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Old 06-01-2013, 01:26 PM   #1
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how many carbs?

How many carbs a day should I be counting in order to lose weight. I am confused with glycemic load info, carb info, glycemic index info, etc. I need a regiment to follow. Please give any info you can. Thank you
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Old 06-01-2013, 01:56 PM   #2
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I think a great place to start is twenty carbs a day. From vegetables. After two weeks you can add in new foods, one at a time and see how your body reacts.
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Old 06-01-2013, 01:57 PM   #3
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If you're wanting to do Atkins induction you start at 20 carbs a day. Mainly from Induction level veggies.
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Old 06-01-2013, 05:05 PM   #4
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I would ignore the glycemic info as the science behind it is seriously flawed. I would rely on an actual low carb program such as Atkins. You can find the basics of this with a quick google search.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:47 PM   #5
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You will do best if you just read the label on the package, and if it says "3 carbs" count it as 3 carbs. Most of your carbs should come from vegetables. On Atkins, its recommended to start at only 20 carbs a day, but then you can slowly increase the amount (generally by adding more vegetables at first) as you go.
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Old 06-01-2013, 10:54 PM   #6
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Agree with the 20 carbs a day. If your goal is to lose weight, no more than 20 carbs a day ... after you've dropped the weight, pick and choose your carbs, but never go above 80 carbs a day.
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Old 06-02-2013, 05:52 AM   #7
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Welcome. I agree with the 20 g carbs start.Additionally I would recommend you to read though so that you are informed of what is happening in your body and why. Good luck and success.
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Old 06-02-2013, 07:17 AM   #8
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Welcome.
In my opinion, Atkins used to be easier to understand in the older versions.

There's Atkins '72, which is very strict. And there's DANDR (Dr Atkins New Diet Revolution). The current version, with its foundation vegetables and not counting sugar alcohols is confusing, I think.

DANDR is great.
20 net carbs. Some people count all carbs, including fiber. Some people deduct the fiber. In my opinion, the new plan's allowance of deductin sugar alcohols is a way to get people to eat more of their bars and shakes.

Here's the DANDR Induction food list. I can dig out the later stages of DANDR ffor you, but do Induction for at least 2 weeks. Good luck.
Quote:
Atkins Induction Acceptable Food List

All fish, fowl, shellfish, meat, and eggs

Note: Oysters and mussels are higher in carbs than other shellfish, so limit them to four ounces per day.

Note: Processed meats, such as ham, bacon, pepperoni, salami, hot dogs and other luncheon meats—and some fish—may be cured with added sugar and will contribute carbs. Try to avoid meat and fish products cured with nitrates, which are known carcinogens. Also beware of products that are not exclusively meat, fish or fowl, such as imitation fish, meatloaf and breaded foods. Finally, do not consume more than four ounces of organ meats a day.

Cheese
You can consume three to four ounces daily of the following full-fat, firm, cow, sheep and goat cheese, soft and semisoft aged cheeses*, including:

Cheddar; cream cheese; Gouda; mozzarella; Roquefort, and other blue; Swiss cheese

*All cheeses have some carbohydrate content. The quantity you eat should be governed by that knowledge. The rule of thumb is to count 1 ounce of cheese as equivalent to 1 gram of carbohydrate. Note that cottage cheese, farmer’s cheese and other fresh cheeses are not permitted during Induction. No "diet" cheese, cheese spreads or whey cheeses are permitted. Individuals with known yeast symptoms, dairy allergy or cheese intolerance must avoid cheese. Imitation cheese products are not allowed, except for soy or rice cheese—but check the carbohydrate content.

Salad Vegetables
These salad vegetables are high in phytonutrients and provide a good source of fiber.

You can have two to three, cups per day of any combination of the following:

Alfalfa sprouts, daikon radish, mushrooms, arugula, endive, parsley, bok choy, escarole, peppers, celery, fennel, radicchio, chicory, jicama, radishes, chives, lettuce, romaine lettuce, cucumber, mâche, sorrel, spinach

Other Vegetables
You can have one cup per day of these vegetables, in any combination if your salad portion does not exceed two cups. The following vegetables are slightly higher in carbohydrate content than the salad vegetables:

Artichoke, celery root, pumpkin, artichoke hearts, rhubarb, asparagus, chard, sauerkraut, bamboo shoots, bean sprouts, beet greens, broccoli, broccoli rabe, Brussels sprouts, cabbage (red, green, Savoy), cauliflower, chayote, collard greens, dandelion greens, eggplant, hearts of palm, kale, kohlrabi, leeks, okra, onion, scallions, snow peas, spaghetti squash, spinach, string or wax beans, summer squash, tomato, turnips, water chestnuts, zucchini

If a vegetable, such as spinach or tomato, cooks down significantly, it must be measured raw so as not to underestimate its carb count.

Special Category Foods
To add variety, each day you can also eat 10 to 20 olives, half a small avocado, 2 Tbsp. of sour cream, or unsweetened heavy or light cream (limit to two to three tablespoons a day; note carbohydrate content), as well as two to three tablespoons of lemon juice or lime juice. But be aware that these foods occasionally slow down weight loss in some people, and may need to be avoided in the first two weeks. If you seem to be losing slowly, moderate your intake of these foods.

Herbs and Spices
Use all herbs and spices to taste, but make sure that spice blends contain no added sugar.

For salad dressing, use oil and vinegar (but not balsamic vinegar, which contains sugar) or lemon juice and herbs and spices. Prepared salad dressings without added sugar and no more than two carbs per tablespoon serving are also fine.

Acceptable Fats and Oils
Many fats, especially certain oils, are essential to good nutrition. Olive oil is particularly valuable. All other vegetable oils are allowed, the best being canola, walnut, soybean, grapeseed, sesame, sunflower and safflower oils, especially if they are labeled "cold-pressed" or "expeller-pressed." Do not cook polyunsaturated oils, such as corn, soybean and sunflower oil, at high temperatures or allow to brown or smoke.

Use butter. Margarine should be avoided, not because of its carbohydrate content, but because it is usually made of trans fats (hydrogenated oils), which are a serious health hazard. (Some nonhydrogenated margarines are available in health-food stores.)

You don't have to remove the skin and fat from meat or fowl. Salmon and other cold-water fish are an excellent source of omega-3 fatty acids.

Remember that trying to do a low-fat version of the Atkins Nutritional ApproachTM will interfere with fat burning and derail your weight loss.

Artificial Sweeteners
You must determine which artificial sweeteners agree with you, but the following are allowed: sucralose (marketed as Splenda™), saccharin, cyclamate and acesulfame-K. Natural sweeteners ending in the suffix "-ose," such as maltose, fructose, etc., should be avoided. However, certain sugar alcohols, such as maltitol, do not affect blood sugar and are acceptable.

Saccharin has been extensively studied, and harmful effects were produced in the lab when fed to rats only in extremely high doses. The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has removed saccharin from its list of carcinogens, basing its decision upon a thorough review of the medical literature and the National Institute of Science’s statement that there is "no clear association between saccharin and human cancer." It can be safely consumed in moderation, meaning no more than three packets a day. Saccharin is marketed as Sweet'n Low™.

The Atkins preference, however, is sucralose (Splenda™), the only sweetener made from sugar. Sucralose is safe, noncaloric and does not raise blood sugar. It has been used in Canada for years, and the FDA recently approved it after reviewing more than 100 studies conducted over the past 20 years. Note that each packet of sugar substitute contains about 1 gram of carbohydrate, so don’t forget to include the amount in your daily totals.

Acceptable Beverages
Be sure to drink a minimum of eight eight-ounce glasses of water each day, including: filtered water, mineral water, spring water, and tap water

Additionally, you can have the following:

Clear broth/bouillon (not all brands; read the label)
Club soda
Decaffeinated coffee or tea*
Diet soda made with sucralose (Splenda™); be sure to count the carbs
Essence-flavored seltzer (must say "no calories")
Herb tea (without barley or any fruit sugar added)
Lemon juice or lime juice (note that each contains 1.4 grams carbohydrate per Tablespoon); limit to two to three tablespoons

*Excessive caffeine may cause unstable blood sugar and should be avoided by those who suspect they are caffeine dependent. Everyone should try to avoid caffeine. Grain beverages (coffee substitutes) are not allowed. Alcoholic beverages are also not permitted during Induction; those low in carbohydrates are an option, in moderation, in later phases.

Convenience Foods
Although it is important that you eat primarily unprocessed foods, some controlled carb food products can come in handy when you are unable to find appropriate food, can’t take time for a meal or need a quick snack. More and more companies are creating healthy food products that can be eaten during the Induction phase of Atkins. Just remember two things:

Not all convenience food products are the same, so check labels and carbohydrate content.

While any of these foods can make doing Atkins easier, don’t overdo it. Remember, you must always follow The Rules of Induction.
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Old 06-02-2013, 07:20 AM   #9
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Oh, and let me say that the more recent science excludes some of the oils Dr Atkins listed as healthy. I use olive oil, coconut oil, butter, and very occasionally peanut oil for frying. Walnut oil, sesame, avocado oil, and some others are great, but canola and soybean in particular are banned from my home.
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Old 06-02-2013, 07:31 AM   #10
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Once again I find myself not advocating strict adherence to a plan for a newbie.
I base this on my own experience. I was a heavy user of "healthy" whole grain products for many years. Bread and pasta were staples of my woe. As you can imagine, I was over weight.
I went 'cold turkey' with cutting out the bread and pasta, but did not actually count the carbs in anything else I ate.
I started losing immediately. If I had to "count this, measure that" in the early stages of this woe, I don't think I would have stayed with it.
I do count carbs and calories now, but this was only after my new woe became a routine part of my life.
I have a history of going overboard when I try something new. I will get all fired up for a couple of months then fizzle, sputter, and crash.
Yet another failure.
So, if you are like me in this regard and the demands of following induction are too severe, take heart; You can lose alot of weight just by cutting out the main carb culprits.
When you need to take it to the next level, you will already be well on your way.
Best of luck to you.
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Old 06-02-2013, 08:12 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avid View Post
Once again I find myself not advocating strict adherence to a plan for a newbie.
I base this on my own experience. I was a heavy user of "healthy" whole grain products for many years. Bread and pasta were staples of my woe. As you can imagine, I was over weight.
I went 'cold turkey' with cutting out the bread and pasta, but did not actually count the carbs in anything else I ate.
I started losing immediately. If I had to "count this, measure that" in the early stages of this woe, I don't think I would have stayed with it.
I do count carbs and calories now, but this was only after my new woe became a routine part of my life.
I have a history of going overboard when I try something new. I will get all fired up for a couple of months then fizzle, sputter, and crash.
Yet another failure.
So, if you are like me in this regard and the demands of following induction are too severe, take heart; You can lose alot of weight just by cutting out the main carb culprits.
When you need to take it to the next level, you will already be well on your way.
Best of luck to you.
I agree with some of what you are saying, and I know of people who lost well by eliminating wheat, sugar, and starchy white veggies, without counting.

I know from personal experience that we can get ourselves into a spin if we obsess over macronutrient numbers.

But just taking a stab at low carb without being mindful of how to do it right can be quite ineffective. That's why I'm a fan of DANDR---- eat meat. Eat eggs. Eat up to 4 oz cheese. Eat a cup of cooked veg at one meal and a salad at another meal. Still hungry? Eat meat or fat. Boom. Done.
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Old 06-02-2013, 08:37 AM   #12
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I think it makes sense to start with the "gold standard" - Atkins level induction. Starting there gives you a nice baseline that has worked for many people. Of course, it is not the only way to go, but I would recommend it for two weeks if you are planning to take a low carb approach. You can the forget about glycemic load. Once you have a baseline and know the general rules then you can do as much tweaking as suits you, but few and small tweaks are recommended. With that baseline you can finds lots of experienced based advice from folks here. You'll ultimately decide what works and doesn't work for you based on your own invidual goas.
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Old 06-02-2013, 09:26 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avid View Post
Once again I find myself not advocating strict adherence to a plan for a newbie.
I base this on my own experience. I was a heavy user of "healthy" whole grain products for many years. Bread and pasta were staples of my woe. As you can imagine, I was over weight.
I went 'cold turkey' with cutting out the bread and pasta, but did not actually count the carbs in anything else I ate.
I started losing immediately. If I had to "count this, measure that" in the early stages of this woe, I don't think I would have stayed with it.
I do count carbs and calories now, but this was only after my new woe became a routine part of my life.
I have a history of going overboard when I try something new. I will get all fired up for a couple of months then fizzle, sputter, and crash.
Yet another failure.
So, if you are like me in this regard and the demands of following induction are too severe, take heart; You can lose alot of weight just by cutting out the main carb culprits.
When you need to take it to the next level, you will already be well on your way.
Best of luck to you.
I followed Atkins induction to the letter, planned my daily menus and counted carbs very carefully all the way through my weight loss. Now, I'm going more toward Avid's early plan. I am still counting, but after the fact, just to keep track of what I've already eaten instead of planning what I'm going to eat. (I am a big tracker anyway and want to keep an eye on what I'm eating. If my weight starts to rise, I'll know what to look at.)

At this point, I simply do not eat any bread, pasta, rice or sugar if I can help it. I have eaten a little potato and other starchy veggies from time to time and I eat a little bit of fruit. (I've never been a major fruit eater so it isn't a huge temptation for me.) So far, I have maintained my weight loss just by cutting out those categories and my appetite remains under control as long as I do that. If I can continue maintenance this way, I'll be happy.

For me one of the big differences between this plan and others I've been on over the years is this idea that certain categories of foods are making me fat rather than the accumulation of food I eat each day. Psychologically this liberated me from a certain habit of mind I had for many years. The appetite suppression that comes with not eating those foods just reinforces it.

Over the past 11 months of doing this I've had some high carb this and that at social occasions and have had a few blips on the scale because of it. But overall, I've just adopted the mantra "I don't eat that" the same way vegetarians don't eat meat or people with allergies don't eat whatever causes their allergy. I certainly don't know yet whether this will stick over the long term but so far, I've found it remarkably easy to do that --- much easier than the strict portion and calorie control I lived with for years before.

YMMV --- If I've learned one thing from these boards over the past year it's that everyone who is successful finds their own way, which is quite remarkable in itself. There is far more flexibility in this diet than any I've ever done before. If you stick to the basic principles you'll be able to figure out the right way for you and be successful. Good luck!
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:09 AM   #14
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Hi Everyone...I was actually hoping to find others who have simply cut out bread and pasta (all grain), starchy vegetables, rice & sugar.

I hate counting...I'll end up obsessing and then find a reason to binge when I don't follow "to the letter".

Day 3 today. I am a binge eater (food addict). I find that a low carb diet which eliminates the carbs above but gives me some flexibility to each seeds, nuts and tons of veggies is less restrictive for me. I'm also trying very hard not to weigh myself...that will throw me into a tailspin and put all of my focus on weight. I simply want to eat "like a normal person" in terms of over eating & be healthy.

Anyone else?

Elena
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:28 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bummys View Post
Hi Everyone...I was actually hoping to find others who have simply cut out bread and pasta (all grain), starchy vegetables, rice & sugar.

I hate counting...I'll end up obsessing and then find a reason to binge when I don't follow "to the letter".

Day 3 today. I am a binge eater (food addict). I find that a low carb diet which eliminates the carbs above but gives me some flexibility to each seeds, nuts and tons of veggies is less restrictive for me. I'm also trying very hard not to weigh myself...that will throw me into a tailspin and put all of my focus on weight. I simply want to eat "like a normal person" in terms of over eating & be healthy.

Anyone else?

Elena
I've known people who have lost on the sort of method you describe. If you have a substantial amount to lose, you should see some results.

I personally can't lose if I eat to satisfaction from nuts, seeds, and veggies.
But if you choose most of your foods from the list I posted above, limit nuts, and increase veggies only from the list I posted, you might do okay. Not rapid, but steady.

Realize that you probably will not get the appetite-supressing benefit of ketosis/low carb because your carbs from nuts, seeds, and extra veggies will probably keep you out of ketosis.

There are other low carb plans which are close to what you describe, but I don't know of any that don't require any sort of counting or restriction.

Bottom line, I guess I'd suggest that you eat to satisfaction from the food list from above, substitute nuts and seeds for the cheeses and cream, and eat most of your veggies from the list.
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:57 AM   #16
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I will agree that Atkins IMHO is the easiest and healthiest plan as you eventually figure out what you can eat and in the end eat a variety of foods and can easily add In carbs that don't effect you. I actually find Atkins the least restrictive of Lc

I still don't get low glycemic diets. I DO get that Atkins is low glycemic but not all LG is LC

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Old 06-05-2013, 09:42 AM   #17
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Thanks - Moving forward I'll try to limit nuts, seed & veggies.

Has anyone used blood sugar testing as a benchmark for how many and what type of carbs they can eat?
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Old 06-05-2013, 09:53 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bummys View Post
Hi Everyone...I was actually hoping to find others who have simply cut out bread and pasta (all grain), starchy vegetables, rice & sugar.

I hate counting...I'll end up obsessing and then find a reason to binge when I don't follow "to the letter".

Day 3 today. I am a binge eater (food addict). I find that a low carb diet which eliminates the carbs above but gives me some flexibility to each seeds, nuts and tons of veggies is less restrictive for me. I'm also trying very hard not to weigh myself...that will throw me into a tailspin and put all of my focus on weight. I simply want to eat "like a normal person" in terms of over eating & be healthy.

Anyone else?

Elena
This is basically how I lost my weight. As I got closer to goal, I had to limit overall food quantity, but the types of foods I was eating remained the same. I am rarely in ketosis and don't get the appetite supressing effect, so that's something to consider. I feel completely satisfied with how I eat, though. Good luck.
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Old 06-05-2013, 10:40 AM   #19
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Thank you for the response...I'm going to keep it as it is for now and like you, try to limit quantities moving forward.

I have about 25 pounds to lose but I'm most concerned about eliminating binge eating and learning to eat normally. I think for me, modified low carb.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:06 AM   #20
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How fast?

On 20 Carbs a day, how fast is the weight loss?
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:11 AM   #21
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On 20 Carbs a day, how fast is the weight loss?
That's like asking how fast is the loss on Weight Watchers. It's an individual thing.

The stricter you are, meaning the closer you follow the rules of induction, the faster you will lose, but that just means you'll lose faster than you would have lost being less strict, not compared to anyone else. Your body is your body, and there are many factors involved in weight loss.

Regardless, most of the losses in the first week to ten days is water weight. That's important, because you need to release the water when you get into ketosis, but it's not fat loss.
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Old 06-06-2013, 06:05 AM   #22
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My first week on LCHF, I overate. I know I did. But I was trying to get those pesky carbs and sugars out of my body. For the first 3 days I felt ravenously hungry. For what seemed like, the entire day. So I ate. I didn't need to feel deprived or like I was sacrificing and I certainly didn't want to let myself get super hungry when there is always bagels, Danish, and candy at work. I was also coming off a long weekend of overindulgence of food and drink. So I needed to set myself up for success and allow my body to purge and adjust. As I go on (and I am by no means a veteran) I now pay more attention to carb grams and fat intake (LOVING THE BPC!!) and surprise! I am now finding that I don't have to deal at all with that hunger or even the desire for those bagels.
Some people are the jump right in types, and others need to wade and get used to the water
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Old 06-06-2013, 06:40 AM   #23
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Quote:
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On 20 Carbs a day, how fast is the weight loss?
I've been thinking a lot about this.
The more I read, the more I think the weight loss comes in layers.

I think we need to stick with an LC plan for at least a month before finding our regular losing groove.

I think the first days we should eat to satisfaction from the allowed foods, not to lose weight, but to get rid of the carbs in our system and to allow the natural appetite suppression of ketosis to kick in. We might lose really well in the first few days, and that's great. But I think the loss is coming from getting rid of the gunk from our digestive tracts and rebalancing how much water is in our cells (to put it oversimplistically, digesting carbs makes us hold water in our cells and our GI tract).

Then once we hit the one-week mark, or maybe 2 weeks or more, the carbs are out of our system and we've settled in to a new routine of eating. And it's about this time that the appetite supression kicks in, so we naturally desire less food.

After that, our bodies are nearly to the point of running on fat and protein in the absence of carbs. It takes a while for the body to react to change, but if we keep on plan, eventually the body will respond, and we'll become fat-adapted or keto-adapted. When that happens, our bodies are running like fine-tuned machines. Energy kicks in. We feel good. We lose weight because the body happily chugs along on fat and protein.

I'm still learning and reading, but it makes sense to me, and in my opinion, it shows that we need to stick with it even if the losses slow after that first big drop.
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:13 AM   #24
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Stats: 300/200/190 initial goal
WOE: low carb
Start Date: November 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by emel View Post
I've been thinking a lot about this.
The more I read, the more I think the weight loss comes in layers.

I think we need to stick with an LC plan for at least a month before finding our regular losing groove.

I think the first days we should eat to satisfaction from the allowed foods, not to lose weight, but to get rid of the carbs in our system and to allow the natural appetite suppression of ketosis to kick in. We might lose really well in the first few days, and that's great. But I think the loss is coming from getting rid of the gunk from our digestive tracts and rebalancing how much water is in our cells (to put it oversimplistically, digesting carbs makes us hold water in our cells and our GI tract).

Then once we hit the one-week mark, or maybe 2 weeks or more, the carbs are out of our system and we've settled in to a new routine of eating. And it's about this time that the appetite supression kicks in, so we naturally desire less food.

After that, our bodies are nearly to the point of running on fat and protein in the absence of carbs. It takes a while for the body to react to change, but if we keep on plan, eventually the body will respond, and we'll become fat-adapted or keto-adapted. When that happens, our bodies are running like fine-tuned machines. Energy kicks in. We feel good. We lose weight because the body happily chugs along on fat and protein.

I'm still learning and reading, but it makes sense to me, and in my opinion, it shows that we need to stick with it even if the losses slow after that first big drop.


I went out of ketosis when I went on a cruise in late March, it took me a week or so to get my weight back to where it was (it was pretty much all water weight), I had no trouble jumping back on plan. But I think it took a number of weeks (maybe 6 - 8) to become keto-adapted again. I am finding I am losing more weight now than I was even a few weeks ago, but I'm eating the same. So the big losses don't always come just at the beginning. Stick with LC eating and your body may surprise you.
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