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Old 12-26-2012, 07:57 AM   #1
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Shaking Things Up....Atkins/JUDDD

I love JUDDD....and have enjoyed good food these past 4 months. My fiancé joined me and hasn't lost anything (I've lost, gained, and lost the same 7-10pounds I had back in August. I've studied my food/exercise logs and realized that there is one thing missing....Discipline. I did real well on reaching my calorie goals; however, my percentages were SO skewed....I was eating mostly carbs. I truly think I'm one of those people that can lose with fat and protein.

I also noticed that carbs must have something to do with my "lazy gene" , because my exercise has been sporadic at best--before JUDDD, Atkins was SO good for making me want to get up early every day and work out. I miss that feeling. I think 4 months was enough time to find that I need to do some "tweaking" to find out what works for me.

My sweetie has been wanting to return to Atkins (we both lost a good deal of weight with it). Here's the deal--I actually enjoy my Down Days--felt good and all, so I want to keep the JUDDD rotations.

I know a lot here do low-carb with JUDDD....but anyone here doing strict Atkins with it? I'm wondering if I can do the rotations in the Induction phase or if I should wait until the two weeks are over?

I'm excited about this "tweak", but in the back of my mind know that at some point I will say "Gee, I sure do miss those pesky carbs..." Hopefully, by that time, I *will* have the disclipline to know how to handle it.


One thing I know for sure....I need to keep coming here and reading, because every time I do, I get a feel-good-type of energy that makes me want to keep pushing to my health goals. You are all sooooo good for me.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:02 AM   #2
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My first month of JUDDD I was doing Atkin's Induction w/ rotations. For me this felt restrictive, but I did lose. I continued to lose just as much when I reindroduced carbs, but if you feel better w/o them you may not feel restricted by doing Atkin's/ JUDDD.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:03 AM   #3
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I did LC for two months, and honestly lost about the same as with JUDDD (which equals, slow but also lacking good discipline), but without enjoying it nearly as much. I was doing Atkins too. I guess if I'm going to diet I'd rather have my cake and eat it too, lol. I'm going to watch how well you do if you decide to switch to strict LC, and if it works well I might consider it too. Good Luck!
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:19 AM   #4
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Quote:
I'm excited about this "tweak", but in the back of my mind know that at some point I will say "Gee, I sure do miss those pesky carbs..." Hopefully, by that time, I *will* have the disclipline to know how to handle it.
I've been on a carb-fest since starting JUDDD. I think once I figured out that I could lose weight and eat carbs, I just went crazy with it. Which, I admit, was kind of fun and mind-blowing, but really bad for my blood sugar. I might try going back to Induction levels with the New Year, and then slowly add in healthy carbs again. Because what I've been eating are NOT healthy carbs. It's not like I've added back certain veggies and all kinds of fruits. I've been eating cakes and cookies and potato chips and bread bread bread.

The great thing about Atkins Induction is, at least for me, it really does suppress my appetite. But I also find that I become obsessive about what I can and can't eat and sometimes a little depressed. I'm definitely going to cut out cakes, cookies, sugar and bread again, but I might keep yogurt and fruit in and see if I can just learn some self-discipline.

Let us know how it goes doing both at the same time Lisa! It's so interesting that you say Atkins made you want to exercise, I think that's a sign that it was what your body wanted.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:33 AM   #5
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I have been basically paleo and low carb for the last 4 years. When I began JUDDD, I experimented for a short period, I tried to add home baked goods & grains on UD. I found that sugar/grains led me to overeat w/ some horrible choices and almost a hungover type feeling. I also had un-nerving hunger the following DD. It is hard to describe, but it was much more uncomfortable than when I refrain from the grain/sugar. However, I may have sensitivity to the sugar/grains which causes these problems, so I feel best abstaining.

Interestingly, I tried the tater hack and liked the feeling and noticed that a few others who were low carbers did as well. Since I have been paleo for the last year, I then started reading up on the Perfect Health Diet (which is a combo of Paleo/Pacific) woe. Dr. Jaminet allows some safe starches such as potatoes/rice in reasonable small amounts with a moderate protein, higher fat (butter, evco, & olive oil) type eating. So far, my body really likes this and I am enjoying learning about the importance of bone broth & fermented veggies/kefir. If you are interested in PHD, we started a thread here...

Perfect Health Diet

Best wishes in whatever you do.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:33 AM   #6
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I don't see any reason you would have to wait until after induction to add rotations back in. JUDDD doesn't care what you eat, even if it's 20 grams or less of carbohydrates per day.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:39 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeirasMom View Post
I don't see any reason you would have to wait until after induction to add rotations back in. JUDDD doesn't care what you eat, even if it's 20 grams or less of carbohydrates per day.
I was just coming back to say this. I JUDDD on any and all manners of eating that I have tried.

Also, your fiance should find JUDDDing much easier to drop weight when he switches back to induction. Usually men have better losses than the females.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:10 AM   #8
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Quote:
I have been basically paleo and low carb for the last 4 years. When I began JUDDD, I experimented for a short period, I tried to add home baked goods & grains on UD. I found that sugar/grains led me to overeat w/ some horrible choices and almost a hungover type feeling. I also had un-nerving hunger the following DD. It is hard to describe, but it was much more uncomfortable than when I refrain from the grain/sugar. However, I may have sensitivity to the sugar/grains which causes these problems, so I feel best abstaining
.

Hope this isn't highjacking the thread, but Sunday, I'm curious about how you have been eating on Paleo. Do you not eat dairy? I'm very interested in Paleo, but so much of what I eat when lowering carbs is dairy. I've also been reading a lot about the 80/20 rule, which sounds so much more doable and I think would keep me sane. I'll also go take a look at the Perfect Health thread you linked!
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:47 AM   #9
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I have been doing JUDD/Atkins combo simply because it helps to keep my cravings at bay. During my previous JUDD attempts I failed each time as I did not keep my carbs low enough. Right now I am doing anywhere from 5-30 gr of carbs a day (gross not net) and it seems to work well for me. Once I reach my goal weight I may go up on the carbs but grains and sugar will always be out of my diet.
I think you will do very well with the JUDD/Atkins combo. Good luck to you!
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:34 AM   #10
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Thank you for the great feedback!

Sunday, I'm going to check out that Perfect Health Diet link. Oh, and that tater hack was pretty fun--I lost on it, but gained it back because of my weakness for potato CHIPS.

deedee, I hear ya on the carb fest. In reading the threads, I expected to grow out of the whole "let's have a carb party!" mindset after a while. I've been on a non-stop party, I guess.

Dawn, You're absolutely right--I'm going to go right into the rotations and not worry about it.

One thing I'm really going to enjoy is getting my HWC back into my coffee--I'll be able to have that on my Up AND Down days.
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Old 12-26-2012, 12:08 PM   #11
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So Lisa, you're only going to count carbs not calories? I only ask because you say you'll use HWC on DD's as well. LC did not equal low calorie for me, but mainly because I ate a lot of meat and fats (and HWC). Sometimes I still use HWC on DD's, but just have less of something else.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:03 PM   #12
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I refuse to give up my HWC!!! But, I do find smaller quantities still meet my inner socioeconomic needs.

Lisa, I am delighted you have recognized something so important about how you work!!! I also have successfully combined Atkins and JUDDD from time to time. Shake it down!!!!
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:14 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saxy1971 View Post
I love JUDDD....and have enjoyed good food these past 4 months. My fiancé joined me and hasn't lost anything (I've lost, gained, and lost the same 7-10pounds I had back in August. I've studied my food/exercise logs and realized that there is one thing missing....Discipline. I did real well on reaching my calorie goals; however, my percentages were SO skewed....I was eating mostly carbs. I truly think I'm one of those people that can lose with fat and protein.

I also noticed that carbs must have something to do with my "lazy gene" , because my exercise has been sporadic at best--before JUDDD, Atkins was SO good for making me want to get up early every day and work out. I miss that feeling. I think 4 months was enough time to find that I need to do some "tweaking" to find out what works for me.

My sweetie has been wanting to return to Atkins (we both lost a good deal of weight with it). Here's the deal--I actually enjoy my Down Days--felt good and all, so I want to keep the JUDDD rotations.

I know a lot here do low-carb with JUDDD....but anyone here doing strict Atkins with it? I'm wondering if I can do the rotations in the Induction phase or if I should wait until the two weeks are over?

I'm excited about this "tweak", but in the back of my mind know that at some point I will say "Gee, I sure do miss those pesky carbs..." Hopefully, by that time, I *will* have the disclipline to know how to handle it.


One thing I know for sure....I need to keep coming here and reading, because every time I do, I get a feel-good-type of energy that makes me want to keep pushing to my health goals. You are all sooooo good for me.
I do a LCHF version of Atkins on JUDDD. I keep my net carbs at around 20/day (or less) and also try to restrict protein to under 60 grams/day (you may not have to do that, however). On down days, about 50 percent of my calories come from fat (such as half-and-half in coffee), the rest from lean protein, and I eat hardly any carbs (5 today); on my up days, I eat more fat but still limit carb and protein grams pretty stringently.

I never could lose weight, no matter how low my calories went, if I ate many carbs; I'm obviously highly insulin resistent. It sounds like this might be true for you, too. Some of us just have to limit carbs and eat mostly fat and protein (plus some low-starch veggies) to lose.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:14 PM   #14
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Lisa~ good luck to you I think you'll do great! I'm currently not doing LC with JUDDD but contemplating it because my body just seems to feel better with lc. Wonderful to hear that your sweetie is still on board with everything.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:21 PM   #15
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After this past month-long carb fest, I think in January, once the last of the sugary treats are gone, I'll try LCHF for a couple of weeks. I'm teetering between that and a potato hack. Either way, it should shake up what my body is expecting and get things moving.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:36 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedee View Post
.

Hope this isn't highjacking the thread, but Sunday, I'm curious about how you have been eating on Paleo. Do you not eat dairy? I'm very interested in Paleo, but so much of what I eat when lowering carbs is dairy. I've also been reading a lot about the 80/20 rule, which sounds so much more doable and I think would keep me sane. I'll also go take a look at the Perfect Health thread you linked!
Yes, you can have dairy, but in limitations. Here is the PHD chart... dairy is limited, as is chocolate, nuts, alcohol, berries & fruits. This is basically paleo w/ added safe starches tubers and rice.

Perfect Health Diet

I have cream in coffee and now use coconut creamer as well.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:14 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedee View Post
I've been on a carb-fest since starting JUDDD. I think once I figured out that I could lose weight and eat carbs, I just went crazy with it. Which, I admit, was kind of fun and mind-blowing, but really bad for my blood sugar. I might try going back to Induction levels with the New Year, and then slowly add in healthy carbs again. Because what I've been eating are NOT healthy carbs. It's not like I've added back certain veggies and all kinds of fruits. I've been eating cakes and cookies and potato chips and bread bread bread.
When I was LCing I stayed away from sweets, potatoes, rice, chips, and especially bread. I LOVE bread but had to figure out a LC version of it, so I make flaxseed muffins, they are english muffin type muffin. They have saved me when it comes to having something to put my sf jam or peanut butter on.
Since JUDDDing I do have chips or cookies on UD's but not every UD and only a little bit. Bad carbs are bad for my blood sugar too. I hope that when this weight is off and my metabolism has been repaired I won't have to be so afraid of carbs, but for now I am fine with just a little here and there. I don't really want to go back to induction. It made me crazy that I couldn't have some foods. It felt restrictive and that doesn't work for me. Even as restrictive as DD's are, knowing I can have it the next day is what keeps me going.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:55 PM   #18
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Thank you for the info Sunday! I'm really interested in trying out the PHD after the New Years.

Quote:
Since JUDDDing I do have chips or cookies on UD's but not every UD and only a little bit. Bad carbs are bad for my blood sugar too. I hope that when this weight is off and my metabolism has been repaired I won't have to be so afraid of carbs, but for now I am fine with just a little here and there. I don't really want to go back to induction. It made me crazy that I couldn't have some foods. It felt restrictive and that doesn't work for me. Even as restrictive as DD's are, knowing I can have it the next day is what keeps me going.
Jan, are you a diabetic as well? As much as I really do love JUDDD so far, I don't have any hopes that it can fix that. But I'm with you on the restrictiveness of induction period, which I think is why it's not meant to last forever. But as a diabetic (or really anyone with blood sugar issues) it becomes more complicated. I wish I'd found JUDDD years ago before I developed all these issues!
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Old 12-27-2012, 04:09 AM   #19
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No, I am pre-diabetic. But LCing has brought my numbers down to normal. I do think that diet can have a huge effect on blood sugar. It takes time and care to eat healthy, low carb and take care of yourself.
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Old 12-27-2012, 06:09 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarygirl View Post
So Lisa, you're only going to count carbs not calories? I only ask because you say you'll use HWC on DD's as well. LC did not equal low calorie for me, but mainly because I ate a lot of meat and fats (and HWC). Sometimes I still use HWC on DD's, but just have less of something else.
Yep! Like Nancy, I refuse to give up my HWC. I've had good experience with appetite supression on Atkins, so I'm hoping that my DD's I will be able to get by with just coffee and HWC.

I've got my tracker set to count carbs and calories, so I'm going to keep an eye on both, but going for under 20 carbs a day. We'll see how it goes!
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Old 12-27-2012, 06:22 AM   #21
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Quote:
No, I am pre-diabetic. But LCing has brought my numbers down to normal. I do think that diet can have a huge effect on blood sugar. It takes time and care to eat healthy, low carb and take care of yourself.
Oh, absolutely, diet is the biggest factor in blood sugar. But I don't think diabetes can be cured, in the sense that you can ever go back to eating high-carb again. At least not for me, unfortunately, as much as I would love that! I guess I just have to accept that won't ever be an everyday thing for me again. Which is okay, there's lots of yummy low-carb foods. I'm going to test out this Perfect Health Diet and see if there are some carbs that aren't quite as bad as others.

Quote:
I've got my tracker set to count carbs and calories, so I'm going to keep an eye on both, but going for under 20 carbs a day. We'll see how it goes!
Good luck Lisa! I bet the loss will be even quicker combining JUDDD with induction Atkins.
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:43 AM   #22
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The very interesting point that the Jaminet's researched when writing the PHD, is the fact that breast milk is nutritionally complete in every single mammalian species, not just humans. When broken down, breast milk is composed of majority of macros from fats, 2nd carbs, and the fewest cals are protein. It is very interesting chapter in the book, because it speaks about how healthy breast babies are in fighting bacterial illness compared to formula fed. With PHD, your macros will be similar 50-60% fat, 35% carb, & 15% protein.
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Old 12-27-2012, 09:38 AM   #23
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I can only speak for myself, but my diabetes has been cured. I was on Byeatta injections 2x per day and my A1C was 8.9
Now I'm on nothing! 65 pounds gone and at last check up my A1C was 6.5 with no meds for 4 or 5 months prior! I eat anything- with moderation.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:00 AM   #24
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I can only speak for myself, but my diabetes has been cured. I was on Byeatta injections 2x per day and my A1C was 8.9
Now I'm on nothing! 65 pounds gone and at last check up my A1C was 6.5 with no meds for 4 or 5 months prior! I eat anything- with moderation.
That's amazing that you've had such success! Unfortunately for me, A1C isn't a great indicator, mine was 5.2 when I was diagnosed. But I think it depends on what you consider diabetic? For me, if my blood sugar goes above 120 with a high-carb meal, that's an indicator that I'm diabetic. Non-diabetics in my life can eat literally anything (a pack of snickers mini-bars for example) and not have their bg ever go above 100, even an hour after eating those. I don't think I'm ever going to have that, and as much as I want to eat high-carbs, I don't want to stress out my pancreas any more.

Quote:
The very interesting point that the Jaminet's researched when writing the PHD, is the fact that breast milk is nutritionally complete in every single mammalian species, not just humans. When broken down, breast milk is composed of majority of macros from fats, 2nd carbs, and the fewest cals are protein. It is very interesting chapter in the book, because it speaks about how healthy breast babies are in fighting bacterial illness compared to formula fed. With PHD, your macros will be similar 50-60% fat, 35% carb, & 15% protein.
I can't wait to get this book! Are there sample menus in there? I always have a hard time picturing food that's that high in fat but not super high in protein.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:05 AM   #25
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There's a new e-book coming out in January by Dana Carpender. Can't link to it because they're a seller, but I think it's called Fat Fast Recipes. I've put my name on the list to be notified when it's ready. Sounds interesting.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:45 AM   #26
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I can't wait to get this book! Are there sample menus in there? I always have a hard time picturing food that's that high in fat but not super high in protein.
Yes, he has a lot of samples on his site and in the book. The great thing about PHD, is it is so simple that it seems too good to be true. Not a lot of cooking, just steaming veggies, simmering broth or slicing veggies. Whole foods can be prepped for the whole week in an hour on the weekend.

Some of my fav PHD blogs are...
tummyrumblr (her blog is AMAZING!) and she is fun. Today she has a "Syrian Roasted Chicken" and "Shrimp&Red Chile Soup" that are mouthwatering.

Nutty Kitchen

Francesca Eats ~ She is Italian and graduated from the French Culinary Institute in NYC. Fascinating ideas and very nutrient dense cooking.

The 10 Minute Meal And this is very well becoming my "go to" right now. 10 min is right up my alley because I don't like to hover in the kitchen.

To be honest, if you follow any paleo bloggers, most meals can be adjusted.
I think the reason that I could have had stalls may have been that I was eating too much protein and excess dairy fat??? Never much cheese, but may have been adding too much hwc, yogurt, & butter.

LoCarbGal, Let us know what you think about it when you get it. I am curious.

Last edited by sunday; 12-27-2012 at 10:49 AM..
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:52 AM   #27
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Thanks Sunday and LCG! I'm going to look into both of these.

I've had a feeling for a long time that dairy wasn't great for me, but I love it so the idea of never having cream in my coffee is a bit too much. It sounds like PHD might be workable for someone like me.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:59 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by deedee View Post
Thanks Sunday and LCG! I'm going to look into both of these.

I've had a feeling for a long time that dairy wasn't great for me, but I love it so the idea of never having cream in my coffee is a bit too much. It sounds like PHD might be workable for someone like me.
Cream is fine with PHD! One reason that I decided to look into the plan is that he promotes IF and the plan allows chocolate, wine, nuts & dairy! In limitation, naturally. What's not to like about that? I enjoy reading the questions that all of his readers post on his site and have learned a lot about restricting protein to around 200 cals per day. Seems that he studied super centenarians, and what they deemed healthy.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:15 AM   #29
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I enjoy reading the questions that all of his readers post on his site and have learned a lot about restricting protein to around 200 cals per day. Seems that he studied super centenarians, and what they deemed healthy.
Do you use something in particular to figure out how many calories a day you're eating of protein? I have a food diary, but it just gives the percentage of my daily food that is a certain group. I'm sure I could figure this out but math is not my strong suit and it would be nice to see how many calories exactly of carbs, fat, protein, etc. I'm eating.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:17 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by deedee View Post
Do you use something in particular to figure out how many calories a day you're eating of protein? I have a food diary, but it just gives the percentage of my daily food that is a certain group. I'm sure I could figure this out but math is not my strong suit and it would be nice to see how many calories exactly of carbs, fat, protein, etc. I'm eating.
****** shows that.
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