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Old 03-08-2013, 09:53 AM   #1
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Just read Dr. Johnson's book

And I must say I was a little disappointed. Yes, the SIRT1 information was amazing, as well as the science behind the diet itself, but, IMO, the nutritional information was off (the whole thing about saturated fat being artery clogging) and the Atkins diet is NOT high protein! I am just really protective of Atkins and I get really crabby when anyone spouts off "information" about it that is wrong. I still do rotations because I like the way it makes me feel, but I still count carbs too.
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:10 AM   #2
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I actually LOVED the way Atkins made me feel. I read Gary Taubes(I think that is his name), or at least summaries and excerpts from his books, and he made me a believer in fat! I have not read Dr Js JUDDD book yet, but I am sure I would be rolling my eyes at that section!
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:21 AM   #3
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I've never done Atkins so I must have glossed over that part. I don't remember him saying much about it or fats. It's been a while since I read it, but I think I was more interested in learning about SIRT1 and also how and why alternate day fasting works.

I really was bothered when I read The Dukan Diet book that he seemed to say all fat is bad. He does not even advocate "healthy" oils like fish oil and EVOO. It just makes me scratch my head wondering why, with all the research out there, these experts can be really off about the importance of fats in a healthy diet??

When I successfully did the Dukan Diet to give me a jump start in 2011, I did not give up my EVOO, fish oil supplements and coconut oil. It worked great, actually it probably worked better!
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:23 AM   #4
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ETA: I don't think I've ever read a diet book that I totally agree with! But I do learn some great things from every book I read.

I got Mosley's Fast Diet on my Kindle but have not had time to read it yet.
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:35 AM   #5
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I agree with you Demonica. I loved the sciency stuff about the fast, the sirts etc. But I was peeved about his take on low carb and Atkins and such. Just another doctor with knee jerk reactions to food groups, and a total misunderstanding of another doctor's work.

I've read 5:2, but haven't gotten around to reading the update yet. I really want to get The Fast Diet, but hesitate to sink more money into reading about a diet I already know how to do and be successful on. I want to wait and get it at the library.
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:46 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Demonica View Post
And I must say I was a little disappointed. Yes, the SIRT1 information was amazing, as well as the science behind the diet itself, but, IMO, the nutritional information was off (the whole thing about saturated fat being artery clogging) and the Atkins diet is NOT high protein! I am just really protective of Atkins and I get really crabby when anyone spouts off "information" about it that is wrong. I still do rotations because I like the way it makes me feel, but I still count carbs too.
ITA with you Demonica. I just use JUDD principles and eat my own food.
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:12 PM   #7
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Same can be said for my favourite book Mastering Leptin by Byron Richards. I still refer to his book - it's the ideal I strive for on UD's however he also has a swipe at Atkins. There's no diet book I agree with totally - just have to ignore some bits and run with the principles that you can work with. Ron Rosedale also recommends less protein and ...nuts....for me...no.
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:27 PM   #8
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Same can be said for my favourite book Mastering Leptin by Byron Richards. I still refer to his book - it's the ideal I strive for on UD's however he also has a swipe at Atkins. There's no diet book I agree with totally - just have to ignore some bits and run with the principles that you can work with. Ron Rosedale also recommends less protein and ...nuts....for me...no.
Oh, yeah. I forgot about Mastering Leptin book. There is Atkins critique plus he says you should weight the same in the evening as you do in the morning (Hello! no possible after eating all day)
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Old 03-08-2013, 01:23 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Demonica View Post
And I must say I was a little disappointed. Yes, the SIRT1 information was amazing, as well as the science behind the diet itself, but, IMO, the nutritional information was off (the whole thing about saturated fat being artery clogging) and the Atkins diet is NOT high protein! I am just really protective of Atkins and I get really crabby when anyone spouts off "information" about it that is wrong. I still do rotations because I like the way it makes me feel, but I still count carbs too.
That was exactly what I thought when I read it too!

So, like with any written WOE plan (and Dr's Eades had a good post on their blog a while ago about how the diet book industry forces them into a mold, whether they want to write the book that way or not...), I think we can take what we want from the book, and then figure out what works/doesn't work for your own body

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Old 03-08-2013, 01:43 PM   #10
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I think we can take what we want from the book, and then figure out what works/doesn't work for your own body

S.

ITA with this. Seems like I always have to gloss over certain parts of most diet books, but still interested in what they have to say.
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Old 03-08-2013, 03:51 PM   #11
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I think most of us agreed that as a cosmetic surgeon Dr J did well passing on the info about intermittent fasting, but that is nutritional info was off base and out of date. Take what works as inspiration and leave the rest behind.
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Old 03-08-2013, 04:21 PM   #12
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I think most of us agreed that as a cosmetic surgeon Dr J did well passing on the info about intermittent fasting, but that is nutritional info was off base and out of date. Take what works as inspiration and leave the rest behind.
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Old 03-09-2013, 08:57 AM   #13
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Yes! Dr J is an expert on JUDDD but should have steered well clear of giving nutritional advice!

I think the books are worth reading if understanding WHY we do what we do helps us to keep on doing it
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Old 03-09-2013, 11:57 AM   #14
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And I must say I was a little disappointed. Yes, the SIRT1 information was amazing, as well as the science behind the diet itself, but, IMO, the nutritional information was off (the whole thing about saturated fat being artery clogging) and the Atkins diet is NOT high protein! I am just really protective of Atkins and I get really crabby when anyone spouts off "information" about it that is wrong. I still do rotations because I like the way it makes me feel, but I still count carbs too.
So is this not true anymore I thought Saturated fat was not good for anyone! I love all dairy, so hope I have been wrong on trying to avoid sat. fats.
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Old 03-09-2013, 01:20 PM   #15
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So is this not true anymore I thought Saturated fat was not good for anyone! I love all dairy, so hope I have been wrong on trying to avoid sat. fats.
Yes, you have been wrong but you are in good company.

The evidence is really overwhelming, but the mainstream media & medical establishment are slow to come around- doing so would be admitting they were so wrong for so long.
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Old 03-09-2013, 04:04 PM   #16
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So is this not true anymore I thought Saturated fat was not good for anyone! I love all dairy, so hope I have been wrong on trying to avoid sat. fats.
It's actually inflammation that causes the arteries to become clogged--
inflammation creates little "cracks" in the artery walls, and cholesterol sticks to them.

I just Googled "saturated fat good for you" to see if I could find a quick explanation. Most of the websites are ones I probably can't link here, but if you Google it yourself, there's one on Dr Mercola's website that is pretty short & clear, and a longer more detailed one on Men's Health.
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Old 03-09-2013, 04:45 PM   #17
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A great book to read is Eat Fat Lose Fat by Dr Mary Enig and Sally Fallon, the latter being the President of the Weston A Price Foundation. I do recommend it in Kindle though, the writing on the actual book is so small it's difficult to read in comfort. It's mainly all about good and bad fats and they highly recommend coconut oil.

There was a diet book doctor, I can't remember who, I think it was Ron Rosedale but I'm not sure, who did originally recommend saturated fats in his book but had it removed by the publishers or they told him to remove it to keep the book more mainstream. Also his book was aimed at diabetics and I maybe the publishers were toey about recommending saturated fat. So maybe the diet doctors are forced to fit in with the publishers in some ways in order to get their main message out.
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Old 03-09-2013, 04:56 PM   #18
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Butter and virgin coconut oil contain the same sort of fat that is found in breast milk. Can't be bad!
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Old 03-09-2013, 06:35 PM   #19
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It's actually inflammation that causes the arteries to become clogged--
inflammation creates little "cracks" in the artery walls, and cholesterol sticks to them.

I just Googled "saturated fat good for you" to see if I could find a quick explanation. Most of the websites are ones I probably can't link here, but if you Google it yourself, there's one on Dr Mercola's website that is pretty short & clear, and a longer more detailed one on Men's Health.
Thanks ever so much PJ! I read the article by Mercola, makes one wonder about a lot!!! I use only olive oil, coconut oil and butter in cooking, but I still use Crisco Shortening in my cookies - is this a bad one I also save my bacon grease and use that for frying potatoes! i suppose that is a no, no because of the salt and such - think?
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Old 03-09-2013, 06:51 PM   #20
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You're welcome!!!

Crisco shortening is probably "bad" because it's made of vegetable oils like soybean or something. And most oils *should* be liquid at room temperature; the process that makes them solid is hydrogenation, and that's not natural!

Real butter is actually a healthier, less processed choice.
Or, if cost is an issue, I'd use plain old liquid oil before I used shortening.
Idk if that would mess up a cookie recipe...maybe if you refrigerate the oil first, so it's semi-solid?

I save bacon grease, too...
I'm gonna blow your mind some more--salt isn't bad for you either!!!
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/03/op...bout-salt.html

The real "problems" with salt--water retention & high blood pressure, for example--often aren't caused by the salt itself but a deficiency in other electrolytes (magnesium, potassium, etc). By cutting back on salt, there might temporarily be enough of the other minerals for the body to balance itself out, but adding more minerals (via food or supplements) is more beneficial than just cutting out salt.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:08 PM   #21
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You're welcome!!!



The real "problems" with salt--water retention & high blood pressure, for example--often aren't caused by the salt itself but a deficiency in other electrolytes (magnesium, potassium, etc). By cutting back on salt, there might temporarily be enough of the other minerals for the body to balance itself out, but adding more minerals (via food or supplements) is more beneficial than just cutting out salt.
And when I started adding seasalt to my drinking water my water retention issues went away. Something so simple after years and years of swelling up like road kill everytime I had something salty.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:23 PM   #22
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And when I started adding seasalt to my drinking water my water retention issues went away. Something so simple after years and years of swelling up like road kill everytime I had something salty.
I don't have high blood pressure, quite the contrary, but I add pink Himalayan salt to anything that it will taste good with. I need it on DD or I get very dizzy when I stand up. DW has high blood pressure and does not add salt to anything. I use just a little when cooking and add more to mine if I want or need it.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:48 PM   #23
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I have high blood pressure and have brought it down with
(If anybody's interested)
magnesium
potassium
hawthorn berry
olive leaf
Vitamin C
green tea (2-4 teabags per day)
hibiscus tea
cayenne (occasionally, seems to work immediately)

I know it sounds like a lot, but about a year ago, I couldn't get my blood pressure down so I sort of panicked and started a bunch of things at once! They all seem to help, so I still feel okay if I run out of one thing for a week or don't feel like having tea one day. Also, the whole regimen probably costs less than $20/month...I make my own potassium pills with NuSalt, get Vitamin C powder and add it to drinks, buy the hibiscus in a 1-pound bag...

My blood pressure was creeping back up a bit recently, like 125/85, but a couple days ago I added green tea back in (have neglected it the last couple months; I don't like it hot but it has not been good iced tea weather! ) and my bp is back to 120/80 or just under (115/75ish).

I have read that high blood pressure can be caused by chronic dehydration, and salt helps keep us hydrated, so, logically, cutting salt might be a bad thing...OTOH, diuretics can reduce blood pressure. It's so confusing!!! I know for myself there is a difference between retaining water (swollen feet & hands, relieved by diuretics) and being well-hydrated (I can use lots of salt but don't get puffy)...something to do with electrolytes, I guess, but I can't explain it.

One weird thing is, I used to get puffy/itchy feet and hands very badly, esp in warm weather, but since taking metformin (diabetes med), that doesn't happen anymore. I stopped taking it for a week last year and started puffing up again! Maybe in my case water retention has something to do with carbs & blood sugar more than salt?

Ooh, ooh! Eureka moment! Everybody always blames the salt in Chinese food for making them retain water, but Chinese food can be pretty darn carby! I wonder whether it happens if you eat something with soy sauce but without all the rice, noodles, breading, etc? Hmmmm.....

Last edited by piratejenny; 03-09-2013 at 08:10 PM.. Reason: grammar
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Old 03-09-2013, 08:23 PM   #24
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I just had to refresh my memory, but the real reason high blood pressure occurs is because the arteries become too narrow and/or inflexible.

So I'd guess what less salt/diuretics do is induce slight dehydration which reduces the volume of blood...I know the lab can't get any blood out of me in the morning unless I drink a quart of water!!!

And so it seems to me that a better long-term solution would be to clear those arteries and make them more flexible--like a balloon instead of a garden hose. I started taking extra Vitamin C because it is supposed to improve elasticity of the blood vessels. Some of the other things I take have dilatory or anti-inflammatory properties, and/or clear plaque from the arteries.
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Old 03-11-2013, 05:46 AM   #25
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I learn so much reaing the JUDDD board and the main board, this place really is a wealth of information!

About the books, I read everything I can about the WOE I'm interested in trying, but tend to have more faith in the long lasting tried and true, Atkins for example. Most of the new miracle diets I tend to be very weary of but do read about them and see if they make sense to me. Your local library is great if your library has inter library loans (you tend to get the books quicker), much better than dropping $25.00 per book then rejecting the book halfway through.
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:33 AM   #26
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I hate it when people knock Atkins. His plan is brilliant and healthy. It was life changing for me and kept me well throughout the 10+ years I followed it.

The fact that I am not following it now doesn't change that. I love my sat fats and always will. You won't find low fat salad dressings in my food, even on a DD, yuck.
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Old 03-11-2013, 07:58 AM   #27
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I could never lose weight on Atkins but could maintain very easily. I have no problems with the Atkins diet. I think part of the problem is the many people that do not follow the Atkins protocal correctly and it ends up being a high protein diet.

When I read, I just skip over the parts I do not agree with and go on. I do not beleive I have read any kind of self-help or diet book that I agreed 100% with. That does not mean I did not get good information out of that book.
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Old 03-11-2013, 10:18 AM   #28
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You won't find low fat salad dressings in my food, even on a DD, yuck.
THIS ^ is one of the main reasons I hated WW, sure I lost weight but to save points would use low fat salad dressings and low fat mayo.... that stuff (to me) is just plain nasty! I love my full fat foods!!
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Old 03-11-2013, 10:21 AM   #29
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I could never lose weight on Atkins but could maintain very easily. I have no problems with the Atkins diet. I think part of the problem is the many people that do not follow the Atkins protocal correctly and it ends up being a high protein diet.

When I read, I just skip over the parts I do not agree with and go on. I do not beleive I have read any kind of self-help or diet book that I agreed 100% with. That does not mean I did not get good information out of that book.
I tend to maintain on Atkins also, I have to chop my calories to lose (1500 UD, 600 DD), my "real" UD # is 1,700, even then it's slow losing....oh well, I love low carb.
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Old 03-11-2013, 10:27 AM   #30
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I tend to maintain on Atkins also, I have to chop my calories to lose (1500 UD, 600 DD), my "real" UD # is 1,700, even then it's slow losing....oh well, I love low carb.
I too like a lower carb type diet. I do feel better without grains although oat bran and oat groats are sometimes part of my diet. I love fresh veggies and being able to slather them with butter BUT doing all of that can make for VERY high calorie counts and that is why I think I just maintain on Atkins. I found that out when I started tracking calories when I started JUDDD. Won't mention what my former calorie counts were for a regular day. It is a wonder I did not weigh more than I did.
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