BMR!!! Eating To your BMR... No Matter What!

[Ilpirata]

Lisa sent me to the yeast thread in the main lobby and i really think there's something there. I'm SO doing the virtually dairy free thing plus starting pro biotics, ACV, and upping my CO consumption to 4 TBS a day.

I'm going to give it a month. Peanut butter and cream cheese cerainly SEEM to correllate to my stalls. I lose the BEST on zero carbs zero cheese. It may darn well be yeast which its my understanding something like 70-90 percent of us have a problem with!

[GME]

Originally Posted by Ilpirata

My frikking random number generator is back up to 211 this morning. i could practically scream.

This is eerie! I am in the. same. exact. place number-wise. I finally got to 208, but this morning I was 211. Freaky!

[Ilpirata]

This is eerie! I am in the. same. exact. place number-wise. I finally got to 208, but this morning I was 211. Freaky!

TWIN! TWIN! TWIN!

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by Ilpirata

Lisa sent me to the yeast thread in the main lobby and i really think there's something there. I'm SO doing the virtually dairy free thing plus starting pro biotics, ACV, and upping my CO consumption to 4 TBS a day.

I'm going to give it a month. Peanut butter and cream cheese cerainly SEEM to correllate to my stalls. I lose the BEST on zero carbs zero cheese. It may darn well be yeast which its my understanding something like 70-90 percent of us have a problem with!

Also when the yeast starts dying off you mght feel ill and crave the very foods that feed the yeasties.

[Zer]

Originally Posted by retroworx

Hey Zer: Not to get too nosy or in your business, but have you had a complete thyroid work-up, including TSH, Free T3 and Free T4, plus TPO Antibodies? Just wondering if there may be a medical reason for what looks like a slow-ish metabolism.

As I read what Pam and others say about a full workup, I know that I've never had a proper workup on what has been dx'd as a low-functioning thyroid. No meds EVER helped me to feel better and I am interested in finding an MD who will look at adrenals, not just thyroid. My HMO balks at doing this - or doing anything much at all. So I am planning on seeking private advice. Local nutritionist does a workup on live blood as part of a diagnostic evaluation. I am keen to see what she'd find in my own blood, now that I have been off thyroid meds for a couple of years.

I quit buying and taking meds that had no effect. Did not see any change in my body's function. So I figure the meds (synthroid for decades, then cytomel added at my request for a couple of years) were not touching what I guess to be adrenal exhaustion. I think it's a common diagnostic error. Not yet ready to take on a full diagnostic procedure, but planning to do so soon.

As a chiro told me recently, if a drug or supplement is going to work, it will show results in a few months. Well, I never saw much result from all the years of taking synthroid or thyroxin that started off as some MD's guess that I was "depressed" - and that was a dx that I chased for 35yrs before I found my true dx of Asperger's and understood that no antidepressant could EVER offset my Aspie traits. It's been a long frustrating struggle. I'm drug free today, except for the ibuprofen that I've started taking to help me top qvetching about a painful hip. I still have some pain, but I complain less when I take ibuprofen, so I figure it's helping - in some way.

Thanks for asking. I shall find a doctor and get a workup and find out just what might help improve my body's function. Meanwhile, I've got to cut my carbs down to <5% to see a good result from eating LC. I'm still too carby.

[retroworx]

Originally Posted by Zer

As I read what Pam and others say about a full workup, I know that I've never had a proper workup on what has been dx'd as a low-functioning thyroid. No meds EVER helped me to feel better and I am interested in finding an MD who will look at adrenals, not just thyroid.....

Ah, good to see you're way on top of things

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by Zer

As I read what Pam and others say about a full workup, I know that I've never had a proper workup on what has been dx'd as a low-functioning thyroid. No meds EVER helped me to feel better and I am interested in finding an MD who will look at adrenals, not just thyroid. My HMO balks at doing this - or doing anything much at all. So I am planning on seeking private advice. Local nutritionist does a workup on live blood as part of a diagnostic evaluation. I am keen to see what she'd find in my own blood, now that I have been off thyroid meds for a couple of years.

I quit buying and taking meds that had no effect. Did not see any change in my body's function. So I figure the meds (synthroid for decades, then cytomel added at my request for a couple of years) were not touching what I guess to be adrenal exhaustion. I think it's a common diagnostic error. Not yet ready to take on a full diagnostic procedure, but planning to do so soon.

As a chiro told me recently, if a drug or supplement is going to work, it will show results in a few months. Well, I never saw much result from all the years of taking synthroid or thyroxin that started off as some MD's guess that I was "depressed" - and that was a dx that I chased for 35yrs before I found my true dx of Asperger's and understood that no antidepressant could EVER offset my Aspie traits. It's been a long frustrating struggle. I'm drug free today, except for the ibuprofen that I've started taking to help me top qvetching about a painful hip. I still have some pain, but I complain less when I take ibuprofen, so I figure it's helping - in some way.

Thanks for asking. I shall find a doctor and get a workup and find out just what might help improve my body's function. Meanwhile, I've got to cut my carbs down to <5% to see a good result from eating LC. I'm still too carby.

Zer once you are on thyroid meds you are usually on them for life. The meds suppress the thryoids production of hormone and the meds take its place. So stopping the meds will not cause your thyroid to start producing hormone again. Adrenal exhaustion and hypothyroidism often go hand in hand. So by stopping your thyroid meds especially after years of taking it might not have been a good thing for you. I have thyroid nodules so I sympathize and also about the HMO. A great book about the thyroid I have learned a lot from is "The Thyroid Solution"-sorry I don't remember the author's name because I loaned it to someone at work. Here's a great website too.

Stop the Thyroid Madness

[Zer]

Thank you for the info, advice, the book title and the website. I need to be able to discuss this in an informed way, when I do find an MD to run tests according to what Pam (my thyroid guru) says provides a true picture of a person's thyroid health.

Originally Posted by lisabinil

once you are on thyroid meds you are usually on them for life.

Ah, I've heard that. But that presupposes that the meds were appropriately prescribed - which I doubt - and that meds have been monitored with adequate testing of all the aspects of thyroid function - which has never happened to me, far as I know. I think the problems I had or have may have been other than thyroid malfunction.

The meds suppress the thryoids production of hormone and the meds take its place. So stopping the meds will not cause your thyroid to start producing hormone again. Adrenal exhaustion and hypothyroidism often go hand in hand. So by stopping your thyroid meds especially after years of taking it might not have been a good thing for you. I have thyroid nodules so I sympathize and also about the HMO. A great book about the thyroid I have learned a lot from is "The Thyroid Solution".... Here's a great website too. Stop the Thyroid Madness

Well, I don't know what to do EXCEPT stop the meds, on the premise that the dx is wrong and that said meds are not helping fix whatEVER the problem may be. I figure my next testing will be on what my body can do, what I produce, without meds to affect the test. Last time I was off thyroid meds and got tested I showed a TSH of 41 - and was given a prescription to reduce that to an acceptable figure. But what other tests should have been done? I'm finding out that TSH alone is not adequate for dx and that other tests and other ratios are significant in discerning what meds are most appropriate. So, for now, I am unmedicated and hoping that my Scots-Irish genes are up to handling an unmedicated thyroid and adrenals that MAY or may not be exhausted. I have a lot of faith in my Scots-Irish genes. They seem to have pulled me through some awkward situations.

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by Zer

Thank you for the info, advice, the book title and the website. I need to be able to discuss this in an informed way, when I do find an MD to run tests according to what Pam (my thyroid guru) says provides a true picture of a person's thyroid health. Ah, I've heard that. But that presupposes that the meds were appropriately prescribed - which I doubt - and that meds have been monitored with adequate testing of all the aspects of thyroid function - which has never happened to me, far as I know. I think the problems I had or have may have been other than thyroid malfunction. Well, I don't know what to do EXCEPT stop the meds, on the premise that the dx is wrong and that said meds are not helping fix whatEVER the problem may be. I figure my next testing will be on what my body can do, what I produce, without meds to affect the test. Last time I was off thyroid meds and got tested I showed a TSH of 41 - and was given a prescription to reduce that to an acceptable figure. But what other tests should have been done? I'm finding out that TSH alone is not adequate for dx and that other tests and other ratios are significant in discerning what meds are most appropriate. So, for now, I am unmedicated and hoping that my Scots-Irish genes are up to handling an unmedicated thyroid and adrenals that MAY or may not be exhausted. I have a lot of faith in my Scots-Irish genes. They seem to have pulled me through some awkward situations.

Free T3 and free T4 along with a TPO antibodies (this checks for Hashimotos-an autoimmune disease of the thyroid). A good thread is the sticky in the Health Forum-nonstickpam has lot of good input there. If you go to the Armour thyroid med website you can find a list of docs in your area that prescribe this. The thyoid is such a complicated and frustrating organ.

[Zer]

Thanks, again, for helping me to find pertinent info on thyroid and on MDs too!

Pardon me for daring to show my face here, but I do need to hear that aiming for my BMR and protein targets - while curbing carbs at <5% - is working and that I ***CAN*** make better choices, when I've a mind to do so.

At 4am Friday...nothing but a bowl of cereal would do...
...okay, 2bowls...sigh...it was sooo good!

And it is written into my food diary...
...so I'll understand why my weight is UP
on my next venture to collect data.

Who is in charge here?
I'd just like to know.
Apparently it's not my Better Self.

That said, I am back aboard and on track at 10am;
I plan to eat fish and/or meatballs, HB eggs, bacon today.

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by Zer

Thanks, again, for helping me to find pertinent info on thyroid and on MDs too!

Pardon me for daring to show my face here, but I do need to hear that aiming for my BMR and protein targets - while curbing carbs at <5% - is working and that I ***CAN*** make better choices, when I've a mind to do so. That said, I am back aboard and on track at 10am;
I plan to eat fish and/or meatballs, HB eggs, bacon today.

Hang in there Zer and concentrate on how far and how much progess you have made. Look the big picture-2 bowls of cereal won't ruin everything for you-concentrate on the good. I know you post you like to read and another good book is "The Diet Cure" by Julia Ross and she explains what we are lacking that causes us to crave carbs like you do at night like that. You are not alone and nor are you weak! She explains and explores different aspects of the human metabolism and what we have done to ourselves, yo-yo dieting, improper nutrition, yeast issues, health issues and how to start a supplement regimen to heal yourself and how to eat to do this. She gives case studies from her clinc and this is a very interesting read. I reread it and it seems I learn something new everytime.

[lisabinil]

Zer-may I point out something I see happening with you? I do not mean to offend or overstep in any way but just want to help. t seems you have limited your WOE and cut back drastically. It seems that lowereing your carbs severely seems to cause more offplan or binge eating episodes for you. When you were eating a broader range of foods such as healthy fruits and veggies you didn't go off plan but were scared by nornal water weight fluctuations on the scale. I am at 195 lbs and have seen an 8 lb jump in water weight in one day. But I take a deep breath and realize this is my body doing this because of the health problems I have not eating too many healthy carbs. Restriction like you are doing is one of the biggest causes of offplan eating or bingeing. Listen to your body-maybe it is trying to tell you what it needs. Hypothyroidism and burned out adenals can cause water weight gain-it is temporary as you have seen-it comes off. The way to heal your metabolism is not to restrict too severely-you can damage it more.

[skeeweeaka]

Originally Posted by Ilpirata

Lisa sent me to the yeast thread in the main lobby and i really think there's something there. I'm SO doing the virtually dairy free thing plus starting pro biotics, ACV, and upping my CO consumption to 4 TBS a day.

I'm going to give it a month. Peanut butter and cream cheese cerainly SEEM to correllate to my stalls. I lose the BEST on zero carbs zero cheese. It may darn well be yeast which its my understanding something like 70-90 percent of us have a problem with!

Hey Kisha...when you do the zero carb thing, what keeps you regular. I am having a difficult time with low carb because I was so used to being regular... Now I know there are those out there who think "regular" is ridiculous, but I feel better when I am regular. Now a week ago I made sure I had 3 veggies a day and one serving of low carb fruit...getting my carbs up to about 40 and higher fat... I lost two pounds that week but my fiber was still low and I was stilll having problems in that area... However, my energy levels were much better with the added carbs...and at this point I am trying to eat healthy but something that I can sustain!

This week I'm struggling because I am not feeling well but started tracking again yesterday... I wonder if anyone else has any ideas.... I already know about Magnesium and Milk Thistle which I take but sometimes that doesn't work very well either...

TJ

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by skeeweeaka

Hey Kisha...when you do the zero carb thing, what keeps you regular. I am having a difficult time with low carb because I was so used to being regular... Now I know there are those out there who think "regular" is ridiculous, but I feel better when I am regular. Now a week ago I made sure I had 3 veggies a day and one serving of low carb fruit...getting my carbs up to about 40 and higher fat... I lost two pounds that week but my fiber was still low and I was stilll having problems in that area... However, my energy levels were much better with the added carbs...and at this point I am trying to eat healthy but something that I can sustain!

This week I'm struggling because I am not feeling well but started tracking again yesterday... I wonder if anyone else has any ideas.... I already know about Magnesium and Milk Thistle which I take but sometimes that doesn't work very well either...

TJ

You are not taking enough magesium then-up your dose until you get regular. You will know when you are taking too much when your stool becomes too loose. (I know tmi)-you can Google this. Also make sure your magnesium is chelated-it is bound to the amino acids and is absorbed into the bloodstream more easily. Avoid it in oxide form. Flaxmeal is also great for constipation. I have 2 tbl in Fage with sliced strawberries. Also adding berries like strawberries, raspberries & blueberries to your WOE will help too.

[skeeweeaka]

Originally Posted by lisabinil

You are not taking enough magesium then-up your dose until you get regular. You will know when you are taking too much when your stool becomes too loose. (I know tmi)-you can Google this. Also make sure your magnesium is chelated-it is bound to the amino acids and is absorbed into the bloodstream more easily. Avoid it in oxide form. Flaxmeal is also great for constipation. I have 2 tbl in Fage with sliced strawberries. Also adding berries like strawberries, raspberries & blueberries to your WOE will help too.

Thanks Lisa I will try upping my Magnesium then. Also, I see you eat yogurt on Atkins... I have some full fat yogurt that I would like to have so maybe I will eat some tomorrow with some ground up flax and some strawberries... Sounds yummy! Do you count all of the carbs on the packaging.... I know some people say that the carbs in yogurt are negligible... Thanks again for the tips!

Did very well eating to my BMR today...just a little over my lower limit but that is okay...carbs were inline though... FitDay Free Calorie Counter and Diet Journal:*Public Journal

TJ

[theislandgirl]

Originally Posted by lisabinil

You are not taking enough magesium then-up your dose until you get regular. You will know when you are taking too much when your stool becomes too loose. (I know tmi)-you can Google this. Also make sure your magnesium is chelated-it is bound to the amino acids and is absorbed into the bloodstream more easily. Avoid it in oxide form. [COLOR="Green"]Flaxmeal is also great for constipation. I have 2 tbl in Fage with sliced strawberries. Also adding berries like strawberries, raspberries & blueberries to your WOE will help too[/COLOR].

All high in [COLOR="Green"]soluble fiber[/COLOR]...as is chia seed and any other of the highly coloured berries you can find. Also liquids (water!) and lots of extra fat are all helpful for regularity.

You need the fat and the liquids to let the fiber do its work, they work together.

[Ilpirata]

REGULAR = COCONUT OIL! And just to clarify I never do zero carb. I am always eating a cup of veg like zucchini or green beans plus salad greens every day. What I find i have to go zero on is nuts and cheese.

[lisabinil]

I eat Fage full fat and just count the carbs.

[Zer]

Originally Posted by Ilpirata

REGULAR = COCONUT OIL! And just to clarify I never do zero carb. I am always eating a cup of veg like zucchini or green beans plus salad greens every day. What I find i have to go zero on is nuts and cheese.

Yep, my nuts are in the freezer - not at hand for munching. And cheese also is a treat, not a daily item. I want to keep broc sprouts in my menu, for the spicy bite as well as for the amazing nutrition that sprouts offer. I'm also planning on keeping bacon-basted greens and 'shrooms as part of my daily plan, in small portions, as flavorful additions to a protein-rich plan. I'm using VCO to enrich my morning hot slosh of WPP, cacao, espresso. Adding a few Tbs of VCO makes a difference in how satisfying it is, so VCO stays in. I'm also adding some VCO to things that need some moistening, like fish dishes. Adds fat and adds an interesting flavor too. I'm going to see if I can add small portions of wild rice and quinoa once or twice a week. I like the texture and I hope that I can get the benefit from adding small amounts of this carb to my menu. Having it done up in 1/2cup portions helps me manage portion control. We are building up a lot of containers that are suitable sizes for portioning out food for me. It is handy for me, when I open the fridge, to be able to grab portions sized to be less tempting than a big bowl of anything is for me. Having bacon in bags to snack on has really helped me to enjoy this treat over a longer time. Just a smaller bag. I'm hoping to re-shape my thinking about portion size, in time, as I learn to eat a wider variety of food at each meal.

Luckly, eggs come already portioned, each incredible egg in its own pkg!

[Parisfox]

Zer....have you ever tried Armour Thyroid instead of Synthroid? Synthroid is a man-made synthetic thyroid hormone. Armour is a "natural" thyroid product. It works MUCH better. Synthroid doesn't do a thing for me. Armour does. You might need to be on it for several months before you notice any difference. It's not a "magic" weight loss pill but it does work much better. However, it's really difficult to find a doctor who is willing to prescribe it since the big drug companies don't recommend it because they don't make mega-bucks from it. If you can find a doc to prescribe it, have them check your TSH AND your T3 AND your T4. Some only check the TSH and that's not sufficient.

[skeeweeaka]

Originally Posted by lisabinil

I eat Fage full fat and just count the carbs.

Ok, I'll just count them then thanks. I've missed eating yogurt... Also, upping the Magnesium did help....now I'm regular!

Originally Posted by Ilpirata

REGULAR = COCONUT OIL! And just to clarify I never do zero carb. I am always eating a cup of veg like zucchini or green beans plus salad greens every day. What I find i have to go zero on is nuts and cheese.

Oh coconut oil for you, I haven't purchased any lately...just been sticking with EVOO and butter. My mistake about the zero carb, I thought I saw that somewhere in your post... I'm trying to keep 3 veggies in my diet and one serving low carb fruit...most days so good for you on keeping the veggies in!


TJ

[Zer]

Never had Armour, but I've read a bit about it. Not willing to try it on my own, as some online seem to be doing - with some success. I'm chicken.

Originally Posted by Parisfox

Zer....have you ever tried Armour Thyroid instead of Synthroid? Synthroid is a man-made synthetic thyroid hormone. Armour is a "natural" thyroid product. It works MUCH better. Synthroid doesn't do a thing for me. Armour does. You might need to be on it for several months before you notice any difference. It's not a "magic" weight loss pill but it does work much better. However, it's really difficult to find a doctor who is willing to prescribe it since the big drug companies don't recommend it because they don't make mega-bucks from it. If you can find a doc to prescribe it, have them check your TSH AND your T3 AND your T4. Some only check the TSH and that's not sufficient.

Thanks. HMO pharmacist tells me that he has Armour, so all I need do is find an MD who know how it works - what-all to test for and HOW TO INTERPRET labwork that is done blind, with no clue what meds I'm taking or not taking. Strikes me as useless to test blindly, just as it is apparently useless to medicate for TSH to get that reading down to a range. TSH is a symptom, not a cause, I gather, so I am seeking an MD who will seek a CAUSE, not just medicate a symptom.

[lisabinil]

Originally Posted by skeeweeaka

Ok, I'll just count them then thanks. I've missed eating yogurt... Also, upping the Magnesium did help....now I'm regular!




Oh coconut oil for you, I haven't purchased any lately...just been sticking with EVOO and butter. My mistake about the zero carb, I thought I saw that somewhere in your post... I'm trying to keep 3 veggies in my diet and one serving low carb fruit...most days so good for you on keeping the veggies in!


TJ

Glad to see you are feeling better!

[duece49424]

Tj - what type of magnesium did you get? I went to the store and there were so many different kinds - there was gylcinate, chelated, m.....and a bunch more....does it make a difference what one?

[SlimMoeDee]

Hello all. I was stalled for approximately 3 weeks and came looking for advice. Upped my water intake to at least 64 oz per day (working on increasing it) and than saw this thread. For the last 4 days i've have been trying to eat to by BMR (made it 3 out of 4 days.) I am also trying to keep my proteins in line. Geez - what a balancing game!

This morning the scales showed 4 lbs lost! Finally. I don't know if it was the water or eating to BMR but i'm just glad for any kind of movement. (Skeeweeaka - this is a different type of movement than you want. lol) I think I will continue eating this way for a while and watch what happens.

Who knew how difficult it could be to get in between 1761 and 1813 calories. On top of this keep your ratios in line. Today, I had to resort to eating Spam to reach the calorie minimum. It is relatively low in carbs, high in fat, and not too high in protein. (Of course I washed some of the sodium off before cooking.)

Glad to be here.

[SlimMoeDee]

Forget the Spam idea. That didn't work. For probably only the 2nd time since July, I had hunger that led to eating like I used to eat. Not going there again.

[skeeweeaka]

Originally Posted by duece49424

Tj - what type of magnesium did you get? I went to the store and there were so many different kinds - there was gylcinate, chelated, m.....and a bunch more....does it make a difference what one?

Hey Deuce, I purchased the chelated glycinate... I usually take one, but took two and it worked like a charm... The other types didn't work for me...

Originally Posted by SlimMoeDee

Hello all. I was stalled for approximately 3 weeks and came looking for advice. Upped my water intake to at least 64 oz per day (working on increasing it) and than saw this thread. For the last 4 days i've have been trying to eat to by BMR (made it 3 out of 4 days.) I am also trying to keep my proteins in line. Geez - what a balancing game!

This morning the scales showed 4 lbs lost! Finally. I don't know if it was the water or eating to BMR but i'm just glad for any kind of movement. (Skeeweeaka - this is a different type of movement than you want. lol) I think I will continue eating this way for a while and watch what happens.

Who knew how difficult it could be to get in between 1761 and 1813 calories. On top of this keep your ratios in line. Today, I had to resort to eating Spam to reach the calorie minimum. It is relatively low in carbs, high in fat, and not too high in protein. (Of course I washed some of the sodium off before cooking.)

Glad to be here.

Hey Slim I will take ANY type of movement I can get.... Four pounds please...it takes me months to lose that! Congrats to you on the weight loss, now you've got me working on my water intake ! Hey whatever it takes!!!

TJ

[theislandgirl]

Originally Posted by SlimMoeDee

Forget the Spam idea. That didn't work. For probably only the 2nd time since July, I had hunger that led to eating like I used to eat. Not going there again.

Yeah, I hear you on that! The carbs it DOES have are refined sugars/dextrose, or some such. Nasty.

CO, mayo with anything (tuna), avocado, some macadamias, even an "egg cream": these are great calorie boosters that DON'T have that spam effect on me.

[Zer]

394.4 is today's data, to start my week off on a solid footing. No illusions. I've been all over the 390s during July and August, hope to abandon them soon - to spend October in the 380s as I lighten my load and adapt to having all sorts of LC menu items in the fridge: salmon, porky-meatballs, bacon, with baconbasted greens and 'shrooms on the side. Also liverwurst with broccoli sprouts. Add a few avocados and an occasional can of tuna in olive oil. HB eggs, the incredible edible egg. Sardines. Good eats! Ah, cheesy treats in Melle's Cheatos with Asiago. That's living about as good as I am able. Onions? Yes, and leeks as well, flavoring greens and 'shrooms too! With all of that to select from, what can tempt me to stray? Not much, I imagine! I hope!

[WenB]

I've fallen off the wagon, but I'm back and determined again.

The stress of the hurricane and lack of ability to plan for a trip this weekend led to a carb-fest I knew what I was doing and did it anyway.

Tomorrow I'm back to my BMR eating with low carbs - today I'm going to bombard my system with water (in the past 10 days I've averaged 16 oz a day vs my 3 liters a day and that's more important than the BMR, IMHO).

Breakfast - 3 oz espresso w/ 4 oz HWC and 1 liter of water - still working on it
Lunch - sardiens and 1.5 liters of water and maybe a salad
Dinner - more water and some homemade pimento cheese on pork rinds