Where does excess fat go?

[metqa]

[Threadjack]
Sashimi, don't worry 'bout the hair, you're still hot. (don't tell BF I said so)
but I miss the bacon (Oh! that did NOT sound right . . .)
You know what I mean!! ([COLOR="Green"]I'm gonna get banished[/COLOR] )

[end Threadjack]

I'm gonna go cream some almond butter and whip up some bacon butter tomorrow! (ooooh I sound so mean )

[SashimiMark]

Thanks metqa.

I can't wait to get to TJ's tomorrow so I can buy some almonds so I can make me some yummy milk. I ran out 2 days ago!

[ab1ht]

Thanks, Purple. That was a good review.

So does LC help kids with epilepsy? Do you have one of these kids?

[retroworx]

(OT)

Hey, Mark:

Did you see that you've been nominated?

Pork Diplomat

[SashimiMark]

You nut.

[MarblesLongGone]

Originally Posted by Prozak

....I am considering a rendezvous with Dr. M. Eades as well... ..

Get hooked on his blog, he's funny!

[Margot 65]

Originally Posted by ab1ht

Thanks, Purple. That was a good review.

So does LC help kids with epilepsy? Do you have one of these kids?

Actually, i found this out by accident:

If you google 'low carb high fat diet' you will find tons of links and recent articles about how these diets are being shown to help kids with epilepsy.

Awesome stuff, and it REALLY makes me wonder why this diet can be considered so good for some, but terrible for the rest of us.

[Margot 65]

Originally Posted by MarblesLongGone

Get hooked on his blog, he's funny!

I was just there the other day, he is!

Sounds like a cool guy, he should post here I think he would fit in

[KajunDC]

Originally Posted by ab1ht

OK, so now I got that question answered, here's another one...

Q: So if I eat plenty of fat and there are lots of ketones in my blood ready to be used for energy, why would my body use the STORED fat? This would imply that I SHOULD be counting fat calories, which I know is not correct.

If you have dietary fat, your body will use that first before stored body fat.

Calories do count. This WOE works because it satisfies and keeps peole from gorging on too many calories, which is what the carb cravings of excess sugar causes to happen... it make you eat more and more calories.

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by ab1ht

Thanks, Purple. That was a good review.

So does LC help kids with epilepsy? Do you have one of these kids?

Google ketogenic diet-its been used for years for treatment for epileptics. You might want to read Lyle McDonalds "The Ketogenic Diet" a lot of your questions are answered in his book.

[ab1ht]

Originally Posted by lisabinil

Google ketogenic diet-its been used for years for treatment for epileptics. You might want to read Lyle McDonalds "The Ketogenic Diet" a lot of your questions are answered in his book.

I just requested it from the library. Thanks.

[metqa]

I'm not looking at a book, but I'm just gonna toss this out there

Um, because carbs are so quickly swept away, you can get hungry again soon after eating till full.

Fat, We have receptors that limit fat intake to a certain amount, causing nausea if you choose ignore it's influence. So I think we could eat a meal with fat and feel satiated without a big calorie intake, and feel satiated longer. If this is the case, you will feel fuller sooner, but not take in as many calories overall cause you will feel fuller longer. Since your body is burning fat, when it runs out of dietary fat, it is no biggie to just get some more from the body to keep burning so even though you have finished digesting your last meal, you still don't feel hungry cause your body just got a little extra from your body to keep things running till your next meal comes along.

So if you eat 'TOO MUCH FAT" your body will not have a need to use body fat. It would flow into the intestines where it is mixed with bile for absorbtion, but not all of it will be digested and absorbed, so some will be excreted as oily poo. You haven't benefited yourself at all in that case. Of course whatever is being oxidized will be excreted as ketones from the breath, skin and urine, but that is not extra fat, that is the fat that is being burned as everyday fuel.

Can you gain weight eating fat without carbohydrates, I dunno, but you definately can't lose weight if there is no energy deficit. even with fat. there must be less dietary fat than the body actually needs so that it will use the body fat to make up the deficit.

I think like this. They say to reduce your calories to say 1500, but your body still wants 2000 worth of calories, so you give it 1500 of fat, protein and carbs, and your body should burn body fat to make up the last 500 it needs to keep up your daily life. Of course I'm talking about benefiting from a lipolytic metabolism and not just calorie reduction. This makes sense to me. . .

Sorry no support for these ideas but it's out there somewhere, I'm tired of looking at books for awhile, I'm just going from memory and theory

[MarblesLongGone]

Re: Eades. Look up his book review thing. someone did a critique of Protein Power, and gave the book 4 stars, 'cause her husband went off of the diet and gained weight!

Originally Posted by Prozak

I was just there the other day, he is!

Sounds like a cool guy, he should post here I think he would fit in

Originally Posted by KajunDC

If you have dietary fat, your body will use that first before stored body fat.

Calories do count. This WOE works because it satisfies and keeps peole from gorging on too many calories, which is what the carb cravings of excess sugar causes to happen... it make you eat more and more calories.

That is NOT entirely how it works. It has been shown in study after study that people can eat more calories on LC than on LF. The difference is INSULIN! Fat does not trigger an insulin reaction, carbs do. Protein can cause a slight rise in insulin. Insulin is the saving hormone, it encourages the depositing of fat on the body. Glycogen is the spending hormone, it is required to burn stored fat. Insulin is the stronger of the two hormones, for survival purposes.

Originally Posted by ab1ht

So does LC help kids with epilepsy? Do you have one of these kids?

Essential fats are required for good nerve function. Anyone with a disease that involves the nervous system should look at the spectrum of the fats that they consume!

[Margot 65]

Dr Eades' blog is great, I just found this tidbit here:

The satiety center, located in the hypothalamus, is the part of the brain that tells us when we’re full. Unfortunately, it runs about 20-30 minutes behind our actual eating pattern, so we can stuff food in for a good while before our brains tell us we’ve had enough. Fortunately, it works a little more quickly [COLOR="Red"](thanks to the help of cholecystokinin and some other gut hormones)[/COLOR] when we eat primarily fat.

Well, I think the chances are pretty good that some people here are deficient or compromised in this hormone. So that could explain why they can overeat fat (when I can't come even close).

[MarblesLongGone]

I like that Dr E will happily discuss the other LC authors in a friendly, not competitive way. though his teachings are not 100% Atkins compatible, nor the reverse, I think that he recognizes that BOTH of them were on the same side in thinking that INSULIN is our modern health enemy!

[NancyH58]

Originally Posted by ab1ht

Yes, we do. But what happens to the fat we eat that DOESN'T get used as fuel?

That's really my question.

Uncoupling proteins (UP).
Fatty acids increase activity of UP. UP controls "non shivering thermogenesis" which is a fancy way of saying "if you have a ton of fatty acids in your blood, and insufficient insulin to store them as fat, and your mitochondria are already full of energy, then your body turns the extra energy into heat and it floats off of you like radiation".

This is the "metabolic advantage" in a nutshell.

However, most of what we eat is used for energy. The metabolic advantage is at best a couple hudnred cal (a major bonus but not enough to really explain how much more we can eat and still lose).
The reason it seems like the metabolic advantage is so great is because a high carb diet slows our metabolism if we are glucose intolerant. A high insulin level in a person with poor muscle glucose tolerance will artificially depress energy. The cells are starving without enough fuel getting in to them, which in turn slows metabolic rate making us feel crap and causing us to maintain on low cals. Runing on fatty acids will circumvent glucose intolerance of muscle, giving us much more energy and making it appear as if we are "wasting" calories. In reality, what is going on is our metabolic rate is much more close to normal than it is on a glucose diet.


The "metabolic advantage " is a bit of a misnomer. It is more appropriate to say eating carbs for glucose intolerant people is a "metabolic DISadvantage".

[Purple Crayon]

Originally Posted by ab1ht

Thanks, Purple. That was a good review.

So does LC help kids with epilepsy? Do you have one of these kids?

From what I read, it sounds like LC is good for epilepsy.
And no, my kid is a furbaby.

I was looking up ketogenic diet to see if it was a LC diet because a friend's child has recently been diagnosed with a rare form of brain damage. He has seizures and the neurologist has recommended a ketogenic diet to help control them.

My question is, how do you make a ketogenic diet a weight-gain diet?
If I wanted to gain weight I'd go high-carb, high fat. How does one put on weight with low-carb, high fat?

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by Purple Crayon

From what I read, it sounds like LC is good for epilepsy.
And no, my kid is a furbaby.

I was looking up ketogenic diet to see if it was a LC diet because a friend's child has recently been diagnosed with a rare form of brain damage. He has seizures and the neurologist has recommended a ketogenic diet to help control them.

My question is, how do you make a ketogenic diet a weight-gain diet?
If I wanted to gain weight I'd go high-carb, high fat. How does one put on weight with low-carb, high fat?

Ingest enough calories and you will gain-it works that way for some of us.

[jenna...]

Originally Posted by oobladee

This is where many die-hard Atkins and I split ways. There is a tipping point where when you eat more calories than your body needs, whether fat, protein or carb your body stores it as fat. Calories still count.

Period.

I agree.... I count calories but stay low carb, plenty of fat and protein.

[MarblesLongGone]

Originally Posted by Purple Crayon

From what I read, it sounds like LC is good for epilepsy.
And no, my kid is a furbaby.

I was looking up ketogenic diet to see if it was a LC diet because a friend's child has recently been diagnosed with a rare form of brain damage. He has seizures and the neurologist has recommended a ketogenic diet to help control them.

My question is, how do you make a ketogenic diet a weight-gain diet?
If I wanted to gain weight I'd go high-carb, high fat. How does one put on weight with low-carb, high fat?

Change the fat to protein ratio. I LOSE best at 75% or higher of my calories coming from fat. Drop the fat some, and raise the protein.

[MarblesLongGone]

And, he's trying for GROWING GAINS, not pack on some flab gains. Adequate protein and fat intake allows you to grow and repair tissues as need be!

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by 3bees~1flower

so how are you upping you fat WITHOUT upping your protein? this is something i have wondered for a long time. could you give a days example of how you would eat?

thanks so much!

Hi 3Bees,

I eat a lot of butter, heavy whipping cream (which i get from whole foods, and the ONLY ingredients are heavy whipping cream, no carrageenan or milk solids). i have a recipe for baked cream, which is basically 6 egg yolks + 2 cups heavy cream + davincis (1/4 cup) baked at 325 for 1 hour. i eat salad with dressing, and just really cut down my meat...ill have like 1 or 2 oz with butter. im experimenting with coconut and butter bark. a few days ago i ate close to 3,000 calories and i did not gain a lb. im going to cut out my diet dr pepper consumtion as well. i do drink coffee, and ill have a couple tbspn of heavy cream in that. if im low on fat, ill whip up 1/3 cup heavy whipping cream with some davincis and cinnamon and eat that.

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by 3bees~1flower

that's just it...adding an extra T of butter to my meal doesn't have enought "bulk" to make my stomach full...kwim?

then you need to eat more....excess fat without carbohydrates WILL NOT MAKE YOU FAT. it just can't. you might not lose weight super duper fast, but even if you eat 5,000 calories of butter (which would be super hard, i find that usually after 2,000 cals i honestly can not eat anymoe) it won't be stored. what will happen? you will have a bunch of energy and you will get super hot. for me, i used to go to bed around 9 and now i go to bed closer to midnight, im up puttering around, and i get up early. im also SUPER HOT. i figure skate, and now i need to wear TANK TOPS when before i wore sweatshirt and gloves because i get TOO SWEATY now that im upping my fat. don't worry about calories, eat util you are full. i average close to 2,000 cals a day, somtimes 2,500, sometimes 1700.

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by Start

LOL i got it.. I think lol

Can you please tell me waht you eat? because most meat contains more protein than fat... I always try to eat more fat grams than protein grams but my protein is pretty high up there almost as much as fat and sometimes can be more than the fat.. in any event... I'm wondering if I should be more concerned with the percentage of fat from calories which is always like 60-70+% of total calories...

hi,
i answered what i eat in a previous post. i don't base my diet on meat anymore, i base it around fat. my favorite "meals" are the baked cream i described, or just a whippin up 1/3 to 1/2 cup of heavy whipping cream. i have 1 or 2 oz of meat WITH my butter rather than 1 or 2 tbspn of butter WITH my meat. i limit my protein to 60 g per day, up to 90 if i am heavily excersing , but i really prefer to keep it no higher than 80 g. excess fat will not be stored, and i can go into more of the gory details if anyone wants, ive got my super duper detailed biochemistry text right here (voet and voet if any1 is interested). keep your fat up and your protein moderate. i never worry about fat anymore.

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by Bluegenes

You'd think someone with a biochem. degree would be bright enough to know that the first letter of each sentence should be a capital letter?

thats ok, this isnt english, and i don't see how that's at all relevant to anything?

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by metqa

You would think that someone frequenting boards called Low Carb "Friends" would be tactful enough not to be so petty. Please, If you have something to share on topic with the OP, DO SHARE! At least this person has something of value to add to the issue at hand. What information do you have to enlighten our minds on the topic? Please, add some value . . .

thanks!

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by magic maker

Dude. Paul specified: Little words, lots of pictures...

sorry, i tried to be as "exact" as i could, rather than speak in generalizations.

[3bees~1flower]

Originally Posted by Polymerase

Hi 3Bees,

I eat a lot of butter, heavy whipping cream (which i get from whole foods, and the ONLY ingredients are heavy whipping cream, no carrageenan or milk solids). i have a recipe for baked cream, which is basically 6 egg yolks + 2 cups heavy cream + davincis (1/4 cup) baked at 325 for 1 hour. i eat salad with dressing, and just really cut down my meat...ill have like 1 or 2 oz with butter. im experimenting with coconut and butter bark. a few days ago i ate close to 3,000 calories and i did not gain a lb. im going to cut out my diet dr pepper consumtion as well. i do drink coffee, and ill have a couple tbspn of heavy cream in that. if im low on fat, ill whip up 1/3 cup heavy whipping cream with some davincis and cinnamon and eat that.

THANK YOU! i appreciate you taking time to answer my questions...i think i may try the baked cream...sounds interesting! is this some you use as a meal or a dessert, or...? i just wish i could find what helps me lose at a consistent rate...it just seems sooooo slow right now and i still have 20lbs to my goal...is 20lbs considered "close to goal" and therefore will take longer? just curious as to what amount is considered "close to goal"?

[Polymerase]

Originally Posted by 3bees~1flower

THANK YOU! i appreciate you taking time to answer my questions...i think i may try the baked cream...sounds interesting! is this some you use as a meal or a dessert, or...? i just wish i could find what helps me lose at a consistent rate...it just seems sooooo slow right now and i still have 20lbs to my goal...is 20lbs considered "close to goal" and therefore will take longer? just curious as to what amount is considered "close to goal"?

the baked cream is great! i also add cinnamon to it. i have used it as a meal (lunch) in and of itself if i am particularly high in protein for the day (like i want to eat some more meat with dinner). today i had a salad for lunch and had some of the baked cream with it cause i was still "hungry".

i don't really know what is or isn't close to goal...so i can't help you there, but congrats on your weightloss so far!

[3bees~1flower]

thanks, again, polymerase! i appreciate your time.