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Old 03-22-2014, 11:51 PM   #31
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I found some interesting info on a site called Body Recomposition, called "Why Big Caloric Deficits and Lots of Activity Can Hurt Fat Loss." The author is a trainer, and I'll quote some of the more interesting passages:
Quote:
. . . One oddity that I’ve seen (and personally experienced) over the years is one where the combination of very large caloric deficits and very large amounts of activity (especially higher-intensity activity) can cause problems for people either stalling or slowing fat loss.
Quote:
In any case, dieting in general is a stress. And of course training is a stress. And the more extreme you do of each, the more of a stress occurs. And I suspect that a lot of what is going on when folks try to combine excessive caloric deficits with massive amounts of activity is that cortisol just goes through the roof (there’s another issue I’ll come back to at the end that relates to this). Simply, you get these massive chronic elevations in cortisol levels.
Tangentially, this is also one reason I suspect that various types of cyclical dieting help with some of this issue. For at least brief periods, when calories are raised to maintenance or above, you break the diet/training induced elevations in cortisol.
Quote:
But that’s probably not all of what’s going on. Another effect of chronically elevated cortisol levels is leptin resistance in the brain. I’m not going to talk about leptin endlessly here again, you can read the Bodyweight Regulation Series for more information. When the normal leptin signal to the brain is blocked, a lot of things can go wrong metabolically and I suspect that this is part of the problem.
In this vein, although not necessarily related to cortisol per se, at least one study found that the addition of 6 hours per week of aerobic activity to a very low calorie diet (in this case a protein sparing modified fast) caused a larger decrement in metabolic rate than the diet alone. The body appears to monitor caloric availability (simplistically caloric intake minus output) and if it gets too low, bad things can happen.

Last edited by calichris; 03-23-2014 at 12:03 AM..
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:54 AM   #32
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Chris,
This is such interesting stuff. Perhaps it's because I don't weigh and therefore look for other signs of progress or not, but your quotes and others like them resonate with my own observations:
- my hot flashes worsen after really low DDs and if I wait too long to eat on UDs. It's as though my body is waving a red stress flag around caloric restriction. It's fantastic, because it's really helping me find my own sweet spot with timing, caloric intake, and even macros.
- I was a competitive athlete growing up and trotted two marathons and a good number of half marathons as an adult and feel certain that aerobic exercise, although wonderful for many reasons (happiness, vitality, adventure), never ever helped with weight loss for me.
- although I like the idea of going back to weighing without it freaking me out, I have too great a tendency for that number to become THE Marker, the number of all numbers, the pass or fail indicator.
There's something great and sane for me in following hot flashes, sleep quality, happiness, vitality, muscle mass, and the fit of my pants.
I absolutely know that the slow pace of weight loss would drive me mad if I were watching it daily, and that it would lead me to pay less attention to the other signs.
Anyway, thanks for passing such great information along.
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:09 AM   #33
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I hope you all work out your individual needs. We are such complex animals.

I exercise because I genuinely feel better when I do, I guess my workouts are kind of light, but at 66 I am happy with them. I do aerobic/conditioing classes with light weights and some Zumba, occasional Combat that's it.

I have been getting in more regular workouts for the past month and my weigh is right at goal. So I seem to be doing something right.
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:30 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kissa View Post
I hope you all work out your individual needs. We are such complex animals.

I exercise because I genuinely feel better when I do, I guess my workouts are kind of light, but at 66 I am happy with them. I do aerobic/conditioing classes with light weights and some Zumba, occasional Combat that's it.

I have been getting in more regular workouts for the past month and my weigh is right at goal. So I seem to be doing something right.
That's for sure, Cindy. So glad for all kinds of success here. It's amazing to witness.
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Old 03-23-2014, 11:16 AM   #35
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When I was a teenager, I loved basketball and tennis (gym class), but other than gym class, I never exercised other than walking. I love walking, but my knees and feet can't handle it. When I lose enough weight that I won't do more damage, I'll start walking again, but will watch to see if it affects weight loss (which has priority for now). Thanks for starting this thread.
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Old 03-23-2014, 03:39 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kissa View Post
I hope you all work out your individual needs. We are such complex animals.

I exercise because I genuinely feel better when I do, I guess my workouts are kind of light, but at 66 I am happy with them. I do aerobic/conditioing classes with light weights and some Zumba, occasional Combat that's it.

I have been getting in more regular workouts for the past month and my weigh is right at goal. So I seem to be doing something right.
Cindy, I hope to be able to maintain the way you do! Having fun, vacations, wine with the neighbor on a down day if it happens .... no worries, make it up next time ... down days when needed, exercising, keeping active ... I just love the sound of that! I am going to keep that as my vision of the future.
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:16 PM   #37
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Me, too, Chris, me too!
We are so blessed w/ wonderful examples!!
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Old 03-24-2014, 08:42 AM   #38
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Thank you both. I am blessed not only with all of you great folks to support me but a wonderful family and friends too. Time to count my blessings once more.
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Old 03-24-2014, 09:14 AM   #39
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I'm so glad we have so much input here.

I actually don't agree with the calorie theory... maybe I read too much. I read Zoe Harcombe's book a few years ago and it convinced me. It's still a theory after all. To me, Juddd isn't really about the calories, it's about what intermittent fasting causes to happen in the body.

I think for now, I will increase my DD calories a little bit here and there, when I feel I need it (50-100 calories) because I still want to exercise on DD. I have decided to change up my type of exercise. I'll run one day a week for 20-30 minutes (only because I've worked so hard to get there, and I enjoy it and feel good after so I don't want to nix it altogether), and the other days switch it up - DD's I plan to do more moderate exercise, and throw in HIIIT 2-3 days a week. Plus my weights as usual. I did HIIT twice last week after I posted this thread, and I'm back down to 159.6. Not that one thing has to do with the other, because frankly I have no idea. But I weighed so might as well throw it out there.

Plus I have been researching body building sites a little bit, and they talk a lot about how cardio is not so good - lowers your metabolic rate over time - but HIIT keeps your body confused and only have to do 20 minutes a few times a week - helps maintain muscle and burns fat, that's what they say. So we'll see. I certainly don't want to lose muscle, but it's nice to SHRINK altogether and sometimes that can mess with my head.

One thing is for sure, I feel like HIIT is easier than running nonstop... and with HIIT you're supposed to push yourself to your max for 30 seconds or so, which I certainly did aim for. But overall, running is harder for me, and I sweat way more with running. But none of this seems to be what we all think it is, or what we've always been taught - and it'd be crazy for me to keep doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result, right? lol.

Good luck to everyone to figure this out! We can do it!!!
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