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Old 01-10-2013, 05:17 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by rubidoux View Post
That is a serious motivation for me (I don't think I would be doing this if it wasn't good for my diabetes), but it also depresses me in a HUGE way that this is it for the rest of my life (unless I decide that life isn't worth living w/o carbs, which I won't). That is really heavy for me. I need to really come to terms with the fact that I am not going to get almost any enjoyment out of food at all in my life. I think at some point I will accept that and will really incorporate that into my mind set in an honest and straightforward way and then I can move on to the important things in life... At least that's how I hope it'll work.
If you haven't already read them, I would highly recommend Jenny Ruhl's books, Blood Sugar 101 and Diet 101. Ruhl is diabetic and a long-time low-carb dieter. She initially changed her lifestyle after reading Dr Bernstein's book and, over the years, she has done a significant amount of additional research. I'm not diabetic, but her books are so insightful and well-researched that I have found absolutely invaluable information in them with regard to structuring my low-carb eating plan.

In Diet 101, Ruhl suggests some strategies for making low-carb eating suit an individual lifestyle. I don't want to misrepresent the information by over-simplifying it, but one of her suggestions is that even diabetic low-carb dieters can reasonable fit in some of the higher-carb foods they would prefer to not live without by rigorously measuring portions, testing their post-meal blood sugar, and finding the right amount of each beloved food that will not drive blood sugar up past 140 mg/dl. I have not taken this approach because I'm not diabetic and, honestly, I could happily eat nothing but meat and cheese for ever and ever.

Ruhl suggests that controlling a diabetic person's diet "well enough" to keep blood sugar below 140 mg/dl may not be a "perfect" solution but it is statistically "good enough" to prevent most diabetics from deteriorating into the classic diabetic health complications, eliminate secondary insulin resistance that is caused by toxic levels of systemic insulin, and will greatly reduce the risk of heart disease. In Diet 101, she says:
Adopting a less stringent diet may mean settling for weight loss that is better than average though less than ideal, just as it might mean settling for "good enough" blood sugars rather than perfect ones. But a less stringent diet may be the only diet many of us can stick to forever -- after the scale stops dropping, after that early 5 month burst of weight loss is over, and after we realize that, just as the song says, forever is a long time.

But before you can figure out what diet will be "good enough" for you, you'll have to figure out exactly how your blood sugar is performing, because a more relaxed diet that continually pushes your blood sugar up over that 140 mg/dl level is not healthy. It will make you hungry and derail your ability both to lose weight and to maintain it. Over time it will also make you more likely to develop heart disease, no matter how much weight you lose.

...

If a certain food pushes you over your target, but you really want to keep eating it, try cutting back on its portion size until you find a portion size that keeps your blood sugar within range.

Once you have found a few meals that keep your blood sugar solidly in the normal range, use nutritional software to compute how many grams of carbohydrates those meals contain. Be very careful to match the portion size you actually ate to the portion sizes given in the software.

Once you have determined how many grams of carbohydrates these meals contained, you can eat other meals that contain the same amount or less carbohydrate, knowing they will also keep your blood sugar normal, without having to test your blood sugar after eating each one.
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Old 01-11-2013, 03:03 AM   #32
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There are many recipes available that taste just like high carb, so I wouldn't say you could never enjoy food again. Sounds so sad to me I enjoy the LC desserts I make. The dinners and lunches are just easy. Meat and vegetables, eggs, pancakes, egg muffins, coffee or cocoa with HWC, protein shakes ++++++ A LOT Just ask if there's something you're missing. There is most likely a substitute!
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Old 01-11-2013, 04:45 AM   #33
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I'm very sorry that you feel that you will never get any enjoyment out of food again. When you think about it, the foods we avoid are really those with little flavour of their own - potatoes, pasta, rice etc. It's more about texture - those foods are just vehicles for the flavourful sauces, stews, roasts etc. that we put with them. If it's cakes, cookies and candies that you miss, well, there are low carb substitutes - but after a while you may find that you lose your sweet tooth and don't fancy them any more.

Do you not enjoy foods like steak, or lobster, or grilled/roast chicken? What about chilli, or moussaka, or coq au vin? How about pizza omelettes (just use an omelette instead of a pizza base), or crustless quiche, or cheesecake? Sauces like alfredo, hollandaise, or a red wine reduction with berries, or even an orange sauce with, say, roast duck? I've managed to incorporate all of those into my low carb WOE, and I'm loving it

I am a committed foodie, always will be, I think - and I find low carb lets me continue to indulge myself, at the same time as losing weight. It's win-win. I couldn't stick with a WOE I didn't enjoy - so have a think about what your favourite foods are and see if you can find low carb alternatives - am sure there will be some!
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Old 01-11-2013, 04:50 AM   #34
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Great post, darkginger! There are many ways of dishing up our fave meals. Luckily I'm not one of those who are obsessed with bread, chocolate or pizza and so on. I like things to be simple though. Like, oopsies are a good enough alternative to bread for me. And also a lot of microwave bread recipes work well! There's many ways around it just ask! Please, don't be afraid to pm me if you need ideas.
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Old 01-11-2013, 10:31 AM   #35
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Trillex, I will check out the Jenny Ruhl stuff. It sounds like there may be stuff in there I can use.

I have already decided that I don't need to be perfect bloodsugar-wise. There was a time that I was "flatlining" at 95. I made sure that I never deviated from 95, EVER. But it took a TON of work and I don't think I can have a full life that way. Everything has to be about diabetes. At the time, though, I was working on getting ready to get pregnant and then on trying to get pregnant and being pregnant. And I went on that way for a bit while my first was a baby, but then life happened. lol Which is good.

But during that time, which was close to four years in total, I was eating very strictly <30 grams a day (this is Bernstein's protocol -- 6/12/12) and not losing at all. In fact, I was ten or 12 pounds up by the time I got pg. I felt like it was very worthwhile for the bs benefits, but it was pretty discouraging to have found that a normal version of LC didn't help me lose weight. After that, I kept trying to lose by cutting back on fat and adding veggies, which of course was completely the wrong thing to do. But eventually I stumbled upon HFLC and found that below about ten grams of CHO per day I could lose.

For a long time I ate 2.5 grams of CHO per day and managed to lose 40 pounds, which was awesome. After having gained 25 of that back, though, I am now at a point where I am trying to be slightly more liberal (allowing eggs and limited HWC and a small handful of greens and a couple of grams of CHO from other sources for my nightly salad (like a few kalamata olives or half a T of ketchup in my salad dressing, a little more cheese). So far, I'm not sure if I'm losing. I am down about five pounds, but that might be all or mostly water. So we'll see over the next couple of weeks. I'm not weighing myself daily like I used to because I'm planning (hoping) to stick to this whether I lose or not (I know it is much healthier for me that SAD). But if I weigh myself in a couple of weeks and I have not lost anything, I'll have to decide whether or not to pull back to that 2.5 g level or to just try to live this way at nearly 80 pounds over my ideal weight. I am hoping I can lose doing what I'm doing now. I think it is only around 12 or so grams/day.

All of this is a long winded explanation for why I don't see a lot of room for low carb versions of my high carb favorites. I do try to make my food as appealing as I can. This salad dressing that I've been making is pretty yummy and last night I splurged on a caramel peanut butter egg cream (3 g CHO for 1.5 T PB and 1 g CHO for 1T caramel davinci's plus the 3.5 g for the eggs and HWC, gah!). But I am never going to take pleasure from eating this way like I did when I ate "normal" food. OTOH, I don't think that's the ideal. That was probably the food version of lying on the floor passed out with a needle stuck in my arm, when I would rather be like a social drinker. Currently I guess I'm more like a nun, but maybe if I ever lose the weight I can find some more room for pleasure. I don't really want to count on being able to lose it though. I don't have a lot of indication that it's likely.

Anyhow... I know that I sound down and I kind of am, but I think it is part of the journey for me. I feel like I need to not be wearing rose colored glasses about this and I need to acknowledge the fact that it just kind of sucks and accept it. Maybe after that I'll be able to see what the silver lining is. There is another poster here, svenskamae, who I think has similar metabolic challanges (in terms of being resistant to loss not the diabetes) and she is much more graceful about it and seems to take it all in stride. Svenskamae, you're my role model for this! I'm hoping I'll be like that before too long.
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:33 AM   #36
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What if you started carb cycling and every Sunday you allow yourself a cheat meal? Some people even do entire cheat days. If you are really having a hard time sticking to it that would be a good place to start.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:13 AM   #37
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It's funny that you mention that bc I had a cheat meal yesterday and I was just thinking about whether or not I can still count it as a good day. I was not eating on plan, but I think I have recovered nicely and I think there kinda has to be room in my plan for accommodating slip ups. OTOH I have had cheat days and cheat meals that knocked me completely out of the game for weeks and months. So it is a hard issue for me. I think I can't do the once a week thing bc it just won't work for me, but maybe when I get to a point where I am just unable to get through a craving, dealing with that and then moving on should be okay, maybe.

So I'm feeling like yesterday is not a "cheat" but I'm gonna give it a couple more hours to see if I'm still in the groove.
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Old 01-17-2013, 09:13 AM   #38
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I think cheat meals are better than full days. I haven't done it yet.. But I am sure I will if I'm invited places and stuff.
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Old 01-17-2013, 01:02 PM   #39
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The key is not being hungry! Eat plenty of good fats like nuts, seeds, avocado, olive oil.
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Old 01-23-2013, 07:40 AM   #40
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How are you doing?
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Old 01-23-2013, 08:48 AM   #41
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The key is not being hungry! Eat plenty of good fats like nuts, seeds, avocado, olive oil.
I agree with this! Fill yourself up, and don't feel deprived.
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:37 AM   #42
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How are you doing?
Thanks for asking! I'm okay. I've been sticking to my plan pretty well and I have also loosened my standards a bit (I still consider it a good day if I eat something off plan as long as I don't throw in the towel and eat everything in sight).

And I'm trying to increase how much I eat a little. My plan had been to eat once or twice a day depending on what was going on, but that seemed to almost always turn into just once. So, I've been really trying to get that second meal in. It seems to be working in terms of making my plan more livable, but I am not losing AT ALL. I'm still staying under 20 carbs a day and 60 grams protein, but I guess it's too many calories to lose. I'm not sure what I'm going to do.

I've been thinking about how I feel about a life where I am in control of my eating and eating healthy and feeling good, but still 200 pounds. I think there's a good chance that that's the life I've got ahead of me and I'm trying to wrap my head around being happy with this weight. I'm only 5'0", so I don't feel terribly presentable at 200 pounds, but if I were healthy and not eating in a disordered way, maybe I could just get used to that???

Last edited by rubidoux; 01-23-2013 at 10:44 AM..
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Old 01-23-2013, 10:58 AM   #43
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It is really hard for me too. I restarted several times since November. I lost and gained the same 10 lbs. Right now I've been going on day 12 without a cheat. What has been keeping me going this time is a biggest loser competition I've been doing with some friends on my bike team, we weigh in in front of our whole team every Thursday and I am such a competitive person that every time I have thought about eating a bagel or pizza I think about how hard it is to lose and how much I will probably gain if I eat that, and I want to win this competition, or at least look like I'm losing each week! Since you're going for the bar, I'm guessing you are a competitive person, too. Is there any way you can enter a competition like this to help motivate you, so even when you're stressing, you can have that little reminder about the weigh-in? I also know that cheese or nuts will fill me quickly and get me to forget about the bad stuff, so I keep nuts and cheese with me at all times. I don't dare buy anything carby, although I see how that can be difficult with your child.
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Old 01-24-2013, 01:33 AM   #44
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Congrats on doing more than two weeks! I am on my 15th day. I am so happy to be done with induction. I did cheat and ate cottage cheese and a few raspberries. But no nut meals or nuts.
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Old 01-25-2013, 09:29 AM   #45
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OH boy can I relate! I have times when i'm good for weeks and then something throws me off track (mostly fresh bread) and then i find myself struggling again and trying to go day to day. I'm a stay at home mom, so i'm here with a 2 year old all day. I guess i get bored and i want to snack, or i want something sweet. It's killing me!!!!!
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Old 01-25-2013, 02:15 PM   #46
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I get that addysmommy! How about getting some hobbies? Reading, knitting, puzzling, jewelry making, and a lot of other fun crafts! Your baby might be able to join you in some of them even.
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:06 PM   #47
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I failed repeatedly over the last 10 years because of cravings. Then, I learned 2 things that saved me.
  1. Fix your gut. Probiotics, digestive enzymes, betaine hcl, fermented foods. You need to have a lot of the good guys. The ones you currently have love sugar and cause you grief when they don't get it. You want to replace those guys. Antibiotics kill the good guys.
  2. Eat a big protein breakfast within 30 minutes of getting up. Protein is slow in digesting and will keep you from being hungry for hours.
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Old 01-26-2013, 04:27 PM   #48
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I failed repeatedly over the last 10 years because of cravings. Then, I learned 2 things that saved me.
  1. Fix your gut. Probiotics, digestive enzymes, betaine hcl, fermented foods. You need to have a lot of the good guys. The ones you currently have love sugar and cause you grief when they don't get it. You want to replace those guys. Antibiotics kill the good guys.
  2. Eat a big protein breakfast within 30 minutes of getting up. Protein is slow in digesting and will keep you from being hungry for hours.
One thing I've found that makes things a little easier for me is to not eat at all until at least 3 p.m. I have read about the leptin reset/big breakfast thing, but it's hard for me to think about giving up IF. If (and sadly I believe this is more a matter of when) I fall off the wagon again, maybe I will give the BAB a try.

Where can I read more about the gut stuff? It used to be that whenever I was eating low carb all of my digestive issues disappeared and I felt heat, but that has been less and less true lately. Like, I still seem to be having heartburn now even though I'm eating <20 g of carb, which is kind of disturbing to me bc low carb used to instantly put a stop to my heartburn.

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Old 01-26-2013, 04:47 PM   #49
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Where can I read more about the gut stuff? It used to be that whenever I was eating low carb all of my digestive issues disappeared and I felt heat, but that has been less and less true lately. Like, I still seem to be having heartburn now even though I'm eating <20 g of carb, which is kind of disturbing to me bc low carb used to instantly put a stop to my heartburn.
I just started taking Pancreatin which is amylase, protease, and lipase. For me, it has been amazing.

You might try reading about the GAPS diet. Also, search for an article called The Leaky Gut Prescription.

Last edited by beachguy; 01-26-2013 at 04:54 PM..
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Old 01-26-2013, 06:58 PM   #50
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I just started taking Pancreatin which is amylase, protease, and lipase. For me, it has been amazing.

You might try reading about the GAPS diet. Also, search for an article called The Leaky Gut Prescription.
Alright, thanks, beachguy, I'll look into those.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:58 PM   #51
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Just gotta update to say that I hit 21 days! When I started this thread I never would have thought that I was at the beginning of a good streak (knock on wood). I hope I really have made it a habit.
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:47 PM   #52
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An aside on the gut stuff: there was an episode of Radiolab about probiotics--apparently, keeping your gut bacteria in balance also keeps you less afraid of things and more relaxed, more brave and confident... I can't remember the hormone that the "good" bacteria release. I mentioned this to some doctors i am friends with and they laughed at me, but whatever. I still load up on probiotics to fix my gut and to hopefully help my ability to mountain bike and get over my fear of things!
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:36 PM   #53
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An aside on the gut stuff: there was an episode of Radiolab about probiotics--apparently, keeping your gut bacteria in balance also keeps you less afraid of things and more relaxed, more brave and confident... I can't remember the hormone that the "good" bacteria release. I mentioned this to some doctors i am friends with and they laughed at me, but whatever. I still load up on probiotics to fix my gut and to hopefully help my ability to mountain bike and get over my fear of things!
I'll have to see if I can find that online. My nine year old LOVES radiolab. And a little more courage is always a good thing.

I gotta tell ya, whenever I see your sig pic I always think of a time that I went sledding in Troy when I was like 4 or 5 years old (just about 40 years ago now!) and in my memory, we were sledding down a hill that was very woody, and had only a really narrow path that we were going down between the trees and it was so scary! And I think it was probably something like 10* out that day because I can *still* remember the cold! So when I see your pic, I kinda believe you're riding down that hill. lol
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:53 PM   #54
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haha there are lots of hills in troy! I wonder if you were in Prospect Park, I went to a bike race there this year, it was very hilly in there. This photo was actually taken in a state forest near Poughkeepsie.
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