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Old 12-23-2010, 05:23 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Looweewoo View Post
I was a vegetarian for 35 years. When I added back eggs and dairy I stopped calling myself a vegetarian. Because it would be wrong. But as far as I am concerned others can call themselves anything they want, they don't have to be correct about that. But I do object to them then claiming that they are correct and the correct usage is wrong.
I'm not making a claim about what's correct; I'm making a claim about what most people think the word "vegetarian" means. The claim seemed to be that vegetarians eat nothing but vegetables as per:

"a vegetable as in vegetarian."

I myself was a vegetarian for many years, knew many vegetarians, read a lot of vegetarian books/ccokbooks/magazines, have gone to vegetarian restaurants and I've never before heard the claim that eating eggs or dairy makes one not a vegetarian. I guess one learns something new everyday.

Perhaps millions of Indians who think they are vegetarians and drink cow's milk need to be enlightened. Who knew Mahatma Gandhi felt the need to "stretch[ing] the term so that [he] can feel [he] belong[ed] to the "vegetarian" culture."


But my part in derailing the thread is over. My apologies for it, OP.
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Old 12-23-2010, 05:37 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auntie Em View Post
Wlsrockchick, welcome! Another former vegetarian here.

I enjoy eating hard boiled egg yolks. (I'm allergic to the whites.) I keep a nice supply of hard boiled eggs in the fridge and just peel one or two when I wish.

Sometimes, I keep a small pile of cooked hamburgers in the fridge, too.

I eat celery sticks or raw turnip slices sometimes, when I want clean crunch.


I have found Dr. Kurt Harris' blog, PaleoNu, of immeasurable help, in discovering a healthy way of eating which works well for me. He gives scientific explanations for all his recommendations.

I'm one of those who found that nuts, cheese, and prepared foods, such as sausage, were problematic, and I no longer eat them. For example, nuts, seeds, and grains contain phytic acid, which blocks the absorption of minerals.

Some find artificial sweeteners keep them from losing weight.

Also, foods such as mayonnaise, are high in polyunsaturated fats, which can keep folks from losing weight. Lots of information at Paleo sites on ratios of Omega 3s and 6s, if you are interested.

I believe in eating real food, not packaged/prepared things. Sausages, hot dogs, mayonnaise, sugar-free jello, store-bought jerky and salad dressing are all packaged/prepared things.

Not eating nuts, seeds, or their oils, and leaving out the cheese enable me to lose the last ten pounds.

I wish you all the best in finding what works well for you.

Thank you so much Auntie Em for the good advice, as i think this is the road i need to follow. I will definately look into it.

Staying out of the vegetarian debate, have had it with so many people in the past. Everyone should do whatever they want and call themselves whatever makes them happy.

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Old 12-23-2010, 06:02 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kat819 View Post
Perhaps millions of Indians who think they are vegetarians
Most of those millions probably don't use that word for their diet. They have, IIRC from my three years at the ashram (where I was taught not to eat any animal products), Hindi words for any of their several religious diets (some of which allow animal flesh). If they use "vegetarian" when speaking English, they may be correct, or they may be incorrect, depending on the particular diet they follow.

Many people understand the phrase "low carb diet" to mean a dangerous fad diet which is mostly bacon and whipped cream. If we accede to their belief and use their parlance, would we thereby be correct?
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Old 12-23-2010, 06:22 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Looweewoo View Post
Most of those millions probably don't use that word for their diet. They have, IIRC from my three years at the ashram (where I was taught not to eat any animal products), Hindi words for any of their several religious diets (some of which allow animal flesh). If they use "vegetarian" when speaking English, they may be correct, or they may be incorrect, depending on the particular diet they follow.

Many people understand the phrase "low carb diet" to mean a dangerous fad diet which is mostly bacon and whipped cream. If we accede to their belief and use their parlance, would we thereby be correct?
My reference is to Gandhi's book, The Story of My Experiments with Truth, written in English by himself and not translated into English. Gandhi consumed milk his entire life and considered himself a lifelong vegetarian.

As I said, I've never before met anyone or read anyone who considered that the only true vegetarians were people who eschewed eggs and dairy in my lifetime. One learns something new everyday. Too bad I'm no longer living in Berkeley to go out and enlighten the masses.
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:37 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wlsrockchick View Post
The more i think about it the more i agree, am getting rid of all of the high sodium foods & PB. What is a good clean snack? Would love to hear more of what you all eat for maximum results. Meat is so new to me after all this time, but i love it now and i do feel stronger.

Thanks for all the advice!
W
If you love your meat now and want to lose more quickly, I say 3 squares a day, no dairy, no frankenfood. meat/veggies and fat will get you there.
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:43 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auntie Em View Post
Wlsrockchick, welcome! Another former vegetarian here.

I enjoy eating hard boiled egg yolks. (I'm allergic to the whites.) I keep a nice supply of hard boiled eggs in the fridge and just peel one or two when I wish.

Sometimes, I keep a small pile of cooked hamburgers in the fridge, too.

I eat celery sticks or raw turnip slices sometimes, when I want clean crunch.


I have found Dr. Kurt Harris' blog, PaleoNu, of immeasurable help, in discovering a healthy way of eating which works well for me. He gives scientific explanations for all his recommendations.

I'm one of those who found that nuts, cheese, and prepared foods, such as sausage, were problematic, and I no longer eat them. For example, nuts, seeds, and grains contain phytic acid, which blocks the absorption of minerals.

Some find artificial sweeteners keep them from losing weight.

Also, foods such as mayonnaise, are high in polyunsaturated fats, which can keep folks from losing weight. Lots of information at Paleo sites on ratios of Omega 3s and 6s, if you are interested.

I believe in eating real food, not packaged/prepared things. Sausages, hot dogs, mayonnaise, sugar-free jello, store-bought jerky and salad dressing are all packaged/prepared things.

Not eating nuts, seeds, or their oils, and leaving out the cheese enable me to lose the last ten pounds.

I wish you all the best in finding what works well for you.
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Old 12-23-2010, 08:20 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wlsrockchick View Post
B- Low carb shake made in blender (3 net carbs) & black coffee
S - 3 Turkey dogs
L - some meat or tuna/mayo, maybe some cheese
S - 0 carb beef jerkey & some turkey peperoni
D- big green salad, no toms, assorted meat, turkey bacon, and Waldens blue cheese dressing
S - SF Jellow and 2 tbsp of no sugar peanut butter & a big dollop of sour cream ( i suddenly crave sour cream)

I have a serious red wine addiction and have been having roughly 2 glasses every night....
Hi wlsrockchick,

You're not losing because practically everything on your menu is a problem food. The only things on your menu that don't generally cause problems are tuna, lettuce, and coffee. Everything else has more carbs in it than you think, is a staller, or is way up the rung ladder.

The solution to this is to read DANDR and do a nice clean induction by the book.
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Old 12-24-2010, 05:26 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Looweewoo View Post
<...> A vegetarian had always been a person who because of philosophical or ethical reasons, declines to eat animal products even though knowing that their body is the body of an omnivore. There were a few people who mistakenly thought humans were "herbivores", beings who, by nature, are supposed to live off vegetable products only.<...>
I have vegetarian friends (vegans) who do so for whatever reason they want, I never asked. Their choice is good enough for me.

They never preach nor do I. They know my choice is low carb and they never say anything about that either. We know that we are all simply finicky eaters for our own private reasons. When I go to their house they have low-carb non-meat snacks available and vice versa.

I've have had others proselytize to me and say that humans were not evolved to be carnivores (they meant omnivores) and that we have the digestive system of an herbivore.

I tell them
  1. Mankind has been eating meat long before we were Homo Sapiens. Homo Erectus cooked meat. And stone tools for killing and butchering animals have been around in our ancestors for well over 2 million years. So homo sapens have always eaten meat.
  2. We do not have the digestive system of a herbivore -- Do we have multiple stomachs like a ruminant? Do we eat our feces like a rabbit? Do we have an extra long intestine like a horse?
  3. We have canine and grinding teeth like you would expect for an omnivore

I have no problem with anyone being a vegetarian or a lacto-ovo-omniovre, or whatever else. I do have a problem with misrepresentation whether it is willful or not. So I usually assume it isn't willful but the person telling me the untruth is simply misinformed. So I feel it is kind of me to help them see the light. And when I am misinformed, I appreciate other people returning the favor.

So if you lacto-ovo people want to be correct, call yourself a lacto-ovo-ominvore. If you don't want to be correct, that's OK with me. But at least you are no longer misinformed.

Bob
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Old 12-25-2010, 03:09 AM   #39
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I was a VEGETARIAN for a long time, and I called myself that because I ate honey.

That's it. No dairy, no eggs, no nothing. Honey was my one exception. But, I couldn't refer to myself as a vegan, because the implication there is that all animal products are off the table.

When I was speaking to someone in a situation where it mattered, I opted to use "vegetarian" in order to qualify my choice to eat honey.

It also had to do with lifestyle stuff. Not all products I used at that time were completely "vegan" so again, I opted to use the word vegetarian for the purposes of accuracy until I finally decided to go full on vegan, and dropped the honey, as well as becoming more picky about animal products I used that were NOT eaten (lanolin and beeswax, for example).

I don't see the point of being picky about someone else's self-identification.
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Old 12-25-2010, 07:29 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaSage View Post
I don't see the point of being picky about someone else's self-identification.
I don't either. You can call yourself a hatbox for all I care. But when you start saying that "hatbox" is now the correct term for homosapiens and that "human" now means anything with feet except homosapiens, and that I am wrong to refer to you as a human... then things are going downhill.

Historically, since the invention of the printing press, the main purpose for changing the definition of words has been part of government and commercial propaganda efforts, intentionally distorting and confusing the meanings of words in order to destroy the ability to reason and communicate effectively. That's why the three possible sizes are now "large", "extra-large" and "Grande", someone wants you to not think of their small cup as being small.

We think in words, and if those words are muddled, then our thoughts are muddled.

When we have to make up new words just to be able to accurately refer to something that already had a perfectly good word... well, I can't stop it, but I get to point out that it's happened. I'm just expressing my personal experience and my feelings about my personal experience, if that's still allowed.
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Old 12-25-2010, 08:17 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by Looweewoo View Post
<...> That's why the three possible sizes are now "large", "extra-large" and "Grande", someone wants you to not think of their small cup as being small.<...>
Before being LC I ate a lot of pizzas (after all, my grandparents were all born in Italy and pizza is Italian "soul food"). I was always amused that the smallest size pizza you could order in any pizzeria I ever visited was called "medium".

I did find one place that offered 8" pizzas, and they were called "personal".

Women's dress sizes have inflated so that people can fit in a size that says it it smaller than it really is (women's sizes confuse me anyway). The result is my 115 pound wife has to try to find a size zero.

And the two partners-in-crime, the government and huge corporations are the worst offenders.

I like a Peter O'Toole line from the movie The Last Emperor -- "A gentleman should always mean what he says and he should always say what he means."

Saying you are a vegetarian means you eat no animal products, as an animal cannot be called a vegetable by any stretch of the imagination.

We have a perfectly good word for someone who eats both plant and animal products, "omnivore".

I often wonder why certain omnivores want to be included in the ranks of the vegetarians. Is it to become part of the vegetarian culture? Is it some sort of elitist self-esteem? Is it something else?

I'm just curious. Please tell me.

Bob
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