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Old 02-10-2014, 03:36 PM   #1
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Please Tell Me Others Had The Same Problem Starting...

I have attempted four (five?) DDs now, and everyone of them ends in failure.

I get to about 1 pm and it all goes downhill quickly.

This time, I had a dull headache that made me feel crummy all around, so I planned on eating cottage cheese when I got home. Well, the day ended in McDonald's

I *did* stay below my UD calories, but that is pointless without DDs.

I wonder if I should just stick with 18:6 or 16:8 IF and stick to TDEE - 20% to lose. At least then I'd have a chance of sticking to it.

I just wanted this to work so bad. But I feel like crap when I realize how poor my willpower really is.
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:11 PM   #2
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It can be really hard starting! This is a drastic change of eating for most of us, and your body may be fighting it. Trying 18:6 may be a good start, then once you've got that under your belt, you can see if you can extent your fasts longer. Once your head and your stomach are on board, you won't have the struggles anymore...or rarely.

Please don't beat yourself up about it! I'm glad you're posting your frustrations, because all you need is some encouragement, and you'll get there. Keep reading up on all the fantastic results, both on scale and off, that many of us are having. That will keep you going! Let us help!
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:20 PM   #3
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I kind of do 16:8 naturally, as I am not a breakfast person and usually don't get home from classes until 1. I am absolutely no issues with that. I really don't know where the headache came from today.

I wonder if chicken broth in the morning would help, or make me even hungrier.
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:24 PM   #4
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Chicken broth helps me, along with spice. I add a Serrano pepper or hot sauce to broth.

I'm curious though about your religious fasting. Is it different from JUDDD fasting?

Some of us struggle in the beginning and some don't. It's very individual.
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:26 PM   #5
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And LoCarbGal, WOW! 144.5 lbs lost?! Amazing!
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:28 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeirasMom View Post
Chicken broth helps me, along with spice. I add a Serrano pepper or hot sauce to broth.

I'm curious though about your religious fasting. Is it different from JUDDD fasting?

Some of us struggle in the beginning and some don't. It's very individual.
In the Orthodox Church, there are different types of fasts. On Wednesdays and Fridays, we are supposed to go vegan. For Lent as well.

We are supposed to eat as little as possible when we fast, but I am very new to the Church, so this fasting is still tricky for me.

ETA: Also, do you drink broth in the morning or when a craving hits? I wonder if it would make me hungrier like food does, or hit the spot.
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:39 PM   #7
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Sorry you are struggling, Eli. Maybe you could start with 5:2 and ease into JUDDD? Make your DD numbers as high as possible and work your way down.

There are lots of JUDDDers who started out at 800 and worked their way down. Some even found they could stay there and still lose.

Also, you need to evaluate what's going on in your life. Is this the best time to incorporate a new WOE when you are making other changes at the same time?

You are definitely not alone with DD struggles. The important thing is that you ARE trying.

Come here anytime you need to talk. We are all here for you!
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:46 PM   #8
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My husband and I are living with his mother at the moment, so it may be easier to do 1,400 cal/day and aim for 400/2000 in a few months when we are gone.
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:57 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elisheva View Post
In the Orthodox Church, there are different types of fasts. On Wednesdays and Fridays, we are supposed to go vegan. For Lent as well.

We are supposed to eat as little as possible when we fast, but I am very new to the Church, so this fasting is still tricky for me.

ETA: Also, do you drink broth in the morning or when a craving hits? I wonder if it would make me hungrier like food does, or hit the spot.
I rarely have it any more, but it was a lifesaver in the beginning. I would have it whenever I felt too hungry to make it to a meal time. Usually just once or twice per day, and it would really do the trick.

I think if you can power through a few down days, with some of the tricks posted on this board, it might make your religious fasts even easier. Or even just start out trying to do vegan DDs, eating as much as you want at first. If it's mainly raw or steamed veggies, you can have a lot of volume for low calories.
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Old 02-10-2014, 05:08 PM   #10
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And LoCarbGal, WOW! 144.5 lbs lost?! Amazing!
Thank you! I'm glad to see the JBs (JUDDD BUDDDs) rallying around you. You'll figure it out. Very interesting about your religious fasting. Is it Greek Orthodox, Russian? You don't have to answer if you're not comfortable.
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Old 02-10-2014, 05:12 PM   #11
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Thank you! I'm glad to see the JBs (JUDDD BUDDDs) rallying around you. You'll figure it out. Very interesting about your religious fasting. Is it Greek Orthodox, Russian? You don't have to answer if you're not comfortable.
I happen to be part of a Greek Orthodox parish, but overall, all of the Orthodox churches follow the same fasting rules. There may be a few cultural exceptions, but I can't think of any.
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Old 02-10-2014, 05:18 PM   #12
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I will try again tomorrow. I'll aim for 400, but if I need to go over I won't go full-blown Up Day, or Medium Day.
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Old 02-10-2014, 05:59 PM   #13
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You're getting some good advice here and I'm sure you'll take it to heart...don't try to rush it, relax and let it come. As it will, I know. Sounds like you're making a lot of changes in your life right now which may be making it more difficult. A lot of new JB's are not used to counting calories which can add to the difficulty as well.

Try starting at the higher end of your calorie allowance and ease into the program. And, making your DD's vegetable days would certainly help, too.

Above all, don't beat yourself up. Take it one day at a time and if you slip a little, relax and get back to the program...don't think because you had a few more calories than you think you should, don't say to yourself that you've lost it for the day and continue eating. Take a deep breath, drink some water, and climb back on the program.

You can do this, but if you don't...so what? try something new, the 5:2, for instance...that would fit in with your religious fasting. Many folks have lost a lot of weight by just fasting 17 hours every day, doing the fast-five, for instance. Research has shown that by fasting just 17 hours, you get many of the benefits of the ADF.

We're here for you if you need us...check back and let us know how you're doing...post on the daily chat, the daily weigh-in, whatever...there's always someone around....hugs!
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:10 PM   #14
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Tomorrow's plan:

Snack: 100cal worth of sunflower seeds
Lunch (about 2pm): 1/4 cup cottage cheese
Dinner: 2 hb eggs with mustard and salt (saw this in the low carb DD staples thread and my mouth is salivating thinking about it... Yum!)

I'll carry a thermos with chicken broth as I won't be home until 2.

I'm thinking a green pepper, baby carrots, and black olives platter with ranch along with the eggs.

I think that will bring me to about 600 - 700 cals.
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mssarge View Post
You're getting some good advice here and I'm sure you'll take it to heart...don't try to rush it, relax and let it come. As it will, I know. Sounds like you're making a lot of changes in your life right now which may be making it more difficult. A lot of new JB's are not used to counting calories which can add to the difficulty as well.

Try starting at the higher end of your calorie allowance and ease into the program. And, making your DD's vegetable days would certainly help, too.

Above all, don't beat yourself up. Take it one day at a time and if you slip a little, relax and get back to the program...don't think because you had a few more calories than you think you should, don't say to yourself that you've lost it for the day and continue eating. Take a deep breath, drink some water, and climb back on the program.

You can do this, but if you don't...so what? try something new, the 5:2, for instance...that would fit in with your religious fasting. Many folks have lost a lot of weight by just fasting 17 hours every day, doing the fast-five, for instance. Research has shown that by fasting just 17 hours, you get many of the benefits of the ADF.

We're here for you if you need us...check back and let us know how you're doing...post on the daily chat, the daily weigh-in, whatever...there's always someone around....hugs!
Thank you so much!

I keep reminding myself that tracking my calories, even if I do go over is a great practice in awareness. I'm not really gaining, more maintaining.
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:27 PM   #16
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That's very good and a great start...I meant to ask if you were keeping a food diary as well as counting calories? Many of our JB's have discovered "trigger foods" that encourage them to go off program. For instance, if I have grains, it will make me hungrier for more grains. If I have protein with them, not so much. I've pretty much stuck with trying for 500 kcals on my DD's and I'm doing pretty well, if I do say so myself.

Oh! and another good suggestion for when you're starting the program is to plan on the same menu every DD...when I was losing the most weight, I would have a veggie egg-white omelet with a couple slices of turkey bacon for breakfast, a veggie plate for lunch; celery, carrot stick, bell pepper, radishes, raw turnip slices, etc.. and the chicken, cabbage & laughing cow cheese thingie. so filling and lasts all day long. (if you haven't checked the thread on that, it's really easy, I'd buy chicken breasts, cut them in half, and quick saute the three ounces or so of chicken, add a cup or so, more if I was really hungry, and stir fry that until the cabbage wilts, add one (or two if calories allowed) laughing cow cheese wedge (they come in so many delicious flavors) to make the dish creamy...very easy, quick and very filling.) Sometimes I'd buy one of the grocery store rotisserie chicken (like today) and use it for the dish.

Can't emphasize enough that having the same thing every DD makes it so much easier.

Last edited by Mssarge; 02-10-2014 at 06:36 PM..
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:32 PM   #17
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I'm brand new to JUDDD, but I'm not new to IF or fasting for religious reasons. The only tip I have is that I have one high fat/low carb meal at lunchtime. That way I'm not going so long without food that I become ravenous and the high fat content keeps me satiated through the rest of the day. If I have some calories left and I'm hungry in the evening I will snack on some bell pepper or fruit. If I don't have any calories left, then I just chug some water and head to bed early. Hope that helps!

Don't be so hard on yourself, you'll figure out what works best for you.
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mssarge View Post
That's very good and a great start...I meant to ask if you were keeping a food diary as well as counting calories? Many of our JB's have discovered "trigger foods" that encourage them to go off program. For instance, if I have grains, it will make me hungrier for more grains. If I have protein with them, not so much. I've pretty much stuck with trying for 500 kcals on my DD's and I'm doing pretty well, if I do say so myself.

Oh! and another good suggestion for when you're starting the program is to plan on the same menu every DD...when I was losing the most weight, I would have a veggie egg-white omelet with a couple slices of turkey bacon for breakfast, a veggie plate for lunch; celery, carrot stick, bell pepper, radishes, raw turnip slices, etc.. and the chicken, cabbage & laughing cow cheese thingie. so filling and lasts all day long. (if you haven't checked the thread on that, it's really easy, I'd buy chicken breasts, cut them in half, and quick saute the three ounces or so of chicken, add a cup or so, more if I was really hungry, and stir fry that until the cabbage wilts, add one (or two if calories allowed) laughing cow cheese wedge (they come in so many delicious flavors) to make the dish creamy...very easy, quick and very filling.) Sometimes I'd buy one of the grocery store rotisserie chicken (like today) and use it for the dish.

Can't emphasize enough that having the same thing every DD makes it so much easier.
I will have blood sugar crashes with carbs alone. Carbs also make me ravenously hungry.

I think keeping the same menu sounds good too. It is easier than scrambling for food while hungry.
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Old 02-10-2014, 07:07 PM   #19
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Absolutely!!! Who wants to think about food when you're hungry...the same foods make it much easier.

My go-to's include a nice big salad with the 3 oz of chicken tossed into...of course, I don't use much, if any dressing...I like just lemon juice or vinegar to dress the salad.

I'll heat a can of chicken broth, add a half-stalk of celery and a couple of baby carrots sliced, add the chicken breast or stir in a beaten egg to make egg-drop soup.

I keep a bag of baby spinach around too, makes great addition to all of these things, too..particularly the egg-drop soup.

the chicken, cabbage & lc cheese thingie

I"ve also some low carb tortillas that make a nice quesadella with non-fat cheese

for breakfast, try adding chopped veggies to the egg-whites to make it more filling

Sometimes egg-whites just doesn't do it, so I always have boiled eggs in the fridge, one large egg is 75 calories and is very filling, particularly if I have one just before leaving the house...so I'm not hanging around the house where food is accessible.
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Old 02-11-2014, 03:19 PM   #20
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Good luck to you, elisheva. If I'm not mistaken, I saw where you had a good DD yesterday? It takes time and practice to master DDs for some of us, and lots of us never have extremely low DDs. It sounds like you have a good plan for tomorrow too! Planning things that you actually look forward to having is a step in the right direction.
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Old 02-11-2014, 03:27 PM   #21
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Good luck to you, elisheva. If I'm not mistaken, I saw where you had a good DD yesterday? It takes time and practice to master DDs for some of us, and lots of us never have extremely low DDs. It sounds like you have a good plan for tomorrow too! Planning things that you actually look forward to having is a step in the right direction.
Unfortunately no. I got a headache about 2 pm and everything went downhill from there. When I attempted on Sunday, I had an allergic reaction to lentils (it was my second time eating them, and I am allergic to peanuts and peas which are legumes along with lentils) and I was in a bad mood the rest of Sunday and ruined it.

Today did not go well, either.

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Old 02-11-2014, 03:37 PM   #22
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Part of me wants to do an 18:6 fast like I was doing, but another part really wants JUDDD to work.

One of my concerns is water consumption - I know there can be too little or too much. And too much can throw sodium out of balance. If I wanted to try a complete fast, since I seem to be an all or nothing person, how much water should I drink?
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:08 PM   #23
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I can't answer that (about the water) because I've never done a complete fast, but I know that I don't monitor my diet sodas or water on DDs especially, because I seem to have to have something to drink at all times. It keeps the focus off food for me, sometimes.
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:11 PM   #24
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I can't answer that (about the water) because I've never done a complete fast, but I know that I don't monitor my diet sodas or water on DDs especially, because I seem to have to have something to drink at all times. It keeps the focus off food for me, sometimes.
I assume that I would not be able to drink enough water to harm me anyways, I am just a paranoid freak

I think diet soda might contribute to my headache.

I had some chicken broth today - I am not a fan.
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:45 PM   #25
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There is a formula of how much water we're "supposed" to drink but I think the simplest is divide your weight in half and transfer that to ounces...I weigh about 170 lbs, so half would be 85 ounces.

I don't remember if that includes your other beverages but I don't think so. I figure it would be hard for me to drink that much but when you consider morning/afternoon coffee, a couple cups of tea, juice with breakfast, and maybe a glass (or two) of wine with dinner, it would be easy to drink that much as I always have a glass of water poured and sipping on it all day.
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:47 PM   #26
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There is a formula of how much water we're "supposed" to drink but I think the simplest is divide your weight in half and transfer that to ounces...I weigh about 170 lbs, so half would be 85 ounces.

I don't remember if that includes your other beverages but I don't think so. I figure it would be hard for me to drink that much but when you consider morning/afternoon coffee, a couple cups of tea, juice with breakfast, and maybe a glass (or two) of wine with dinner, it would be easy to drink that much as I always have a glass of water poured and sipping on it all day.
I carry a 24-oz water bottle around with me, but I usually only drink 1 1/2 of those. I forgot I had some delicious pumpkin spice tea. I think I will get that out for tomorrow and drink it during the day with water and see where it leads.
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Old 02-11-2014, 10:39 PM   #27
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Try Better than Bullion or the cubes. Don't drink prepared broth, its disgusting.
Also, in your original post you said you managed to stay below your UD cals. How far below? Eating your UD cals is important so you're heading into your DD well nourished. Now is not the time to cut corners on your UDs, you need the nutrition.
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Old 02-12-2014, 01:05 AM   #28
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1) As Yennie says, if you are eating below your UD calories, then you are probably setting yourself up for trouble on DD. Especially while adjusting to the rotations, most of us need to eat at or above UD calories or this becomes just another body-stressing low cal diet.

2) If you are drinking about 32 ounces of liquid a day, it is very unlikely you are drinking enough. If this is a common state for you (and it is a common state for many, many people) then your ability to recognize "I'm thirsty" signals may be impaired: you may perceive them as "I'm hungry! I'm starving!"

I encourage you to double the amount of water - flavored water, some teas, count anything without caffeine - you drink and spread it out over the day. At what your body would perceive as mealtime, make sure you drink a large glass of water then wait 10 to 20 minutes to see if the hungry feelings resolve. (Oh, and I count caffeinated drinks as 1/2 the volume of fluid. That seems to work for me.)

3) You mentioned carbs trigger hunger in you. I encourage you to try various dinner patterns - eating low carb or very low carb at dinner on UD may reduce hunger on DD....OR eating higher carb as the last meal on UD may help. I encourage you to try different patterns to see how your body responds to carb carry-over.

4) 18:6, 19:5, 20:4 does work for some metabolisms. Rotations that tight do not allow nearly as much caloric wiggle-room as the DD/UD rotation does. If you decide to go there, please read the "rules" first...just to maximize your chances of success.

In the meantime, plan your DDs with several hundred calories of wiggle-room foods (on DD you may aim for 500 calories...and it is good to end up there or less. BUT, if that does not work out it is better to end up eating 800 calories than 1600)
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STILL below goal 2/15/14

I did not "lose" weight. I evicted it. It is gone and it ain't coming back!

JUDDD cares about calories. JUDDD does not care what you eat. Your body probably does.
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Old 02-12-2014, 01:16 AM   #29
Very Gabby LCF Member!!!
 
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Asheville, NC / Marietta, Ga
Posts: 3,767
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Stats: 175/111.8/124 - 5'4, 61yo
WOE: JUDDD/PHD, LC now that my BG is getting weird
Start Date: JUDDD 1/1/12 + LCHF 12/1/13 (controlling diabetes)
Oh, and one trick I used to get around how yucky pre-packaged broth is: Drain a soup you like through a colander. Heat and drink the liquid instead of broth. Add water or broth to the soup solids, stick it in the fridge to have for dinner.

Or, add spices to the pre-packaged broth to enhance the flavor.

Once I got myself hydrated, water was usually enough to calm the hunger-beast.
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Old 02-17-2014, 04:25 PM   #30
Senior LCF Member
 
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 252
Gallery: CelticFan
Stats: 140/126.6/118
WOE: JUDDD/1 day diet
Start Date: Feb. 2000
Me!!! I have started and failed so many times! For me I completed my first down day at ease when I stayed busy, drank lots of hot green tea or low calorie protein water and delayed eating until dinner. Then when I got the late night craving I had some low calorie broth and went to bed. Once I got through one day, it was so much easier the next DD. The first down day when I went to bed semi hungry I wrote down what I wanted to eat the next day before I went to bed. I was actually not very hungry on my UD which made me kind of upset. haha
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140/112 at goal (Maintained 9 years with Atkins)
Restarting- 2/14/14 @ 131/126.6/118
5'5
39 Years
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