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-   -   Question for the Juddders? (http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/juddd/792383-question-juddders.html)

Joannew 12-30-2012 10:42 AM

Question for the Juddders?
I am going to start JUDDD tomorrow, 12/31/12 along with LC.

I was wondering how it would work if a person could put their goal weight in the calorie calculator at 50% Maintenance Mode?

For example, my goal weight is 130# and at 50%, UD would be 1500 and DD would be 750 which averages out to 1125 calories per day.

Would appreciate your thoughts/input on this concept.

ouizoid 12-30-2012 10:51 AM

I think it might work--maybe just a bit more slowly.

The theory is that the bigger the spread between UD and DD the better, and that you need a number below 500 to get the sirtuin enzymes flowing--but I have lost weight consistently doing a DD at 600 or above.

adillenal 12-30-2012 11:27 AM

Those numbers are almost exactly what my maintenance calories are.
All you can do is try it and see since everyone loses weight differently.

E.W. 12-30-2012 11:55 AM

You can always try it. But his maintence guide lines sort of puzzle me. In one of his
earlier papers he quotes a study about people who were not overweight who used this
WOE . The people had an average calorie intake of 1600. Then they started eating 900calories on a DD and 2300 calories on there UD. They stayed out of the hospital a whole
lot more than the controle group. But I am suprised he didn't talk about this study especialy when it showed this WOE could even benifit people who didn't need to lose weight.

Librarygirl 12-30-2012 01:21 PM

I'm confused about people in maintence saying they can eat over 2000 calories on UD and maintain. Then Adi, you say your UD cals are 1500?? Then Dr. J says 2300 on UD and 900 on DD? I doubt the calculator would allow that much at my goal weight, not nearly that much.:dunno:

adillenal 12-30-2012 02:12 PM

Librarygirl - Calculator UD maintenance calories for me is 1586. Now you have to remember that age makes my maintenance calories way lower than younger folks. To make up for that I eat very low DD's so I can increase the UD's. DD's for maintenance are 771. Those two numbers felt like I was dieting everday so I am doing it "my way" and lowering DD's and increasing UD's. So far it is working for maintenance as long as I don't go WAY WAY over 2000 on UD's. And yes, sometimes I do. It is very easy to rack up those calories without half trying. When I do 300/1800 is when I start to slowly, very slowly start a downward trend on the scale. Hopefully I can get that going again now that Christmas is over. That 1586 is sure low so I try to avoid it if possible.

Babsbabs 12-30-2012 02:44 PM

I do the same thing Adilenal when I am successfully maintaining. When I go over my maintenance calories on UD I can keep my weight stable by borrowing them from my DD. if I have a good UD (within my calorie range) then I let myself go up a bit on the DD.
In terms of weight loss those numbers might work for you Joan. I think that many have lost with 600-700 calorie DD's. My only thought is that I think the bigger calorie spread between the UD and DD helps to keep my metabolism going during weight loss. When I have done low calorie eating everyday for more than a week my body seems to adapt making weight loss difficult and weight regain very easy. As long as your metabolism is still getting that boost from the UD I would guess it would work. There seems to be a lot of range in what works for different people. You might find that you can use the weight loss UD number and just go a few hundred calories over on your DD and still lose. I think Beeb did this and lost weight quickly if I am remembering accurately. Let us know what you find out.:)

Kissa 12-30-2012 04:19 PM


It is the gap that starts things going as a rule. Otherwise it is simply calorie reduction which can cause stalls quite quickly, as Babs says.

Librarygirl 12-30-2012 05:02 PM

I usually eat more than 500 cals on DD, but not always. I did stall, but still averaged, so far, over 1 lb loss a week. That might not be fast enough for some, but it is fine with me as long as I can enjoy the ride. :)

Joannew 12-30-2012 06:06 PM

Thank you for all the responses! I guess I can only experiment and see how it goes!:)

Librarygirl 12-30-2012 06:14 PM

Yes, JUDDD is very open to experimentation! Enjoy! :)

grammyw/kitties 12-30-2012 06:34 PM

I do believe that age plays a big part in calories. Mine are 394 for dd and1792 for ud add 200 to ud if I exercise..I may playwith these after I get used to this WOE. I get tired of counting calories all the time. I can't help it if I was born endowed..

Librarygirl 12-30-2012 06:43 PM

Lol, GWK, I do too. I resisted counting calories for a long time, but I find it fairly easy to do every other day (eod). I don't strictly count on UD's, but just guess sometimes at how much I've had. Anyway you look at it, there has to be some kind of restriction in order to lose weight. I guess we could all just say we didn't want to count calories/carbs/etc. and stay the way we are. :) :)

Flossyliz 12-31-2012 08:06 AM

I'd be wary of experimenting much before I was confident my sirtuin levels were established.

Carly 12-31-2012 08:55 AM


Originally Posted by Flossyliz (Post 16161604)
I'd be wary of experimenting much before I was confident my sirtuin levels were established.

I would try to follow the calculater for at least 3 weeks at your current weight with 20%- 30% WLM.

If that isn't working then try experimenting. Just my opinion though.

The spread is important as is low DDs. That is what has worked for me. I know others have been successful with higher DDs.

Eieio 01-03-2013 10:44 AM

Thank u Joan for asking that q!
Lib g I read it that way also, corn-fusing.
Fr my self my first go around woe.
I lost on 700-800 dd. not on perviously that high.
Was working very hard outside, had to eat to keep going.
Now that I'm partially nursing my bow bow knees.
I do no exercise, very little work at all,only keeping t house clearness, laundry. Nothing big.
Somy dd cal goal of 500 is a breeze to make. IM NOT WORKING, actually having a nice time?
I may be finally getting to re-retire.

gotsomeold 01-04-2013 05:36 AM

DDs need to low enough to invoke caloric restriction. This happens when your body has burned up most of the calories you ingested, burned up a certain amount of stored glycogen, and initiates a fairly brief period of sirtuin production (during which time the body preferentially burns fat for energy). UDs are not just fun, they have to be high enough to turn off caloric restriction. Because after about 40 hours of fat burning, your body expands the - ahem - internal cannibalism to include muscle and begins slowing the RMR dooooown. When this happens, you are not doing JUDDD. You are just doing an interesting form of low cal eating.


UD Calories
The website uses the info you enter to calculate your the probable resting metabolic rate (RMR). UD calories are, roughly, RMR + 14%. Depending on how much you have to lose, UD calories based on goal RMR can be too low. This is the reason we do not usually encourage people to begin at the end (goal weight)

I suggest you compare calculated UD cals based on goal with calculated UD cals based on current weight. If there is more than - oh, I am kind of guessing here - 200 calories difference, I encourage you start with current weight UD calories.

DD Calories
Somewhere around RMR - 14%, caloric restriction kicks in. Some people, probably with unexpectedly high RMRs, lose with fairly high DD calories. Most people lose better when they find the sweet spot between 0 calories and 35% weight loss. A bit of experimentation helps.

If you are asking about 750 cal DDs because you are worried about how you would feel at a lower level, 750 is a great place to start. Over time, as the SIRTs accumulate, you should get a certain amount of appetite suppression (and learn more about what you can eat low cal that is very satisfying). I am betting ultimately you will need to eat at lower cal levels to lose, but try it - you might like it.

LoCarbGal 01-04-2013 07:17 AM

:goodpost: Really good explanation Nancy.

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