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Old 06-20-2013, 05:38 PM   #721
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Oh, I see what you mean, Danielle. And in my opinion, fwiw, what your DD "had no business knowing" was YOUR call and DH's - not theirs. She's your kid!

As for kids having a chance to have a relationship with people before they pass away...I'm torn. I truly don't know how I feel about that.

I am the bad guy in our family because I got a restraining order on Gavin's dad after literally years of trying to compensate for his crazy/dangerous/bullying behavior and protect Gavin as best I could while keeping his dad in his life. My mother and older brother are my ex's BFFs, and the three of them love to get together and gossip about what a horrible person I am. So, I don't know. Should I subject my learning-disabled son to that, just so he can have a relationship with his manipulative, self-absorbed grandmother before she dies? Gavin loves her. Gavin loves his daddy. I'm the ogre that is standing between my poor little boy and his loved ones, and why? Because I like to prove points at other people's expense, because I think I'm better than they are, and because I am just hard to get along with.

They are not even on the same planet with taking responsibility for their behavior, so any relationship between Gavin and the Dark Triad (x, my brother, and my mother) is definitely going to include nasty talk and lies about me because I stood up to them and also defended Gavin from them.

I don't know what's right here. I guess this is weighing on my mind today, thanks for listening.

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Old 06-20-2013, 06:30 PM   #722
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Damn, you guys! What nightmarish families! I'm starting to think a little incest isn't the end of the world. Ugh. Not really, but on a somewhat serious note my life and negotiating the waters of family is easier than yours and I really feel for you guys. My dad is gone (hallelujah) so it's just my mom's denial and she's spineless (likely the entire problem in the first place!) so she goes with the flow and is an awesome grandma. I have a hard time dealing with her, but the boys love her and she adores them. It works. I guess.
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Old 06-20-2013, 06:46 PM   #723
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Yeah, kinda thought that too Lynne, regarding what I choose to tell my kids and all.. .... and the reason (I think, anyways..) they go on and on about that, is because the stuff she "knows" is showing their bad behavior and she has called them all on it.. and then they get flustered with her and just whine over & over again, "your mother tells you entirely too much..you shouldn't even be concerning yourself with knowing this stuff"... uh huh, whatever!! Part of our therapy was learning to communicate with our children and learning how to NOT keep secrets any longer..especially given the fact that our kids are NOT little!! This one lil aspect no one seems to remember..they speak of my kids as if they're toddlers..! After the *showdown* went down, there was a time where DD16 had wanted to go visit over summer break.. we had to draft a letter to the entire family stipulating our boundaries and what they would NOT discuss with DD. It was per our therapists suggestion to do it and I believe it really stunned my parents.. About a year later my one sister took it upon herself to message me something ridiculous on new year's eve and had the audacity to get offended because I told her to knock it off and not contact again..then the text and FB drama happened w/ the girls about me..that came up, it turned into a HUGE fight between myself, my sister, and my DH.. it ended up him telling my sister not to make contact w/ any of our kids under 18.. ... I'm sure this is the "excuse" they're all making in regards as to why NO ONE has even made an effort to talk to her about her grandpa.. disgusting. I truly truly feel for you, none of this is easy especially when we're trying to protect our kids
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Old 06-21-2013, 12:34 AM   #724
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I'm only just catching up on all this.
Hell Dani looks like you've got a serious emotional roller coaster to contend with, IMHO families are a pain in the ass! I only really have my Mum and my 84 yo old Gran, the rest of my relatives are on my Dad's side and since he moved 'across the pond' and left my Mum in one heck of a financial black hole I've hardly heard from any of them... I hardly even speak to him and I was always 'Daddy's girl!'

Well... I've lost another 0.8 lbs so that's 4.4 lbs since Monday :-)

As we're now past 20th June.... what's the next challenge called? I think I've missed it????? xx
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:36 AM   #725
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just don't get it..I mean, I think about my kids and that scenario and it makes me cry every time because there would be no way in hell that I'd EVER have that sort of relationship with them
That is what makes you completely DIFFERENT!
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:44 AM   #726
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Thank you, Tami I seriously feel as if I'm losing my mind with all this crap. I guess my thought process is that she's young and she's taken offense to how I've been treated..and while I appreciate all that, I truly do, none of this has to do with her, and I don't want her later coming to realize this and regret not getting that time. And I'd be lying if I said that I don't get twitchy that my other 2 are "ok" with everything and can have whatever conversations with them.
Family, you don't pick them, that is FOR SURE!

Stand by her. Don't stand in front of her and don't push her or the other 2. It's a difficult situation that I think you are handling WAY better than I would. My Hat's off to you girl!
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:47 AM   #727
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OH and DEATH brings out the absolute worst in people. The words, the money, it all makes me sick!
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:52 AM   #728
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I am very fortunate. I have a great family. Not sure why I was always FAT!

That being said, I weighed in today to finish up this challenge. I'm up 2 from my signature weight but at 169, I met the goal of this challenge. FIRST TIME EVER!
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:53 AM   #729
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OK, START for me using last weeks weight and goal for 06/21, right???

START 173

GOAL 169
Not very impressive as it was only 4 pounds, but it's 4 gone!
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Old 06-21-2013, 06:04 AM   #730
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4 pounds is 4 pounds - at least it's going in the right direction!
I started the challenge at 193
I then got up to my highest of 195 on Monday (06/17)
Today back at 189 so I'm the same as you 4lbs... x
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Old 06-21-2013, 06:05 AM   #731
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You are so right! 4 pounds down is better than 4 pounds up! Thanks girl
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Old 06-21-2013, 07:51 AM   #732
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WooHoo Monica!!! Great job meeting your goal! 4 more pounds GONE baby!

I was at 189 this morning, so 5 pounds gone (over & over again) for me. Didn't make goal... guess I know what goal for the next challenge will be. I swear I used to lose faster! lol

Sooo, brainstorming for a new challenge name. Do we want it to get back to the fighting spirit of old challenges or just any generic fall type name?
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:13 AM   #733
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Same here Tami... 2 pounds gone, 3 gained back and forth constantly.

Had a bit of a 'fall' off plan today and now paying the price with crippling stomach pains
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:30 AM   #734
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Oh no, Gina Hope you feel better soon!
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:40 AM   #735
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It's my own bloody fault, full day at work and didn't bring lunch (cleaning up cat poop took longer than expected this morning!) had a sandwich and crisps then boss bought me a chocolate eclair then biscuits with a cup of tea...
Far far away from the good healthy Dukan diet I am supposed to be following..
Far far away from Gluten Free which seems to work for me :-(
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:56 AM   #736
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I have a feeling I would have succumbed to the chocolate eclair, too. Yum. Still, sorry you're suffering, though. Not fun at all, especially at work.
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Old 06-21-2013, 09:46 AM   #737
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Damn, you guys! What nightmarish families! I'm starting to think a little incest isn't the end of the world. Ugh. Not really, but on a somewhat serious note my life and negotiating the waters of family is easier than yours and I really feel for you guys. My dad is gone (hallelujah) so it's just my mom's denial and she's spineless (likely the entire problem in the first place!) so she goes with the flow and is an awesome grandma. I have a hard time dealing with her, but the boys love her and she adores them. It works. I guess.
Oy, Tami. Yours is over, thank goodness. I guess there was nobody else in the family to try to fight to keep things secret?

No idea on the challenge name so far. Thinking...

Danielle, again. At least you get to live with YOU and not THEM.

Monica, for the successful challenge!! It was your turn!!

Gina, I'll join you in an eclair too. Sorry about the suffering though. on the 4.4 lbs!!

That's awful that your dad left your mom in such a financial pickle and the rest of the family sort of abandoned her (and you), too. Fellow Oregonian or not - that's not cute.

Sometimes I think that family is a study in human weakness and an exercise in forgiveness. I just want to just SLAP people sometimes. Is that bad?

Me... I gained weight this challenge. The next one I WILL do better.

I'm off to meet the day. Miles to go before I sleep and all that.

Happy Friday!!

Lynne
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Old 06-21-2013, 10:51 AM   #738
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Thanks for listening to my whining, girls. Guess I needed someone other than poor DH to do it with Poor guy.

Lynne~ you're right, at least I only live with me I sleep just fine at night..I know I have made the right decisions when it comes to all of this..very hard to not feel guilty tho' when you've been taught to take whatever gets dished out all in the name of family..KWIM? I had to go to therapy to learn that "intact" families are the minority and that my situation is actually quite normal. I guess I get overwhelmed with it all..ie; my past, etc.. because me putting my foot down should've have happened years and years ago.. well, it wasn't until I was in the midst of the hardest experiences of my life (an ugly seperation from DH and impending divorce) did I find my strength and it carried over into every aspect of my life..there's no turning back now.

Don't worry, you are not alone in the "gain" category..I gained too Very ashamed of myself!

Tami~ no hon, I would endure what I did a million times over if it meant you never having to endure yours.. that's really a tough thing to hear and makes me sad 189 is brilliant, so proud of you!

Monica~ 4 pounds is amazing..you don't have much left to lose so be VERY proud for every pound you've lost!!!

Gina~ good lord woman, I'd have eaten the ecclair too I'm afraid to admit I'm so sorry for your tummy troubles, that's no bueno. I hope you feel better soon, love!
-----------------

Lost 2.2 in 4 days.. I'm ok with that

UD today. Going to dinner tonight and possibly a movie--it's been so long since we've been I'm actually kinda excited

DD16 was talking last night as if she was going to CA. ... I think she liked the idea I put before her that she wouldn't be subjected to days with these people, but rather, minutes, if that's all she was interested in. Told her that her dad and I would go grab a bite to eat or something while she visited and she could call when she was done and we'd head back home & leave the others.. Well, now it's more than likely that DS won't be able to make it, he's already HAS to take 2 weeks off from work because his new apt won't be ready and he's gotta be outta the old one.. this is a new job but they were understanding.. however, right now he's in the middle of training at another bank so I dunno??? DD18 mentioned last night that her boss is having kinda a hissy about her taking more time off too (she took 3 weeks off alittle while back to go to CA)..so she may not get to go. Go figure, huh?
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Old 06-21-2013, 11:26 AM   #739
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WHAT are you going to go see Danielle?????

Isn't it funny how things WITHOUT you doing anything start turning around? Divine intervention?

I'm up for whatever name. I love you girls and will FOLLOW you anywhere!
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Old 06-21-2013, 11:29 AM   #740
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DS weighed in today..200.4, DARN IT, oh so close. He only weighs about once a week AT BEST! From his highest, that's 30 pounds gone!
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Old 06-21-2013, 11:46 AM   #741
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Monica, we'll probably see either This is The End, or The Bling Ring For some reason dh doesn't wanna see Now You See Me. Thought about World War Z..but meh, I dunno I can't decide..

Divine intervention is right..so weird. I won't set my sights on anything yet, things change on a dime around here

Such exciting news about your DS!!! Man, to have that kind of metabolism!!!!
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Old 06-21-2013, 07:14 PM   #742
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Oy, Tami. Yours is over, thank goodness. I guess there was nobody else in the family to try to fight to keep things secret?
Like most kids, I didn't tell anyone until I was an adult. It had happened for as long as I can remember until I was 15 or so when I stabbed him in the shoulder with a partially chewed & sharp dog bone. lol. Talk about empowering. Really, though, you just grow up thinking it's normal for so long and by the time you know better you're ashamed and all of that. He was still alive when I told my mom. I was out of the house, but she stayed with him and continued living with him until he died several years later. I don't know about you, but there's no way I could live with someone who molested my kids! I'd have a hard time leaving him alive and intact So giving her the benefit of doubt that she never knew anything, never suspected anything, etc. her still staying with him after she knew what he had done cost her a ton of respect in my eyes. She doesn't seem to get it and I don't really care at this point. Cold hearted b? Sometimes, but not usually

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Tami~ no hon, I would endure what I did a million times over if it meant you never having to endure yours.. that's really a tough thing to hear and makes me sad
Aw, thank you sweetie. You made me all teary eyed & stuff I really am about as over it as one could be I think. I struggled for years wondering how he had treated my sister, our girlfriends, etc. Come to find out he did mess with my sister, but I took the brunt of it and I'm glad for that. Talking about it really is pretty therapeutic and I found out that once I started just accepting it as part of my life that I'm really not ashamed of (why would I be?) it lost all power over me... or at least most of the power is gone. The only thing that haunts me a bit is that I do mention it on occasion (it's obviously a real downer so I try not to do that often ) and I worry that people will think I would do the same to my kids or theirs. Wouldn't in a million years, kids & dogs are my life, but the statistics are out there to support that thought. I can't do anything about that either, though. It just is what it is.

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189 is brilliant, so proud of you!
Thanks, hon. I'm not thrilled, but am pleased overall

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DS weighed in today..200.4, DARN IT, oh so close. He only weighs about once a week AT BEST! From his highest, that's 30 pounds gone!
WooHoo! Go kiddo! I'm sooo happy for him, Monica and I know you're just thrilled! Love it!
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:28 PM   #743
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Tami, all I can say is I'm so sorry !!! Adults suck!!!
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:51 PM   #744
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Tami, all I can say is I'm so sorry !!! Adults suck!!!
Thank you... I'm definitely not a very trusting person and I'm sure that has something to do with why I've always been drawn to young, innocent, non-judgmental, non-threatening beings aka munchkins & puppies
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Old 06-22-2013, 08:11 AM   #745
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Tami, all I can say is I'm so sorry !!! Adults suck!!!
Amen to that, sister.

Quote:
The only thing that haunts me a bit is that I do mention it on occasion (it's obviously a real downer so I try not to do that often ) and I worry that people will think I would do the same to my kids or theirs.
Tami, this is a good point (though I thought most perps were male...?). The point being: when you tell people the truth, it often comes with unintended (and unjust!) consequences - as if having been a victim of something means you're to blame or contagious somehow!

I noticed this when Gavin was hospitalized a few years ago - that people's "friends" have a tendency to go missing when life becomes a "real downer" that can't be hidden. (It wasn't just our friends - it happened to everyone with a sick child.) On the other hand, I remember that there are also new friends that pop up out of the woodwork when life becomes a "real downer". That's good for me to remember right now because we're (me and Gavin) going through one of those periods where our "friends" are heading for the hills.

The best part about being *us* is that we get to be the good kind of friend - the sort that doesn't run screaming when things get too "real". And that capacity takes more than good intentions; it takes huevos. (Espanol for Danielle )

So to make a long ramble short...I'm glad to have you friends with huevos during this excessively "real" period of my life.

No idea on the new challenge yet, sorry. Anyone?

Lynne
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Old 06-22-2013, 09:07 AM   #746
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Tami~ I can totally relate to the empowerment feelings.. I think once I learned this (only took me 40 years! ) and realized that I don't *have* to do anything that I don't want to and quit letting my past bleed into my future as excuses as to why I couldn't ever stand up to my parents..there was no going back.The way my mother treated me my entire life are the effects of much of what she feels about herself..and I had to learn how to not carry that burden anymore! Placing ALL the blame and insecurity, and all the injustice back onto their doorstep and walking away was the most freeing thing I've ever experienced. Perhaps this is why they think I am so cold and unfeeling--2 things that my sister has stated in one of her rants previously.. Whatever, I don't care anymore. ...and I most absolutely agree, I don't think I'd have left dear ol' dad intact any more than you would have!

Lynne~ Oh yeah, I lost so many people in my life by the choices I made in deciding to heal and save my marriage.. the hardest road I've ever walked and something I was sure I would have a super hard time with after everyone abandoned me. Only made me that much stronger and the lessons I have learned along the way have helped in so many other ways! .....yup....huevos... I like it!
------------

Went out with the hubbs last night. Dinner & a movie.. kinda a higher UD than I planned but it all worked out ok.. today I'll probably keep it lower than usual for a DD to try and counter some of the cals from yesterday.. altho', taking DD16 to see Monster's University today... popcorn... .... AGAIN!!!
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Old 06-22-2013, 10:18 AM   #747
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Tami, this is a good point (though I thought most perps were male...?). The point being: when you tell people the truth, it often comes with unintended (and unjust!) consequences - as if having been a victim of something means you're to blame or contagious somehow!
I'm sure most perps are male and I have no clue if anyone ever thought this about me or not, but from the time I learned of those stats it's something that always just bugged me and made me wonder. I would think if anything I'm more caring and more protective over little ones.

It really sucks that people do indeed disappear when you're struggling. I don't know if it's self preservation on their part? Maybe they really just can't handle it? I dunno. It sucks, whatever the reason. I'm glad you do have friends with huevos who are sticking by you now! Though it's a down day and I keep reading huevos as huevos rancheros and it's making me hungry! lol

Danielle, I'm so over the cold and unfeeling bit... if I am cold and unfeeling, which I certainly am at times, all I can do is point those fingers back at them and scratch my head... geez, wonder what on earth made me that way? My dad abused all of us mentally and physically the entire time we were growing up as well and my mom was a blubbering mess, so I was the one to call 911 when he left with his gun saying he was going to commit suicide for example. Mom and sis bawling & begging. Me picking up the phone and saying that he better not hurt anyone else on his way out. My mom uses the word strong to describe me and thankfully has the sense to not say 'cold' even if that's what she's thinking half the time I'm not perfect and I just don't care anymore, unless it affects my relationship with hubby. I do have to be careful with that. He had a horrible childhood as well, so we're pretty forgiving with each other when one of us responds viscerally to something that triggers emotions from the past. I've been accused of treating him like my dad and he's been accused of treating me like his step mom. I don't think either of us do it intentionally and it's something we both work on, but I don't think it can be totally avoided either.

Sooo, new challenge name...
Fighting 'til Fall
Fumbling into Fall
Fighting the Fat Fall Challenge
Flinging the Fat Fall Challenge
Fall into Fitness
Fall into Skinny Jeans
Fall... blah blah blah... I'm brain dead... keep brainstorming, please. I don't really like any of these, but maybe they'll be a jumping point for a better idea?
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Old 06-22-2013, 11:02 AM   #748
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Tami, at Huevos Rancheros! I've been picturing eggs with hot sauce on top myself.

You ladies are not "cold and unfeeling" - you're heroes. You did what needed to be done while the damsels in distress waved their white hankies and let YOU do all the heavy lifting. Now they blame YOU for that?? Yeah, right.

I like the forgiving thing you and DH do, Tami, being extra generous with the good guy in your life because he is nursing his own battle wounds.

Fitter by Fall?
Awesome by Autumn? Hehe.
Skinny Jeans Challenge? (Sigh. I miss my skinny jeans.)

Lynne
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Old 06-24-2013, 05:55 AM   #749
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I agree with Lynne- you are ALL EMPOWERED women. You have faught against the odds to be where you are today! As a Mom, I can't imagine doing any of the things your family has done to each of you.

Tami - if anyone harmed a hair on my children's head (mentally or physically) I would be gone. There wouldn't be 1 chance or accepting even 1 apology. GONE and I would never look back. I can't wrap my head around what your Mom was thinking or still is. It is truly UNTHINKABLE to me! I know your boys have had your full support and will grow to be amazing men/father's. Nothing at all like what you grew up in. I have a dear friend who's Dad abused them all physically and sexually. It makes me PUKING SICK! I can't stand him and HE KNOWS IT! She doesn't have a lot to do with him anymore and I am thrilled about that. When she was in therapy trying to cope with her childhood, her therapist called me her "alter ego". I was the one person in her life that called BS on her Mom and Dad. I don't / didn't say nice things about them and was NOT nice to them either. I tolerated him at best and if at birthday parties for her children, HE started to act up, I called him out on it. She , at that time, didn't have the ability to do it. I could go on and on about my HATRED of that man and my complete LACK OF RESPECT for her Mom staying with him and still being with him today!

Danielle - as a Mom, I would support my children in the decisions they make in their life. Adult or child age. I would never push MY INSECURITIES on either of my children either. It is hard, especially at the age mine are now. They know I feel less than pleased about my size. This weekend at one of Haven's Games she was really quiet as we were gathering our stuff to leave. I asked her, what's up? She replied XX was being mean, earlier, when I wasn't here, she pulled her shirt tight on her tummy, stuck it out and said, HEY LOOK, I'm Haven! I was livid. It was the Coaches daughter and they were still there. We have known her/them for almost 3 years. I marched over there, Coach said, oh I think this is H's headband, I took it and said thanks. She then said, was there something else? I directly addressed her daughter and said, XX not everyone is tiny like you. Haven was told what you said about her and her size and I want you to know, I don't feel FRIENDS should ever say those things about each other. I said, XX she considers you a friend and she has known you longer than any girl on the team and she is over there crying about what you said. Her parents were livid with her, XX tried so say she did not say it. They wouldn't hear it and told her to immediately go apologize. XX had a different attitude when she got to Haven. She didn't deny it, she did apologize and said she shouldn't have said it. XX is really tiny for her age. Short and SKINNY, I made sure she understood that we simply all can't be made that way. GRRRRRR I was MAD! I was pleased her parents were almost as horrified as I was on what she said/did.
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Old 06-24-2013, 05:57 AM   #750
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Lynne - I can tell you, I have seen some interesting things happen with parents of children that are having children. I am baffled at the lack of supppot or participation they give. Dennis and I have had numerous discussions of how WE will handle life once our kids have kids....I cannot imagine saying any of the things your family said to you about your PRECIOUS Gavin. Born or not, LIFE, all LIFE IS PRECIOUS!! We are all unquie and each of us deserves the shot in life that you are giving to Gavin! Stand your ground girl, You make me proud of all the things I believe in!
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