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-   -   JUDDD And Anxiety/Stress Symptoms (http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/juddd/811208-juddd-anxiety-stress-symptoms.html)

Lanarkwitch 09-01-2013 01:59 AM

JUDDD And Anxiety/Stress Symptoms
 
Hi everyone, need some input from those who might have done any reading up on fasting and anxiety symptoms.

Not a secret that living in Egypt has been pretty stressful this last while, however I had been ticking along nicely on JUDDD since coming back my holiday, however, after last week end I started to show really bad anxiety symptoms, leg weakness, shaking, palpitations, knot in stomach etc, this absolutely came from nowhere, nothing happened, no outside stressor.

DH insisted I stop my rotations which I have done and am concentrating on eating well, but I am unsure if this was anything to do with fasting at all, any input guys?

KeirasMom 09-01-2013 05:53 AM

I've suffered from anxiety all my life, and saw no increase with JUDDD. It actually got better for me when I was put on thyroid medication. I would recommend following up with your doctor to find out if there's any internal chemical or hormonal reason for your anxiety. :dunno:

Librarygirl 09-01-2013 06:17 AM

I have had anxiety/depression for a long time. I was on anti-depressants for over 10 years, but now take Amoryn, which is a herbal supplement. It works very well, but I'd recommend trying 5HTP and Vitamin D siupplements. Those are major ingredients in Amoryn. I still get stressed and anxious, but not usually for no reason anymore. I agree with Dawn that you should talk to your doctor.:console:

Low Carb Librarian 09-01-2013 08:30 AM

This is why I quit doing JUDDD. I was doing fine with the eating but I became depressed on my DD's and had anxiety and couldn't sleep at night.

Carly 09-01-2013 09:02 AM

I've had bouts of anxiety during my life, but never had any issue with juddd. It had disrupted TOM both times I was in WLM. I have not had a low DD in several days an today my TOM finally returned after close to 2 months. So I know it effects me that way.

Lanarkwitch 09-01-2013 10:39 AM

In all honesty I think maybe its not related to juddd but its hard to explain that to hubster as he's never been on board with juddd at all, between the rioting, protests, curfew, power/water cuts, and being back on my uni course I think it might all just be adding up :p

LoCarbGal 09-01-2013 11:05 AM

I can't help with the anxiety question Emma, but I'm so sorry you are experiencing this. I know I've had unexplained anxiety feelings for no *apparent* reason in the past. It's way more disturbing than when you know why. But I'd say you have reasons to be feeling stressed. Take good care!:hugs:

Lanarkwitch 09-01-2013 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoCarbGal (Post 16584742)
I can't help with the anxiety question Emma, but I'm so sorry you are experiencing this. I know I've had unexplained anxiety feelings for no *apparent* reason in the past. It's way more disturbing than when you know why. But I'd say you have reasons to be feeling stressed. Take good care!:hugs:

Aww thanks, its just so out of the blue, I'm generally not an anxious person, I'm not even fully convinced its anything to do with anxiety either, who knows maybe next week I might throw in a dd and see how I feel :)

Haycyn 09-01-2013 06:11 PM

I would really look at your DD vs UD carb counts. There is evidence out there to suggest serotonin receptors in your stomach responding to carbs, and therefore there could be a biological reasoning for your DD anxiety.
There would also be questions on supplementation on those days or changing your WOE. The research I have read suggests it occurs in those with history of A/D.
It is certainly worth a google search. "Low carb and depression," or "low carb and serotonin" should bring up the arguments.
I personally do not believe in everything I read, but I am considering this and trying Sam E before I try JUDDD again.
It may be the stress of Egypt WITH the DD rotations is more than you need right now.
I say listen to your body. I realize you are living through the craziness in Egypt, so maybe you do not see it, but I guarantee you when you look back you will not think, "Gee that was when I was so stressed I quit JUDDD."
Stay safe there, whatever you decide.

Librarygirl 09-02-2013 06:54 AM

Another supplement that's gotten lots of positive reviews is Seredyn (for anxiety). It acts fast (after one pill) as a calming agent, and apparently well. I have looked into ordering it along with Amoryn.

KeirasMom 09-02-2013 07:35 AM

I use Valerian root if I know I'm going to be on a road trip or other situation that causes me anxiety. It's supposed to make you sleepy, but it just keeps me from being totally neurotic. Just be forewarned: It smells like dirty feet!

jacquelinejolie 09-02-2013 10:30 AM

Emma, I found a post for you that seemed like an extreme reaction to IF (she did Lean Gains which isn't a really long IF window like some JUDDD-ers do) but maybe wasn't since she's a female. Wish I could link to it for you but it's called "How Intermittent Fasting Saved Me…while Slowly Killing Me" on civilizedcavemancooking.

Another extremely good article on Paleoforwomen called: Shattering the Myth of Fasting for Women: A Review of Female-Specific Responses to Fasting in the Literature.

I'm starting to get very worried for young women on here that try to go very low on DD's in their desire to see the scale weight drop faster and eat nothing but a salad or a piece of fruit - or nothing. :( :( I would never advise a daughter of mine or a friend to do that. Maybe I'm paranoid after my own experiences with that kind of weight loss method.
Really wish that Johnson hadn't said that a total fast was ok. Maybe he was right for men and *some* ie - few - women but...

Carly 09-02-2013 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KeirasMom (Post 16585788)
I use Valerian root if I know I'm going to be on a road trip or other situation that causes me anxiety. It's supposed to make you sleepy, but it just keeps me from being totally neurotic. Just be forewarned: It smells like dirty feet!

^^^^^ smells worse that dirty feet... My friend use to swear by though.

I know there was some literature about IF and fertility. Last time I was in WLM TOM got totally screwed up and went back to fairly normal when doing 5:2. In less that 2 mos of WLM this time TOM went wacky again. I had to suspend low DDs for a few days and it returned.

Haycyn 09-02-2013 05:19 PM

Wow, what a scary read!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacquelinejolie (Post 16586076)
Emma, I found a post for you that seemed like an extreme reaction to IF (she did Lean Gains which isn't a really long IF window like some JUDDD-ers do) but maybe wasn't since she's a female. Wish I could link to it for you but it's called "How Intermittent Fasting Saved Me…while Slowly Killing Me" on civilizedcavemancooking.

Another extremely good article on Paleoforwomen called: Shattering the Myth of Fasting for Women: A Review of Female-Specific Responses to Fasting in the Literature.

I'm starting to get very worried for young women on here that try to go very low on DD's in their desire to see the scale weight drop faster and eat nothing but a salad or a piece of fruit - or nothing. :( :( I would never advise a daughter of mine or a friend to do that. Maybe I'm paranoid after my own experiences with that kind of weight loss method.
Really wish that Johnson hadn't said that a total fast was ok. Maybe he was right for men and *some* ie - few - women but...


Librarygirl 09-02-2013 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacquelinejolie (Post 16586076)
Emma, I found a post for you that seemed like an extreme reaction to IF (she did Lean Gains which isn't a really long IF window like some JUDDD-ers do) but maybe wasn't since she's a female. Wish I could link to it for you but it's called "How Intermittent Fasting Saved Me…while Slowly Killing Me" on civilizedcavemancooking.

Another extremely good article on Paleoforwomen called: Shattering the Myth of Fasting for Women: A Review of Female-Specific Responses to Fasting in the Literature.

I'm starting to get very worried for young women on here that try to go very low on DD's in their desire to see the scale weight drop faster and eat nothing but a salad or a piece of fruit - or nothing. :( :( I would never advise a daughter of mine or a friend to do that. Maybe I'm paranoid after my own experiences with that kind of weight loss method.
Really wish that Johnson hadn't said that a total fast was ok. Maybe he was right for men and *some* ie - few - women but...

I read this about how IF slowly killed me and I believe this young woman wasn't doing things exactly correct. She said she was basically bingeing and fasting, which is NOT what IF is about. She also said something about how she became so obsessed with having a perfect body she resorted to "extreme intermittant fasting", which I know from experience is not exactly true. At least it isn't "extreme" for me. It is extreme compared to any other diet I've tried, but it is also the only one that has ever worked or that I could sustain. I am over 40 and don't have the health concerns that younger women might, so I think IF should be treated with caution and careful research. I also don't fast completely, and never have.

It'stime 09-02-2013 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanarkwitch (Post 16584714)
In all honesty I think maybe its not related to juddd but its hard to explain that to hubster as he's never been on board with juddd at all, between the rioting, protests, curfew, power/water cuts, and being back on my uni course I think it might all just be adding up :p


that could do it for me!

jacquelinejolie 09-02-2013 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Librarygirl (Post 16586802)
I read this about how IF slowly killed me and I believe this young woman wasn't doing things exactly correct. She said she was basically bingeing and fasting, which is NOT what IF is about. She also said something about how she became so obsessed with having a perfect body she resorted to "extreme intermittant fasting", which I know from experience is not exactly true. At least it isn't "extreme" for me. It is extreme compared to any other diet I've tried, but it is also the only one that has ever worked or that I could sustain. I am over 40 and don't have the health concerns that younger women might, so I think IF should be treated with caution and careful research. I also don't fast completely, and never have.

I agree with you there. She took what isn't even an extreme protocol - Leangains, although I've never tried it, does not seem extreme to me (it's basically skipping breakfast and timing what you eat around when you work out, which I've done for years) - and made it extreme. Sometimes Paleo / Crossfit people do that kind of thing, especially young ones - "if some is good, more must be better!" kind of thing.

I have also done Fast 5 for about 2 months (only eating in a 5-6 hour window or so which is ~ 18 hours fasting at a time) - and had NO problems. Lost something like 2 pounds a week without counting anything, but it just didn't fit into my life at the time and wouldn't now.

If I did feel anxious, had hormonal or health issues, etc., I'd take a holiday from the diet or any kind of IF or any diet period and do a re-set for a couple of weeks at maintenance calories to regulate hormones etc. Sort of like Dawn did I think when she took a break.

Lanarkwitch 09-03-2013 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacquelinejolie (Post 16586076)
Emma, I found a post for you that seemed like an extreme reaction to IF (she did Lean Gains which isn't a really long IF window like some JUDDD-ers do) but maybe wasn't since she's a female. Wish I could link to it for you but it's called "How Intermittent Fasting Saved Me…while Slowly Killing Me" on civilizedcavemancooking.

Another extremely good article on Paleoforwomen called: Shattering the Myth of Fasting for Women: A Review of Female-Specific Responses to Fasting in the Literature.

I'm starting to get very worried for young women on here that try to go very low on DD's in their desire to see the scale weight drop faster and eat nothing but a salad or a piece of fruit - or nothing. :( :( I would never advise a daughter of mine or a friend to do that. Maybe I'm paranoid after my own experiences with that kind of weight loss method.
Really wish that Johnson hadn't said that a total fast was ok. Maybe he was right for men and *some* ie - few - women but...

Thank you so much for these articles, very interesting reading, perhaps the most interesting thing is that I felt I had actually researched IF before starting it at the beginning of the year and now I can clearly see I was only "researching" the positives.

Another thing I realised is that back in January when I had great results with JUDDD for a few months, I was using my VLCD packs so av 550 cals per day, and lost approx 2lbs per week (it wasn't quite that linear though), the packs were part of a ketogenic diet and the 3 servings I was having on a DD were nutritionally complete, high protein, low carb, life was just as stressful back in January as we had just moved to another city after months of uncertainty, but I felt well and had loads of energy for it.

I had a small gain on a break for my birthday but was back to my JUDDD low again within 2 weeks, however I just could not get back into it, probably because the move to Egypt was beginning to look likely and it was a massive job to organise the whole thing in 5 weeks, short story, I gained it all back and more, I had just got down to within about 3lbs of my JUDDD low before my vacation and then of course gained again, which I have now just managed to get off again.

Stress symptoms seem to have eased off and I am feeling quite normal again, I hate the thought of dieting everyday, its tiresome and laborious and frankly I won't stick to it. After a lot of swings and roundabouts this year I have lost the same 12lbs at least 3 times,and now I am back to wondering where to go from here, as clearly my weight is far from stable, todays 196 could easily be tomorrows 205, god I've written a book here, but I think the best way to proceed with this might well be to do a 5:2 week next week and use my VLCD packs and see how I feel. :dunno:

Clearly for me at least, IF whilst stressed, or over stressed isn't a good plan, I really wish they would do more research on this stuff, so at least I won't feel like I am going mad!

Carly 09-03-2013 06:00 PM

What is a VLCD pack?:confused:

Lanarkwitch 09-04-2013 12:40 AM

Very Low Calorie Diet 3 packs a day total meal replacement

Carly 09-04-2013 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanarkwitch (Post 16588981)
Very Low Calorie Diet 3 packs a day total meal replacement

Thanks!

SlimNana 09-04-2013 09:14 AM

:hugs:

Cortisol, Stress, and Weight Gain
by Vincent Milardo

Role of the “Stress Hormone” in Weight Control

Eating when under stress isn’t just about filling an emotional need. Your body has a system of hormonal checks and balances that actually promote weight gain when you’re stressed out.

The so-called “stress hormone” cortisol is released in the body during times of stress along with the hormones epinephrine and norepinephrine that constitute the “fight or flight” response to a perceived threat. Following the stressful or threatening event, epinephrine and norepinephrine levels return to normal while cortisol levels can remain elevated over a longer time period. In fact, cortisol levels can remain persistently elevated in the body when a person is subjected to chronic stress.

How does cortisol influence weight gain? Cortisol has many actions in the body, and one ultimate goal of cortisol secretion is the provision of energy for the body.

Cortisol stimulates fat and carbohydrate metabolism for fast energy, and stimulates insulin release and maintenance of blood sugar levels. The end result of these actions is an increase in appetite. Thus chronic stress, or poorly managed stress, may lead to cortisol levels that stimulate your appetite, with the end result being weight gain or difficulty losing unwanted pounds.

:) Ann

jacquelinejolie 09-04-2013 10:31 AM

I agree with Ann on the stress / cortisol link. Apart from pregnancy, I gain weight when I'm overwhelmed at work. Also have difficulties sleeping then (not insomnia, but 3 a.m. waking). Since I never tracked what I ate while I was gaining :), I don't know if it was a calorie issue. I do find it hard to believe that I can gain 30-40 pounds in a matter of a few months but it's possible since I go from a normally active (maybe higher than normal for my age, but it doesn't seem like it compared to my thin, younger, childless friends that actually enjoy working out more than I do), average eater to a slug, junk food eater when stressed.

I didn't realize this topic and the paleo article were discussed earlier this year:
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/ju...-hormones.html

Emma, I am fine on the anxiety side, but am retired now, so have no stressors. :) I've also been taking magnesium daily for the last couple of months and I don't know if that helps? It's supposed to help with stress but that's not what I'm taking it for. I've had bouts of depression in the past but other than a PMS-y episode one day last month, have been fine with that too. If I had a mood gauge, I would guess that I've been more zen than normal since starting JUDDD. But that could be partly from just being happy that I can fit into my jeans again. :)

What you're eating on your VLCD is similar to how I was doing my DD's (I pretty much followed the macros that I used for Lyle McDonald's rapid fat loss, which is a PSMF plan) until my little experiment with higher fat and a higher DD (900+) lately. I'm seriously shocked at the impact the higher fat, higher calorie DD has had on my bodyfat levels - not really sure why it dropped so dramatically so quickly. But it's early days yet so am trying not to get my hopes up. And my energy is higher, but not in an anxious way. I think it's a delicate balance and a lot depends on hormonal status.

Librarygirl 09-04-2013 12:15 PM

I remember having a good bit of stress early on when I started JUDDD. I just recalled that TJ (Trying JUDDD) and I both were talking about it in one thread here, somewhere lol. I have the JUDDD calm now, and I'm delighted that I stuck with it.

Lanarkwitch 09-07-2013 04:42 AM

Well I finally found out what was causing my symptoms, no doubt it's the Pterostlbene, I took 2 capsules on Thursday morning after breakfast and began to shake quite violently within 20 mins of taking them, fortunately the feeling subsided after about an hour. I had stopped all my supplements when the anxiety began as I wanted to eliminate any potential sources. No more ptero for me!

Librarygirl 09-07-2013 05:54 AM

Lanark, I was taking ptero for a while too. I might have experienced the stress I mentioned, and attributed it to JUDDD, when it was the ptero all along! Good job on figuring it out. :)

Carly 09-07-2013 06:07 AM

Glad you figured it out! Which brand were you using?

LoCarbGal 09-07-2013 07:16 AM

What a relief to know what was causing it. Will you be going back to JUDDD rotations again, or sticking with what you've been doing?

ouizoid 09-07-2013 08:24 AM

the Ptero totally did me in. I was anxious and a total insomniac when I was taking it! I'm so glad you figured out the problem--

Lanarkwitch 09-07-2013 10:00 AM

Well how daft do I feel for not mentioning the ptero earlier, I began taking it when I was on vacation just 1 per day, when I came back I was taking 2 and then upped it to 3, so clearly there was a compounding effect to start with and then when I got pushed over the edge it took quite a while to feel normal again, which thankfully I do, I was taking the Jarrow brand that I think quite a few here are also taking, its a bit of a shame really as I had felt that particularly if I took it after eating it was helping with hunger pangs.

So glad I found the reason I was feeling so bad, because it just wasn't making any sense to me at all.

Back on JUDDD rotations as of today and have felt no issues with fasting, mild headache and manageable hunger, situation normal for me! Feeling good and ready to start ticking off some of my weight loss goals, thanks for checking up on me everyone xxxx


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