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-   -   Is Ketosis necessary? (http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/main-lowcarb-lobby/804773-ketosis-necessary.html)

Donamo 05-25-2013 06:34 AM

Is Ketosis necessary?
 
I have read a few of the LCHF books and have been eating that way for about 10 days. My goal is not really weight loss, although a few pounds would be nice.

My goal is to get better control of my Meniere's symptoms. Meniere's is one of those diseases where there is no known cause and no known cure. It is an inner ear disorder and is affected a lot by diet. I am hoping that a very steady insulin level will be of some help. I also need to keep low sodium in my diet.

So, there are a lot of things in the Atkins style diet that I can't eat, such as sausage, cheese, nuts, anything with a high level of arginine, anything aged. In order to get enough food, I have probably been eating more meat and veggies and more milk than you should in induction and thus can't seem to get my ketone level up much. I have read where people have said they don't feel hungry eating LCHF but this hasn't happened to me yet. I wake up hungry and often feel hungry between meals. Is this because I am not in ketosis? I took a ketone reading yesterday and it was 0.9.

I am eating beef, fish, chicken and veggies that are "above the ground" with a glass or two of whole milk.

Mistizoom 05-25-2013 06:47 AM

First, ketosis isn't necessary for anything, but it can be a desirable metabolic state for many, depending on your health goals. I have no idea if a ketogenic diet would help with your health issues or not. It helps with mine (insulin resistance and PCOS), though it hasn't done anything for my blood pressure unfortunately!

Are you using urine or blood ketone strips? I assume urine...if so the level does not matter. As long as the strip changes color you are in ketosis (or were...as you could be out of ketosis and your body is dumping the remaining ketones). The color/level is more of an indication of your body's hydration status. Whole milk is pretty high carb (lots of sugar), there may be better alternatives to that. Have you thought about seeing a nutritionist to discuss your dietary goals given your restrictions? We saw one for my son recently and she was familiar with ketogenic diets (though not necessarily encouraging of using it for him).

Good luck!

Donamo 05-25-2013 07:07 AM

Hi - I have no idea if a ketogenic diet will help either but I wanted to try it. A lot of Meniere's sufferers try to eat low glycemic so I thought ketogenisis might be one step better.

I am using the Precision Xtra meter and the reading was .9 mmol/L yesterday afternoon. I am not sure if there is a particular time of day you are supposed to take a reading.

avid 05-25-2013 07:35 AM

Hi,
I wish you well in your quest for improved health. I really like it when people come in stating that their goal is 'health' as opposed to simply losing weight.
Like the others posted previously, I have no idea if ketosis will help with your condition.
I would, however like to refer you Dr. Terry Wahls. You can google her, find her on face book, go to 'you tube' as well as other places.
Hers is a fascinating story. Briefly, she was diagnosed with progressive Multiple Sclerosis.
She followed the usual medical advice but got progressively worse. As a medical doctor she decided to review the literature herself and realized that dietary nutrition might help with her symptoms. Well, the results were amazing. She went from being in a wheelchair to taking 18 mile bike rides. Mind you, she never stopped listening to the MS doctors or rejected the meds/advice....but their value was limited untill she added a 'caveman' type diet to her regimine.
I have no idea if her recommendations can help you or not. But whenever anyone new comes to the forum with a serious chronic disease inquiring about food and health, I always suggest they check her out.
Best wishes for health and happiness.

Mistizoom 05-25-2013 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donamo (Post 16439664)
Hi - I have no idea if a ketogenic diet will help either but I wanted to try it. A lot of Meniere's sufferers try to eat low glycemic so I thought ketogenisis might be one step better.

I am using the Precision Xtra meter and the reading was .9 mmol/L yesterday afternoon. I am not sure if there is a particular time of day you are supposed to take a reading.

Anything from 0.5 mM to 5 mM indicates you are in ketosis. So you are! You might want to head over to the Nutritional Ketosis subforum. There are people who hang out there who use blood ketone meters and can give you more specific information on using them.

Weezy 05-25-2013 09:31 AM

If you're trying for ketosis, a .9 is technically in ketosis--according to Phinney & Volek, anything over .5 means ketosis.

With your dietary limitations, you may want to consider adding more fats to reduce the hunger. Butter produced from grass-fed cows (KerryGold is widely available), coconut oil, and MCT oil are some great ones. Stay away from any vegetable oil other than olive. Upping your fat will help with ketosis and will definitely help with the hunger.

Milk is very high in sugars, and that could be the culprit as to why you're at minimal levels of ketosis.

Take your blood ketone reading first thing in the morning--that is the lowest point of the day. If you're over .5 then, you're in ketosis.

If you haven't read Phinney & Volek's book "The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance," you might want to take a look at it. It's packed with information on ketosis.

jeaniem 05-25-2013 09:36 AM

Donamo
I have Meniere's and LC helps minimize the roar of the tinnitus greatly. I can't really say for certain that LC has made much of a difference with the other symptoms such as the vertigo and nausea as I find the disease has a mind of it's own and comes and goes with no real pattern or reason in my case. The only thing that seems to be an issue is my symptoms tend to be more of an issue in the Spring and sudafed seems to help control the dizziness.

Donamo 05-25-2013 01:43 PM

Ok, that is good to know! I guess I have one more book to read, whew! Thank you all for the info.

Nice to meet another Meniere's person here too. Jeaniem, you may want to read "Heal Your Headache" by Bucholz. It was recommended to me by another MD sufferer and by eliminating the foods he recommends it has made a huge difference in my life. Gave it back to me really as I was sliding down hill. ( even though I've never really had headaches!)

DiamondDeb 05-25-2013 02:34 PM

No, ketosis is not necessary & most fat-loss diets do not even mention it.

I've lost a lot of weight and have never once wondered or worried about ketosis.

Just eating a healthy diet with few processed foods should help you.

Are you supplementing magnesium? I ask because I've been researching it a lot recently & have seen mention of it being connecte to inner ear problems. My aunt has an inner ear balance problem with no real diagnosis so it was of interest to me.

Donamo 05-25-2013 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiamondDeb (Post 16440251)
No, ketosis is not necessary & most fat-loss diets do not even mention it.

I've lost a lot of weight and have never once wondered or worried about ketosis.

Just eating a healthy diet with few processed foods should help you.

Are you supplementing magnesium? I ask because I've been researching it a lot recently & have seen mention of it being connecte to inner ear problems. My aunt has an inner ear balance problem with no real diagnosis so it was of interest to me.

Yes, I do take magnesium supplements. You may want to read up a bit on Meniere's for your aunt, it may be what she has. It is a weird disease with several different treatments, none too successful.

Phranquie 05-25-2013 03:50 PM

Donamo- I also have Menieres but have not found specific relief from eating LC. I do stay away from caffeine and of course limit my salt. I eat a moderate amount of carbs usually average of about 45g a day. I have never been told to not eat cheeses, although I don't eat a lot of them. I will have to read about this.

My otolaryngologist has me on a diuretic and a compounded vasodilator called nylidrin which worked well several years ago keeping me failry symptom free. I had been off the meds totally since last July and have been eating LC since then. While I have had daily intermittent tinnitus, a few weeks ago my symptoms of dizziness and vertigo returned after having been absent for almost 4 years. So I am back on the meds daily and also take sublingual compounded atropine if I feel an episode of vertigo starting to happen which helps to stop the total crash and spin from happening.

Jeaniem- For nausea from dizziness a great med is actually a low dose of valium. I had no idea until my doc prescribed it for me.


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