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Old 02-13-2014, 10:46 AM   #271
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If I couldn't come here, I don't know what I'd do.

Thank you, all of you, for coming to listen and share your own struggles.


I share your sentiments. It is awesome to be able to come here and vent those frustrations.
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:19 PM   #272
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:42 PM   #273
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You come to us for support but we come to you for support Cindy. Mutual admiration society.
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Old 02-13-2014, 05:25 PM   #274
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It's been nearly a month since my first post in this thread (was somewhat of a shock!), and I've come to the conclusion that I have to go back to rotations whether or not I eat a certain way. My acid reflux has come back, plus other TMI issues with LC, or not doing rotations, whichever is the reason. I think I will start on Sunday with a DD, because although I had planned to start tomorrow, it's day and I would like to have a nice dinner (probably at home). Plus our fund-raiser dinner is going to be rescheduled on Tues or Thurs of next week, so I need for Monday to be a UD. Thanks for all the awesome support!!!
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Last edited by Librarygirl; 02-13-2014 at 05:28 PM..
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Old 02-14-2014, 05:28 AM   #275
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Cindy, I love your willingness to experiment, observe, and reset your plan. It's so reasonable. Makes me realize I've spent too much of my life trying, failing (or perceiving myself as failing), and screaming off into a vat of S&V chips and cheap chocolate.
It's amazing, how much there is to learn here.
Thanks.
All the best with your return to rotations.
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Old 02-14-2014, 06:19 AM   #276
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Thanks, Kristen. I realize I made a goof--Monday needs to be a DD, not a UD.
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Old 02-14-2014, 11:12 AM   #277
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Yep, what Kristin said! Love you girl!!! So LC Juddd style coming up?
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Old 02-14-2014, 12:58 PM   #278
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Nah, no LC, just Juddd. For now.
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Old 02-14-2014, 01:21 PM   #279
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Hey, Cindy,
While you are deciding be sure to stop for a sec and remember how far you've come!
You are an inspiration to me.
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Old 02-14-2014, 03:50 PM   #280
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Thank you, Pat. You inspire me as well.
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Old 02-15-2014, 09:28 AM   #281
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hope it goes well but remember, eject that useless sugar carby crappy processed junk from your menu
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Old 02-15-2014, 01:39 PM   #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joyjoy View Post
Cindy, I hear you. I stopped juddding a year? 18 months? ago because I couldn't handle another UD/DD failure and then I could not for the life of me jump back on. It took several tries over the year before my enthusiasm for it came back. At this point I'm glad I didn't push harder back then. The right time arrived. And this time it's easier.

I don't know what to say except that I hope you trust that your desire for a slimmer, healthier bod is what matters most. Juddd isn't the key to it all. Your desire is. Juddd is one wonderful vehicle.
Have a little faith in yourself. Maybe you aren't failing. Maybe something in you wants a different path for a bit.
The other thing I'll pitch in is that I don't think there is a wrong choice to make here. If you keep plugging away at this, you'll have good days and bad days and lots of support here. If you try a different woe, you'll have good days and bad days and lots of support here. If you decide to do the first sugar-goat-milk-creme hack (who here would not like to try that after reading about Adi's description??), you'll have good days and bad days and lots of support here.

The great fear is that we'll gain weight if we lose hold of the rope.
I dunno. I lost hold, I gained a bit, I hated myself some days, loved myself other days, moved into slightly different clothes, and came back to this beautiful crowd. All good.

Just my two cents. Lots of love your way, Juddd sister. I'll look forward to supporting you no matter what.
Beautiful post.
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Old 02-15-2014, 02:15 PM   #283
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Yes it is, Skinjob. It's something that should be in "The Best JUDDD Threads".
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Old 02-15-2014, 02:19 PM   #284
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Kristins way with words is second to none.
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Old 02-16-2014, 09:28 PM   #285
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Disheartening? It's a thoroughly miserable experience that can cause you to second-guess your own perceptions.

I'd lost 25lbs with aching slowness before starting JUDDD in late 2011. After losing an initial 3 lbs, I lost nothing else for >16 weeks, iirc, and just couldn't shift from 140lbs (within 10lbs of my goal). I was beyond fed up and when a slice of life happened, I stopped doing anything as I couldn't bear the endless effort for no results.

Inevitably, I ended 2012 with a 17lb regain, to reboot JUDDD at 157lbs. I have nothing but my own fed-upness (and the normal variance of *life*) to blame for needing to lose 17lbs before reaching my original sticking point. *in sore need of kicking myself icon*

I now think that I couldn't gel with JUDDD initially because I should have improved my metabolic flexibility after 10 solid months of reducing my kcal intake which was (in retrospect) horribly low before switching to JUDDD. I just didn't trust the process and I'd no idea that my LBM was so low (and, again, with the help of hindsight, that really hasn't helped).

Seeing negligible outcome for what feels like a remarkable amount of strategising, self-restraint, self-abnegation etc. is thoroughly demoralising - there's no getting around it. It feels like part of your life has been given over to participating in a particularly gruelling endurance event with a maddening vagueness over the finish line and how long the event is expected to take. The worst thing about it is that you have to participate in this endurance event in parallel with managing the rest of your work, family life etc.

You're also surrounded by a public rhetoric that makes weight loss appear to be linear, rational, and predictable. So, if you're not conforming to this, then, somehow, despite your personal integrity, somehow, you must be 'cheating' or suddenly developed kcal intake blindness. Pah and Pah again.

Thing is tho' - even when it's impossible to see your progress, it's too easy to overlook that you're still in the endurance event and you're still going. And particularly that it's to your credit that you're still slogging along with no thought of dropping out. You're still looking for insights and tweaks to improve your performance.

This has, as ever, turned into an essay - so I'll spare you the remainder which would just riff off Cavafy's Ithaca.
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Old 02-17-2014, 06:48 AM   #286
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Thanks for reposting this, Chris.
Hey Slow, would you care to start a thread on how to increase our metabolic flexibility? Or is there one already? I know you mentioned research and a web address, but I'll bet we'd love an easily accessible discussion here.
Look at me, asking you to make my life better.
If you're not keen, I'll go back to your references.
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Old 02-18-2014, 04:49 AM   #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joyjoy View Post
Hey Slow, would you care to start a thread on how to increase our metabolic flexibility? Or is there one already? I know you mentioned research and a web address, but I'll bet we'd love an easily accessible discussion here.
I will But it may not be for 7-10 days as I'm still tied up with coping with flood-related activity (speaking of which, the rain is currently louder than the sound of the keyboard) and (drum roll) I'm organising a DXA scan for which, stupidly, I need to travel a ludicrously long way (but will allow me to visit family friends).

And, of course, I can only describe what I did, and some of the research that supports it but it does seem to have some correspondences with the Lyle McDonald material that Frosty has mentioned (albeit without the refeeds/carb cycling as I'm just looking to maintain while increasing the kcals intake). I won't turn this into an essay with the caveats but will post a thread when I can.
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Old 02-18-2014, 05:32 AM   #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarygirl View Post
it's easy to feel totally alone in my struggle when I focus on the "majority" of successes I see. I was blaming myself for many months for not being able to totally fast on DDs or for not going low enough...or for going over on UDs too often...I truly think either it's menopause or a thyroid problem....you don't know how much I appreciate your kind empathy and well-thought out advice.
I have an inordinate fondness for the themes of Anglo-Saxon poetry - which are variations on integrity, honour, community, and admiration for those who grasp the enormity of the task that faces them (slaying a dragon, fighting a battle against enormous odds) but choose to stay and to continue. I see weight loss is the same way for so many of us. There are aspects of it that isolate us so much and we need a community to keep us grounded.

Joyjoy has said (somewhere) that in 20yrs we'll look back, with the benefit of further research, and shake our heads at the comparative lack of knowledge we currently have about weight loss, the influence of hormones/menopause, the microbiota/gut, stress hormones and sleep.

It doesn't feel like it but maintaining while your body is fiddling round with your hormone levels is a substantial win - much as you'd prefer a weight loss. Too many women start to restrict their kcal intakes so much that I'm not so surprised that they lose their bone density and have problems relating to that as they get older.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LoCarbGal View Post
I really do think my body has settled in at this weight, and is going to make me be patient and work for the next big shift. Could yours be doing the same thing? We are so close in height, weight, age, body type (pear).

I have resigned myself to just staying the course and putting in the work until my body is ready to release some more fat. I'm not thrilled with that prospect, but it's better than gaining it back like I have in the past.
Plateaus are common and make no rational sense to us at present. This is one area where I think we will have to wait on research to answer this question.

For me, it's related to our bodies edging towards metabolic adaptation when they detect a drop in intake. We're not consciously doing anything differently but we can't possibly be aware that the body has now streamlined some actions so efficiently that we no longer need the same kcals to fuel it. Nor can we be aware of other hormone shifts that alter how we process our food and influence our activity levels or how we store fat.

It is so easier said than done but it looks like there are some demographics where it would be better to shed the weight over a longer time and then keep maintain it - rather than lose it faster only to regain and have to repeat. Being human, we hate the notion of that tho' - I think we like milestones such as, "I want to be size 6 for this wedding/vacation".

Quote:
Originally Posted by vanilla_latte View Post
I you, SlowSure. You just summed up and clarified so much with the bolded. I'm constantly thinking I must be doing something wrong since everyone else is losing like crazy...But it's the truly successful JB's (or any other WOE for that matter) that leave me scratching my head wondering what the heck am I doing so wrong that I don't see the same success??
...
I'm right there with you, Cindy. I sometimes feel deflated when I see others having all the successes that I want to have.
Oh, thank you. I loathe the glib rhetoric around weight loss and it infuriates me - so I can't imagine what it's like to have been dealing with it for 30yrs or so.

I think that for many people, weight and health reflects the body's response to the eco-system in which we're living (work, commute, family, stresses, obeseogenic neighbourhoods etc.) and, at some point, we'll understand how it affects our hormones and metabolism. Just not at present.

Nutrition research is a comparatively young discipline. Weight loss research is an even younger discipline and, frankly, with the benefit of further technical developments, some of it seems to have been conducted with inappropriate hypotheses and wrongly-interpreted outcomes.

The consequence of this, however, is that we have horrible public rhetoric and media emphasis on what size people ought to be - but we are engaged in large-scale field trials of people's best guess at what should work logically. But, I'm firmly of the opinion that whereas logic will get us a long way, there are so many anomalies that we have to accept that we just don't have enough data or understanding to guide some people effectively for healthy weight loss.

One of these days, I will learn the art of short answers/discussions/comments.
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Old 02-18-2014, 07:16 AM   #289
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Slow, I so appreciate your thoughtful and intelligent posts. Please keep 'em coming!
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Old 02-18-2014, 08:44 AM   #290
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SlowSure, I loved your post (#288). You make such good sense. Thanks for taking the time to post it.
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Old 02-18-2014, 01:12 PM   #291
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Slow, I so appreciate your thoughtful and intelligent posts. Please keep 'em coming!
, ditto.

My sweet DH would just like me eat low carb (since that's how I want to eat) and just let what happens happen - or not - as far as the weight loss goes. I wish I had the patience to do that and wait (no pun intended) my body out. I sometimes have visions of my body just saying the heck with it and begin ditching pounds right and left!

I know I sound like a flip floppy fish, but I saw on another board exactly how I'd like to eat. Six days a week low carb, one day of carbs. She said it works for her. That is something I could do. Would it work for me? Who the heck knows.

I came back to JUDDD in November and although my rotations haven't been perfect and there were the holidays, I'm still in the same 5 pound range I've been in since then. It could truly be that I like JUDDD, but it just doen't work for me any more. With no NSV's happening either, that just might be the case.
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Old 02-18-2014, 02:06 PM   #292
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Aw, 'Nilla.

If that 6 days on 1 day off LC would work, it sounds great. My experience with LC has always been that deviating in the least causes quick gains and the return of cravings/disappearance of appetite control. So I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be for me. Obviously some people can do it and succeed, so if you decide to try that, good luck to you!
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Old 02-18-2014, 03:27 PM   #293
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That does sound do-able, Nilla. IF, like LCG said, you can do it. I found that while I was LCing, any deviation resulted in an immediate gain...then a week to get it off. So, it would probably work for me for maintenance but not to lose. It would be great if it works for you for weight loss as well!

I'm just JUDDDing right now, and still over my first day weigh-in this month. I was up a little then, so it is discouraging. However, I do enjoy the feeling of DDs and I feel better physically. Sooner or later, I have to start losing again, don't I?
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Old 02-18-2014, 06:03 PM   #294
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That does sound do-able, Nilla. IF, like LCG said, you can do it. I found that while I was LCing, any deviation resulted in an immediate gain...then a week to get it off. So, it would probably work for me for maintenance but not to lose. It would be great if it works for you for weight loss as well!

I'm just JUDDDing right now, and still over my first day weigh-in this month. I was up a little then, so it is discouraging. However, I do enjoy the feeling of DDs and I feel better physically. Sooner or later, I have to start losing again, don't I?
That's exactly how I feel! I've been hungry a couple of times on DDs, but I feel so darned good on DDs, it's amazing. It's like I've eaten so badly for so long, my body really loves having those fasting days. I've over-eaten and I've been sick and had unexpected social eating, but those things are going to continue to happen forever, so I'm just rolling with it. Overall, my weight is trending downward and I feel rather victorious for having found this WOE.
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Old 02-18-2014, 06:19 PM   #295
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YAY, Tango!
Loved reading your post.
I am working to not lose my momentum.
Thank you for sharing your enthusiasm.
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Old 02-18-2014, 08:09 PM   #296
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Hello everybuddy!

Cindy, Tango, Pat......(and everyone else too) I truly believe we have to all PULL together (like we all do I know) to make this happen for ourselves.

As interesting and informative as all the scientific aspect of this is, I simply have to rely mostly on my own dogged determination and (maybe this is just ME) coming here and reading about everyone's day to day REAL-LIFE SITUATIONS and how we help PULL each other through the rough days, means so so much to me.

Again, I know this is not a new revelation, but I feel kind of like a little kindergarten child that needs repetition about WHY and HOW to stay the course sometimes. I get that here!

This is more conformation as to why my chosen WOL literally IS a way of life. There will always be hungrier days, more stress, sickness, relational issues, just a myriad of things that could potentially de-rail us.

Working together like we do for the good of one another is such a BIG part of this battle for me! Our having the common thread of attaining smaller healthier bodies is a bond I hope will never be broken.

Thanks for............just being here.

Phyl
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Old 02-18-2014, 09:42 PM   #297
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Phyl!
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Old 02-18-2014, 11:52 PM   #298
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WE

LOVE YA CINDY
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Old 02-19-2014, 04:23 AM   #299
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Love you too, Barbo!! Love all these happy thoughts this morning too from everyone.

I went for over 2 weeks without a real DD and I can say without a doubt that I feel better with fasting. I wake up earlier and with more energy, I feel happier and I just feel thinner, whether or not it's true lol. Doing something different for a while really made me appreciate JUDDD.
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Old 02-19-2014, 07:58 AM   #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gotitnow View Post
Hello everybuddy!

Cindy, Tango, Pat......(and everyone else too) I truly believe we have to all PULL together (like we all do I know) to make this happen for ourselves.

As interesting and informative as all the scientific aspect of this is, I simply have to rely mostly on my own dogged determination and (maybe this is just ME) coming here and reading about everyone's day to day REAL-LIFE SITUATIONS and how we help PULL each other through the rough days, means so so much to me.

Again, I know this is not a new revelation, but I feel kind of like a little kindergarten child that needs repetition about WHY and HOW to stay the course sometimes. I get that here!

This is more conformation as to why my chosen WOL literally IS a way of life. There will always be hungrier days, more stress, sickness, relational issues, just a myriad of things that could potentially de-rail us.

Working together like we do for the good of one another is such a BIG part of this battle for me! Our having the common thread of attaining smaller healthier bodies is a bond I hope will never be broken.

Thanks for............just being here.

Phyl
This post is just lovely. It is so helpful to me. I do the best when I commit to spending time here.
This is why that is so.
Blessings,
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