A DD Hack

[ouizoid]

I can't respond with the detail I want because I am at a conference typing on my cell but consider the idea that bs regulation takes place over several days with this hack. I will write more this afternoon when I am at a computer. It may be that blood sugar regulation is a process not an event with this hack

[Babsbabs]

I just found this thread! Wow, really interesting reading. I have been craving potatoes lately. Unfortunately I have been eating them in French fry and chip form. It would be great if the potatoes could help me lose the weight gain by eating them without the fat! I am going to try this with JUDDD.

[gotsomeold]

Originally Posted by ouizoid

I can't respond with the detail I want because I am at a conference typing on my cell but consider the idea that bs regulation takes place over several days with this hack. I will write more this afternoon when I am at a computer. It may be that blood sugar regulation is a process not an event with this hack

'zoid, you are an angel at a conference!!! Concentrate... concentrate... and I look forward to hearing from you when you have time. Meantime, there are now tons of places I can to do more research (this really is fascinating).

[sunday]

I recently stumbled upon an interesting blog by Tim Fentriss (author of "The Four Hour Body"), about this "same food" eating daily. He has many positive reviews on the blog from folks who have lost a lot of weight eating the "same meal" repeatedly for breakfast/lunch w/ Slow Carbs. Just in case anyone wants to read the reviews...google, "tim fentriss how to lose 100 lbs".

The list of slow carbs foods...

http://www.slowcarbliving.com/slow/files/scfdlist1.pdf

It seems to be that the less variety and the same meal for each day works. He allows one cheat day per week, where you eat whatever you want. Some of the reviewers said that they restricted themselves to one "free for all" day each 10 lbs that they lost.

[cuttie99]

Ok everyone, I was getting hungry so I decided to go with an all potato diet no calorie counts. Ouizoid, I am still interested in hearing about your thanksgiving bloat!! so to keep me untrack I will try to post daily this potato experiment. Not planning on tracking cals but will do my best. No blood sugar issues I am aware of.


12/2 wt 173.5 - feel bloated due to my treats!
Breakfast: 180 cal small yukon potatoes microwaved with pepper salt.
lunch: 4 boiled potatoes about 180 with P and S, boiled in water with garlic powder, italien seasoning and salt. (didn't really add much flavor) Tasted "creamier" then microwaved...


So far I am not really that hungry and not craving anything. I kind of like that I don't have to worry about what to cook etc. I also love potatoes so I hope I can hang on to at least this Saturday. Not planning on doing any exercise.

Thank you joy joy and Sunday for your support!

Su11 did you lose an additional 4 lbs after you lost your bloat weight?

I am planning to buy some FF chicken stock cubes to boil my potatoes to add more flavor. Maybe sprinkle them with chili powder or chipolte... I am not a good cook. Please help with ideas!! If any one has any suggestions on how I can make my potatoes taste better I would really appreciate it. I am not planning on adding any oils or pam. I am going to use only seasonings, herbs, maybe little sugar free ketchup and hot sauce. Have not tried the potatoes with vinegar yet or made any hashbrowns.

Thanks!

[cuttie99]

Originally Posted by Carly

I did a potato only DD yesterday. 3 cups cubed and boiled in FF broth. I ate half a cup at 11am and almost 2.5 cups at 10:30pm. They were filling and i ate them slightly warm- reheated after chilled in fridge. Yesterday Morning I was 138: that was way up after some Chinese food. I'm about to go weigh in. I'll report back.

Congrats Carly!!!

[Kissa]

Anyone considered Splenda on the potatoes...?

[GrannyPants]

Originally Posted by C'Marie

Thanks for this. I read the link and clicked on another one, it said that vinegar with it lowered the glycemic index also. I didn't buy any russets, they all smelled moldy to me! I bought yellow, red, purple, and a couple sweets.

I didn't read much further than that link I'm afraid..

You know I can't wrap my head around putting vinegar on potatoes directly...I know my X used to get french fries down the shore and there was always vinegar to put on them... DD says she likes vinegar and salt chips...

If I can get the last of my shirataki noodles down, I can easily do the potato vinegar thing.

[Kissa]

How can you consider fish and chips without malt vinegar? Sacrilege!

I love anything pickled, so vinegar is great for me.

[sunday]

Granny, I believe malt vinegar would be the best way to go. I use ACV daily in my water, but would think that malt would taste much yummier than acv on taters. It is def a German thing.

Cuttie, I saw some who did the p-hack said that they roasted the potatoes in the oven with salt/pepper, chives, herbs and onion. That sounded a bit like a potato that I make for family w/ a drizzle of olive oil, and it is very moist. I know you can't use oil, but if you boil the taters for a few minutes before placing in the oven, it makes them moister (look for Hot Crash Potatoes - Pioneer Woman).

[sunday]

Cindy, are you asking for sweet potato? I can't envision sweet white potato?

[Joyjoy]

Su, I'm interested in your bloat talk.
Part of my interest in this hack is in eliminating most foods so that I can learn a bit about any sensitivities by watching signs and symptoms now and when I return to a varied diet.
I have a history of migraines and crazy sinus headaches that come with puffy eyes and overall fluid retention. They were certainly aggravated by premenstrual and perimenopausal hormonal changes, but I wonder about diet involvement too - sensitivities, insulin spikes, etc. So what an exciting opportunity to learn!

So far, I've had a headache and puffball eyes for the entire hack duration!
Granted, I am also having the first menstrual period in four or five months, and I'm sucking back paint fumes all day long - can't escape the n=1 thing.
But wouldn't it be fantastic if this day 3-4 transition kicked in and the puffiness disappeared??
Hey Nancy, if you're still reading, there was some interesting chat in the hack threads about whether sustained LC helps or harms insulin sensitivity and resistance. That was new thinking for me.
Onward! (Who knew the lowly spud could be so exciting?)

[Joyjoy]

Thanks for the Tim Ferris stuff, Sunday. And yeah, I do good walks on good hills every day and I see no problem with it.
And Cindy. Splenda on potatoes? You are out there, honey. I'll try it if you will.
Cuttie, yay for you for giving it a whirl.

I'm emptying the dregs of all kinds of vinegar bottles: malt, ACV, red wine vinegar, balsamic. All delicious with good salt. (the vinegar-potato thing comes naturally to Brits and Canadians)
I laughed today at the store. Big sale on organic potatoes. Wuhoo!

[Kissa]

Nice, love an organic deal Kristin.

2 things I really notice the difference in taste when I get organic. Potatoes and celery.

I dipped some tatter in a bit of Splenda, not bad. But I prefer salt and vinegar.

[becksterinindy]

Decided to start today instead of tomorrow. Boiled potatoes last night (2 russets and 6 each petite red and yukon gold). Yummmm cold with a drizzle of malt vinegar.

Not sure how long I will hang but a fun experiment to be on.

kissa I am with the rest....splenda?

I did save the potato water I boiled them in thinking of mashing some potatoes in a bit of that and/or add spices and more potato water and call it soup. May add some ff broth from time to time if I can stick to this for several days but for now want to stick to only vinegar.

Think I will have the hash browns for supper tonight. Watching grandkids right now, unexpectedly, so will play with potatoes later

LOVE this thread and thank you all for the info and posting your experiences.

[ouizoid]

ok--back in the room on my laptop--

So--a few personal observations and some hypotheses--remember, IANYD, and YMMV, and all those other internet disclaimers, lol.

I had a semi-potato day yesterday (not dinner, cause, conference, ha)--but as I was running around I had the startling realization that I felt like I was in ketosis! metal mouth, no appetite, the whole 9 yards, so I put my biochemist hat on, and this is what I think--

I think potatoes SPIKE insulin, and then it drops superlow because free fatty acids are mobilized to deal with the spike. voila, ketosis because there has been a vacuuming up of glucose. I think the glucose gets very quickly cleared from the blood (maybe resulting in the hypoglycemic crash so many of you are reporting). I suspect that over time, this mechanism becomes more efficient, possibly restoring insulin sensitivity (I think. All Hypothetical).

I think the longer I am eating potatoes IN THE ABSENCE OF FAT, my own fatty acids from my fat stores are dealing with the glucose more efficiently as time goes by. I am really recognizing that even if I have a hungry moment or two, it quickly goes away, much like judding and then I have to make myself eat. I ignore hunger spikes and then they disappear almost entirely.

So--I would never encourage any of you who are having a bad time with potatoes to stick it out. seriously. But, for those of you who are on the fence about it, I suggest trying a few different runs of potato days and see if you notice any changes in satiation and fat loss. I am losing fat, appetite, tastes for sugar/wheat, and anxiety etc by eating taters. It is so interesting to me.

As to the bloat question--I didn't weigh myself before thanksgiving, so I don't know for sure, but I lost 6 pounds in 5 days, and I am willing to wager that at least 2-3 of those pounds were bloat. I expect that any of us who are seriously carbing up will have some initial bloat, that will then come off. I also note that I am prone to bloating for any number of reasons, and at this point, I don't freak out about a slight uptick. It is the overall moving average that interests me, and I can see that potatoes are having a beneficial effect on me.

All the folks at the conference last night told me how slim I was looking. I start my next round of taters tomorrow, so I will be reporting in on how it goes.

It is all just a grand experiment, yes??? It could all come crashing down around our ears, lol, or it could be very very cool!

love you guys

Ouis

[Kissa]

'Fried' my potatoes thinly sliced in a very hot nonstick pan until they browned a little.

Sprinkled with salt a dipped in malt vinegar. Lovely.

[sunday]

Originally Posted by sunday

I recently stumbled upon an interesting blog by Tim Fentriss (author of "The Four Hour Body"), about this "same food" eating daily. He has many positive reviews on the blog from folks who have lost a lot of weight eating the "same meal" repeatedly for breakfast/lunch w/ Slow Carbs. Just in case anyone wants to read the reviews...google, "tim fentriss how to lose 100 lbs".

The list of slow carbs foods...

http://www.slowcarbliving.com/slow/files/scfdlist1.pdf

It seems to be that the less variety and the same meal for each day works. He allows one cheat day per week, where you eat whatever you want. Some of the reviewers said that they restricted themselves to one "free for all" day each 10 lbs that they lost.

oops, it is Tim Ferriss! Not Fentriss. I apologize!!!

[Joyjoy]

Ouiz, thanks so much for the theory! I'd swear I'm in ketosis today, too. My breath has that crazy smell and hunger is sharp when it comes and then it just passes. It's turning into an effortless DD.
Ketosis on potatoes! Wild idea.

[sunday]

Ouis,

I believe that could, indeed, be what is happening with the insulin sensitivity. I know that I have read about this somewhere on the MDA. It is so interesting! I am anxious to see my friend's results. She is the biggest sugar addict I know. Loves ice cream & yogurt more than anything! It is a huge deal for her to be able to set the sweets aside to try this tater hack. I am keeping my fingers crossed!

[cuttie99]

well everyone. not doing that great. its 430pm. I had about 700 cals of taters today and can't even think about eating more. I am not hungry and I am satisfied. however I have a dull headache! just took 2 advil. not sure if its potato related or that I didn't eat enough cals. Alos feel slightly bloated and slight nasea. usually if I have had good feast days and suddenly drop my cals I get a headache (usually from lack of carbs, sugar .. but I am eating potatoes!) but haven't really been closely monitoring it. my husband found out about my diet and now has lovingly nicknamed me "couch potato" . I am starting to have my doubts. I tried some potato with vinegar and did not care for it. I finally gave in and had some with ketchup. my ketchup is 50% sugar free. (Had mixed sugar free and regular together to consolidate jars.. should have left them alone). had about 1.5 tsp with dinner potatoes.

so the pros: easy, satisfying, no hunger or cravings
cons: ? headaches, boring, bloated and nausea

I went to the supermarket today and this experiement has really helped me again appreciate foods! last week I would look at grapes and salad and say "not really interested I prefer cookies!" now those grapes in the supermarket looked soooo good. Made me say to myself.. "Why don't you stop trying to do these shortcuts for wt loss and just eat freaken healthy!" easier said then done! Well will report my findings tomorrow. Not sure if I will be able to stick with this diet because I don't think I will be able to eat enough!! Thats a first! usually down days I am starving and cranky and think about food all day and end up blowing it. Today it was easy just wish I didn't have this headache.

I wasn't planning on this being DD and if I continue to have consecutive DD's not sure if I will lose wt? what do you guys think? Maybe this diet will only work for those that eat a good amount. I guess I can only do potato dd's....

Looks like joy joy is also having headaches too.

[Shari4]

Well, Potato Buds, yesterday I did a DD with small yukon potatoes & one boiled sweet potato. It was my first PD. I actually ended with higher than normal calories. Usually, I try to keep it at 400; but, yesterday I did 600! My weight was down 1.8lbs this morning! On my last JUDDD UD I was up 1.2 pounds. So, not a lot of extra loss; but, a loss none the less! Today I have a 3lb sack of yukon gold that I boiled last night and a couple of sweet potatoes to cook. I'm not sure if I can eat it all!! But, I'll try.

I checked my BG about an hour after eating today & it was 118. That is about normal for me. I know for some of you that's high; but, my doctor says it's ok(my daughter & sister say it isn't ) They're both diabetic.

I'm finding that my hunger is less & that I have no craving for sweets. That is a miracle all by itself!! Haven't notice ketosis yet. But, this is my first UD eating just potatoes.

Keep reporting everyone! I've got to go get some malt vinegar. I've never used it(don't throw things at me!!!! )

Have a great potato day!!

[ouizoid]

cuttie--I had headaches the first day or so too. I wonder if it is like the ketosis flu? They went away after a day or so--

[Joyjoy]

But Sunday (Ouiz? Anybody?), how the heck does all of this mesh with Finney, Volek, Taubes, et al??????????

[ouizoid]

yeah, what does it mean Joy? I'd love to know. I'm just 'sperimenting! So many theories! Everyone has an opinion!

I think it actually means different strokes for different folks!!

I think it means we shouldn't be deathly afraid of certain carbs under certain conditions, especially if they are carbs that humans have been eating forever (unlike grains like wheat that are recently genetically modified and in no way resemble ancient grains), and especially if what we eat means we don't feel like eating again for hours and the insulin ends up being cleared from our bloodstream by the time we DO eat.

I think that if we aren't our ancestors, working physically hard all the time, we better be careful about combining said carbs with a bunch of fat. Or sugar (which wasn't ancestrally available).

I think it means that whether we are depending on a "healthy" insulin spike/clearing like taters plus food (vs eating a carpload of sugar, flour, and fat) or we are using a DD fast like JUDDD, somehow or another we can't eat so frequently that we have some weird constant flow of glucose in our system. We aren't built for that.

my 2cents, lol. I'm sure Taubes et al would disagree with me.

[Scotty]

I will be doing another DD Pd tomorrow. I willbe at work so that will be the acid test of whether I get my ususal DD headache and brain fog which does affect my work.

I will be having all together just under a pound(!) of yukons boiled and with some grape tomatoes and parsley, a bit of ff broth if I need it, and for "dinner" roasted with a bit of Pam which tasted yummy to me yesterday.

I lost about 1.7 pounds at the last Pd yesterday and hoping for a repeat. Trying to get some wiggle room for the holidays. I am not doing this for health-just for a change and experiment in hunger which has plagued me for th ten months I have been JUDDDing and because although I love veggies I HATE salads which I have tended to have on DDs. Thanks.

[pooticus]

OMG! BUDDDs I love it!

Ouiz, I just stumbled upon your thread after white knuckling my way through week 1 of Induction. It's not that I haven't been eating delicious low carb food, but after eating anything I "wanted" to eat while on surgery diet sabatical (and gaining 22lbs) - even while calories were only in a 1400-1800 range/day...I'm finding my mind wants anything other than lc!

Now this...I want taters like nobody's business! Shut. Up! I want them so bad, right? LOL. I may have to try the potato experience when I am back to JUDDD. I figured I would do 2 weeks of Induction, then re-transition to my beloved JUDDD. And then...oh boy howdy! And then, Potato Land here I come! Wouldn't it be great it if it didn't jack with the T2?!

I wait and watch with you all as your perform this wonderful experiment!!! Cudos Ouiz! (You know Jan Krasniewski Optimal Diet, which is very high fat like Banta, actually includes a small portion of potatoes as part of the diet...and they lose weight and anecdotal evidence from patients are that different disease states are reversed.

Maybe it has to do with the leptin/ghrelin/insulin feedback loops and clearing fat from the liver???

[Su11]

Originally Posted by cuttie99

Su11 did you lose an additional 4 lbs after you lost your bloat weight?


Thanks!

Hi Cuttie- I didn't weigh at all after Thanksgiving... it was Not Good. So, I know there was some weight gain there. Then when I started this plan, around the 2nd day or so my fingers suddenly puffed up, along with my face and my ankles were HUGE. I had to sleep with my legs on a pillow to try to drain it out.

But that was a couple of days ago, and this morning I decided to see how much weight I still had to lose to get back to my pre-Thanksgiving weight. I was actually 4 lbs LOWER than my pre TX weight, so I have to have lost at least 6 lbs total (I was very Not Good ) .

I don't use any sugar and I'm not using much sweetner. I am not eating any fat at all. I do like cold potatoes, but I don't always eat them that way.

I do think we get confused by the starch issues. We have so many starch carbs that are not really 'human food' because we have modified them so much. But the foods that have not changed a lot probably are things that we were built to eat, unless something is off kilter in our bodies. We have always had folks that did better at one end of the spectrum of carbs than another... Jack Sprat who ate no fat, for example!

Long term, I know that I will add back in the good fats, but maybe some cycling of fat would be a better idea.

[gotsomeold]

Fingers crossed for you Scotty! It will be great if PDs are the way to keep you looking & feeling great without all the DD unpleasantness you have had to endure.

I think 'zoid is correct. NK works...for some people. Atkins is a lifesaver...for some people. Some vegans enjoy rich and vibrant health...and some don't. Some people thrive on fat and protein only...some collapse. IF/CRON works miracles for some...and is dangerous for others. And so on and so on and so on.

I think Taubes, et al, ad infinitum each and every one has hold of one part of the elephant. Except (pardon me while I revert to my Southern roots) ain't nobody actually seen the whole elephant...yet.

The world will little note nor long remember our experiments here. But, you know, sometimes I feel that as we share and learn and grow in knowledge and experience, we may be catching glimpses of that huge and complex shape.

Maybe, with each of these experiments we even hear - listen! beyond the horizon! such a quiet yet imposing sound! - the elephant trumpet it's greeting:

"Howdy Ya'll. Betcha didn't think I was going to be this complicated, did you?"

[ouizoid]

Maybe it has to do with the leptin/ghrelin/insulin feedback loops and clearing fat from the liver???

hey Pootie! Interesting idea! I think someone over MDA mentioned something like that--

If you try this hack, I feel like we now have enough info to say to people that there may be an "adjustment period," lol. We have reports of sugar spikes, somnolence, bloating, headaches, etc., but for the lucky ones, after getting thru the adjustment phase, there seems to be dietary satisfaction, fat loss, energy and well being. I hope that describes you poot!

Nancy--you are hilarious! The Elephant Speaks!!