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Old 12-11-2012, 05:23 AM   #1
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Who doesn't cheat? :)

I don't cheat. I don't ''plan'' to cheat either. If I eat a bite of something carby it is because it is on a whim. and it is super rare I do it.

because I know me. I am the true carb addict type. I look at carbs and I gain weight so even a bit of high carby junky food puts weight on me in an instant. I know my limits.

I am atkins and have adopted this way of eating for life. there is 'no plan' to eat whatever I want at the holidays for one day. there is no 'I need' carbs for a change of pace. no 'I have a party coming' and 'plan' to eat off my WOE just this time.

I am full low carb for life. This really is such a better way for me to eat.

Who else is like me? No cheating, no planning carby foods for a day, no compromises just once in a while because this is the choice we choose? to stay low carb no matter what foods are out there?

I know some of you are die-hards like me I would love to see who is strictly LC withotu compromising their WOE for any reasons on purpose.

(I know some can eat higher carbs, stay on plan and survive. I can't so I am wondering who eats like me out there and sticks to LC all the time regardless of the food situations we encounter)
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:16 AM   #2
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Good attitude Trigger!! I am a 'true to plan person' as well for a couple of reasons but the most significant is that I fell off the wagon a # of yrs. ago, regained all my losses and then some and had a devil of a time getting back on board. I don't want to risk that again.

In addition to that, I have come to realize that this is about my health and well being and not just weight. Because I love the way I eat, it is easy to be true blue.
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:25 AM   #3
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Wow, I thought I was pretty strict! Get out of the way, Sharon Osbourne! Trigger is here to be the new Atkins spokesperson!

Almost always, I don't cheat even a little. When I started this WOE over the summer, I had my eye on the prize with such focus that, like you, cheating just seemed (and still seems) usually not worth it. With definite rare exceptions!

So far, my only full blown " I-am-not-counting-one-carb-tonight" cheat was this past Sunday at a party. The reason? I know it's kind of making excuses, but I did feel that I had been consistently very strict, which fortunately led to having completely achieved goal with quite a bit of wiggle room. I did feel that I could more than afford it, and I knew for me it really would be just one evening, and then back to our normal awesome WOE.

I do think I confused a lot of people at that party, because most of them knew I had lost weight with a low-carb diet. Yet there I was, shoveling in mac n cheese like grocery stores had stopped selling itl!

On a side note: do you think we should try to find a different word for "cheating"? "Cheating" implies that there's so much deprivation and/or desire involved that eventually you just HAVE to give in. With this woe, that isn't the case. There's no feeling of not getting to have large enough portions of really delicious foods. It's just that, every once in a great while, you just want a darn french fry!
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:29 AM   #4
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i don' t cheat.
I DO drink wine or mich ultra or select 55 in the evening, and it is in my daily carb count. That induglence allows me to totally stay on plan. I don't ever have bites of anything carby. i am extremely strict and I don't feel deprived. I'd rather be thin than eat a cookie.
Christmas parties for me are easy...ham, shrimp, roast beef, cheese. these days I try not to eat a lot of cheese...while I still have about 10 pounds to go. When i start adding carbs, it'll be more vegetables, not bread or cake like LC foods....eating things like wasa crackers with cheese or peanut butter was what led me to slowly gaining the weight back. I'm not going to do that this time. I'll look forward to bigger salads, more asparagus and brussels sprouts!!! Yum!
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:30 AM   #5
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How about "indulging"...sounds better than "cheating"!
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:31 AM   #6
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Indulging is not bad but I have to say that my on plan food feels more like indulgence than off plan carbs do.....maybe that is just me....
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:31 AM   #7
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I was super hardcore when I was still losing weight and did not cheat because I wanted to get to goal as fast as possible.

But, now I do eat off plan and don't consider it cheating since my plan is maintenance and it includes non-lc foods. For example, I never make lc replacements for high carb foods but once in a while I will eat some of my mom's made from scratch pastries or have some real pizza. I don't see anything wrong with these foods in the context of a healthy and whole foods lc diet so I don't feel badly about eating them.

I think the problem starts if you are still in weight loss mode and already planning what to eat off plan and have cheat days that take over your focus on lc and staying on plan- then you already have one foot out the door and will find it hard to keep going without cheating more and more.
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:34 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by nolcjunk View Post
I was super hardcore when I was still losing weight and did not cheat because I wanted to get to goal as fast as possible.

But, now I do eat off plan and don't consider it cheating since my plan is maintenance and it includes non-lc foods. For example, I never make lc replacements for high carb foods but once in a while I will eat some of my mom's made from scratch pastries or have some real pizza. I don't see anything wrong with these foods in the context of a healthy and whole foods lc diet so I don't feel badly about eating them.

I think the problem starts if you are still in weight loss mode and already planning what to eat off plan and have cheat days that take over your focus on lc and staying on plan- then you already have one foot out the door and will find it hard to keep going without cheating more and more.
Congrats on your on going success nolcjunk! I might point out though that many folks do not consider wheat (in any form - be it homemade, or otherwise) to be a `healthy or a whole food`. In fact, it is considered a big contributor to a wide variety of health issues for many people.
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:39 AM   #9
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Count me in!

I've learned from bitter experience that when I cheat, whether spontaneous or planned well in advance, three things happen:
  1. I suffer intense cravings for the next few days, intense enough that my willpower simply isn't strong enough to fight them.
  2. My immune system gets compromised when I get knocked out of ketosis, so I find myself at my doctor's office needing antibiotics for yet another sinus infection.
  3. Three months and fifteen pounds later I realize I need to go back on low-carb, because I am sick of being sick all the time, I'm sick of the reactive hypoglycemia, and if I don't turn it around I'm going to need a whole new wardrobe.

NEVER AGAIN! I've been low-carb on-again and off-again for years. But I've been on 100% since March of 2011. Not one cheat day. And the result? No more sinus infections and antibiotics. No more reactive hypoglycemia. No more IBS. And my clothes fit! Why would I want to cheat? The only one who gets cheated when I cheat is ME! Cheated out of my health and happiness.

So I'm with ya, Trigger!
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:40 AM   #10
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Congrats on your on going success nolcjunk! I might point out though that many folks do not consider wheat (in any form - be it homemade, or otherwise) to be a `healthy or a whole food`. In fact, it is considered a big contributor to a wide variety of health issues for many people.
I think it's fine as an occasional food and the problem comes from eating it daily in huge quantities.

And, you are taking what I said out of context- I said it's fine in the context of a healthy and whole food diet (this being what I eat 99 percent of the time, and doesn't include wheat).

I'd rather eat that piece of cake, or have some real pasta once a month than use AS and something like shiritake or dreamfields more often to make replacement foods for high carb meals- I consider these less healthy and faux foods that shouldn't be eaten.

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Old 12-11-2012, 06:45 AM   #11
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great thread and wonderful responses. I enjoyed reading them all.


for me personally, it is a cheat. Only because if you are Induction, you are to stay at about 20 carbs per day max. OWL is adding 5 carbs per week SLOWLY to see where your weight loss/stop losing weight kinda happens so you can get a handle on what max carbs you need to limit to continue losing.

so if you have a X carb count you are supposed to be at...then ya are cheating with poor choice foods.

If you pick a plan and X carbs, then stick to it

If I can get away later in the plan in maintenance of say 30-40 carbs, sure I might eat something, but it will be in the carb count for the day.


I feel most pick a carb count, know their body limits, and then BLOW it cause it is a holiday. 200 carbs in one day just cause it is a holiday seems super pointless to me.

I lost almost 70 lbs on low fat/low cal. can we say starving LOL. I allowed a little food back cause I was constantly hungry. Sure I was going to gain 50 lbs back. I saw it coming.

but with this plan it is all about losing and keeping it off and making those good food choices.

kinda 'being normal'. I want normal back. No more playing with food. the planning high carb foods, allowing yourself to go over your carb limits for your body and your carb personality, just to have to fight with getting back on track, fight with feeling kinda sickly after eating higher carbs, gotta lose those 5-6 lbs. you put back on in one day.....all isn't worth it to me at all.

(but again, I know some can eat a bit and be ok. I guess it comes down to what type of person you are to handle higher carb foods.)

I am not kidding myself one bit anymore. I am a carb nutjob and they have to go LOL

but best is, I am not hungry. I am stuffed. satisfied with the high fat decadent foods. WHY not make LC versions of meals you enjoy and eat those. Why give in? I am never giving in cause I don't have too. People give in only because they 'want' too.

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Old 12-11-2012, 06:49 AM   #12
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How about "indulging"...sounds better than "cheating"!
I like it!
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:56 AM   #13
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How about "indulging"...sounds better than "cheating"!
These words have very different implications to me personally. I can indulge and stay on plan, but cheating implies going off plan. For example, berries with creme fraiche or a piece of quality dark chocolate would be an indulgence, but still something that fits within the framework of my plan. But tortilla chips (my carb kryptonite) or exceeding my 40g allotment in a day, those would be off-plan cheats. Even if I decided in advance to eat that way, for a holiday or something, it's still an off-plan day because that's not the way I plan to eat for the rest of my life. So it's a cheat. Does that make sense?

That's just the way I use those words, though. I'm sure they have different connotations to other people.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:01 AM   #14
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I have just finished one of the best books on the subject of weight-management (and I've read quite a few over the years), Beating Overeating by Gillian Riley.

One of the salient points she makes is relevant to this thread--i.e., studies show that one of the greatest barriers to successful weight loss and weight management is perfectionism--that 'all or nothing' approach that insists on total compliance to a specific food plan.

Even Mark Sisson (among others) says that 80% compliance to healthy eating is sufficient for optimum health. So that occasional slice of pizza or home-made pastry is totally consistent with healthy eating--as long as it is very occasional.

Personally, I take my approach from AA and take it one day at a time. I've been maintaining for close to two years with this approach, and it works for me. I would not say 'never' to any specific food. I doubt that I've had a cookie in the past 5 years, but I don't say that I never would eat one.

All the studies show that a sense of excessive restriction or deprivation is the major cause of binge eating.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:11 AM   #15
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Exactly what Gretalyn said, including her list. SAME HERE.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:14 AM   #16
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Another non-cheater here. Eating the wrong things caused me to put all the weight I lost back on, and I've learned from that, and will not be doing it again. I drink red wine, and vodka, and that's part of my way of eating, not a cheat. I lose weight whilst drinking alcohol, I enjoy drinking alcohol, and - although I do give it up for weeks at a time if I feel I've been overdoing it - being able to have a drink is one of the things that makes my way of eating something I envisage doing for the rest of my life.

Not sure I like either the word 'cheat' or 'indulge' to describe eating off plan. As others have said, I indulge myself frequently, with my luxury items like duck breasts, lobster, scallops etc. It's hard to find a word that doesn't have connotations of 'bad', because eating isn't a moral issue. I think perhaps I'll start referring to off plan foods as 'spiky' foods, because they spike my insulin levels, and they make my stomach and gut feel like I've eaten a cactus

So, anyway, I have no plans to eat anything spiky - ever. There are a lot of foods I chose not to eat when I was eating a standard diet (mac 'n cheese, anything from McDonalds, chocolate (except in cakes and desserts), crisps/chips, Doritos, most processed foods) - I had no temptation to eat them because I believed they were poor quality foods, and NOT eating them wasn't depriving myself, it was a choice based on my beliefs. Same goes for high carb foods - not tempted to eat them because I believe they're bad for me. And spiky
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:22 AM   #17
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Quote:
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I have just finished one of the best books on the subject of weight-management (and I've read quite a few over the years), Beating Overeating by Gillian Riley.

One of the salient points she makes is relevant to this thread--i.e., studies show that one of the greatest barriers to successful weight loss and weight management is perfectionism--that 'all or nothing' approach that insists on total compliance to a specific food plan.

Even Mark Sisson (among others) says that 80% compliance to healthy eating is sufficient for optimum health. So that occasional slice of pizza or home-made pastry is totally consistent with healthy eating--as long as it is very occasional.

Personally, I take my approach from AA and take it one day at a time. I've been maintaining for close to two years with this approach, and it works for me. I would not say 'never' to any specific food. I doubt that I've had a cookie in the past 5 years, but I don't say that I never would eat one.

All the studies show that a sense of excessive restriction or deprivation is the major cause of binge eating.
I don't see it that way. I see my choice of action to eat on plan as a good thing. not a restriction, or why would I do it?

If I started eating homemade pastry and pizza with crust I would be a balloon again. 20% high junk carbs in my life and I might as well not even start a low carb diet cause no way I would handle that

It comes down to knowing yourself I guess and being smart enough to know your limits.

And maybe it is time on plan? I am only 9 weeks into it and doing well. very comfortable. but newer people starting low carb, maybe it is that they haven't accepted the fact that tons of 'comfort foods' are the bad foods. just can't wrap around that yet and they hang on??? thinking they can eat them and do well?

maybe the old 'eat to live vs. live to eat' attitude comes into play for most.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:27 AM   #18
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And maybe it is time on plan? I am only 9 weeks into it and doing well. very comfortable. but newer people starting low carb, maybe it is that they haven't accepted the fact that tons of 'comfort foods' are the bad foods. just can't wrap around that yet and they hang on??? thinking they can eat them and do well?

maybe the old 'eat to live vs. live to eat' attitude comes into play for most.
I think time on plan definitely comes into it. At first I was just starting out and was super strict, and part of that was fear of failure. But, over years in maintenance I learned what I can and can't eat, and know my body pretty well and feel secure in my choices. Tons of comfort foods are definitely bad, but I can have some and be fine and stay at 110.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:29 AM   #19
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I've been maintaining my goal weight within 5 lbs for almost 30 years, but have only been low carb for the past 2 years or so due to blood sugar issues. Prior to LC, I cheated occasionally (i.e., Christmas cookies, wedding cake, etc.) but was pretty strict about counting calories, using portion control, and making healthy choices. Since starting LC, I've never cheated because I know my blood glucose would spike to well over 200, followed by horrendous reactive hypoglcyemia. I love all types of food, but I plan to happily continue my low carb, whole foods way of eating for the rest of my life
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:18 AM   #20
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All the studies show that a sense of excessive restriction or deprivation is the major cause of binge eating.
I can see this being true, but . . . . I suspect that part of the equation is that those who successfully lose and maintain weight readjust their expectations of what it means to feel deprived. We all know people who would feel "deprived" by any diet that didn't allow them to eat the entire pan of brownies in one sitting. Some of us were those people at one point. But in time, I have learned that I'm not being deprived of anything by not eating those kinds of foods. I have a tremendous array of delicious, filling, nourishing foods in my diet, so I don't feel deprived at all, even though I don't plan to eat a wheat product again for the rest of my life. I'm truly okay with that. Having experienced what it does to my body, I don't want it, so I don't feel deprived by not having it. I feel liberated.

Also, in my experience, this is one of the strengths of low-carb dieting as compared to low-fat dieting. Low carb foods are nutrient-dense and very satiating. You don't have to go around half-starved on a low-carb diet. You can eat a huge variety of wonderful foods, and you can eat until you're satisfied.


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I think perhaps I'll start referring to off plan foods as 'spiky' foods, because they spike my insulin levels, and they make my stomach and gut feel like I've eaten a cactus
I like that term! Has the same exact effects on me!

Last edited by Gretalyn; 12-11-2012 at 08:34 AM.. Reason: typo
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:32 AM   #21
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I think it's fine as an occasional food and the problem comes from eating it daily in huge quantities.

And, you are taking what I said out of context- I said it's fine in the context of a healthy and whole food diet (this being what I eat 99 percent of the time, and doesn't include wheat).

I'd rather eat that piece of cake, or have some real pasta once a month than use AS and something like shiritake or dreamfields more often to make replacement foods for high carb meals- I consider these less healthy and faux foods that shouldn't be eaten.
Dreamfields pasta is a wheat product the very same as pizza or cake or pastries. I wouldn`t touch any of these things with a 10 foot pole. Shirataki noodles are a fiberous yam. No more faux food`` than coffee, nuts, ground meat or canned tomatoes (just to list a few).

Wheat is worse than sugar and having it very occasionally is probably ok for someone young and not metabolically challenged, in the same way a little bit of arsenic is in small amounts, very occasionally but not healthy all the same.

I agree that some a.s. is not likely to be much better but the evidence is not there yet.

So in the context of this thread which is do you cheat or not, I thought it important that some less schooled in low carbing not confuse the idea of eating pizza and pasteries as a `non-cheat`. It is contrary to low carb eating in most definitions and would be classified as a cheat.
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:39 AM   #22
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I jsut read about dreamfield pasta. I won't eat it either. It said that while it does not spike blood sugar within about an hour, people need to take their blood sugar about 3 hrs. after eating it. it goes thru the body slowly and people don't know they are spiking so much later after eating. AH HA...it isn't good for you actually.

edited to say I wish I remember where I read that. just the other day actually.
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:45 AM   #23
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So in the context of this thread which is do you cheat or not, I thought it important that some less schooled in low carbing not confuse the idea of eating pizza and pasteries as a `non-cheat`. It is contrary to low carb eating in most definitions and would be classified as a cheat.
That would be hard to confuse for anyone. I didn't cheat while losing weight and now eat off plan in maintenance- nothing confusing there. I said I do not consider them cheating on my plan of maintenance.

Shiritake are just a non food for me because they have no nutrition and perpetuate the need for those foods- that you need pasta with your meal, when really a meat and a vegetable are enough. I do low carb because I don't want to eat bread, pasta, pizza, rice the majority of the time, so why would I replace those foods with imitations?

The people behind the whole 30 (a paleo type jump start program said it best)- trying to shove your old, unhealthy diet into your new diet will ruin it faster than you can say paleo pizza. so this means no junk foods made with approved ingredients.

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Old 12-11-2012, 08:51 AM   #24
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I think The Diet Doctor page had something to say about Dreamfields and blood sugar spikes. I've just decided I don't need pasta of any type in my life - it doesn't taste of anything for a start, it's just a vehicle for sauces, and I find shredded lettuce works just as well

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who's sworn off wheat products (including beer!) for life. It does sound a bit extreme, but it really doesn't feel that way. One pizza and 4 small slices of soda bread were the beginning of my regain - that was all it took to undo all my good work over the previous 3 and a half years (when I was maintaining) - and this is why I now know that I can't eat the spiky stuff at all.

The only foods I don't eat now that I will, hopefully, be able to accommodate when maintaining are legumes - lentils etc. that I enjoy cooked Indian-style. I don't get lentil cravings though! I've never had a sweet tooth, so I don't miss sugar in the slightest.
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:55 AM   #25
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Darkginger I so agree. Pasta is nothing really. vehicle for sauce just like you said. anyone eat plain pasta? with nothing on it? NO because it stinks and has no flavor I don't miss pasta one bit either.

Dreamfields to me is a real fake. claims alot but I read (and darn I am still trying to remember what site) that most of the 'low carb food claims' are a bunch of hooey.

anything tagged low carb, do your research befoer buying into their claims. most are not real.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:02 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by nolcjunk View Post
That would be hard to confuse for anyone. I didn't cheat while losing weight and now eat off plan in maintenance- nothing confusing there. I said I do not consider them cheating on my plan of maintenance.

Shiritake are just a non food for me because they have no nutrition and perpetuate the need for those foods- that you need pasta with your meal, when really a meat and a vegetable are enough. I do low carb because I don't want to eat bread, pasta, pizza, rice the majority of the time, so why would I replace those foods with imitations?
Wheat and sugar are not part of a low carb woe and eating them even occasionally are cheating even if one says they are in the their personal plan....Shirataki noodles are low carb and therefore on plan and not a cheat and are not imitation food - they are quite real, I assure you.

For anyone who is interested in shirataki noodle, I would just warn that there are 2 varieties and one uses only the yam but the other uses a mix of yam and tofu. The tofu variety is not a good choice as there are issues with this soy product that can be very problematic for those with metabolic issues.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:04 AM   #27
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I had a brownie yesterday and it was awful. I mean it tastes good, but what it does is awful. Its true what they say, its like eating hungry pills. I just wanted another brownie when I ate it, not my beloved bacon and meat (plus after eating carbs you are afraid to eat on-plan foods since not the fat will stick)

Also I ate my normal 120g of fat yesterday so the brownie made me panic, thinking all that fat is going to be stored now ):<

I never cheat with pastas and rice and potatoes or anything like that, because it feels wierd in my mouth anymore. Tastes funny too. So basically just attracted to chocolate things off plan. But I am glad that there are good AS chocolates for that. It is just tough during the holidays when family blesses your home with homemade goodies and its to many for you to feed your kids. But IMO its almost over and I havent gained.

I want to be a never cheater someday, but I am only 10 months in, maybe after I survive my first holidays I will be a never cheater! XD
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:38 AM   #28
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I think there's some confusion here among those of us who are eating in maintenance and those still working on weight loss.

"Low carb" isn't only Atkins, and I have had holiday meals that included a dessert [sugar!], and yet my total carbs for the day were only about 60g--which is low-carb by almost all definitions. I don't consider that a 'cheat,' and I don't appreciate anyone else deciding that my WOE involves 'cheating.' That's insulting.

The issue of grains has been brought to the forefront by the Paleo community as well as Dr. Davis's Wheat Belly, and while I don't eat any grains in general, I reserve the right to have a bagel if I want one on occasion, and it's not 'cheating.' It's a choice I've made on one particular day.

My WOE is not a religion, and food is not a moral issue. It's a matter of choices I make daily to preserve my health, which includes maintaining my weight. No one else can decide for me what are correct choices and what aren't.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:45 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Leo41 View Post
I have just finished one of the best books on the subject of weight-management (and I've read quite a few over the years), Beating Overeating by Gillian Riley.

One of the salient points she makes is relevant to this thread--i.e., studies show that one of the greatest barriers to successful weight loss and weight management is perfectionism--that 'all or nothing' approach that insists on total compliance to a specific food plan.

Even Mark Sisson (among others) says that 80% compliance to healthy eating is sufficient for optimum health. So that occasional slice of pizza or home-made pastry is totally consistent with healthy eating--as long as it is very occasional.

Personally, I take my approach from AA and take it one day at a time. I've been maintaining for close to two years with this approach, and it works for me. I would not say 'never' to any specific food. I doubt that I've had a cookie in the past 5 years, but I don't say that I never would eat one.

All the studies show that a sense of excessive restriction or deprivation is the major cause of binge eating.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:49 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Trigger828 View Post
I don't cheat. I don't ''plan'' to cheat either. If I eat a bite of something carby it is because it is on a whim. and it is super rare I do it.

because I know me. I am the true carb addict type. I look at carbs and I gain weight so even a bit of high carby junky food puts weight on me in an instant. I know my limits.
Interesting question!

Iím 11 weeks in and about 7-10lbs from goal. I think in the beginning I probably did see it as something I would be strict with until I got where I wanted to be and then Iíd ease up but realising how badly I craved sugary carbs for the first couple of (painful!) weeks made me see that actually, I donít like how I feel when Iím at the mercy of sugar.

I would previously be completely unable to refuse sweets/cakes/cookies, etc, and I mean genuinely INCAPABLE of being in a room where there was sugar without reaching for it. Since getting past the early cravings I can now sit at a table where there are sugary carbs and I have no interest. I work in an office where endless treats are brought in and left in the kitchen and I am so amazed at myself for being able to totally ignore them when I never thought I could. I think after years of silly diets I finally know myself well enough to know that one bite, one mouthful is all it takes for me to crash and crash hard so yep, for me, this is a lifestyle now.

I did worry that Iíd be feeling anxious about Christmas by now, about all the temptation but Iíve already made my plan. I plan to carry on doing what Iím doing and when everyone else is reaching for huge chunks of cake, I plan to reintroduce some berries into my diet and have those with some cream. I figure that the joy of having berries for the first time in three months (when they used to be a daily thing for me) will be enough! When my family is snacking on chocolate, Iím going prepared with a bag of sugar free Yorkís peppermint patties and I also plan to make some coconut bark.

Iím happiest when Iím not overweight because I feel confident, comfortable in my clothes and in control and, having a history of depression and somewhat disordered eating at times, I feel so much more healthy and stable mentally which for me is actually just as important, if not more, than how I feel/look physically.

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