenic Diet a Key to Recovery - Health & Science - CBN News - Christian News 24-7 - CBN.com
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/ge...n-morning.html

lterry913 08-29-2013 07:58 AM

Good luck with your battle against cancer...I do believe keto is the way to go for this...when I researched it for my dad I saw video of a cancer tumor lighting up from increased blood flow after a high glycemic meal...and little of no blood flow to tumor after keto meal.
I mentioned the mim in another thread as comfort food...I made thises for my dad using a combo of flax, almond and coconut flour...he could tolerate the bready texture and i'm sure the calories will help a lil with weight loss if you can eat them.

My dad is doing great right now and was actually able to avoid chemo and radition...but I think reducing his sugar had a lot to do with the size of his huge kidney tumor shrinking before emergency surgery...the muffins were more of a comfort food for him in his transition to low or no sugar and higher fat.

Once again, good luck. My prayers are with you...keep us posted.

ravenrose 08-29-2013 09:18 AM

so sorry you have to deal with all this *hugs*

if those readings are after a good sized meal, I would say not to worry about it. if that's fasting, how high are you going after eating?

don't think of insulin as some horrible last ditch thing. it's really very easy and almost painless to use the new(er) insulin pens. the only nuisance is testing your blood sugar more often.

best of luck

Emily-D 08-29-2013 10:43 AM

lterry, could you post the recipe for those muffins? Thanks!

lterry913 08-29-2013 12:10 PM

2 tbs almond meal
1 Tbs flax
1 tsp coconut flour (optional)
1 egg
some sweetener if you choose (I use erythritol...stevia can be used also as well as splenda)
flavor of choice....some use cocoa powder if so add some liquid
some add pumpkin...no extra liquid needed
sometimes I will add cinnamon...no extra liquid
blueberries if you can do those...no extra liquid

mix all ingredients together in a mug ... cover with a saucer ...microwave for 1min or longer if needed.

there are tons of recipes out there...just google omm or mim and you wil find so many variations.

If you make these plain in a square container and slice across instead of down they make good taosted bread slices.

lterry913 08-29-2013 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lterry913 (Post 16580510)
2 tbs almond meal
1 Tbs flax
1 tsp coconut flour (optional)
1/2 tsp baking powder
1 egg
1 tbs butter melted in mug first
some sweetener if you choose (I use erythritol...stevia can be used also as well as splenda)
flavor of choice....some use cocoa powder if so add some liquid
some add pumpkin...no extra liquid needed
sometimes I will add cinnamon...no extra liquid
blueberries if you can do those...no extra liquid

mix all ingredients together in a mug ... cover with a saucer ...microwave for 1min or longer if needed.

there are tons of recipes out there...just google omm or mim and you wil find so many variations.

If you make these plain in a square container and slice across instead of down they make good taosted bread slices.

I forgot to add a Tbs melted butter in mug first...this helps keep it moist.
And 1/2 tsp baking powder...some say they don't use the BP and see no difference in rise.

Emily-D 08-29-2013 01:08 PM

Thank you! I'm looking forward to trying it.

2001MaryT 09-06-2013 09:41 PM

Thanks for all the great comments and suggestions. I'm going to try the recipe and check out the links. My sugars are dropping again, after the steroids have been through my system. I take 1000 mg of Metformin twice a day, as well as Levemir, and Novolog, so lots of insulin to see sugars of 250+. These are fasting readings, by the way -- before meals!

Next week will be my third chemo. We'll see how it goes.

MaryT

dgidaho 09-06-2013 11:38 PM

I don't have any advice, MaryT. Just want you to know that there is another person out here who cares.... :console:

pooticus 09-07-2013 05:36 AM

Hi Mary :hugs: and so sorry you are going through this fire!!! A ketogenic diet is the best way through the fire. I also added fasting into the game with calorie restriction on alternate days via JUDDD.

I would go into every chemo treatment with a 16-18 hour fast. I tried to go into every radiation treatment with a minimum of a 14-16 hour fast.

My Stage IIIC highly agressive, poorly differentiated breast cancer shrank 60% from chemo. The doctors were shocked at that outcome because mine was a "lazy eater".

Hope this helps!!! Will be saying prayers for you.

Romy 09-07-2013 05:54 AM

Hi Mary, I am truly sorry for what you are going through. I hope that you recover quickly and that you will be cancer free once going through all treatments. Will pray for you.
I can relate a bit as I have a very good family friend that is going through the same thing, pancreatic cancer.

A friend of mine just sent this info to me. I do not know if it true or if it even works but it certainly cannot hurt to try along with your treatments.


This is the latest in medicine, effective for cancer!

Lemon (Citrus ) is a miraculous product to kill cancer cells
It is 10,000 times stronger than chemotherapy

Why do we not know about this? Because there are laboratories interested in making a synthetic version that will bring them huge profits. You can now help a friend in need by letting him/her know that lemon juice is beneficial in preventing the disease.
Its taste is pleasant and it does not produce the horrific effects of chemotherapy.
How many people will die while this closely guarded secret is kept, so as not to jeopardize the millions of large corporations?
As you know, the lemon tree is known for its varieties of lemons and limes. You can eat the fruit in different ways:
you can eat the pulp, juice press, prepare drinks, sorbets, pastries, etc...
It is credited with many virtues, but the most interesting is the effect it produces on cysts and tumors.
This plant is a proven remedy against cancers of all types. It is considered also as an anti microbial spectrum against bacterial infections and fungi, effective against internal parasites and worms, it regulates blood pressure which is too high and is an antidepressant, combats stress and nervous disorders.
The source of this information is fascinating:
it comes from one of the largest drug manufacturers in the world, says that after more than 20 laboratory tests since 1970, the extracts revealed that : It destroys the malignant cells in 12 cancers
including colon, breast, prostate, lung and pancreas. The compounds of this tree showed 10,000 times better than the product Adriamycin, a drug normally used chemotherapeutic in the world, slowing the growth of cancer cells. And what is even more astonishing:
this type of therapy with lemon extract only destroys malignant cancer cells and it does not affect healthy cells.?
Institute of Health Sciences,
819 N. L.L.C. Cause Street , Baltimore

pooticus 09-07-2013 08:32 AM

Mary be sure to discuss homeopathic remedies with your oncologist. Mine forbade me from eating supplemental vitamins especially anti-oxidants c, e (which that citrus thing would be because of the quantity being consumed) -- because they protect the cancer from the chemo. :hugs: (If it was that easy to cure cancer, none of us would have it.)

Fighting4myLife 09-07-2013 09:18 AM

Prayers for you. I am fighting brain cancer and understand your struggles. I will pray for you. I'm doing keto/lc (as I only have limited knowledge of what the difference is between keto and lc). My biggest struggle right now is my lethargy, which prevents me from having any interest or energy to get up and prepare a lc meal.

ArdMaine 09-07-2013 09:23 AM

I'm just here to post my support to those of you fighting for your lives. I am sending positivity and well wishes to you all!!

clackley 09-07-2013 09:25 AM

Fighting4myLife, so sorry you have to deal with your cancer. I had to pipe in and suggest you try the things that work for others who are making a change to ketosis. The first one is broth (2 cups per day at a minimum and not the low sodium). It would be best to make your own when you are feeling up to it. Second is potassium which is found in good quantity in avocados.

It may take some time to adjust to ketosis but it will be worth it and hopefully with the addition of those foods, you will be feeling much better very soon.

Fighting4myLife 09-07-2013 09:31 AM

Thank you August and Cathy. :hugs: I love avacados and I will definitely add more to my diet. I'm sure my sisters would love to pitch in and make me some bone broth.

pooticus 09-07-2013 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clackley (Post 16594057)
Fighting4myLife, so sorry you have to deal with your cancer. I had to pipe in and suggest you try the things that work for others who are making a change to ketosis. The first one is broth (2 cups per day at a minimum and not the low sodium). It would be best to make your own when you are feeling up to it. Second is potassium which is found in good quantity in avocados.

It may take some time to adjust to ketosis but it will be worth it and hopefully with the addition of those foods, you will be feeling much better very soon.

:goodpost::goodpost:

2001MaryT 09-07-2013 09:50 AM

Pooticus, every chemo session we bring a list of meds I'm on, and so far no one has squinted their eyes. I do understand what you mean -- it would be a shame to undue anything that the chemo helps. Hard enough to go through this without undermining.

Thanks for everyone's posts. Going to share it with my DH who is my cook, pill dispenser and has been so wonderful to me!

Weezy 09-07-2013 10:30 AM

Bless you, with hugs and wishes for health and success!

I'm so sorry to hear about your struggles. The only advice I can give is to echo the homemade bone broth. I pretty much lived on that for a couple months after my cancer surgery--I wasn't hungry at all and food just didn't work for me. But bone broth was soothing and comforting.

We condensed it by boiling after removing the bones, so I could get more nutrition with less volume. Also would add a teaspoon of organic plain gelatin powder, along with a big blob of butter and good gray Celtic sea salt. When my stomach could handle it, added sour cream or cream or greek yoghurt to get more fat and calories into me. Eventually started added some finely chopped beef to the broth.

I don't think I would have recovered as well if I had not had the bone broth. And once I was feeling better, I really went keto and have stayed there ever since. Before surgery, I had been eating a basic LC/moderate fat diet...but my body sure loved loves the high fat/low carb keto version. At my last checkup, I was still cancer free (1 year now...not a long time, but I'm very hopeful!).

Holler if you're interested in my version of how to make bone broth. :)

pooticus 09-07-2013 11:42 AM

Iagree the bone broth was so healing and nourishing when I didn't or couldn't handle food. I would simmer it with sliced ginger to make a "tea".

2001MaryT 09-07-2013 02:31 PM

I'd love the bone broth recipe. Not sure what it is -- like a chicken carcass?

Emily-D 09-07-2013 05:48 PM

Best wishes to all of you who are fighting cancer.

Here's how I make bone broth. I take the leftover bones from a rotisserie chicken or a roasted turkey. Put them in a large pot and add cold water. Pour in a splash (up to 1 Tablespoon or so) of apple cider vinegar. Cover the pot and slowly bring to a simmer. I like to simmer it for 12 hours or even more if possible. Strain, then refrigerate.

I always start it first thing in the morning, so I can simmer it for a long time.

You can find more information about bone broth on the Weston Price website.

froggyx6 09-07-2013 07:11 PM

I had been a diabetic for 15 years when I was diagnosed with breast cancer. My blood sugar shot up the few days before and after a chemo treatment because of the steroids but I was warned this would happen. It would then come down with the help of metformin and other drugs until the next chemo treatment.

I would suggest eating whatever you are comfortable with for now...whatever you can keep down...whatever tastes good. For me it was cheese grits and chicken noodle soup. I pretty much survived chemo on those two foods. I lost over 20 lbs. during chemo but gained it all back in the year following.

I'm sorry you are going through this and wish you the very best.

2001MaryT 09-08-2013 02:01 AM

Thanks, Emily for the bone broth recipe. I'll try and do that -- I've made soup before but never stained it for just the broth. On chemo days, that would be appealing.

Had to look up cheese grits -- they sound tasty!!

Mobear 09-08-2013 05:00 AM

No advice just :hugs:. I"ll keep you in my prayers.

clackley 09-08-2013 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2001MaryT (Post 16594461)
I'd love the bone broth recipe. Not sure what it is -- like a chicken carcass?

I make both chicken and beef and they are essentially the same with the exception of the bones. I do think it is good to get good quality bones if possible (i.e. grass fed, free range/no antibiotics).

Bone Broth (a.k.a. chicken stock or broth)

Bones from chicken
water
onion
garlic
carrots
celery stalks including leaves
bay leaves
whole pepper corns
1 tbsp. cider vinegar
In a stock pot cover bones( and any giblets, skin or vegetates from the roast and include any leftover pan drippings) and cover with water. Add the rest of the ingredients and bring to a boil. Cover and simmer for up to 8 hours. The longer the better. In the last hour of cooking, add a bunch of dried seaweed.
Drain through a sieve and refrigerate. Season to taste.

*This can also be done by boiling a whole chicken for about 40 min to 1 hour (depending on the size of the bird) along with all the seasonings except the vinegar and the seaweed. Once the bird has been removed, add the vinegar and proceed as above. You now have the most tender of chickens. Remove the meat and return the carcass to the pot.

For beef, I get marrow bones and roast them in the oven for about 40 mins. and then start the broth. The roasting really makes a big difference in the flavour of the final product. I highly recommend this step.


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