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Old 11-15-2012, 03:58 PM   #811
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Thanks for the link KT. This really touches home for me because my last (for 25 years) was shift work! Every few days I would work different shifts - days, evenings, even midnights. I can't tell you how many could be found standing in front of the vending machines at 3:00 a.m. One night I swiped someones yogurt because I just had to have it...not very nice on my part.

I am also so surprised about the protein. Last winter I stopped eating most veggies and pretty much just lived on protein. In an effort to lose weight I had switched to boneless skinless chicken breast, lean beef, eggbeaters, light salad dressing on salad (about the only veggie I was eating...and still I could not reduce my insulin. Now that I have really restricted the protein, I have eliminated my morning shot and reduced the other 2 mealtime shots I take. I'm hoping to reduce my night time long acting insulin also!

I am sure now that the excess protein was being converted to glucose and that was why I couldn't reduce the insulin.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:59 PM   #812
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Interesting study, thanks for posting, Key Tones. The more I read, the less I believe that the standard advice to "eat less, move more" and "calories in must be less than calories out" are anywhere near adequate for people with complications like insulin resistence and diabetes.

I'm 0.4 pounds within reaching the 180s, and am finding down days on JUDDD to be getting easier over time--even rather pleasant for at least part of the down day. I think that cutting back my protein and focusing on getting into nutritional ketosis made adopting JUDDD much easier than if I had gone right to JUDDD from SAD or lowcarb/high protein. I'm still trying to stay in nutritional ketosis with JUDDD--just largely confining my food to my lean protein target and a little cream in coffee on my down days. And I'm trying to eat very clean and getting lots of nutrients from bone broth, liver, and fish (salmon roe, anchovies, salmon, shrimp). Some combination of those things seem to be working for me right now, but I don't know the relative importance of the various elements. I'm just happy to be losing right now after so many stalls.

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Old 11-15-2012, 04:12 PM   #813
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Thanks for the link KT. This really touches home for me because my last (for 25 years) was shift work! Every few days I would work different shifts - days, evenings, even midnights. I can't tell you how many could be found standing in front of the vending machines at 3:00 a.m. One night I swiped someones yogurt because I just had to have it...not very nice on my part.

I am also so surprised about the protein. Last winter I stopped eating most veggies and pretty much just lived on protein. In an effort to lose weight I had switched to boneless skinless chicken breast, lean beef, eggbeaters, light salad dressing on salad (about the only veggie I was eating...and still I could not reduce my insulin. Now that I have really restricted the protein, I have eliminated my morning shot and reduced the other 2 mealtime shots I take. I'm hoping to reduce my night time long acting insulin also!

I am sure now that the excess protein was being converted to glucose and that was why I couldn't reduce the insulin.
It's great that you have been able to cut back your insulin so much on less protein, Maureen. I hope that you continue to make progress on that front, as well as losing more weight.

I'm sure this situation of excess protein stalling weight loss and making diabetics use more insulin is not all that uncommon, but there's almost no literature about this. I looked for cookbooks with high fat recipes at Amazon and find that searching for "fat in cookbooks" brings up a ton of "healthy LOW fat" cookbooks, except for Jennifer McLagan's "Fat: An appreciation of a misunderstood ingredient, with recipes" and a couple of olive-oil-focused cookbooks (all of which I now own). I've read three Scandinavian books translated into English about eating LCHF, the best of which is Sten Skaldeman's "Lose Weight by Eating," and have also read the Phinney and Volek books, Barry Groves' "Natural Health and Weight Loss," and Mary Enig and Sally Fallon's "Eat Fat, Lose Fat" (which is higher carb than Atkins). Apart from those book, I haven't seen much that focuses on making fat (rather than protein) the staple of one's diet for weight loss, and on the need for some of us to limit protein as well as carbs. Please let me know, everyone, if you find another promising source on this approach.

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Old 11-16-2012, 04:04 PM   #814
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Hi all....I recognize some of your names from the NK or 80-15-5 thread which I have been on for months...the only ones. Drjlocarb invited me over to this thread since I've been in a stall/gain mode since the 2nd month of NK eating and testing. I just returned from being on the road across 4 states for the last week and my order of ketone strips arrived today, so I've got to get back on track bigtime!

2 years ago I did Body for Life which was weights/cardio and nonfat eating and high protein. I lost 20# and went down 2.5 sizes. Loved it, but didn't "feel healthy" having hot flashes, etc. and thyroid going a bit nuts. So, went to a nutritionist in lowcarb and she put me on Atkins '72. Gained the 20# back over about 6 months and then got stuck right back up where I was before all my hard work. And I remain there...well, down about 4#, but only 2 on the NK way of eating since August. So, I"m stuck with the rest of you, and "doing everything right" and being frustrated by everyone whining over "only losing 2# this week" and those types of posts. I would be happy with a 1# loss in a month!

Anyway, just thought I would introduce myself to those of you that aren't familiar with my name. I am the one someone mentioned about 5 pages back about the MCT oil being a "do not recommend" from the Phinney/Volek book...can't remember which one, but it did make that a point. I use it!!!! I don't like CO in my hot decaf coffee (can't do caffeine), but LOVE the MCT oil in the coffee with HWC.

I'm wondering about the elimination of SF syrups in my coffee and/or elimination of dairy! Hate to do either of those things as they are my "treats".

Sorry this is so long. I type fast so am "wordy".
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Old 11-16-2012, 04:33 PM   #815
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I type so slow, I cant get my thoughts across and my posts are lacking in the words and thoughts I want to convey.



We really want to know what works and what doesn't. So many people give up and move on, so we need people that are sticking to LC through stalls even if those stalls last for years. I don't need to know IF low carb is working for the newbies, I need to know what is working for the long termers. This is why I want to know IF you are losing on NK, where you LC before and were you just losing too slow OR (like Jimmy) were you doing the right things and it wasn't happening for you?
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Old 11-16-2012, 08:29 PM   #816
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I type so slow, I cant get my thoughts across and my posts are lacking in the words and thoughts I want to convey.



We really want to know what works and what doesn't. So many people give up and move on, so we need people that are sticking to LC through stalls even if those stalls last for years. I don't need to know IF low carb is working for the newbies, I need to know what is working for the long termers. This is why I want to know IF you are losing on NK, where you LC before and were you just losing too slow OR (like Jimmy) were you doing the right things and it wasn't happening for you?
OK..will try to answer. I did Atkins '72 strict induction for about 5 months with no result a few years back so I ditched it. Then I did Protein Power and another high protein nonfat style by Venuto that was nonfat/high protein??? Didn't work either. Then 2 years ago I did nonfat/high protein/probably under 30 carb and lost 20#, but I also exercised to the max 5 days a week while doing that. Didn't "feel right" though, and went back to lowcarb. I feel happy and healthy doing high fat, moderate protein and lowcarb even though I am not losing. For me personally, I think a lot of it has to do with my history of eating and really messing up my body from years of not eating red meat, years of eating only fruit and cottage cheese, oatmeal and carrot juice...stuff like that. I have always exercised to the hilt, and stopped that for the last 8 months or so and only walked. No change. I have been told that I messed up my metabolism by years of over-exercising, under-eating and at my age (64) it's taken a toll on my body.

I am hoping to be like Skaldeman (?) who says some people like me who are really messed up, it might take 6 months. But I do plan to stick with this...have my ketone strips and will start testing next week once again. I have not played much with how much protein and am usually around 80-83% fat. I did "lose" on the fat fast days...but only managed 4. And, I got into ketosis then.

I have no clue about the high/moderate/low protein or the 75-85% fat. All I know is that when I have carbs, I do seem to gain, and bloat. I can have about 8 raspberries with breakfast and not have an effect which is a treat now and again. I don't touch fruit in any other form.

I guess my next test would be to eliminate dairy and see what happens. That will be hard as that's how I get in lots of my fats...butter, HWC, cream cheese and hard cheeses. But I'm curious to know if that helped anyone else. I have read that many have gotten off all the SF sweeteners and it didn't change a thing, so I never tried to go off them.

The only thing that has worked for me in the last 5 years or so was changing from low carb to low carb/nonfat and high protein. But I don't think that's healthy, and my skin was so dry and I had bad hot flashes without the fat to help my endocrine system.

Hope that's what you were looking for. I'm glad to have this group to talk to rather than all those where the program is working for them so easily. This way when we each "experiment" with more/less protein, more/less fat, etc., we can compare notes. I had one day in September where I had 190 grams of fat and 1900 calories (vs. my 140 fat and 1200 calories) and that was my biggest weight loss!!!! So, Phinney/Volek might have something on the idea of trying to keep calories up (for me about 2000!) and finding that the body will "get" that it's not in starvation mode and then will release the fat/weight. But I'm sort of afraid to do that. I spent years eating 600-900 calories a day. I think that's what really messed me up. That's why I don't understand the JUDDD and hcg 500 calorie ways of eating at all. I'm trying to "eat" these days. But definitely have hardly any carbs. Rare to have a salad or veggie. Pretty much straight meat, eggs, cheese, full fat dairy, and bacon!!!!

Sorry for the long answer. I'm really wondering about the dairy though......
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Old 11-16-2012, 08:59 PM   #817
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Shelley! I do read the NK threads from time to time so I recognize your name

I was disappointed this morning when my bounce went upto 190. Praying it is only temporary. My mostly good news to balance out the weight was a brief report on my blood work. A1c was 5.5. Fasting bg was 55 (kind of low even for me) and doctor probably won't like it. Urinalysis was good for various checks. The poor doctor is appalled at my cholesterol which is 322 or 332 (can't remember). It was the same early in 2012 when checked by VAP.

Shelley I use SF syrup as a flavoring in my coffee every day. Earlier this year I went to lowfat dairy and cheese, but it made no difference in weight. Now, I am usually full fat again just keeping a close eye on protein from the cheese.
I think it is funny that the only protein calculator that came close to what I am currently eating is the fitness tracker! Dr. Bernstein, bs 101, and Phinney & Volk and PP all had me me eating between 66 and 75g. What seems to be working - very slowly - is about 45g a day spread over 2 meals. I have eliminated protein at breakfast which allowed me to stop my morning insulin.

It is hard to say if eliminating the SF syrup and dairy will help you....but it didn't do a darn thing for me.
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Old 11-17-2012, 05:53 AM   #818
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Hi Shelley and welcome to the stubborn club!!

Stalled out Oct. 2010 after a 56lbs loss within a yr. of vlc Atkins woe.
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Old 11-17-2012, 08:30 AM   #819
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Oh, I love "The Stubborn Club", but wish it weren't so. After posting here yesterday I decided to try something I was told to do years ago...to eat crap! So, I had 2 pieces of candy, and 1/4 cup of potato salad with my chicken last night. Fasting BG was 108 this morning and ketones were .2. Lots of room for improvement and I'm going to be "on target" after one meal of being very naughty.

I think I'm going to do 3 days of the fat fast as that seems to kick start me into the ketosis stage. Thanks for the confirmation that eliminating SF syrups and dairy is not going to change anything for you and probably me. I used to be dairy free (Atkins induction) and it didn't help. I know this is the best for my health, but it frustrates me to know that I can lose on nonfat and high protein....but then have health issues.

Mobear...my cholesterol has always been high as an adult....250-325. My HDL is also high. My triglycerides are low as is CRP and homocysteine levels are low too.....those are the ones to worry about. Every doc I have gone to tries to put me on statins. I refuse. I do all their stupid tests, and the last one was a calcium score (to see the blockage percentage in the arteries). Mine was zero. I don't care about cholesterol readings. My Ha1C in April was 5.8, and that was on strict Atkins '72 induction. But I can't find a doc that will do anything about my fasting glucose of over 100...they laugh and say to wait until it's 125 and then we can discuss it. I think my glucose levels for low carb and sugar free are too high,and the docs don't seem to care or think it's something to deal with. Strange. Typical medical.

My weight was up 1# today (no surprise with my candy/potato salad), and I am hopeful that the fat fast will drop that and maybe another 1# and then I begin again (with one meal lapse in well over 3 months of NK eating to perfection) and Atkins '72 for"ever".

Cathy....that is fabulous that you lost 56# on Atkins! That's too long of a stall though (2 years), so I totally understand that frustration.

I'm still not convinced that lower protein is right for me. When I dropped down to 47 grams of protein/day, I gained. I did better on 60-65 and was not gaining....but not really losing either. The calculations and such are so varied, that it does take each person having to figure out the macros for themselves. So far I am failing at that part.
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Old 11-17-2012, 10:14 AM   #820
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Shelley do you remember the Paul Simon song "50 Ways to Leave Your Lover"? I think that there have to be 50+ ways to calculate protein requirements Initially (9/2010) I was using the old WW formula of 2oz, 4oz, 6oz of meat, fish, poultry over 3 meals for a total of 12oz a day. Probably a lot of days I ate more than that...I wasn't exactly tracking it. In July 2012 after being stalled for a year I started online tracking. Well, holy crap I never thought about the protein in lettuce for pity sakes, or mushrooms, or salad dressing, or, or.

You get the idea! So starting then I began wittling down the protein. This is much much harder than I ever imagined. I went down a few grams a week to get used to it. I upped the fat as the protein went down and tried to keep carbs no more than 30g total.

There has been a lot of "bouncing" and a few times I was really worried about bounching out of onederland. The bounce got smaller and slightly lower as time went on and it has only been in the last few weeks that I have finally gotten below my stall weight of 192!!!

So, don't give up.
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Old 11-17-2012, 10:15 AM   #821
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Welcome Shelley. I have to post and run because I'm getting ready to go to a party.

I've lost over 100 pounds. I started low carb in 2005 and only managed to lose maybe 15-20 pounds in any one year. My losses tend to come in spurts here and there. This means NOTHING happened most of the time for years and years. Ugh....

I was lucky enough to have my old doctor leave the practice. A new young doctor told me it wasn't my fault, explained metabolic syndrome and told me I would never lose the weight unless I went low carb. I found out in recent years he follows a paleo diet himself. He read Neanderthin years ago. Frankly, even he is shocked that I weigh less every time he sees me. he pulled up a graph once. Even though I am frustrated and go crazy, when he graphs my weight from 2005 it is amazing.

OK, I only came in to post this. Oh what a great paper. If you are looking to renew your commitment to not eat crap, here it is. It is a beautifully written, well referenced paper in support of the paleo diet. I personally need this. Not talking about it.

I suggest downloading the whole paper and printing it out. I think I read it while reading one blog linking to another, can't remember now. I've been looking for a good reference in support of the paleo diet. I can't think of something better than this I have read in recent years.

Here you go:

The western diet and lifestyle and diseases of civilization
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Old 11-18-2012, 07:41 PM   #822
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Shelley do you remember the Paul Simon song "50 Ways to Leave Your Lover"? I think that there have to be 50+ ways to calculate protein requirements Initially (9/2010) I was using the old WW formula of 2oz, 4oz, 6oz of meat, fish, poultry over 3 meals for a total of 12oz a day. Probably a lot of days I ate more than that...I wasn't exactly tracking it. In July 2012 after being stalled for a year I started online tracking. Well, holy crap I never thought about the protein in lettuce for pity sakes, or mushrooms, or salad dressing, or, or.

You get the idea! So starting then I began wittling down the protein. This is much much harder than I ever imagined. I went down a few grams a week to get used to it. I upped the fat as the protein went down and tried to keep carbs no more than 30g total.

There has been a lot of "bouncing" and a few times I was really worried about bounching out of onederland. The bounce got smaller and slightly lower as time went on and it has only been in the last few weeks that I have finally gotten below my stall weight of 192!!!

So, don't give up.
Hi..I won't give up and yes I remember that song!!!!

I am doing my own research on what I recorded in ****** when I was 20# lighter. Did my usual weigh/measure today. Up 2# more in the last week. I have gained 4# in the last 2.5 months of doing NK eating, but my inches are down a tiny bit....and that is good! So, am checking out what I was eating when I was 20# less. Surprise...I was eating much more protein and much more calories every day. I mean a lot more of each! My fat was 74# vs my current 80-83%, so it was mostly the difference in protein. Carbs were still under 20 total. So, I need more protein and a bit less fat. Will pull out my printed off fitdays and "copy" those days of food this week and see what happens.

Phinney/Volek do talk about the macros that they feel are best. The NK links have less protein and less calories as "what works" in the 2 threads I was following for the last 2.5 months. So, I"m going to up my calories and protein and see what happens.

So...will keep you posted on this weeks changes.
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Old 11-18-2012, 07:44 PM   #823
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Welcome Shelley. I have to post and run because I'm getting ready to go to a party.

I've lost over 100 pounds. I started low carb in 2005 and only managed to lose maybe 15-20 pounds in any one year. My losses tend to come in spurts here and there. This means NOTHING happened most of the time for years and years. Ugh....

I was lucky enough to have my old doctor leave the practice. A new young doctor told me it wasn't my fault, explained metabolic syndrome and told me I would never lose the weight unless I went low carb. I found out in recent years he follows a paleo diet himself. He read Neanderthin years ago. Frankly, even he is shocked that I weigh less every time he sees me. he pulled up a graph once. Even though I am frustrated and go crazy, when he graphs my weight from 2005 it is amazing.

OK, I only came in to post this. Oh what a great paper. If you are looking to renew your commitment to not eat crap, here it is. It is a beautifully written, well referenced paper in support of the paleo diet. I personally need this. Not talking about it.

I suggest downloading the whole paper and printing it out. I think I read it while reading one blog linking to another, can't remember now. I've been looking for a good reference in support of the paleo diet. I can't think of something better than this I have read in recent years.

Here you go:

The western diet and lifestyle and diseases of civilization
Oh how I wish I could find a doc that doens't want me on statins and eating lots of fruit! Thanks for the link to the article. I just printed it off and will read it soon.

I'm curious about paleo vs NK eating. I think paleo is non-dairy and has fruits and veggies??? I looked into it, but figured it was similar to Atkins '72 which did NOT work for me at all. I think most veggie carbs do me in. Even a small salad. I do better with just protein and fat I think.

We shall see what my experiment does this week...goign back to 2 years ago with higher protein/calories and still under 20 total carbs. Essentially NK eating, but with MORE protein/calories. Thanks for the link.
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Old 11-19-2012, 06:44 AM   #824
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Shelly, I would love to know what the high ptn will do to your fasting bld/glucose.

Part of the reason I thought NK would work for me is because I felt the higher protein was being converted to glucose and inhibiting my ability to use ketones(my fat) for energy. I seem to remember you had some high f b/g readings also.
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Old 11-19-2012, 08:37 AM   #825
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Shelly, I would love to know what the high ptn will do to your fasting bld/glucose.

Part of the reason I thought NK would work for me is because I felt the higher protein was being converted to glucose and inhibiting my ability to use ketones(my fat) for energy. I seem to remember you had some high f b/g readings also.
You are correct...my fasting morning BG testing was all over the place, but usually over 100 easily....up to 120-125 sometimes. And when I did it an hour after breakfast of bacon and eggs it dropped into the low 90's and high 80's.

I will try this with higher protein this week and higher calories. I only know how I felt in my body 2 years ago on 20# less body weight and lower fat in my belly, butt, hips! I looked great, everyone commented on that. But I "bonked" with every pilates class and was beet red and exhausted for them. I feel that I am lifting heavier weights and don't "bonk" with the NK style of eating...but it took about 6 weeks to get to that point...and Skaldeman said it can take up to 6 months for someone to truly become keto adapted and burn fat. I have "cheated" a couple times. Yesterday I made yam fries. A big no no for carbs. I don't do it often, and I"m not a chocolate person so have no worries about cheating on that. Also, for those of you that love chocolate, I have read in many places that the chocolate cravings are a deficiency in magnesium. I guess my levels must be good. I have never liked chocolate. I'm strange.
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Old 11-19-2012, 08:59 AM   #826
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Ah, I think the hard core paleo types are eating mostly grassfed meats and mostly non-farmed seafood, fruits and vegetables, avoid genetically modified and have a thing against modern, large sweet fruits (not sure avoiding sweet fruits thing make sense in terms of following philosophy after one of the bloggers pointed out that obviously ancient fruits from africa were very sweet). There are a lot of versions of this - some like Sisson call it 'primal' and include dairy and 'safe starches.'

I don't think Atkins said anything about avoiding processed oils or mayonaise (which is usually soybean oil)--a huge no-no in paleoland. Fats/oils are limited to the type that doesn't require industrial processing to extract. My understanding is that the processed oils easily go rancid (but you can't taste when), oxidize at high heat (so should not be used for cooking), and are inflammatory (causing modern diseases). I haven't read the more recent books, however. It seems climbing the carb ladder would take you back to the western diet.

I have read recipes for making your own mayonaise, but I understand it only lasts a couple of weeks so I haven't bothered.

Some more liberal paleo types will eat "safe starches" such as rice or potatoes because these don't seem to cause ill health effects (diabetics and maybe others aside), but there are arguments against eating these as well. Generally, the paleo diets eliminate grains, legumes, processed sugar, and processed oil.

Did I forget anything? Almost forgot legumes - no beans or peanuts

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Old 11-19-2012, 01:57 PM   #827
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Well, I don't eat paleo and yet I do in a way per what you wrote. I don't eat legumes, and when I tried to go up the rungs of Atkins '72 I failed miserably. The only fruit I have is a rare morning of 8 raspberries with my protein. Not a daily thing and definitely seasonal.

I don't do any grains at all...so not only gluten free but totally grain free...that means no rice, no pasta, no nothing like that. I also don't do potatoes. I just eat protein and fat, a very rare small salad and usually broccoli, cauliflower or spinach for veggies, and definitely not every day.

I make my own mayo with light olive oil and mix it with ACV and a drop of EZSweets for my salad dressing when I have one. My oils are light olive oil, coconut oil, MCT oil and macadamia oil. Used to use grapeseed oil, but I'd rather have the others. Sugar?! Are you kidding! ha ha ha No, no sugar...it went bye bye with flours years ago.

I only eat wild fish when I can find it. If not, then I don't have any. My meats until recently has been elk and moose (married a hunter), so grass fed for sure! Now I am buying meat at the store and can only do the expensive ones or else I notice the hormones they use and it causes me problems. So..not a lot of meat. When I do have meat, it's usually a good organic steak (as I said, not often!) I do use ground pork a lot as they have no antibiotics or hormones in it (against teh law here so they say). I mix it 50/50 with ground chuck that is also organic. A little goes a long way. Yesterday I had 3/4# of each and made lowcarb meatballs fried in bacon grease, put them in my little silicone 1" square candy maker and put them in the freezer...and now they are all in a ziplock freezer bag so that I can pull out as many little individual ones as I want...when I want.

I am going to take my 1 hour PP fasting glucose here in another 30 minutes. Will be curious to see what it is. I will try to remember to do the same thing after dinner. A more accurate BG reading from my understanding.
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:19 PM   #828
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Originally Posted by Key Tones View Post
Ah, I think the hard core paleo types are eating mostly grassfed meats and mostly non-farmed seafood, fruits and vegetables, avoid genetically modified and have a thing against modern, large sweet fruits (not sure avoiding sweet fruits thing make sense in terms of following philosophy after one of the bloggers pointed out that obviously ancient fruits from africa were very sweet). There are a lot of versions of this - some like Sisson call it 'primal' and include dairy and 'safe starches.'

I don't think Atkins said anything about avoiding processed oils or mayonaise (which is usually soybean oil)--a huge no-no in paleoland. Fats/oils are limited to the type that doesn't require industrial processing to extract. My understanding is that the processed oils easily go rancid (but you can't taste when), oxidize at high heat (so should not be used for cooking), and are inflammatory (causing modern diseases). I haven't read the more recent books, however. It seems climbing the carb ladder would take you back to the western diet.

I have read recipes for making your own mayonaise, but I understand it only lasts a couple of weeks so I haven't bothered.

Some more liberal paleo types will eat "safe starches" such as rice or potatoes because these don't seem to cause ill health effects (diabetics and maybe others aside), but there are arguments against eating these as well. Generally, the paleo diets eliminate grains, legumes, processed sugar, and processed oil.

Did I forget anything? Almost forgot legumes - no beans or peanuts
Dairy.
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Old 11-19-2012, 04:32 PM   #829
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Oh, yes, I forgot diary...thank you, Cathy.
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:28 PM   #830
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Dairy.
OK...this is what I've been thinking about for some time. That I need to eliminate dairy. (and I just bought some greek yogurt today to try!) I consume about 1/4 cup of 40% HWC, 2 oz of cream cheese and probably 2 tbsp of butter every day. I do have cheese, but not all the time. Just as a "condiment" on eggs or a hamburger patty.

So you all eliminate dairy? Or if you didn't, did you find it caused you to stall or gain? Wow...I'd have to up my coconut and mct oils to get in my fats if I had to give up dairy. And give up coffee because I love it as a "hot milkshake"! Today I had decaf with HWC and pumpkin pie spice.....ala the expensive Starbucks Pumpkin Pie lattes of the "old days of past". It was great!

But, please tell me more about your experiences with dairy.
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:38 AM   #831
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Gave it up...didn't help.
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Old 11-20-2012, 09:03 AM   #832
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I went dairy-free for about 6 wks.. Got the ususal 2lbs loss and then slowly regrained despite the restriction.
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Old 11-20-2012, 09:12 AM   #833
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I gave it up recently. I tried a few times before but failed. I have been curious because milk is supposed to trigger a larger insulin response than expected. Since I was diabetic in 2005 (and in theory still am), I decided this would benefit me.

Since I lowered protein at the same time in my more recent attempt, and severely upped vegetables, it is difficult to isolate the effect. I have now come to view vegetables as a vehicle for fat. I have been making various squash soups and eating a lot of spagetti squash. I made a nice curried coconut milk butternut squash soup!!! I really think I do better with more cauliflower mashed (will try some soups next).

Anyway, I have recently dropped below 210 out of this change and am still bouncing around below 210, even with all the holiday parties and chocolate eating I've been doing (this is my compromise when there are cookies and pastries and pies everywhere - I will go get some dark chocolate; it is not as harmful). I am more energetic. This is the thing I think makes the big difference. I can be on my feet all night working around the house, shopping, cooking soups, cleaning...I think these changes must have caused a drop in my insulin levels, giving me more energy. I don't feel like sitting around surfing on the computer all the time. This is my theory anyway.

I think, for the first time (I've been waiting for it) I have noticed that coconut milk in soup gives me an energy boost.

I had 3 egg yolks (whites down the drain!) for breakfast and mashed cauliflower. I have half some sort of roasted sweet winter squash in my bag for lunch (which will need some kerrygold butter!) and two avocados for snacks.

I do still eat kerrygold butter.

I've been drinking unsweetened almond milk. It has been weird drinking coffee without cream (I haven't lugged almond milk to work yet for coffee, but I will). I need more sweetener to get coffee down. Consequently, I've been drinking more tea. It isn't so bitter!

I might have some oysters for dinner. Haven't decided yet.

Last edited by Key Tones; 11-20-2012 at 09:14 AM..
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:26 AM   #834
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I wasn't going to post about this until I lost all my regained weight but I am too excited to keep it to myself (there is a reason I am known as Chatty Cathy )

Nutritional ketosis for months and after almost 5 wks. of berberine (Glycosolve), I have lost 5.5 lbs. . Most of this has been in the last 2 wks. when I doubled my dosage (from 500mg to 1000mg - one in the morning and one in the late afternoon).

Four more lbs. and I will be back to my stall weight. Never thought I would be ecstatic to see that weight again but I will be!!

Just needed to share and the main board is far too anti-N.K.. You would think that low carb was low fat....
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"The energy content of food (calories) matters, but it is less important than the metabolic effect of food on our body." Dr. P. Attia

"dumping carbohydrates on your broken metabolism is tantamount to doing jumping jacks on two broken legs" -The Spark of Reason

“Eat animals. Mostly fat. Enjoy!
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:50 AM   #835
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YOU GO GIRL!!!!!

FANTASTIC!!

WOO HOO!!

I am sooooooooooooo happy for you. You just brought a tear to my eyes!
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:32 AM   #836
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Wow, Cathy, that is such great news! You have hit paydirt!!!!!

I love it when that happens!!!


So great right in the holiday season too
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:59 AM   #837
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Gosh Cathy that is just wonderful . I couldn't be more happy for you...you have such a struggle and now something that WORKS....
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Old 11-21-2012, 01:21 PM   #838
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Thanks everyone. I am enjoying my current success.
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:16 PM   #839
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Awesome and hopeful news Cathy!
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Old 11-22-2012, 10:51 AM   #840
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Wow...Cathy, that is great news! I have been very curious about berberine/glycosolve, but you are the first to report on using it and the very excellent results you have gotten with it.

Congratulations!!!!
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