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Old 03-01-2013, 10:18 AM   #1
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A couple other hack ideas--no potatoes! no gas!!!

Idea #1: Mess with the bliss point
(for if you "can't stop eating")

Over the last couple days, I read a really long and interesting article about the "Science of Junk Food".
And there's something called the "bliss point", where food is flavored so perfectly that your brain doesn't tell you to stop eating. (This isn't just a junk food conspiracy--now that I know what it's called, I realize that, as a cook, this is what I am good at! I called it "having generic tastebuds" because almost everybody loves my food and complains that they eat too much of it. For many years I cooked for large groups, and got good at making the food exotic, nutritious and appealing but not *too* spicy or garlicky or bland.

But anyway--back to the point...if food is more strongly flavored, our brains get a signal that we've eaten enough.

So my thought is--what if you serve yourself your food, and then add just a little "too much" salt, pepper, garlic, hot sauce, etc?

I know that when I make my coffee just a tiny bit too sweet or not sweet enough, I get sort of turned off to it and don't drink it as quickly, or don't want another cup.

Idea #2: Sugar water instead of potatoes on DDs

This is a concept from The Shangri-La Diet. The author, Seth Robers, has some theories about flavorless calories, but now I'm wondering if the insulin spike from sugar might be part of the puzzle, somewhat similar to the potato hack.

It's been shown that people can survive for long periods on nothing but potatoes, but since sugar has no proteins or nutrients, I would imagine it should only be used for a day or part of a day (instead of breakfast or before bed). However, since many JUDDDers do almost a complete fast on DDs anyway, maybe this could work.

The "rule" is that you can't have any other flavors for an hour after or before your "flavorless calories". So no coffee or Crystal Light or gum or toothpaste or ANYthing.
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Old 03-01-2013, 10:24 AM   #2
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Idea #1a:

Another concept from the Shangri-La Diet is that your body doesn't store calories as efficiently when presented with unfamiliar flavors or flavor combinations. Like, cinnamon on your pizza.

Okay, that's a totally over-the-top example!

But what got him started on this whole thing, IIRC, was a vacation on which he drank a lot of soda that came in "weird" flavors, but he lost a lot of weight. So he started doing a lot of reading and self-experimentation, found out that aroma and flavor (not just calories), are linked to satiety, and came up with this "diet"...which, now that we have the term "bio-hack", really seems more like several hacks than a diet.

Last edited by piratejenny; 03-01-2013 at 10:27 AM.. Reason: add to sentence.
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Old 03-01-2013, 10:34 AM   #3
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Here it is in a nutshell, from the FAQs on the SLD forum:

"You only want to consume flavorless calories during the 2 hour window. Outside of that go for as much flavor as possible. By default your body raises its setpoint when it detects flavors that it knows and loves, and lowers it with unknown flavors. Because of this you should always attempt to eat a variety of foods and flavors."
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Old 03-01-2013, 10:39 AM   #4
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Very interesting PJ! I agree with you on the coffee comment. I've noticed that too. Another tool in our toolbox - thanks!
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Old 03-01-2013, 11:10 AM   #5
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I would totally put cinnamon on Hawaiian pizza. I'm weird like that though.
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Old 03-01-2013, 01:35 PM   #6
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I find it satisfying to eat foods with really intense flavors and that intensity helps me feel satisfied with a relatively small amount of food. Some examples: salmon roe (expensive but luscious), anchovies (I add the contents of little jar to my salads), kimchi and other fermented vegetables, sour dill pickles. I guess that's the opposite of eating just a little because the food is boringly bland.
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Old 03-01-2013, 02:05 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by svenskamae View Post
I find it satisfying to eat foods with really intense flavors and that intensity helps me feel satisfied with a relatively small amount of food. Some examples: salmon roe (expensive but luscious), anchovies (I add the contents of little jar to my salads), kimchi and other fermented vegetables, sour dill pickles. I guess that's the opposite of eating just a little because the food is boringly bland.
I guess, I am just the opposite. Flavorful food makes me more hungry. I can't eat small quantity of delicious food
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Old 03-01-2013, 03:02 PM   #8
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You would not believe I was just reading Seth's book yesterday. I've had it for a while and just decided to get down and read it. I have lurked on his forums in the past however. One poster even clipped her nose for over a year! Posters on Marks Daily Apple tried the oil version of this and it was the usual, some did really well and broke though plateaus and some gave up. Their verdict is that it's not a magic weight loss but it can help with appetite suppression.

If anyone wants to try the oil version - it's around 1tb twice a day with a one hour eating window each end - no food one hour before the oil and no food one hour after the oil. Start with 1tsp though as it can cause stomach upsets initially. No food, gum, toothpaste etc in those respective two hours, only water or pills. Oil can be dispersed in a little water and drunk that way if a spoonful is difficult. AS can come in as little as 2 days. Extra light olive oil or refined coconut oil seem to be the best as they have the most neutral taste. If the oil is strong tasting then holding your nose while taking it and drinking a shot of water afterwards to get rid of the taste should help.

I think any of Seth's methods could only enhance JUDDD and I will start the oil today on this DD.

He says to eat different foods as well. I tend to eat the same ones over and over - greek yoghurt, fruit, nuts and salmon. It seems to be all I want to eat these days. I don't even crave meat anymore (on Atkins I was a carnivore - ate only meat - but a great weight loss). I think this has only really happened since I've been on JUDDD.
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Old 03-01-2013, 03:22 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tobelowcarber View Post
I guess, I am just the opposite. Flavorful food makes me more hungry. I can't eat small quantity of delicious food
Everybody's "bliss point" can be different...what's flavorful/delicious to one person is too intense or bland for someone else.

However, the "hack" in the Shangri-La Diet isn't based on calories or amount of food you eat; it's that your set point can be affected by flavors. I find that fascinating!!!

I think for some people having too many food/flavor choices can lead to overeating, but the "flavorless calories" part of the SLD provide appetite suppression.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mojocat View Post
You would not believe I was just reading Seth's book yesterday. I've had it for a while and just decided to get down and read it.
Cool beans!

Quote:
He says to eat different foods as well. I tend to eat the same ones over and over - greek yoghurt, fruit, nuts and salmon.
You don't necessarily have to change the foods, just change the seasonings/flavor combinations.
But I think that's just a way to speed things along; the flavorless calories can be enough for weight loss.

Last edited by piratejenny; 03-01-2013 at 03:23 PM..
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Old 03-01-2013, 03:31 PM   #10
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I guess I could eat something I dislike like brussel sprouts and just mix crazy combinations of spices over them; now I could do that.
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Old 03-01-2013, 03:48 PM   #11
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If anyone wants to try the oil version - it's around 1tb twice a day with a one hour eating window each end - no food one hour before the oil and no food one hour after the oil. Start with 1tsp though as it can cause stomach upsets initially. No food, gum, toothpaste etc in those respective two hours, only water or pills. Oil can be dispersed in a little water and drunk that way if a spoonful is difficult. AS can come in as little as 2 days. Extra light olive oil or refined coconut oil seem to be the best as they have the most neutral taste. If the oil is strong tasting then holding your nose while taking it and drinking a shot of water afterwards to get rid of the taste should help.
.
Mojo- help me understand this, please. You eat twice a day, let's say at 8 AM and 4 PM. You have 1 tsp oil at 7 AM, 9 AM, 3 PM and 5 PM? Or the oil can be taken anytime as long as you have 1 hr window between oil and food? Thanks!
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Old 03-01-2013, 03:53 PM   #12
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Oil can be taken anytime during the day as long as the one hour window either end is maintained. Seth says some people find it easier to take it one hour after eating because they aren't hungry.
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Old 03-01-2013, 03:58 PM   #13
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Most people have 1 tb spaced out twice a day. You could try 1tb on a weekend and see if if gives you cramping or running to the toilet hehehe. If not then you can go work towards 1tb twice a day. If if gives you stomach prob start with 1tsp twice a day until you get used to it. You don't need to take several tsps over the day to make up a total of 2tbs. So 1tb spaced out twice a day.

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Old 03-01-2013, 04:02 PM   #14
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Most people have 1 tb spaced out twice a day. You could try 1tb on a weekend and see if if gives you cramping or running to the toilet hehehe. If not then you can go work towards 1tb twice a day. If if gives you stomach prob start with 1tsp twice a day until you get used to it. You don't need to take several tsps over the day to make up a total of 2tbs. So 1tb spaced out twice a day.
I can see this working nicely for constipation

What is the reasoning behind taking the oil?
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:13 PM   #15
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It's a theory about the weaker a food's flavour, the weaker it's flavour-calorie association and so it lowers your setpoint so your body doesn't require as much food and hence appetite suppression. Eating flavours that are associated with flavour (ie your favourite foods) raises your setpoint. When he was eating large amounts of bland food he lost weight. He started out with sugar water and then found oil did just as well and had health benefits. Oil is high calorie with no flavour. The body gets the calories but no taste so lowers it setpoint.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:20 PM   #16
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Other methods he recommends are using a swimmer's nose clip when eating, trying new foods, cooking more (because bought foods have the same ingredients/flavours all the time), adding random spices, eat one food at a time, eat foods that are digested slowly and eat more bland foods. However the oil or sugar water is the main method.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:26 PM   #17
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I did SLD for a while and it worked ok when I had a set routine but the 2-hour window could sometimes be difficult to find and the oil got very messy when I was travelling!

It's very like JUDDD in the way you have to experiment and find what works best for you.

I'd definitely study it before having a go, as you need to be clear about what to do and why. You'll need to count the oil calories too, so a bit "pricey" on DDs. I see no reason why you shouldn't do this while JUDDDing, in fact I think there's at least one person on Seth's forum who is doing both.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:32 PM   #18
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PS I tried the sugar water once. It made me really nauseous and left a disgusting sweet taste in my mouth for the rest of the day. I did better with extra light tasting olive oil (noseclipped).

Thanks to SLD, I also discovered that bullet proof coffee (not noseclipped!) in the 2 hour window worked well for me and I still use that on hungry DD mornings.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:37 PM   #19
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At 120 calories per tb it would eat a huge chunk out of my DD. When I tried IF before JUDDD I would have MCT oil in coffee to get me through the day and I found that helped with AS. I've never taken it on it's own with the 1 hour windows but if I ever get to a DD point where I'm not eating I would so def do the oils.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:42 PM   #20
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I was one of Seth's original guinea pigs. I would say the biggest problem I noticed (other than the inconvenience) is that the effect wears off if you don't do it and many people quickly regained weight. I've followed his forum for years Lots of interesting ideas there
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:42 PM   #21
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I don't mind MCT or CO and BP never did it for me, made me nauseous, I just couldn't handle the butter flavour. Being from England Flossy you would have seen the Vicar of Dibley and the famous Christmas brussel sprout episode...my favourite episode. I could so do brussel sprouts with crazy spicing.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:44 PM   #22
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Bascially it sounds as if he's saying in order to not overeat, you need to only eat to live, not enjoy smells or flavors. I imagine that would be effective, but depressing lol.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:44 PM   #23
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Interesting...I will have to look into it. Hey, if the oil decreases my appetite I am all for it even if "eats" chuck of my DD calories. I wonder if I could do this with ghee. I love ghee and can eat it by the spoon, but never really attempted it in this fashion. Off to read more about it.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:46 PM   #24
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I was one of Seth's original guinea pigs. I would say the biggest problem I noticed (other than the inconvenience) is that the effect wears off if you don't do it and many people quickly regained weight. I've followed his forum for years Lots of interesting ideas there
Whatever happened to..was it Rosie..who clipped her nose for a year?
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:47 PM   #25
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Being from England Flossy you would have seen the Vicar of Dibley and the famous Christmas brussel sprout episode...my favourite episode. I could so do brussel sprouts with crazy spicing.
Oh, I love that show They have it every Saturday on my local PBS station. Never seen the brussel sprouts episode. BTW, I LOVE brussel sprouts. Hated it as as kid, though.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:47 PM   #26
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Interesting...I will have to look into it. Hey, if the oil decreases my appetite I am all for it even if "eats" chuck of my DD calories. I wonder if I could do this with ghee. I love ghee and can eat it by the spoon, but never really attempted it in this fashion. Off to read more about it.
You could do it with anything as long as it has no flavour or you clip your nose if it has. Edit; well not everything; check his forum out - some dedicated people there.

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Old 03-01-2013, 04:50 PM   #27
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Oh, I love that show They have it every Saturday on my local PBS station. Never seen the brussel sprouts episode. BTW, I LOVE brussel sprouts. Hated it as as kid, though.
Oh yea she can't say no and accepts invitations to several christmas lunches with the last one culminating in a brussel sprouts eat off. I can't eat them whole but sliced and steamed with butter or oil they taste nice.
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Old 03-01-2013, 04:50 PM   #28
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You could do it with anything as long as it has no flavour or you clip your nose if it has.
So it has to have no flavor or aroma?. Ghee is too flavorful. Cliiping the nose will help with the aroma, but not the flavor, I guess
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Old 03-01-2013, 05:42 PM   #29
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The holding/clipping nose makes food less flavoursome (i.e. supposedly if you eat an apple or onion with your nose closed they taste the same - I haven't tried it).

Constipation? What is that? That's the beauty of JUDDD and eating like a hog on UD's - it gets the system moving the next day...fast...and often.....say no more....
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Old 03-01-2013, 05:51 PM   #30
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Usually, constipation will be a problem at the beginning of almost any new WOE. I had it on LC, and I had it on JUDDD. Not a problem anymore, however, thank goodness! It did take about 2 months to get completely regulated however.
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