Need opinions on what's going on with me!

[Somewhat Damaged]

Alright, to lay it all out there: I'm 28, female. Insulin resistant with PCOS, hypothyroid (on natural thyroid), been doing Atkins induction since Dec 1st.

Last April I embarked on a low carb ketogenic diet (about 1600 calories/day) with the goal of going a month, but only made it 18 days. One day I woke up feeling jittery and depressed, anxious, and just out of sorts so I added a moderate level of carbs back in. I fell of the wagon shortly after that and gained back 15 of the 20 lbs I lost that year.

I started Atkins Induction Dec 1st, did fine up until about 5 days ago. My calories are anywhere between 1500 and 2200 on a given day. I am eating real foods like meats, some veggies, sour cream, butter, etc. About 5 days ago I got pretty exhausted, brain foggy (I usually am, but this is more than usual), headachey, shaky, dizzy, feel depressed, I slept for 12 hours last night (usually only can sleep for 7 to 8), and honestly I just feel like I want to cry and go back to bed.

In both cases where this has happened, I've been keeping my carbs low (specifically with the first diet the intention was to cut out grains and sugar which I'm obviously not eating on Induction). And I know that if I were to eat a small portion of carbs it would relieve these symptoms.

So... what do you think? Is this just a really delayed (3 weeks in!) Induction Flu, or is low carb messing with the levels of something important in my body? Specifically, I'm thinking serotonin or thyroid hormone.

Just looking for some opinions or personal experiences. Thanks.

[fireflyfaster]

I know for people with hypothyroid, VLC can sometimes be a problem. I don't think that LC is messing with something important, but I do think it's important that you be sure eating enough overall, and to include ALL the allowable carbs you can for induction (or early OWL, if that's where you are now) --making a lot of them in the form of dark green leafy vegetables.

Your symptoms sound like they could be either induction flu or low blood sugar (especially the shakiness and dizziness), or some kind of yeast die-off reaction.

Most people here have induction flu for a few days up to, at the very outside, a couple of weeks. I had the exact symptoms you're describing for two months, both this time around and years ago when I first LC'ed.

The only thing that would relieve the problem at that time was to eat a large serving of spinach, bok choy, or another leafy green.

I do believe it will pass, and I think it's important to stay on plan so that you can keep moving forward and come out the other side (it did happen, even for me!)

You may also want to check with your doctor to see if you need to adjust your thyroid meds. There are lots of people here very knowledgeable about thyroid, PCOS, etc.

[InspiredBlue]

Are you sure you aren't simply ill? Not everything that happens to us when eating LC is the diets "fault".

[Blood Sugar 101]

It's early on in the diet to be experiencing thyroid slowing. That usually happens, if it happens, many months in.

It's hard to know what the answer is, it might be a good idea to talk to your doctor about taking Metformin which is often prescribed for people with PCOS and will lower your insulin. It's a very safe drug with a long track record and no dangerous side effects. It can be bought as a generic for $5-10 a month. It really helps a lot of us with weight loss.

Then once you have the insulin resistance under better control you can try a more moderate low carb diet, along the lines of South Beach. The metformin will make it MUCH easier to lose weight and manage a slightly higher carb intake. And that might help with your mood.

Eating in a way that makes you depressed is not wise, and throwing psychoactive drugs in to address the depression would make you fatter as SSRIs are known to increase insulin resistance and promote weight gain.

Because you have a complicated health situation DO NOT take advice from people who have normal metabolisms because their experience may not be like yours.

Once you cut back to a South Beach level, BTW, and get used to it, there is nothing to stop you from slowing reducing your carbs more. I hear from many people in the diabetes community who take the "gradually decrease carbs" approach rather than the "Cut out almost all carbs" approach. They do extremely well, stick on the diet long term and lose as much weight, long term as everyone else.

[Leo41]

On our Thyroid board, our resident expert, Nonstickpam, says that we hypos need at least 30g of carbs daily to function well. I believe it's true because when I was much younger (and not hypo), I thrived on VLC, but when I tried that about a year ago to try to break a stall, I got 'unwell' exactly as you describe. I feel best on about 30g of carbs a day, mainly veggies.

You might look into ProteinPower because 30g is the recommendation, and it's a very flexible plan in terms of foods.

[Somewhat Damaged]

fireflyfaster: I was kind of thinking low blood sugar, as well. That's definitely part of what I seem to be feeling... especially the shakiness and headache. I definitely want to stick with LC (due to the IR and PCOS), and I think I'll try the higher leafy greens intake to see if that helps. I have also had the feeling that maybe this is just something I need to 'pass thru' and then I will feel amazing. Thanks!

InspiredBlue: Due to the fact that this has happened to me previously at about the same length of time into the diet, I don't think it's just an illness. Plus I've never had a cold that felt like this before, thankfully!

Blood Sugar 101: I've been on Metformin in the past and it didn't do a whole lot for me in the way of weight loss. In general I am pretty anti-pharmaceutical. I will definitely reconsider the level of carbs I am eating, though, if my current state worsens.

Leo41: Thanks for the info about the level of carbs and PP. I have the book, I'll have to check it out!

[fireflyfaster]

Originally Posted by Somewhat Damaged

I definitely want to stick with LC (due to the IR and PCOS), and I think I'll try the higher leafy greens intake to see if that helps.

I found I had to saute up a mess of 'em in butter or oil -- eating them raw, it was hard to get enough to do the trick. Also the cooking increased their digestibility.

But BS101 makes a good point -- I don't know if my metabolism is normal or not (my thyroid always tests as "low normal" and I don't have money to go outside my HMO for more details) but I don't have the inside scoop on your health issues.

I do have depression and chronic anxiety, though, and both have been helped by keeping my blood sugar low and level through LC. It's a slower recovery for me than the weight loss but no less dramatic.

[ravenrose]

Can you borrow or buy a blood glucose monitor, get some strips, and FIND OUT if it's low blood sugar? That's nothing to fool around with!

If money is an issue, try the Freecycle.org website in your area. There are extra meters and test strips out there and someone might be willing to give you a set.

Good luck!

[Blood Sugar 101]

Originally Posted by Somewhat Damaged

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Blood Sugar 101: I've been on Metformin in the past and it didn't do a whole lot for me in the way of weight loss. In general I am pretty anti-pharmaceutical. I will definitely reconsider the level of carbs I am eating, though, if my current state worsens.

WIth PCOS metformin will only help with weight loss AFTER you cut carbs. But even if it doesn't achieve weight loss it helps counteract the very high insulin levels that accompany metformin. This is important for cardiac health and to prevent further weight GAIN.

Low blood sugar would explain shakiness, but NOT depression of the sort your describe.

[2bflawless]

I am hypothyroid and diabetic. Even after over 6 weeks of T3 I still had zero energy and felt quite ill. I know for most with thyroid problems keeping carbs above 30g is recommended and I certainly tried this. For me however, once I went to VLC I began to feel back to normal, now have lots of energy and most of my hypothyroid symptoms are dormant. I still take my T3 and Metformin but now eating VLC I have actually feel better and have made goal. Just my .02.

E.T.A. I do not count or restrict calories, I do believe that calorie restriction can seriously damage one's thyroid. I believe years of that contributed to my hypothyroidism.

Good luck!

[Somewhat Damaged]

It sounds like this is just going to come down to a personal medical issue.

I made some chicken soup last night with a couple carrots and 1/4 cup of wild rice and had a couple bowls. I felt better after that digested for a little while.

Thanks for your opinions everyone

[dartstar1]

Originally Posted by Somewhat Damaged

Alright, to lay it all out there: I'm 28, female. Insulin resistant with PCOS, hypothyroid (on natural thyroid), been doing Atkins induction since Dec 1st.

Last April I embarked on a low carb ketogenic diet (about 1600 calories/day) with the goal of going a month, but only made it 18 days. One day I woke up feeling jittery and depressed, anxious, and just out of sorts so I added a moderate level of carbs back in. I fell of the wagon shortly after that and gained back 15 of the 20 lbs I lost that year.

I started Atkins Induction Dec 1st, did fine up until about 5 days ago. My calories are anywhere between 1500 and 2200 on a given day. I am eating real foods like meats, some veggies, sour cream, butter, etc. About 5 days ago I got pretty exhausted, brain foggy (I usually am, but this is more than usual), headachey, shaky, dizzy, feel depressed, I slept for 12 hours last night (usually only can sleep for 7 to 8), and honestly I just feel like I want to cry and go back to bed.

In both cases where this has happened, I've been keeping my carbs low (specifically with the first diet the intention was to cut out grains and sugar which I'm obviously not eating on Induction). And I know that if I were to eat a small portion of carbs it would relieve these symptoms.

So... what do you think? Is this just a really delayed (3 weeks in!) Induction Flu, or is low carb messing with the levels of something important in my body? Specifically, I'm thinking serotonin or thyroid hormone.

Just looking for some opinions or personal experiences. Thanks.

If you can get copies of all your lab tests I know that the Atkins clinc USE to consult on these matters and it wasn't too costly THEY are the experts

[Blood Sugar 101]

Originally Posted by dartstar1

If you can get copies of all your lab tests I know that the Atkins clinc USE to consult on these matters and it wasn't too costly THEY are the experts

Whatever value the Atkins clinic might have had--and because they never published ANY of their cases or studies based on them, it is impossible to know what their results were--since Atkins' death his empire has been taken over by profit hungry abuses (eg Atkins Nutritionals) who have badly misused his name.

The clinic doing decent work on the Low Carb diet and publishing its research is at Duke University. But it is very expensive.

[dartstar1]

I only remember Jackie E from Atkins and she was the nurse who consulted with a very nice lady here BC from Idaho (2000) and that was the first time we all learned how the yeast affected people)
I just feel that Somewhat Damaged need to talk with a health professional an eho at least believes and know the Atkins way of Life or understands at low carb