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Old 08-01-2012, 09:44 PM   #91
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I'm sorry you are struggling so with the UD calories. I can so totally relate. All I can say is, it does get better.

I think some of it is your fear of the foods that have been "forbidden" for so long. You are really dieting both days. And you should be loosening up a bit on UD's.

I can NOT save my calories for late in the day. If I go into 4pm or so under 1000 calories, there is NO WAY I can get to 1500 with supper. We eat late, I get SO full on less than 500 cals, and I'm still full when I go to bed, so an evening snack is simply NOT an option.

I think it's just going to take a little time for you to convince yourself that it is OK to eat a little more fat, and to find the times of day when you can get extra calories in without sacrificing the hunger scale that is working for you.

That only looks like 2 meals and a snack. Did you eat supper? What was the timing of the foods you ate? Are you waiting too long in the morning for your first meal, so that it is pushing your starting calories back too far in the day? Just trying to help trouble shoot.

I find I have to plan my UD's every bit as carefully as I plan my dd's. If I just wing it as the day goes on, I will end up way under. If I plan it in the morning, I can see where I might fall short and still have time to make changes or additions to pull it up. If I realize at 6pm that I'm only at 800 calories, there's really not much I'm going to be able to do to make 1500, at least not comfortably. Tonight's supper was rather indulgent and was still only 650. I finished eating 4 hours ago and still feel as if I just got up from the table.

So I do get it, honest. And I believe you will be able to make this work. Giving up the diet mindset on the UD's is really, really hard. Eating foods you've denied yourself for years is hard. I'm not suggesting Twinkies and Hoho's (I know there are many who eat them and am not saying you shouldn't, I just know there's no way I could have at the beginning, and even now, it would be a stretch. Although an Oreo or 2 goes down pretty easy these days. LOL). Just continue on with the little changes, like adding the bacon (how about a couple scrambled eggs in butter next ud to go with it?), eating the skin of the chicken, dipping some veggies in full fat ranch dip, enjoying real butter on some cooked veggies or a whole sweet potato. I've even found some grass-fed, uncured hotdogs made by Applegate Farms that are delicious. At 70 calories each, I eat 2 on UDs and enjoy them immensely.
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Old 08-01-2012, 09:54 PM   #92
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Thanks, Tina. That is all very helpful and going into major consideration.

Part of my issue is my devotion to not overeating past the point of satisfaction an not eating without hunger, which is non-negotiable for me, in my opinion CRUCIAL for future maintenance, and hopefully not counter to JUDDD. That remains to be seen.

That was breakfast (peanut butter/toast/bacon), lunch (chicken) and NOW that I've had a bit of dinner (turkey meatloaf, some broccoli, nectarine), I'm at 1260. And about to go to bed.

We'll see what tomorrow brings. Next UD I'll have the whole damn piece of bread and the rest of the damn fries, if I'm not past satisfied.
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Old 08-01-2012, 10:08 PM   #93
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You know, I'm reading up on psyllium, and not only does it fill you up - it also affects (positively) LEPTIN levels! I have been taking this stuff religiously since Yam-yam advised me to get the powder rather than the capsules. It's solved my constipation problems, and it's also great for cholesterol.

It may well be what's keeping me full on UD's (and very comfortable at 1200-ish calories, but not quite enough to do the same on DD's).

Just more to think about. Thinking out loud here. I can't thank you all enough for the support and ideas.
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Old 08-02-2012, 10:38 AM   #94
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Well, I guess I didn't have to be quite so whiney, although this IS happening with "not the greatest" calorie differential. But I wanted those of you who've been SO WONDERFUL to see it:

7/22 - 174.5 UD CAL: 1613
7/23 - ????? DD CAL: 446 (wasn't really hard at all!)
7/24 - ????? UD CAL: 972 (raging headache all day: too full from Metamucil to eat more)
7/25 - 173.3 DD CAL: 775 (SO hungry due to previous low UD)
7/26 - 173.8 UD CAL: 1606
7/27 - 174.4 DD CAL: 778 (I can't seem to make it down to 500; maybe because UD's are low?)
7/28 - 173.8 UD CAL: 1524 (Can't seem to make it UP to 1750 calories, either!)
7/29 - 174.1 DD CAL: 636 (see thread about my profession +DD; can't do 500)
7/30 - 173.2 UD CAL: 1292 (again, can't hit 1750 for the life of me)
7/31 - 174.1 DD CAL: 486(scale NOT MOVING! No real loss in 9 days GRRRR)
8/01 - 172.9 UD CAL: 1259 (I KNOW, too low, but I'm trying!)
8/02 - 172.0



And you know what? If today needs to be another high DD, I'm not going to stress (she said, always prone to stress as well as stressing about stress).
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Old 08-02-2012, 10:47 AM   #95
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Buttah, I've only been just over a couple weeks on JUDDD, so can't really speak with any authority about its longterm potential.

But I can so strongly relate to your fears of certain foods. When I decided to try Atkins after losing 40 pounds on low calorie and then stalling, I had the hardest time convincing myself fat was my friend. I literally stood in front of the butter at the store frozen--completely immobilized for many minutes, unable to make myself reach out and put it in my cart! Let alone put it in my mouth! We've all been so completely brainwashed by the anti-fat propaganda, we mistake belief for fact, and can't see any other options--at least I couldn't at that time.

I had to make a leap of faith to try something other than what I thought to be true, just jump, and see where I landed. I think it's the same any time we challenge our own personal "truths" which may not in fact be the whole or only truth, or even what's best for us. It's scary as all hell. But I can say I've never once in my life been sorry I took one of those leaps--because I've always added to my knowledge and grown as a result. (or in this case, reduced another 25 pounds once I started slathering that butter on low carb!)

I ran into a similar fear trying JUDDD---that up days to my full 1800 calories would totally derail my habitual 1200 per day diet that had ground me to a nearly 2 year stall; that I'd regain, that I wouldn't be able to control my eating at that level and I'd binge, that more carbs would spell disaster. I knew I could restrict. I just didn't have any faith that I'd be able to eat a "normal" amount or average carbs. So I took the leap despite my fears--and at 2 wks in I am down 6.7 pounds. Which I know won't continue at that rate and I fully expect weeks when I don't lose at all or even gain doing EXACTLY the same things. We all know how THAT goes...

This isn't a food problem, or an appetite problem--it's a fear problem. One we all know VERY well, I suspect, and slaying that monster is the real battle. I wish you courage and a stick of butter, Buttah!
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Old 08-02-2012, 11:06 AM   #96
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Patty,

Buttah, delighted with the loss!
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Old 08-02-2012, 03:13 PM   #97
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Yay Buttah on the loss! Keep trying different things and you will find what works for you.
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Old 08-02-2012, 04:42 PM   #98
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This thread has some wonderful, helpful advice! Thanks to all you vetrans who are so helpful and thoughtful with your posts!
And, great job, buttah, hanging in there. It appears to be starting to work...

I'm learning to be patient with JUDDD and with myself and I'm happier for it!
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Old 08-02-2012, 05:23 PM   #99
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Glad my b****ing and moaning could help others, mommy!

And I have 2 boys, too! Three if you count my husband. Five if you count the dog and the cat. Whole lot of testosterone here.

I just want to reiterate that I've now re-read every single one of your posts, and I just can't thank you enough. All this information is going into consideration, and I'm going to figure this out - whether it's making sure my DD's are 500 or below and not worrying so much about my UD's, or getting my UD's up as well (IF i'm hungry enough).

If it weren't for this thread, I would've given up two days ago and missed out on the positive evidence of the past couple weighings, plus a successful DD today where I felt fine and will likely keep to 500!


Last edited by buttah; 08-02-2012 at 05:42 PM..
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Old 08-02-2012, 05:58 PM   #100
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So glad to see your success. I will honestly say I really didn't think I could do DD's at first and they have only become easier and easier to the point where I really question whether I'm hungry at all. My ability to function on DD's has become intense and I wait for my DD's to tackle some of my most harrowing jobs because my body provides me with tons of energy and the focus I need.

Hopefully you will continue to see nothing but success and begin to have the "not hungry" DD's that many of the JUDDDers notice after a month or so of rotations. I'm going on 2 1/2 months and it seems so doable now I don't know why I was ever worried.
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:28 PM   #101
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So glad to see your success. I will honestly say I really didn't think I could do DD's at first and they have only become easier and easier to the point where I really question whether I'm hungry at all. My ability to function on DD's has become intense and I wait for my DD's to tackle some of my most harrowing jobs because my body provides me with tons of energy and the focus I need.

Hopefully you will continue to see nothing but success and begin to have the "not hungry" DD's that many of the JUDDDers notice after a month or so of rotations. I'm going on 2 1/2 months and it seems so doable now I don't know why I was ever worried.

I hope you're right! What boggles my mind, though, is that this appetite suppression could happen on DD's, but without dampening the appetite on UD's. Does the body get used to the back and forth?

And what happens if you eventually decide to switch to another WOE for maintenance (perhaps after JUDDDing for a long time), like perhaps just following the Hunger Scale (which worked for me for years)? What does the body think then?
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Old 08-02-2012, 07:39 PM   #102
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I may not be conventional, but I don't sweat UDs. It's 10:30pm and I've had 600 calories. It's been stressful since the moment I woke up including the funeral of one of me dearest friends. That is life. I'll try to eat a bit more, but I won't die if I don't. Life happens. I want to stick with my rotations so I maybe hungry tomorrow, but I won't die. Saturday will be an all out UD. I don't think this is ideal JUDDDing, but it's life. I find the spread to be the most important part so if I choose lower UDs I make DDs lower too. Just hang in. The appetite suppression will kick in and I find my obsession with food is almost a thing of the past!
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65.8 lbs lost on JUDDD (3/28/12- 4/18/13)
75.8 lbs were evicted in less than 14 months!
Called goal on 2/5/13 at 126.8. I can wear size 4P!

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Old 08-02-2012, 08:06 PM   #103
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So sorry for your loss, Carly.
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Old 08-02-2012, 08:18 PM   #104
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Sorry for your loss, Carly. Nobody could eat on a day like that.
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Old 08-03-2012, 02:09 AM   #105
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So sorry for your loss Carly. Your a such a great JUDDD proponent and I know you don't have things easy. I love your positive attitude. Bless you.

And dear Elise. Always here with support and sound advice. I too often find myself focused and somehow 'on top of things' on a DD too.

Buttah, you are seeing the rewards and I know the rhythm of the rotations will get easier until you enjoy both. As for any other plan after JUDDD that is something I can't address. This is my lifetime plan.
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Old 08-03-2012, 07:15 AM   #106
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Carly

buttah, Hang in there! Many of us have been making this work to fit with our own eating plan. Remember too, that even when you don't see a loss, other good benefits are happening with Sirt-1. For example: longevity, cognition enhancement, and arthritis relief.
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Old 08-03-2012, 09:19 AM   #107
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Again, I take back ALL my whining and then some:

7/22 - 174.5 UD CAL: 1613
7/23 - ????? DD CAL: 446 (wasn't really hard at all!)
7/24 - ????? UD CAL: 972 (raging headache all day: too full from Metamucil to eat more)
7/25 - 173.3 DD CAL: 775 (SO hungry due to previous low UD)
7/26 - 173.8 UD CAL: 1606
7/27 - 174.4 DD CAL: 778
7/28 - 173.8 UD CAL: 1524 (Can't seem to make it UP to 1750 calories, either!)
7/29 - 174.1 DD CAL: 636 (see thread about my profession +DD; can't do 500)
7/30 - 173.2 UD CAL: 1292 (again, can't hit 1750 for the life of me)
7/31 - 174.1 DD CAL: 486 (scale NOT MOVING! No real loss in 9 days GRRRR)
8/01 - 172.9 UD CAL: 1259 (I KNOW, too low, but I'm trying!)
8/02 - 172.0 DD CAL: 506
8/03 - 171.3 UD (I am SO HAPPY with JUDDD now!)

I'm obviously seeing a surge, and I know it won't last, but it's made a believer out of me.

Kissa, I wasn't just asking about "after JUDDD."
Quote:
What boggles my mind, though, is that this appetite suppression could happen on DD's, but without dampening the appetite on UD's. Does the body get used to the back and forth?
Because I'm still feeling "full" on UD"s, even after "better" DD's. I expect once I eat closer to normal on UD's, my "surge" will normalize. Which is okay, as long as it keeps moving down.
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Old 08-03-2012, 09:37 AM   #108
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"And what happens if you eventually decide to switch to another WOE for maintenance (perhaps after JUDDDing for a long time), like perhaps just following the Hunger Scale (which worked for me for years)? What does the body think then?"

I was responding to this buttah...

The scale, she bounces. Please don't feel too bad when you have a bounce.

We always say think of a ball bouncing down the staircase. It bounces up and down on each step but it still moves steadily down the staircase.

Last edited by Kissa; 08-03-2012 at 09:39 AM..
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Old 08-03-2012, 10:12 AM   #109
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Hi,

If you aren't doing so already, you might try exercising more intensely on UD's to 'work up an appetite' and try to get your metabolism going more. I suppose that sounds counter-intuitive but I think that's part of the point to UD's - higher metabolism.
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Old 08-03-2012, 10:12 AM   #110
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I may not be conventional, but I don't sweat UDs. It's 10:30pm and I've had 600 calories. It's been stressful since the moment I woke up including the funeral of one of me dearest friends.
Sorry to hear about your loss
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Old 08-03-2012, 10:36 AM   #111
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Hi,

If you aren't doing so already, you might try exercising more intensely on UD's to 'work up an appetite' and try to get your metabolism going more. I suppose that sounds counter-intuitive but I think that's part of the point to UD's - higher metabolism.
Already doing!
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Old 08-04-2012, 09:26 AM   #112
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Finally had a bit more to eat on my last UD (1645, and I think that's my tippy top because I was a little too full after dinner, which I refuse to do again)...

This morning, still weighed in at 171.9

13 days in, and I couldn't be happier. I will now say goodbye to the whiney thread and try to encourage other newbies who have the same initial concerns that I did.

You guys rock!

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Old 08-04-2012, 09:29 AM   #113
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That is just wonderful.

If you are not against it on principal, a glass of wine is a nice way to up the calories.

I'll kind of miss the Whiney Thread, lol.
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Old 08-04-2012, 09:33 AM   #114
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Kissa, I will probably do that when I'm a little more steady on my feet. But wine (carbs, sugar) tends to leave me bloated and potentially headachy the next day. Which on a DD, would be scary. But once I have my bearings...

from whine to wine!
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Old 08-04-2012, 11:30 AM   #115
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Thank you to all my JUDDD Budds for your support. My friend will be missed and I'm sure I'm still in shock to a certain extent. It was unexpected, but has made my resolve to get and stay healthy much stronger since I know my friend was not keeping up with her health.

Buttah, I'm so glad you stuck it out to see the beginnings of the JUDDD magic.

Today is my UD when I plan to eat all of my UD calories. I'm waiting for my MRI Valium to wear off so we can enjoy a meal out. I'm still a little from the Valium, but I can't take those closed MRIs without it!
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Old 08-04-2012, 11:57 AM   #116
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Big ol hugs to Carly

And to Buttah! Loved hearing you are getting some JUDDD love!


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Old 08-05-2012, 08:46 PM   #117
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Although I am still struggling a lot with DD's, I just did some math that blew my mind. After nothing going from July 22 to July 31, here is what my daily loss/gain has been beginning July 31.

-1.2 lb
-0.9
-0.7
+ 0.6
-1.09

These are crazy numbers, right? I know this can't continue, but WOW.
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Old 08-05-2012, 08:55 PM   #118
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ps--is that 1.09 supposed to be 1.9?

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Old 08-06-2012, 03:46 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buttah View Post
Although I am still struggling a lot with DD's, I just did some math that blew my mind. After nothing going from July 22 to July 31, here is what my daily loss/gain has been beginning July 31.

-1.2 lb
-0.9
-0.7
+ 0.6
-1.09

These are crazy numbers, right? I know this can't continue, but WOW.

So buttah, ...does this mean that we have convinced you it is a fun way to lose?

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Old 08-06-2012, 07:49 AM   #120
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Stats: 189/137/136-140
WOE: peri-meno "corrective" R4
Start Date: LowCal/Dukan/JUDD 2/12-8/12, then 3 rounds rxHCG
PJ, yes that was a typo. 1.9.

Sunday, I'm beyond thrilled with the lost poundage, but I still wouldn't call it fun. DD's are a HUGE struggle for me. I honestly don't feel well during them, although I can manage closer to 600-700 (which has, surprisingly, not curtailed my recent whoosh). That means my maintenance numbers (see signature) would be totally doable.

But if DD's continue to be this hard when I'm closer to 500, I seriously doubt I'll get to maintenance on JUDDD and may have to look for something that suits me better.

What I'm NOT doing is giving up!

We'll see. Maybe 600-700 will continue to work for me?
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