Low Carb Friends  
Netrition.com - Tools - Reviews - Faces - Recipes - Home


Go Back   Low Carb Friends > Support Groups > Low Carb Challenges!
Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-12-2012, 08:56 AM   #721
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,341
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/212/??? 5/10" The real age 49
WOE: 2014 Nutritional Ketosis Experiment Begins
Start Date: LC'05,'10Paleo,'13 S.Guyenet+S.Roberts'14C.Kresser
Quote:
Originally Posted by svenskamae View Post
You might consider upping your intake of Omega 3 fats as another anti-inflammatory measure, Key Tones. That could be in the form of cod liver oil or krill oil capsules or just working more fish into your diet. Flax oil has omega 3s, too, but I've read that the amount we absorb from flax is way less than what we can absorb from fish-related sources.

I hope you find something that helps.

I've done just a little web surfing on the topic of anti-inflammatory foods, and the information seems highly contradictory. I've read that a low carb diet is anti inflammatory and then see that various website are pushing whole grains and polyunsaturated fats (oh boy, let's have some healthy soybean oil!) and fruits as the basis for supposedly anti-inflammatory diets. What have you read that you trust?

A last point--a friend who has problems with joint pain is avoiding veggies in the nightshade family, like tomatoes and eggplant. Have you given that a try or some consideration?

Thank you for your post. I already take krill oil; Dr. Eades has written some great articles about this on his blog. I'm not sure chia seeds can improve on this but I will try it.

I've read up on anti-inflammatory diets in the past. My focus is going to be on wild-caught salmon and other seafood. I stumbled on the paleo diet in 2005 when pretty much no one heard of it by putting "omega 3" into amazon and ordering the top book results.

I am going to try just meat and vegetables (to be researched) and low carb fruit. No night shades (I have heard of this; I threw out my potatoes the other day), no sweet potatoes. I'm not going to touch sweet potatoes either after reading what happened to Chris Masterjohn when he tried it (joint pain from oxalates I think, would have to google). I am a believer in at least 50 carbs per day. Why make your liver work so hard. Maybe I will have to drop this.

I think I have gone down a gopher hole with my low fat, low carb diet which may have triggered this pain. I would suspect uric acid/gout, but I have more than one joint in pain (knee, shoulder, both hips, left hip worse), but still suspect high uric acid. This is too bad because I lost weight eating low fat protein.

I am still leary of high fat diet. Last time I tried it I put on several pounds and they were like concrete to get back off. I realized that weight gain on high fat is REAL and not bloating. I might try it again but would have to really, seriously watch calories. Still mulling it over. I haven't looked at Jimmy's most recent post yet.

I hate to say it, but I think I will have to give up dairy to see if it helps. Ugh.
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old 10-12-2012, 02:27 PM   #722
Blabbermouth!!!
 
Speck333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,186
Gallery: Speck333
WOE: Semi-Primal
Quote:
Originally Posted by svenskamae View Post
Hi, Speck. You look great in that hat. Good luck with your plan.
haha, I have other holiday hats, too!

Quote:
Originally Posted by clackley View Post
Hi Speck. Glad to see you are still about if not posting much. I am not sure how to respond to your post - are you talking dismal weight situation or life in general? Either way, plans are good.
I didn't realize until you posted this, that I'm pretty tangled in a web of dismay. Things are related in ways you can't see sometimes until someone else points it out (even if accidentally).

Quote:
Originally Posted by drjlocarb View Post
Speck333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2012, 03:07 PM   #723
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,134
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
Nice to see you Speck. Hope things are going better for you
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2012, 03:09 PM   #724
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 15,577
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speck333 View Post
I didn't realize until you posted this, that I'm pretty tangled in a web of dismay. Things are related in ways you can't see sometimes until someone else points it out (even if accidentally).

Sorry to have been the one to point it out - maybe it's because I too am' not great place' lately. Ah, life.....
clackley is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2012, 03:42 PM   #725
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,926
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Key Tones View Post
Thank you for your post. I already take krill oil; Dr. Eades has written some great articles about this on his blog. I'm not sure chia seeds can improve on this but I will try it.

I've read up on anti-inflammatory diets in the past. My focus is going to be on wild-caught salmon and other seafood. I stumbled on the paleo diet in 2005 when pretty much no one heard of it by putting "omega 3" into amazon and ordering the top book results.

I am going to try just meat and vegetables (to be researched) and low carb fruit. No night shades (I have heard of this; I threw out my potatoes the other day), no sweet potatoes. I'm not going to touch sweet potatoes either after reading what happened to Chris Masterjohn when he tried it (joint pain from oxalates I think, would have to google). I am a believer in at least 50 carbs per day. Why make your liver work so hard. Maybe I will have to drop this.

I think I have gone down a gopher hole with my low fat, low carb diet which may have triggered this pain. I would suspect uric acid/gout, but I have more than one joint in pain (knee, shoulder, both hips, left hip worse), but still suspect high uric acid. This is too bad because I lost weight eating low fat protein.

I am still leary of high fat diet. Last time I tried it I put on several pounds and they were like concrete to get back off. I realized that weight gain on high fat is REAL and not bloating. I might try it again but would have to really, seriously watch calories. Still mulling it over. I haven't looked at Jimmy's most recent post yet.

I hate to say it, but I think I will have to give up dairy to see if it helps. Ugh.
Hi, Key Tones. I've read that cruciferous vegetables--arugula, broccoli, Brussels sprouts, bok choy, collard greens, mustard greens, kale, cabbage, radishes, watercress, and cauliflower--have anti-inflammatory benefits by inhibiting the production of prostaglandins. They also are pretty low in carbs.

Upping your intake of wildcaught salmon sounds like a good idea. I've been eating salmon fillets, salmon roe, and smoked salmon frequently, lately, in the hope that upping my Omega 3 consumption would help my weight loss.

I'll check what the Practical Paleo book says about limiting inflammation and joint pain and post that here in the next few days. (Tomorrow I have to host a party for co-workers, and Sunday I phonebank for a campaign, so I might not get to it right away.) Maybe there will be something useful there.

My sympathies about possibly having to give up dairy. I had to give it up for 9 months a few years ago, and it was a real drag; maybe you can see if you handle goatmilk and sheepmilk okay in small quantities (I could), which helps a lot in still making cheese part of one's diet.

Can you get tested for uric acid levels? It seems like the more information you have, the better.

Keep us posted; I hope you feel better soon.
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2012, 11:42 PM   #726
Blabbermouth!!!
 
Speck333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,186
Gallery: Speck333
WOE: Semi-Primal
Quote:
Originally Posted by clackley View Post
Sorry to have been the one to point it out - maybe it's because I too am' not great place' lately. Ah, life.....
We'll get through, we always do.
Speck333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2012, 09:30 AM   #727
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,341
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/212/??? 5/10" The real age 49
WOE: 2014 Nutritional Ketosis Experiment Begins
Start Date: LC'05,'10Paleo,'13 S.Guyenet+S.Roberts'14C.Kresser
Quote:
Originally Posted by svenskamae View Post
Hi, Key Tones. I've read that cruciferous vegetables--arugula, broccoli, Brussels sprouts, bok choy, collard greens, mustard greens, kale, cabbage, radishes, watercress, and cauliflower--have anti-inflammatory benefits by inhibiting the production of prostaglandins. They also are pretty low in carbs.

Upping your intake of wildcaught salmon sounds like a good idea. I've been eating salmon fillets, salmon roe, and smoked salmon frequently, lately, in the hope that upping my Omega 3 consumption would help my weight loss.

I'll check what the Practical Paleo book says about limiting inflammation and joint pain and post that here in the next few days. (Tomorrow I have to host a party for co-workers, and Sunday I phonebank for a campaign, so I might not get to it right away.) Maybe there will be something useful there.

My sympathies about possibly having to give up dairy. I had to give it up for 9 months a few years ago, and it was a real drag; maybe you can see if you handle goatmilk and sheepmilk okay in small quantities (I could), which helps a lot in still making cheese part of one's diet.

Can you get tested for uric acid levels? It seems like the more information you have, the better.

Keep us posted; I hope you feel better soon.
Cauliflower is one of the few vegetables I like. I have it 2-4 times per week. Occasionally brocolli, but I don't like it as much. I'm on a spinach kick this week. Sometimes asparagus. I just don't eat a lot of vegetables. I wish I did.

I am familiar with uric acid testing. My late husband had gout. For some reason, the uric acid levels don't always coincide with an attack. Clueless on that. The doctors won't draw it anymore for that reason, once they know someone has gout problems. I was thinking about asking, knowing that it could be a false negative. By the time I get to the doctor appointment, i will have steered my diet another direction. Maybe.
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2012, 07:21 AM   #728
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
drjlocarb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,267
Gallery: drjlocarb
Stats: 274 /219/190
WOE: vlc/NK
Start Date: LC-1999,jan2010 274 NK 1-1-13 at 244
I listened to Dr Layman with Jimmy Moore yesterday.

This Dr. is all about protein, but not LC or much into weight loss as far as I can tell.

But, he said if you eat less than 30g ptn at a sitting it is not enough to trigger body ptn synthesis. He said without getting to that trigger point, the ptn you do eat has to get stored as fat or used by the liver. At 30g, Lucine(an amino acid), reaches a saturation point in the blood and signals the muscle cells and mitochondria to use ptn for energy and repair.

Raven, if you are still lurking, he did also address the different aa and their influence on insulin and glucagon. Basically he said glucagon stays rather constant no matter what and only insulin goes up or down. That means nothing really raises or lowers glycogen, it just is relative to insulin levels.
drjlocarb is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2012, 12:23 PM   #729
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,134
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
I listened to part of the podcast with Dr. Layman on Saturday. According to him all the protein I am eating 35-45g a day is being stored as fat or used by the liver. How are muscles being maintained? Last Tuesday I overate carbs (had 50g for the day) but protein was still in line at 45g. Its been a couple of weeks at this level of protein, at least 2.5x as much fat as protein and carbs generally between 20-25. If this doesn't result in weight loss then I am upping the protein to 50g a day and staying there.

This is a frustrating way to live, in my opinion. For the past 2 weeks I have just been eating fat at breakfast. Yesterday I was dealing with a head cold and only ate 35g of protein. Today I was famished at 8 - inspite of 2T coconut oil, 1T coconut manna I just caved and ate 1oz of cheese.

I just don't know what to think...I am just super frustrated. End of rant - maybe!
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2012, 12:24 PM   #730
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 15,577
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
I listened to that podcast too and I must say the information (from a guy who really should know), had me really flummoxed. Maybe I should listen again but my general impression was that he does not support lowering protein.
clackley is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2012, 03:22 PM   #731
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
drjlocarb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,267
Gallery: drjlocarb
Stats: 274 /219/190
WOE: vlc/NK
Start Date: LC-1999,jan2010 274 NK 1-1-13 at 244
His idea for a weight loss diet was 120gc/120gptn/70gfat=1600 cal. When Jimmy said 50c/100ptn and the rest fat, he couldn't understand why you would go that low in carbs. He said his research didn't show any better results from lowering carbs below 100-150. Makes me think he has not looked into LC at all. You know....150g carbs IS low carb.

I still find it interesting about the 30g ptn/meal thingie.
drjlocarb is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2012, 03:31 PM   #732
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 15,577
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Ya this gave me the impression that he wasn't too credible when framed by low carbing and particularly ketosis. I think that is a game changer for just about everything about everything...

Last edited by clackley; 10-15-2012 at 03:34 PM..
clackley is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2012, 09:57 PM   #733
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
drjlocarb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,267
Gallery: drjlocarb
Stats: 274 /219/190
WOE: vlc/NK
Start Date: LC-1999,jan2010 274 NK 1-1-13 at 244
I would love to see some research done on people in ketosis vs those on a SAD diet.
drjlocarb is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2012, 09:59 PM   #734
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
drjlocarb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,267
Gallery: drjlocarb
Stats: 274 /219/190
WOE: vlc/NK
Start Date: LC-1999,jan2010 274 NK 1-1-13 at 244
What would happen if you were in ketosis and were not having/or WERE HAVING a glucose dump every 5 hours??????

Just asking.
drjlocarb is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2012, 07:58 AM   #735
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,134
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
Drjlocarb - My guess is that if a person is having a glucose dump every 5 hours they are not producing enough ketones and their liver is dumping glucose to service the brain. I don't think a person could stay in ketosis (or not very deep) if this is happening.

If there is no glucose dump, then wouldn't that mean that the body is in NK and working just fine with ketones and the much smaller amounts of carbs and protein?
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 08:45 PM   #736
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,341
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/212/??? 5/10" The real age 49
WOE: 2014 Nutritional Ketosis Experiment Begins
Start Date: LC'05,'10Paleo,'13 S.Guyenet+S.Roberts'14C.Kresser
Hmm...out of curiosity, I have dropped protein from my lunch a few of times this week by eating an avocado for lunch.

I actually got a buzz on in the early afternoon and early evening and that metallic flavor in my mouth on two of these days. I have not felt that for a looooooong time. I cleaned house one night after work (RARE!!!) and didn't eat dinner until 9. The best combination was large hamburger patty for breakfast (I know, weird) and avocado for lunch. No cheese involved. Fat = avocado and kerrygold butter. Cheese seems to stimulate my appetite anyway (no shock I guess).

OK, this has my attention now. I believe the key for me is to just have an avocado for lunch and nothing else with it.

I stuck with my minimum 50 carbs as well; however, the day I had fruit with breakfast did NOT work. The days I tried to eat whole pears did NOT work. I was hungry after that. A small amount of grapes seems to work better starting in the late afternoon. Even the day I ate a few bites of muffin (I know, but they were chocolate) in the late afternoon worked better than a dang pear for my carbs. I'm just a bit lost as to what to do for carbs since I am experimenting with not using potatoes due to the hip pain. Protein was 45-ish grams. Weird! I've never been able to pull that off before. Anyway, it seems that the key for me is to eat protein at breakfast and then a late dinner and my carbs as an afternoon snack and with dinner. Not sure I can keep it up yet; I need to do this for several consecutive days.

I will try this for a while and report back.

Yeesh, another 100% change in the food I'm eating. My poor body doesn't know what I'm going to send down.

Last edited by Key Tones; 10-19-2012 at 08:58 PM..
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2012, 08:43 AM   #737
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,134
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
KeyTones I use pumpkin (canned) at this time of the year. I make Pumpkin-Sausage soup, cream of pumpkin soup, Dotties Pumpkin Pound Cake and several other recipes....most from Linda Sue's website. Most of the recipes have cream and some have cream cheese so I'm not sure that would work for you.

I think many of us are way more sensitive to protein overload than I would ever have imagined.

Since I've only had avocado once, could you tell me if I should look for Florida avocados or ones from California....or does it even matter?? Do you just slice the avocado and eat it? I think when I had mine it was on a salad at a restaurant and it didn't impress me one way or the other .

Hope everyone else is doing ok.

Drjlocarb I'm wonder if you had wandered into the Diabetes Miracle info before you posted your question about liver dumping every 5 hours.
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2012, 10:16 AM   #738
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,341
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/212/??? 5/10" The real age 49
WOE: 2014 Nutritional Ketosis Experiment Begins
Start Date: LC'05,'10Paleo,'13 S.Guyenet+S.Roberts'14C.Kresser
Mobear,

Pumpkin, thanks! I had not thought of that. I will have to figure out if it is good with avocado, LOL!

The BEST way to eat an avocado, I think, is to cut it in half lenthwise, twist it to break it apart, pop the seed out with a spoon, then drizzle it with a little balsamic vinegar and eat it with a spoon, scooping out bites. How convenient! Most of the time, I just eat it plain or with a little splenda, with a spoon, just like this. No dishes needed, really, just a paper towel if no one is looking.

I forgot to mention protein has been mostly wild-caught king salmon (half price at QFC this week) and seafood mix (mussels, scallops, shrimp, and some sort of calamari - could be fake calamari) from Costco. I have eaten fewer eggs trying to go for the anti-inflammatory omega3s.

OK, I can't believe it. Can NOT believe it....I weight at 8 am this morning - 209! Is it fat loss? I can't believe it could be. I think the dairy perhaps was causing me bloating and I didn't realize it. Nonetheless, I will take it. New low!

Maybe the low carb paleo diet proper is the one for me. No dairy. High omega3. And eat less protein by eating fat only for lunch. I think I read Jimmy Moore eats a huge breakfast and then nothing for several hours. This is what I was trying to mimick, just moving the fat from his breakfast to my lunch since i feel like I need to eat something mid-day.

Hmph.

Last edited by Key Tones; 10-20-2012 at 10:26 AM..
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2012, 01:18 PM   #739
Chatty Cathy
 
clackley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ontario
Posts: 15,577
Gallery: clackley
Stats: 228.5/168/125
WOE: N.K.=vlc/hf/moderate protein & organic/pastured
Start Date: Restart Oct 18 2009
Fantastic news K.T.!!
clackley is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2012, 05:30 PM   #740
Blabbermouth!!!
 
Speck333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,186
Gallery: Speck333
WOE: Semi-Primal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobear View Post
KeyTones I use pumpkin (canned) at this time of the year. I make Pumpkin-Sausage soup, cream of pumpkin soup, Dotties Pumpkin Pound Cake and several other recipes....most from Linda Sue's website. Most of the recipes have cream and some have cream cheese so I'm not sure that would work for you.

I think many of us are way more sensitive to protein overload than I would ever have imagined.

Since I've only had avocado once, could you tell me if I should look for Florida avocados or ones from California....or does it even matter?? Do you just slice the avocado and eat it? I think when I had mine it was on a salad at a restaurant and it didn't impress me one way or the other .

Hope everyone else is doing ok.

Drjlocarb I'm wonder if you had wandered into the Diabetes Miracle info before you posted your question about liver dumping every 5 hours.
I'm getting ready to make pumpkin soup right now.

Being in CA, I don't know what Florida avocados are like, but ours are "local" or from Mexico. The best ones are the dark, rough skinned ones. Haas avocados, I think. They need to be soft and room temperature. They are awesome with turkey and bacon in a low carb wrap or salad, diced and mixed with cottage cheese or scrambled eggs, sliced on top of a burger, mashed and mixed with salsa for a quick guacamole, or just eaten out of the shell with a spoon with a sprinkle of seasoned salt. The hole the pit leaves is also a natural "bowl" for a scoop of tuna, chicken or shrimp salad to sit in, and you can eat it all together. So good.
Speck333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2012, 12:15 AM   #741
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,341
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/212/??? 5/10" The real age 49
WOE: 2014 Nutritional Ketosis Experiment Begins
Start Date: LC'05,'10Paleo,'13 S.Guyenet+S.Roberts'14C.Kresser
Oh, yes, I forgot to mention it. Haas avocados are the best ones!
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2012, 11:08 AM   #742
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,926
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
Congratulations on your new low, Key Tones!

I posted a bunch of avocado-salad recipes in the recipe thread for nutritional ketosis, here: High fat, low to moderate protein recipes?

I also make guacamole by mashing an avocado and mixing in some hot sauce, lime juice, salt, chopped cilantro, and chopped tomato (tomato optional), then dip raw veggies into it.

I had thought that nutritional ketosis was the solution for me, since I lost a (for me) unprecedented 7 pounds between August 28 and September 28. Since then, despite eating low carb (under 20 grams), moderate protein (around 40 grams), and the rest fat, and keeping my calories under 1200/day, I have just fluctuated up and down a pound or two. I am thinking about trying nutritional ketosis plus JUDDD, but I'm not going to try doing down day calories plus long hours of overtime, so I probably won't start that for a few weeks.
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2012, 02:13 PM   #743
Blabbermouth!!!
 
Speck333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,186
Gallery: Speck333
WOE: Semi-Primal
svenskamae, that sucks. Sadly, experiences like yours and Cathy's are discouraging me from giving NK a full chance, still. You would think, at 1200 calories a day, you would *have* to be losing weight. BTDT. Silly people and their "calories in calories out" bs.
Speck333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2012, 06:33 PM   #744
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,926
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
Thanks, Speck. If famine hits, Cathy and I may be in a wonderful position to survive, but otherwise, this does suck. The best thing that I can say about NK is that it really does reduce my appetite to eat minimal protein and more fat, but I also feel like I am stuck with eating just little highfat snacks a couple of times a day, which gets rather irritating eventually.
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 03:30 AM   #745
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,134
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
So sorry to hear you are stuck svenskamae . I will be in the same group as you, Cathy, and drjlocarb. I haven't been testing since my insurance won't cover any of the cost of the strips, but have been doing my utmost to follow the guidelines.

My blood sugar has improved and I've been able to skip my morning insulin since I rearranged my protein to lunch and supper. I was down to high 30's low 40's on the protein and thinking about dropping it further.....but I am just not going to do it. I don't think I can sustain protein below 35g and am not really convinced that is even safe. For now I am trying to stay in the 40's for protein, 20-25g total carbs, and whatever fat it takes to satisfy me.

I actually seem to do better at slightly higher calories - 1200-1500 than I did at 900-1200. But, I get scared by all the "must be a deficit" comments in the Main Lobby and even in the NK and High Fat threads.

Speck - I don't know what to say! Lowering the protein a little below 50g has shown benefits for me, but weight loss isn't one of them. I do think it works very well for some people and maybe you would be one of them
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 02:58 PM   #746
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,926
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
The figures of 40s for protein, 20-25g total carbs, and the rest fat sounds very reasonable to me, Maureen, and are pretty much what I'm aiming for. Going below 40g protein on a regular basis means going below the minimum daily recommendation for women, and that's considered a very conservative figure.

When you say you do better at slightly higher calories, do you mean that you feel better, control your blood sugars better, or have better results in terms of weight--or all of the above?

I share the anxiety about upping calories after years and years of hearing "there must be a deficit" (including on the main board). I really am going to try doing JUDDD plus NK, since that's the only way I feel "safe" raising my calories (on up days); I'll probably start doing JUDDD (maybe with around 700 calories on down days) next week, if I'm able to wrap up a bunch of overtime work by Monday. I'll keep everybody posted on whether that works better for me, but I know it's not necessarily an option for people who are diabetic and hasn't proven to be the solution for some other stalled people here.
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:02 PM   #747
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OH/Involuntary Maint.
Posts: 1,134
Gallery: Mobear
Stats: 235/195/LESS
WOE: Bernstein
Start Date: 9/2010
Svenskamae I think that is a yes to better blood sugar, more satisfied (not looking around for stuff to eat), and less of a bounce in my weight. I got down to stall weight a few times and even slightly less (.2#). My bounce up was less than 2#. At lower calories I am not really satisfied because I've reduced the fat. My bounce seems to be more like 3 or 4#.

I really wish I could do JUDDD. I tried it but couldn't adjust the insulin fast enough and have 2 really scary (bg 40!!!) down days at 700 calories.

Good luck with your experiment .
Mobear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 10:01 PM   #748
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
Key Tones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,341
Gallery: Key Tones
Stats: 312/212/??? 5/10" The real age 49
WOE: 2014 Nutritional Ketosis Experiment Begins
Start Date: LC'05,'10Paleo,'13 S.Guyenet+S.Roberts'14C.Kresser
Svens,

Sorry to hear of your struggles. You are certainly knowledeable and researching the issue thoroughly.

All,

Here is my experiment today. I thought, what the heck, protein just at dinner!

Avocado for breakfast
Avocado for lunch
coffee with sweetener for snacks (no cream)
Premium seafood medley for dinner from Costco (boiled in chicken boullion and gelatin)
mixed berries and grapes
blended cauliflower with plenty of black and cayenne pepper, salt, no butter this time

I'm guessing 1000 calories. I was somewhat hungry during the day but felt that feel-good buzz and had that metalic taste in my mouth all day. I am not hungry at all tonight. I am sipping on some zesty lemon tea with sweetener. Pretty happy.

Wow, I feel a LOT better than I did doing the protein sparing modified fast. My skin feels good. THe only problem is, I think the avocados cause some gas. I am used to near zero gas.

I see a noticable lack of saturated fat here, but I'm not messing with it for now because I feel so much better.

I bought more of the half price salmon at QFC today. I fondled the chocolate and put it back. I didn't even feel like I wanted it! This was on my way home before dinner (just running on avocados and coffee). This is weird!

I saw the doctor today. He looked at xrays of my hips and knees and says they are perfect. Perfectly smooth joints, plenty of spacing in the knees. He called tendonitis! Ugh!!!! I have had that in my arms! Not happy!!!! He referred me to the sports medicine clinic. I hate physical therapy!

Last edited by Key Tones; 10-22-2012 at 10:04 PM..
Key Tones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2012, 07:21 PM   #749
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
drjlocarb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,267
Gallery: drjlocarb
Stats: 274 /219/190
WOE: vlc/NK
Start Date: LC-1999,jan2010 274 NK 1-1-13 at 244
Updates??
drjlocarb is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2012, 07:27 PM   #750
Major LCF Poster!
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,926
Gallery: svenskamae
Stats: 235/178/135 5'3"
WOE: Nutritional Ketosis/Primal/JUDDD
Start Date: January 15, 2012
Maureen, maybe you could let yourself have at least 1200 calories a day, since you do better at that level and it's right at the cutoff point between "lower" and "higher" for you--and is the level that Phinney suggested people try to not dip below. If you were losing weight doing the 900 calories a day, it might be worth the sacrifice, but that doesn't seem to be happening for you, sadly.

Keytones, I'm glad that you are feeling better and sorry that you have physical therapy in your future. I hope you work with someone who is skilled and gentle and makes the process as bearable as possible.

You might want to try a bit of olive oil or avocado oil drizzled on your avocadoes, if you want to get in a bit more fat and avoid dairy. I really like anchovies--I know they are one of those love it or hate it foods--and I sometimes combine olive oil, anchovies, and lemon juice and use that as a dressing over greens or avocadoes--and that's another possible source of Omega 3 fats. I note that you are also avoiding butter in that menu; you might be able to tolerate ghee better than butter, since a lot of the proteins that some people react to are skimmed off when one makes ghee. Just some suggestions, if you are looking for more fats you might tolerate okay, but certainly not necessary if what you are doing now is working well for you ...
svenskamae is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:23 AM.


Copyright ©1999-2014 Friends Forums LLC. All rights reserved. - Terms of Service | Privacy Policy
LowCarbFriends® is a registered mark of Friends Forums, LLC.