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Old 03-23-2014, 02:49 PM   #1
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The benefits of slower weight loss

The benefits of fast weight loss are obvious ... it keeps us motivated, we really see the progress happening in a short time frame, the scale goes down at a rate that is rewarding, and it all just happens faster. I think it's what we tend to hope for when we start a weight loss program (I can lose X pounds by this summer if I lose 2 pounds a week every week!).

That's kind of what happened for me in the beginning when I weighed 273 pounds. I lost about 7 pounds a month, and it was very motivating.

Things have slowed down now, though, and I've decided that despite the reunion with my skinny college roommates in July, I'm not going to be in a rush. I want to make progress, but think there's benefits to slower losses. Feel free to add to these ideas!
  • Greater maintenance of lean body mass
  • Gives your skin more time to adjust to the deflation.
  • Helps keep your metabolism up

That's what comes to mind for now, but I know there's more. What am I leaving out?
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Old 03-23-2014, 03:43 PM   #2
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Well, all I can say is that my skin shows obvious effects of deflation
So if slower loss help in that area you will be very pleased.
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Old 03-23-2014, 04:02 PM   #3
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Taking the time to make it a WOE not a diet, thus more prepared for maintenance.

Not starving along the way!
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:08 PM   #4
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Sheila - that's an important one, about making it a WOE.

Carly - I probably won't be able to avoid loose skin completely, but I'm trying to look at all the bright sides of being a turtle. I do kind of think that because I've been about the same size for 7 months, the looser skin I did have seems to have reduced? Possibly muscle also helps.
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Old 03-24-2014, 03:39 AM   #5
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Unless people have to lose dramatic amounts very quickly because it's medically exigent (e.g., surgery being delayed because of it) I think that slower loss has the potential to reduce the stress of calorie restriction on the body when it's somebody who has been overweight/obese for some time. In a case such as this, the body's been subjected to higher levels of inflammatory substances derived from the fat mass and the hormones released from that.

Alongside the issue of metabolic adaptation, I wonder if careful pacing of the loss (however that schedule looks) can prevent the unhelpful changes that women demonstrate with respect to the 3,500kcal = +/- 1 lb
Adel Moussa's written about this in his Suppversity blog.
Blogpost: Busting the 3,500kcal = 1lbs Weight Loss Myth! A Scientific Deconstruction of a Dumb Rule of Thumb Reveals that Women Need More, Men Less Than the "Rule" Predicts
Quote:
ndependent of the degree of calorie reduction (low calorie = -25%; very low calorie = 890kcal per day) and the sex of the subject, the caloric deficit that was necessary to shed 1lbs of body weight (not fat!) increased from week 1 to the end of week 3...
Both, the baseline, as well as the gradual increase in calorie reduction that was necessary to shed 1lbs of body weight in the course of the 24d study period was greater in the very low calorie arm of the CALERIE study...This, btw, is clearcut evidence for the fallacy of starvation diets.
On both diets, women had a significantly harder time losing weight than men. This was even more obvious in the low calorie (-25%) than in the very low calorie arm
Looking at the data, even in a short-term study like this, some women had to notionally have deficits of approx 4,200kcals to shed 1 lb of adipose tissue. In one arm of the same study, some of the men only needed to expend approx. 2,600 kcals to shed that 1 lb of fat and none of them needed to expend 3,500kcals.

Looking at both arms of that study, the very low calorie protocol was a metabolic mess for both sexes. Plus, I think it's amounting to a Freudian slip that I can't find the link for this other study but I did read a foul one that indicates that if there's weight rebound after the above circumstances, women can find themselves only needing to eat an excess 2,700kcals or so in order to lay down 1 lb of fat (less than 2,700kcals if the kcals come from dietary fat which can have a 94% efficiency conversion rate in digestion).

My speculation is that for people who've dieted previously, or who have been overweight/obese for substantial periods of time, there may well be what's described as post-dieting syndrome in the Fat Trap article by Tara Parker-Pope in the NYT in 2011.
Quote:
While researchers have known for decades that the body undergoes various metabolic and hormonal changes while it’s losing weight, the Australian team detected something new. A full year after significant weight loss, these [weight-reduced] men and women remained in what could be described as a biologically altered state. Their still-plump bodies were acting as if they were starving and were working overtime to regain the pounds they lost. For instance, a gastric hormone called ghrelin, often dubbed the “hunger hormone,” was about 20 percent higher than at the start of the study. Another hormone associated with suppressing hunger, peptide YY, was also abnormally low. Levels of leptin, a hormone that suppresses hunger and increases metabolism, also remained lower than expected. A cocktail of other hormones associated with hunger and metabolism all remained significantly changed compared to pre-dieting levels. It was almost as if weight loss had put their bodies into a unique metabolic state, a sort of post-dieting syndrome that set them apart from people who hadn’t tried to lose weight in the first place.

“What we see here is a coordinated defense mechanism with multiple components all directed toward making us put on weight,” Proietto says. “This, I think, explains the high failure rate in obesity treatment.”

While the findings from Proietto and colleagues, published this fall in The New England Journal of Medicine, are not conclusive — the study was small and the findings need to be replicated — the research has nonetheless caused a stir in the weight-loss community, adding to a growing body of evidence that challenges conventional thinking about obesity, weight loss and willpower. For years, the advice to the overweight and obese has been that we simply need to eat less and exercise more. While there is truth to this guidance, it fails to take into account that the human body continues to fight against weight loss long after dieting has stopped.
This is, of course, in line with Dr Barbara Berkeley's Refuse to Regain discussion of the differences between lifetime previously obese weight maintainers and those who've lose smaller amounts or haven't been overweight/obese for that long.
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Old 03-24-2014, 06:40 AM   #6
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I've been losing pretty slowly. A good side effect is that people who notice me losing weight are not concerned about me. Something else is that my body is probably reshaping at the same time, not after losing weight so how I will look like is more predictable and I am getting used to the new me better this way. Plus, I heard that it will be harder to regain after a slow weight loss. But it is nice to see the number on the scale drop sometimes as well
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Old 03-24-2014, 07:48 AM   #7
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I have been trying to see this as a positive thing too, Chris. I think I might be experiencing some of what Mike relayed in LCG's thread...I can follow protocol well for a few days, then I'm overeating or not sticking to the numbers consistently and lo and behold, no weight loss. I'm going to experiment with the 1700/700 plan AGAIN lol. DDs are easy(ish), but UDs not so much.

Last edited by Librarygirl; 03-24-2014 at 07:50 AM..
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Old 03-24-2014, 08:23 AM   #8
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From what I have read there are toxins and hormones (like estrogen) stored in our body fat and as we diet and lose body fat those toxins and hormones are released complicating the weight loss. Losing slower will slow down the release of those toxins/hormones but still can complicate issues.

The bulletproof fast protocol calls for taking activated charcoal throughout the day to absorb those toxins and blunt the negative effects. You need to take it away from other supplements/medicines so it does not affect those. I'm not sure it works or not but it make sense. It might just be a way to market his own activated charcoal product too, but I'm not sure it could hurt to try during active periods where your trying to burn/lose fat.
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Old 03-24-2014, 10:16 AM   #9
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Seems that people who lose really fast also put it back on really fast.

So, one of the benefits of JUDDD (which to me is moderate loss) is that when it goes off it stays off.
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Old 03-24-2014, 10:23 AM   #10
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I lost fairly quickly and have the battle scars to prove it, saggy wrinkly skin being the most noticeable. I also put weight on VERY quickly when I allow a few free days. Perhaps this wouldn't have been such an issue if I had lost more slowly.
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Old 03-24-2014, 03:17 PM   #11
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I'm really trying to wrap my head around the fact that losing more slowly is truly better for me. I believe it to be true, and I want to believe that I'll lose more consistently if I do that. I'm trying hard not to be impatient and want the weight to just fall off and stay off. Reality, here I come.
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Old 03-24-2014, 03:27 PM   #12
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I get what you're saying, Carol. It's what we all want, but reality isn't always agreeable. I have had such slow losses, I have had to become okay with it or give up. The one drawback of slow losses, for me, is that it is much harder to knuckle down and get past plateaus. I haven't given up, but only losing a lb or two over a long period of time makes it difficult if there is ever a break or unavoidable multiple UDs...then it's knuckle down and get those few lbs off--then another break. Result: maintenance.
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Old 03-24-2014, 03:37 PM   #13
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Yes, Cindy. And I just want to say how proud I am of you that you DO NOT GIVE UP! It is tough to keep plugging along without the added motivation of seeing the scale moving down on a regular basis. You are a stronger lady than you realize!
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Old 03-24-2014, 09:07 PM   #14
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I got the calculator out today and figured out that I have been losing an average of 1.3 pounds per week since my re-start. That's slow. But at least it's going slowly in the right direction.
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Old 03-24-2014, 10:04 PM   #15
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Yam, in light of some of our recent threads, that seems a wonderful pace to maximize fat loss and minimize muscle loss ... and, with all your exercise, you very likely have also added some muscle which would make it even more than it seems. As someone who has NOT gone in the right direction, I think that's fantastic!
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Old 03-24-2014, 10:05 PM   #16
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I agree with Christina, Yam. You're doing great! And right now I'd take that pace with a smile and a happy dance.
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Old 03-25-2014, 06:33 AM   #17
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Me three!!! In the time you've lost 16 lbs, Yam, I've stayed almost exactly the same weight lol.
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Old 03-25-2014, 10:27 AM   #18
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I know it's better for me to lose weight slowly and I really don't want to put the weight back on. I feel my body reshaping, but every now and then I step on the scale and I think what is wrong with me? Why can't I lose weight right now.

I started JUDDD on 2/16/2013 and took a break 3/1/2014. I've been on and off all month, but it's been great because I reached a little bit of a plateau and I just wasn't committed because I was feeling over the entire process which tends to happen when you're dieting.
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Old 03-25-2014, 01:05 PM   #19
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It's really better to lose slowly and keep it off while really getting use to your new WOE so that you don't need to crash diet or worry about falling off the wagon. If your WOE if your WOL than you're set.
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Old 03-30-2014, 01:26 PM   #20
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Thanks Cindy, Carol and Chris! I've decided I'm pretty jazzed about my seemingly slow weight loss with JUDDD. Mostly it's because it actually stays off! If I go out of town like I did last week, have 3 UDs in a row and then jump back in, at least 3 things happen.

1. I don't gain as much during those "free" days as I did on other WOEs.

2. I really, really, really look forward to my welcome home DD and getting back into rotations! Honestly there has never ever been another diet where I look forward to getting back to it after a break.

3. With JUDDD the vacation weight comes right back off. Usually within 2 DD rotations.

So, that's what I mean about it staying off. It's not that it doesn't bounce up after free or free-for-all days, but it's almost like phantom weight that's not real. Otherwise it wouldn't disappear so quickly.

Friday was my first DD back from my trip and half the weight is gone, gone, gone. Today is my second DD since that vacation and I fully expect to be back to pre-vacay weight tomorrow morning.

And then, I'm looking forward to this next week to see if I can drop even lower to a new re-start low. It's all good with JUDDD!
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Old 03-31-2014, 10:09 AM   #21
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Well JBs, I just returned from a lovely cruise and I have some very positive JUDDD news to share.

The first day I tried to do a DD; that DD turned into a MD. The next day I thought, hmm, I better at least do a 1200 cal day; that did not happen and instead turned into an UD. Everyday was either an UD or an UUAD and everyday I ate what I wanted, but only when hungry and only until full (not stuffed). I had a few snacks and treats when I really felt like them. I drank wine with dinner every night and had a few sugary mai tai kind of drinks as well. I was not dieting at all.

By the time I returned home I had been eating what I liked, including sugar and breads and sauces and alcohol for over eight days.

But this time, a couple of things were very different:

1) Once I got home I way able to do a DD without any trouble; this is in stark contrast to every other time I have dieted, where, once past a several day off-diet period, there was just no turning back and I would be unable to control my eating until I had put most (if not all or more) of the weight back on.

And 2) I did not gain any weight.

I feel like I have had some kind of metabolic repair process happening in my body, and my ability to control myself and my body's ability to maintain status quo while surrounded by all that food is the proof of it. I count myself amongst the slow losers group, and perhaps this is another up side of being in that group.

JUDDD magic in action!

Last edited by Macci; 03-31-2014 at 10:12 AM..
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Old 03-31-2014, 10:16 AM   #22
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That’s brilliant, Macci!
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Old 03-31-2014, 10:29 AM   #23
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Awesome update, Macci!

Sounds like you had a lovely time and did not have to stress out about food.

The no-gain and getting easily back to a DD is indeed the JUDDD magic in action.

So glad you posted about this. Great news!
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Old 03-31-2014, 11:52 AM   #24
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I am so thrilled to read this, Macci! What a wonderful result after a fabulous vacation where you didn't deny yourself.
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Old 03-31-2014, 01:08 PM   #25
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Can't beat THAT with a stick!!!!!

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Old 03-31-2014, 01:15 PM   #26
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Thanks Ailuros, Yam-Yam, Low Carb Gal and Gotitnow for your kind words! I sure hope everyone who has not yet made it gets to the same place -- I know it took me a while.
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Old 03-31-2014, 01:42 PM   #27
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Sounds great, Macci!!! The only thing I was wondering is why did you attempt a DD or a MD on a cruise? Thankfully, you did not need to diet!!!
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Old 03-31-2014, 01:48 PM   #28
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Well done Macci. I'm pleased you've settled back so readily and with such peace of mind and good body-awareness.
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Old 04-01-2014, 10:17 AM   #29
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yay!!

Macci!

This is the thing i was just about ready to start a thread about as I will be traveling to france and for several days wont be able to cook my own food.

I am delighted to know of your experience on the cruise.

How nice for you to have had your cake and be able to eat it too,

to have had your cruise holiday and enjoyed the food without
having to forfeit the hard work you have done before.

lets hope others will be able to do the same!

I especially like the thing about your being able to jump back into juddd immediately!
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Old 04-01-2014, 10:43 AM   #30
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Woohoo I just figured out multi quotes (I think) here goes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSure View Post
Well done Macci. I'm pleased you've settled back so readily and with such peace of mind and good body-awareness.
Thanks SlowSure, it really does feel great. Quite a confidence booster, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarygirl View Post
Sounds great, Macci!!! The only thing I was wondering is why did you attempt a DD or a MD on a cruise? Thankfully, you did not need to diet!!!
Lol, you know LG, I read your post, then kinda tilted my head sideways and thought, yeah, why did I try to diet on a cruise!? Thanks for your awesome cheers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MillyBee View Post
Macci!

This is the thing i was just about ready to start a thread about as I will be traveling to france and for several days wont be able to cook my own food.

I am delighted to know of your experience on the cruise.

How nice for you to have had your cake and be able to eat it too,

to have had your cruise holiday and enjoyed the food without
having to forfeit the hard work you have done before.

lets hope others will be able to do the same!

I especially like the thing about your being able to jump back into juddd immediately!
Thank you, Millybee; I sure hope everyone has the same experience, too. I really did have my (weight maintaining)cake and eat it too! Every day! I agree that it was so great to be able to get back on board with the DDs. That was liberating for me. The exercise, as much as I hate to admit it, really helps too.
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