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Old 06-21-2012, 06:09 AM   #1
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discouraged--anyone else not losing?

On the bright side, I lost 52 pounds following the hCG diet. I had some bump ups and downs along the way, and find myself this summer at the same weight I was last summer, 130 pounds, when I purchased my first pairs of shorts in size 8 (a new low for me). I kind of knew I had experienced weight redistribution over the last several months IN THE WRONG DIRECTION--I had lost weight from my lower half and upper half, but every time I regained a few pounds it all went to my lower half.

So I went to put on the fabulous new shorts I wore LAST summer at this same weight and they are too tight.

I am starting to learn that sometimes the promises of a diet protocol will not always hold true. Dr. Simeons' believed in weight redistribution, but I did not experience that. I'm getting past being disappointed over this, and I now realize that when Dr. Johnson says in his book one may eat to satisfaction (but not overeat) on up days this may also not be true for me.

I have been doing JUDDD for 2 weeks with nothing to show for it so far. I just don't think I can add in flour without negative consequences. There was even one day this week after an UD that my regular pants, that I have been wearing for months now at this stable weight, felt tight!

If I thought I could do the VLCD again for any length of time I would restart hCG in a heartbeat, but I just can't go that many days on only 500 calories anymore--I start to feel the overwhelming exhaustion much earlier than before.

I'm going to keep going with this, because I can see myself eating this way for life, but I'm discouraged that I seem to be unable to lose the last 10.

Anyone else, close to goal, not losing?
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Old 06-21-2012, 06:46 AM   #2
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I'm sorry to hear it, but perhaps two weeks is not enough time to get fully in the swing. I just started JUDDD after losing 100 pounds on a low carb diet, and then stalling for *three years* while still eating low carb, and still needing to lose another 100! So I'm certainly not someone "close to goal" and not losing.

But I just finished my first full week on JUDDD and didn't lose an ounce. So I was a little bummed about that. But I don't think a week, or even two weeks or four weeks, is enough time to give any plan a full try. Elsewhere I read of one woman saying she *finally* just lost her first pound or two after being on JUDDD something like 8 weeks with no weight loss.

So my advice is just to keep on keeping on and give it a fair chance! Sorry about the shorts though. That's a bummer. None of my clothes from last summer come even close to fitting me this summer (and in a bad way, not a good way, LOL)
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Old 06-21-2012, 06:53 AM   #3
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Garnet, I understand your frustration!
I'll chip in a couple of thoughts. You'll hear lots more from the rest of this wonderful board.
1. I could never eat to "satisfaction" on UDs. I can eat up to the calculated UD number, and I've lost well doing that. Eating to "satisfaction" is what got me in trouble in the first place. I could easily scarf back 3000 calories per day. The good Dr. may be talking about people with normalized appetites. (Some people do lose without counting UD numbers. It could be that you're not one of them. YET)
2. The first month or so is a learning month. Some lose like demons. Some don't. I didn't. But I was including more carbs, I was struggling with DDs, then UDs, carby/sugary binge episodes, and my body just took a bit of time to get into it. Then I started losing, and eight weeks from my start date, I got to my goal. It makes me wish we could all skip the suffering part, just do the JUDDDing, and relax.
These are early days. Take heart.
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Old 06-21-2012, 06:58 AM   #4
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JUDDD is very healing to the metabolism, and some people get the benefits right away, while others take as long as 9 or more weeks. It does happen, and it's so amazingly freeing when it does.

Since you have two weeks in without restricting on UDs, may I suggest at least tracking your UDs (if you haven't already been)? Some people who don't track and don't lose find when they do track that they either are eating too many UD calories, or surprisingly, too few. Perhaps Nancy (gotsomeold) will pop in and tell you her story, or one of the others. Tina (mykidsteacher) didn't lose like gangbusters initially, and she was close to goal, but then lost several more pounds after she'd done some healing.

There are so many reasons we may or may not lose at any given time. I'm dealing with thyroid issues and medication adjustments, and there doesn't seem to be a lot of rhyme or reason to my patterns, but I'm losing overall. If you added carbs back from a low carb WOE, you likely have gained some water weight. So if you haven't shown a gain on the scale, you've still lost fat and the scale just doesn't recognize that because you've refilled your glycogen stores and have more water weight.

Anyway, don't despair. JUDDD is amazing and if you give it enough time it will give you great rewards.
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:42 AM   #5
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Hey Garnet, I completely forgot that it's possible you may not be eating UP to your UD calories! So sorry, it's just that I will nevah, evah have that particular problem.
All the best.
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:46 AM   #6
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It's wonderful to read that you already lost 52 pounds, so you're already quite a bit closer to your ultimate weight goal. That's always exciting. Now you are only going to be working on those last few pounds, and as long as you're going to be living your life anyway, you might just as well be enjoying some health benefits and weight loss and slimming down of your body as you enjoy fine meals at the same time! JUDDD can probably help you enjoy all of these positive experiences as these next weeks go by.

First of all, I don't know whether you came to JUDDD straight from a P2 round, or whether you also went through P3, etc. or not. But experiencing some weight gain after P2 certainly isn't uncommon, and most folks are having to have those *correction* days off and on... so it's possible that the weight gain you see shown on your scale is a gain of body fat, but I expect it's water weight gain... which still, shows up on that scale.

JUDDD does produce some amazing bounces of weight when we do our morning weigh-ins, and even when we expect to weigh less after DDs, and perhaps a bit up after our UDs, even that doesn't always follow. It's always a guessing game as to what weight we might see on any given morning.

A couple of observations/questions I would have would be these: During this first two weeks, have you been eating at a higher carbohydrate number than you were experiencing previously? That will certainly cause most of us to pack on several (or a lot) of pounds of water weight until our body has finally replenished its fuel stores and has re-hydrated our tissues with the accompanying water weight, as Mother Nature designed. So it could be that you have only gained water weight.

In fact, many who report weight gain initially on JUDDD from *carbing up* have actually been losing body FAT as they were JUDDDing, but the regained water weight fooled them into thinking their weight gain, as shown them by the scale, was fat. LOL But once the body is fully adjusted to those additional carbs in the new diet choices now, true fat losses can be tracked on the scale more dependably. So perhaps that is part of what you are seeing, if you have been increasing your carbs now that you are on the JUDDD plan. Some remain very low carb, but many of us jump right into eating at a higher carb level.

Another thought was that you said you were pretty much *eating at will* on your Up Days, as Dr. Johnson addressed *eating to satisfaction*, etc. etc. etc. My guess is that he had no true concept of what many of us can eat before we are satisfied! I can truthfully say that while my appetite has been modified wonderfully by JUDDD, if I allowed myself to eat free-will for more than a few days at a time, I would quickly be eating so many UD calories as to ruin any weight loss advantage from my DDs.

In a way, Dr. Johnson seemed to talk out of both sides of his mouth in giving us his instructions, because he also addresses what he calls our *Normal* calories a lot. His Calorie Calculator is labeled Normal calories. He tells us that on our Down Days, we will eat at a low percentage of our Normal calories. And he says on his site ".....Use the calorie calculator below to help you figure out what your *regular* and Down Day calorie intake should be, depending on your goals and activity level....."

"what your regular........calorie intake should be....."

And when we input our stats and click the Calculate button, up pops our numbers... not just our Down Day calorie number, but also our Normal calorie number for our Up Days.

So, all of this just to say that if you aren't paying attention to your UD calorie number, it's easy for some of us to overeat our calorie ceiling on those days, and if we are overeating on half of our days, we probably won't lose much weight and may actually gain.

Most of us try to be pretty decently careful to eat pretty close to our UD calorie number without going over much, or even without going under too much either. In the long run, it seems to really promote weight loss for us, and seems to be a part of the component of increased healing and improved health and great vitality and strength. We keep in mind that we are eating so very little on our DDs that the nutrition we get in on our UDs has to be enough to provide for us for both days! That means our UD nutritional intake is important, and cutting it too scant is maybe not the smartest choice for our long term health. But partly, that's my own personal opinion.

Anyway, long post, but I wanted to mention these two thoughts, and then add my welcome to you! I think you will come to love this way of weight management and be very successful on it. It's easy to do, can be altered quite simply to make every upcoming event coincide with an Up Day so that you can partake of parties and celebrations, holiday feasts and all social occasions fully, as the feasting is part of the joyful human celebration and interaction throughout history. Why break the tradition?
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Last edited by SoHappy; 06-21-2012 at 07:53 AM..
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:53 AM   #7
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In Dr. J's book he states that 98% of all no loss problems are due to having too many calories on DD's. BUT that is not the way it is for me. I can fast on DD's and go hog wild on UD's and not lose. SO for me the no loss is directly related to too many calories on my UD's. And I do go over way too much but I know that is what slows me down. I just have not gotten total control of my UD's even after 5 months. BUT I am still losing although slowly. I am NOT doing LC on UD's. I AM doing LC on DD's.
I encourage everyone to track calories on both days if not losing to see where the problem is. I love JUDDD and hope you have success.
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:57 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by adillenal View Post
In Dr. J's book he states that 98% of all no loss problems are due to having too many calories on DD's. BUT that is not the way it is for me. I can fast on DD's and go hog wild on UD's and not lose. SO for me the no loss is directly related to too many calories on my UD's. And I do go over way too much but I know that is what slows me down. I just have not gotten total control of my UD's even after 5 months. BUT I am still losing although slowly. I am NOT doing LC on UD's. I AM doing LC on DD's.
I encourage everyone to track calories on both days if not losing to see where the problem is. I love JUDDD and hope you have success.
Another calorie tracker here, and I so-o-o agree with you about its importance.
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:58 AM   #9
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Garnet, like you I have been on hcg and eliminated 55 lbs. in 3 rounds. I am now in phase 4 - 2 months after ph 3. My weight has slowly crept up, an additional 6 lbs over LDW. YIKES! Correction days are no longer giving me any results and I feel trapped, so I started JUDDD 2 days ago, with today being my 2nd DD. I know I shouldn't have stood on the scale, but I did, so after the first DD, I was down 1 lb and after my first UD, I was up 1.4 lbs. I gasped when I saw that. Today is my DD and I will just follow the VLCD way of eating for these first few weeks to let my body get used to this WOE. So far, I am not happy and this group is so encouraging to me. I will also keep going and definitely stay away from carbs, which I do normally. I don't know why I gained 1.4 lbs from one UD when I was so good. Oh well, I guess that's just the way this goes when your body is learning something new. We'll both have to stick with it to see what happens. Good luck to you (and me!)
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:02 AM   #10
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Beadart, 1.4 is no big deal, here. Really. But I can appreciate that the bounces look horrid if you come from a WOE that doesn't create them. After a bit, you ignore the up bounces and begin to focus on the downward trend. Hang in.
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:07 AM   #11
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You have to remember that on DD's you aren't putting much into your digestive system thus a lower weight shows on the scale. Come UD and you start adding more foods to the digestive system and the scale shows a gain. All food has to digested and the rate it goes through the system can vary from person to person but it is usually a several day process. SOOO you didn't gain fat you gained food being processed through your digestive system. Then DD again with not much added and the cycle repeats itself. BOUNCE, BOUNCE.
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:12 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by garnet10 View Post
I'm going to keep going with this, because I can see myself eating this way for life, but I'm discouraged that I seem to be unable to lose the last 10.

Anyone else, close to goal, not losing?
Garnet10 - I agree with the first 3 posters. My first thought was are you counting your UD calories? I could not lose if I ate till "satisfaction" like Dr. J. said.

This is what I would do if I were you - and I'm not, so take what you need and leave the rest: I would psych myself up by choosing my maintenance range as 130 to 120. I would join the maintenance lane and draw encouragment from those who are having such success there. You need to see their examples. Many of them went on maintenance and surprisingly kept losing. The best thing you said is "I can see myself eating this way for life". Start now - tell yourself you have achieved the high end of your maintenance leeway and enjoy your success. OMG 52 lbs - enjoy that! Go to the gym and pick up a 50 pound dumbell and you'll be shocked.

I don't know if you exercise - but "what I would do, and am going to do" when I get 10 lbs. within my desired weight is zero in on building more muscle. Muscle has such density, you could wear a few sizes smaller at the same weight! Muscle will speed up your metabolism. "Diet if you want to look good in clothes. Excercise if you want to look good naked (or in shorts?)." This is for your good health, and you don't want to be weak by fasting every day. So JUDDD is the perfect answer for you. You have done so fantastic and now you've found JUDDD - the perfect way of life for maintenance. Just relax and enjoy your success. You're there and don't see it. So hopefully you'll read the posts at Maintenance Lane and draw insights from them also. I'll see you there by the end of the year. Don't disappoint me now - I'll need your help. Hope something I've said helps.

P.S. - Wow, 7 more posted while I was typing - see how everyone wants to help you?
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(Total loss will be 26.0 lbs.)

Last edited by Heather; 06-21-2012 at 08:24 AM..
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:14 AM   #13
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Joyjoy, thanks. I love the words of encouragement. Still so new here and learning all the time about what my body does with food. Kind of exciting to be in the know...really! I'm definitely hanging in!
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:18 AM   #14
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Old 06-21-2012, 09:46 AM   #15
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Eating to satisfaction, hmmm.

Sounds good but many of us had no idea what a person of our size would be consuming in calories.
It would not hurt to calculate and go from there.

JUDDD is such a great plan!! Sometimes it takes some trial......
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Old 06-21-2012, 11:23 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adillenal View Post
You have to remember that on DD's you aren't putting much into your digestive system thus a lower weight shows on the scale. Come UD and you start adding more foods to the digestive system and the scale shows a gain. All food has to digested and the rate it goes through the system can vary from person to person but it is usually a several day process. SOOO you didn't gain fat you gained food being processed through your digestive system. Then DD again with not much added and the cycle repeats itself. BOUNCE, BOUNCE.
^^ This!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jem51 View Post
Eating to satisfaction, hmmm.

Sounds good but many of us had no idea what a person of our size would be consuming in calories.
It would not hurt to calculate and go from there.

JUDDD is such a great plan!! Sometimes it takes some trial......
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Old 06-21-2012, 12:14 PM   #17
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Garnet, please don't let yourself get discouraged so early on. I lost the first three weeks on Juddd then stalled until I lowered my DD to 300 calories from 500. There is a learning curve to this woe as every body is different. It is amazing how much weight you have already lost, I am in awe of anyone who can accomplish what you have. It took me 5 months to lose my goal of 25 lbs. You already know how to be a successful dieter and Juddd is like no other woe you have ever tried. You will find that for the most part it is quite enjoyable. It is kind to the body and the spirit. We are all here to support you whenever you need us. Relax into Juddd and give it some time. Let your body do some of the healing that it requires. You may find that you feel better even before you see a loss. I know you will do fabulous at Juddd and I can't wait to hear about your losses. one last thought JMHO I find that it's best to only weigh once a week after a DD. I see no reason to torture myself by being made aware of every little daily bounce on the scale. I think this has saved me a lot of insanity. I also think its best to count UD calories, it is so easy to go over or under. Better to play it safe. I use an old fashioned pen and paper. Again good luck!
Vanessa

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Old 06-21-2012, 01:01 PM   #18
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On the bright side, I lost 52 pounds following the hCG diet. I had some bump ups and downs along the way, and find myself this summer at the same weight I was last summer, 130 pounds, when I purchased my first pairs of shorts in size 8 (a new low for me). I kind of knew I had experienced weight redistribution over the last several months IN THE WRONG DIRECTION--I had lost weight from my lower half and upper half, but every time I regained a few pounds it all went to my lower half.

So I went to put on the fabulous new shorts I wore LAST summer at this same weight and they are too tight.

I am starting to learn that sometimes the promises of a diet protocol will not always hold true. Dr. Simeons' believed in weight redistribution, but I did not experience that. I'm getting past being disappointed over this, and I now realize that when Dr. Johnson says in his book one may eat to satisfaction (but not overeat) on up days this may also not be true for me.

I have been doing JUDDD for 2 weeks with nothing to show for it so far. I just don't think I can add in flour without negative consequences. There was even one day this week after an UD that my regular pants, that I have been wearing for months now at this stable weight, felt tight!

If I thought I could do the VLCD again for any length of time I would restart hCG in a heartbeat, but I just can't go that many days on only 500 calories anymore--I start to feel the overwhelming exhaustion much earlier than before.

I'm going to keep going with this, because I can see myself eating this way for life, but I'm discouraged that I seem to be unable to lose the last 10.

Anyone else, close to goal, not losing?
sweetie--this is me I have done JUDDD last week and lost 4.2 pounds. This week has brought nothing but gains I would be not ok with it, if I were not eating too! But I am eating what I want. I am taking this as a break from the total hcg protocol and enjoying my few weeks off. If I can maintain this loss/being stable I will be OK. But I want to lose more. I am going to hop on another round so I can be good for vacation as I have some shorts I cannot fit into--I am fitting into only 1 pair from last year when I sitting at goal weight. I will get over my cold that I have right now and begin my other round. This seems like a great plan to maintain on, right now I am not losing and need to see those losses.

*Now, I am off to read the responses to your post. I wanted to give you my view before reading the others. Maybe I can find some answers too.
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Old 06-21-2012, 01:33 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muffabuff View Post
Garnet, please don't let yourself get discouraged so early on. I lost the first three weeks on Juddd then stalled until I lowered my DD to 300 calories from 500. There is a learning curve to this woe as every body is different. It is amazing how much weight you have already lost, I am in awe of anyone who can accomplish what you have. It took me 5 months to lose my goal of 25 lbs. You already know how to be a successful dieter and Juddd is like no other woe you have ever tried. You will find that for the most part it is quite enjoyable. It is kind to the body and the spirit. We are all here to support you whenever you need us. Relax into Juddd and give it some time. Let your body do some of the healing that it requires. You may find that you feel better even before you see a loss. I know you will do fabulous at Juddd and I can't wait to hear about your losses. one last thought JMHO I find that it's best to only weigh once a week after a DD. I see no reason to torture myself by being made aware of every little daily bounce on the scale. I think this has saved me a lot of insanity. I also think its best to count UD calories, it is so easy to go over or under. Better to play it safe. I use an old fashioned pen and paper. Again good luck!
Vanessa
I like this good advice for you Garnet. Yes - relax into JUDDD and give it some time.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:19 PM   #20
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I came here off of p2. I chose to introduce carbs immediately. I gained over 10 pounds when I started JUDDD, but just kept going. I was buoyed by the lovely people here and just kept the faith. Sure enough after a few weeks I started losing. I've been doing JUDDD since the end of April and this is the first week I've gotten below my starting number.

I am comfortable, I am happy, I am experiencing ALL of the other benefits JUDDD has to offer, so I figured I'd stick it out. I'm so glad I did! I've had some crazy UD's eating things I wouldn't have dreamed of before, all within my calories. One day I made and ate a small batch of oatmeal butterscotch cookies! And the scale moved down the following day.

This way of eating has so many gifts above and beyond loss! I'm also fully convinced that the body isn't ready to lose after it drops so much so rapidly on hcg. It needs some time to stabilize and I'm not sure playing with the numbers is going to change that. The best thing you can do is stick to your numbers, count the calories, and trust.

YES, you may find that you have triggery foods. YES you may find you don't feel as good when you eat certain things. YES you may find that for you not all calories are created equal, but even so I think you will still experience the healing benefits of JUDDD. Honestly, I do.

Stick around, let these amazing people help you and don't get too discouraged. And if you find yourself feeling low, read over the non-scale victories. That can really help in the dark moments.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:26 PM   #21
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Circusgirl Wow - you girls can sure write great posts! I'm loving all these posts - you girls know your stuff. I can't keep repeating "good post", "good post" to all of you - would take up too much room. But they really are well written and so encouraging.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:27 PM   #22
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After losing 52 lbs, you will need to rest some and stabilize! Circusgirl, Redhead, and SunGoddess have experience with the protocol and Juddd. It is a perfect way to heal your metabolism. Wishing you much better days in the next few weeks!
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:32 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawnyama View Post
sweetie--this is me I have done JUDDD last week and lost 4.2 pounds. This week has brought nothing but gains I would be not ok with it, if I were not eating too! But I am eating what I want. I am taking this as a break from the total hcg protocol and enjoying my few weeks off. If I can maintain this loss/being stable I will be OK. But I want to lose more. I am going to hop on another round so I can be good for vacation as I have some shorts I cannot fit into--I am fitting into only 1 pair from last year when I sitting at goal weight. I will get over my cold that I have right now and begin my other round. This seems like a great plan to maintain on, right now I am not losing and need to see those losses.

*Now, I am off to read the responses to your post. I wanted to give you my view before reading the others. Maybe I can find some answers too.
Dawn, I think you are going to see more losses with JUDDD, but just realized you are in the same boat as Garnet in that you have been doing strict protocol. 2 weeks is not going to be long enough for you to get the healing to your metabolism.

Just curious how much lower do you want or desire to be? At 5'4" and 129, you are at the perfect weight for that height. Hope that you will realize that your body does go through a lot of stress and work when staying on 500 cals for any period of time.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:39 PM   #24
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I really think that anyone coming off of hcg should expect a month of no movement (if p3) or even a few weeks of gaining (if adding carbs.) Not just based on my experience-I think it makes sense.

I swear, it WILL come off, but I think you need to give your body a buffer of a month to have it start happening. It may happen faster, it may not. But I do think it's unrealistic to think you'll lose off the bat coming from p2. Not because it doesn't work, or because your body is broken, but because your body is SMART as all get out and needs a moment to regroup. This is a good thing. This is a protective mechanism. While you wait for the weight to start dropping you can chill with us here and enjoy the other parts.

I know it's frustrating. Trust me, I was frustrated too! And I think it's fine to feel that way, I'm not going to talk you out of it or tell you you're wrong to have those feeling. We all process things differently. BUT I think it's important to sit with those feelings for a limited time, and then step out of the darkness and get a view of the bigger picture. Because as hard as it is to see if from where you're standing now, it's just a perspective issue. It's there!
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:42 PM   #25
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Two weeks is such a short time. And, if I'm reading your stats correctly, you're almost at goal. You don't have very much to lose, so it may go slowly. I agree with the others on tracking your food. It is the best tool! Until you see it in black and white, you have really no idea. Your calorie intake could be much higher or much lower than you think. Either way, give it some time.
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Old 06-21-2012, 05:31 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunday View Post
Dawn, I think you are going to see more losses with JUDDD, but just realized you are in the same boat as Garnet in that you have been doing strict protocol. 2 weeks is not going to be long enough for you to get the healing to your metabolism.

Just curious how much lower do you want or desire to be? At 5'4" and 129, you are at the perfect weight for that height. Hope that you will realize that your body does go through a lot of stress and work when staying on 500 cals for any period of time.
I am 133 and climbing. Not happy about that. I bought my clothing as I was when I was at goal. So I have to be back to 115, but will settle for 120 as I have for the past year. I have plenty of fat that needs to be gotten rid of, trust me!!! My 6s don't fit and that is the size of my work uniform. I HAVE to get this off! I cannot wait a month for the JUDDD magic to work.

Last edited by dawnyama; 06-21-2012 at 05:32 PM..
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:55 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merpig View Post
I'm sorry to hear it, but perhaps two weeks is not enough time to get fully in the swing. I just started JUDDD after losing 100 pounds on a low carb diet, and then stalling for *three years* while still eating low carb, and still needing to lose another 100! So I'm certainly not someone "close to goal" and not losing.

But I just finished my first full week on JUDDD and didn't lose an ounce. So I was a little bummed about that. But I don't think a week, or even two weeks or four weeks, is enough time to give any plan a full try. Elsewhere I read of one woman saying she *finally* just lost her first pound or two after being on JUDDD something like 8 weeks with no weight loss.

So my advice is just to keep on keeping on and give it a fair chance! Sorry about the shorts though. That's a bummer. None of my clothes from last summer come even close to fitting me this summer (and in a bad way, not a good way, LOL)
Thanks for your reply--it's just so hard to see nothing happen after seeing incredible weight loss on the hcg diet. But I will keep on keeping on! I have to give it a fair chance, because I just can't follow the hcg diet anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joyjoy View Post
Garnet, I understand your frustration!
I'll chip in a couple of thoughts. You'll hear lots more from the rest of this wonderful board.
1. I could never eat to "satisfaction" on UDs. I can eat up to the calculated UD number, and I've lost well doing that. Eating to "satisfaction" is what got me in trouble in the first place. I could easily scarf back 3000 calories per day. The good Dr. may be talking about people with normalized appetites. (Some people do lose without counting UD numbers. It could be that you're not one of them. YET)
2. The first month or so is a learning month. Some lose like demons. Some don't. I didn't. But I was including more carbs, I was struggling with DDs, then UDs, carby/sugary binge episodes, and my body just took a bit of time to get into it. Then I started losing, and eight weeks from my start date, I got to my goal. It makes me wish we could all skip the suffering part, just do the JUDDDing, and relax.
These are early days. Take heart.
Oh, that's reassuring to hear! I do realize I have to monitor my UD calories and limit the starches/sugar because what I am doing presently is just not working. I have not been overeating on my up days, but I think I'm eating too many carbs. I think I just suddenly realized we are going away in a month, and I wasn't prepared for the weight loss to take so long. But I'm going to stick with it!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeirasMom View Post
JUDDD is very healing to the metabolism, and some people get the benefits right away, while others take as long as 9 or more weeks. It does happen, and it's so amazingly freeing when it does.

Since you have two weeks in without restricting on UDs, may I suggest at least tracking your UDs (if you haven't already been)? Some people who don't track and don't lose find when they do track that they either are eating too many UD calories, or surprisingly, too few. Perhaps Nancy (gotsomeold) will pop in and tell you her story, or one of the others. Tina (mykidsteacher) didn't lose like gangbusters initially, and she was close to goal, but then lost several more pounds after she'd done some healing.

There are so many reasons we may or may not lose at any given time. I'm dealing with thyroid issues and medication adjustments, and there doesn't seem to be a lot of rhyme or reason to my patterns, but I'm losing overall. If you added carbs back from a low carb WOE, you likely have gained some water weight. So if you haven't shown a gain on the scale, you've still lost fat and the scale just doesn't recognize that because you've refilled your glycogen stores and have more water weight.

Anyway, don't despair. JUDDD is amazing and if you give it enough time it will give you great rewards.
Thanks! I hate counting calories, but I am going to have to on the Up Days. Most likely I'm eating more than I should be, especially since I was partaking of more carbs than I had before.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joyjoy View Post
Hey Garnet, I completely forgot that it's possible you may not be eating UP to your UD calories! So sorry, it's just that I will nevah, evah have that particular problem.
All the best.
Me neither!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoHappy View Post
It's wonderful to read that you already lost 52 pounds, so you're already quite a bit closer to your ultimate weight goal. That's always exciting. Now you are only going to be working on those last few pounds, and as long as you're going to be living your life anyway, you might just as well be enjoying some health benefits and weight loss and slimming down of your body as you enjoy fine meals at the same time! JUDDD can probably help you enjoy all of these positive experiences as these next weeks go by.

First of all, I don't know whether you came to JUDDD straight from a P2 round, or whether you also went through P3, etc. or not. But experiencing some weight gain after P2 certainly isn't uncommon, and most folks are having to have those *correction* days off and on... so it's possible that the weight gain you see shown on your scale is a gain of body fat, but I expect it's water weight gain... which still, shows up on that scale.

JUDDD does produce some amazing bounces of weight when we do our morning weigh-ins, and even when we expect to weigh less after DDs, and perhaps a bit up after our UDs, even that doesn't always follow. It's always a guessing game as to what weight we might see on any given morning.

A couple of observations/questions I would have would be these: During this first two weeks, have you been eating at a higher carbohydrate number than you were experiencing previously? That will certainly cause most of us to pack on several (or a lot) of pounds of water weight until our body has finally replenished its fuel stores and has re-hydrated our tissues with the accompanying water weight, as Mother Nature designed. So it could be that you have only gained water weight.

In fact, many who report weight gain initially on JUDDD from *carbing up* have actually been losing body FAT as they were JUDDDing, but the regained water weight fooled them into thinking their weight gain, as shown them by the scale, was fat. LOL But once the body is fully adjusted to those additional carbs in the new diet choices now, true fat losses can be tracked on the scale more dependably. So perhaps that is part of what you are seeing, if you have been increasing your carbs now that you are on the JUDDD plan. Some remain very low carb, but many of us jump right into eating at a higher carb level.

Another thought was that you said you were pretty much *eating at will* on your Up Days, as Dr. Johnson addressed *eating to satisfaction*, etc. etc. etc. My guess is that he had no true concept of what many of us can eat before we are satisfied! I can truthfully say that while my appetite has been modified wonderfully by JUDDD, if I allowed myself to eat free-will for more than a few days at a time, I would quickly be eating so many UD calories as to ruin any weight loss advantage from my DDs.

In a way, Dr. Johnson seemed to talk out of both sides of his mouth in giving us his instructions, because he also addresses what he calls our *Normal* calories a lot. His Calorie Calculator is labeled Normal calories. He tells us that on our Down Days, we will eat at a low percentage of our Normal calories. And he says on his site ".....Use the calorie calculator below to help you figure out what your *regular* and Down Day calorie intake should be, depending on your goals and activity level....."

"what your regular........calorie intake should be....."

And when we input our stats and click the Calculate button, up pops our numbers... not just our Down Day calorie number, but also our Normal calorie number for our Up Days.

So, all of this just to say that if you aren't paying attention to your UD calorie number, it's easy for some of us to overeat our calorie ceiling on those days, and if we are overeating on half of our days, we probably won't lose much weight and may actually gain.

Most of us try to be pretty decently careful to eat pretty close to our UD calorie number without going over much, or even without going under too much either. In the long run, it seems to really promote weight loss for us, and seems to be a part of the component of increased healing and improved health and great vitality and strength. We keep in mind that we are eating so very little on our DDs that the nutrition we get in on our UDs has to be enough to provide for us for both days! That means our UD nutritional intake is important, and cutting it too scant is maybe not the smartest choice for our long term health. But partly, that's my own personal opinion.

Anyway, long post, but I wanted to mention these two thoughts, and then add my welcome to you! I think you will come to love this way of weight management and be very successful on it. It's easy to do, can be altered quite simply to make every upcoming event coincide with an Up Day so that you can partake of parties and celebrations, holiday feasts and all social occasions fully, as the feasting is part of the joyful human celebration and interaction throughout history. Why break the tradition?
Oh, I think you nailed it on the head. I have been eating more carbs on my up days than I had before. I finished my last round of hcg months ago--I finished that round at 125, historically have always stabilized around 4 pounds over LDW (last dose weight), so I was not surprised when I stabilized at 129 (for several weeks); then I started to liberalize carbs (mostly just once a week) and I ended up at 130.

So I was 130 for several weeks before deciding to do JUDDD. I really felt like my hypothalamus stabilized at that weight (this also happens to be the weight I was for years, when I was always trying to lose 5 pounds).

I'm going to have to do the dreaded calorie counting on my up days, and go back to limiting carbs, which is not that hard for me, I guess I just thought I could do it, when I can't.
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:56 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adillenal View Post
In Dr. J's book he states that 98% of all no loss problems are due to having too many calories on DD's. BUT that is not the way it is for me. I can fast on DD's and go hog wild on UD's and not lose. SO for me the no loss is directly related to too many calories on my UD's. And I do go over way too much but I know that is what slows me down. I just have not gotten total control of my UD's even after 5 months. BUT I am still losing although slowly. I am NOT doing LC on UD's. I AM doing LC on DD's.
I encourage everyone to track calories on both days if not losing to see where the problem is. I love JUDDD and hope you have success.
I hear ya. It must be the same for me--too many calories on my UD's. I hope mentally I can get these UD's on track. What you described is my fear. I don't understand how I ate only 500 calories per day for SIX WEEKS! while doing hCG, yet I'm worried I won't be able to limit my calorie intake on the Up Days. For me, I think I do have to go back to low carb on my Up Days, because it seems for me that eating bread or pasta just makes me crave more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoHappy View Post
Another calorie tracker here, and I so-o-o agree with you about its importance.
Calorie counting is my kryptonite! But obviously, I'm going to have to do it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by beadart View Post
Garnet, like you I have been on hcg and eliminated 55 lbs. in 3 rounds. I am now in phase 4 - 2 months after ph 3. My weight has slowly crept up, an additional 6 lbs over LDW. YIKES! Correction days are no longer giving me any results and I feel trapped, so I started JUDDD 2 days ago, with today being my 2nd DD. I know I shouldn't have stood on the scale, but I did, so after the first DD, I was down 1 lb and after my first UD, I was up 1.4 lbs. I gasped when I saw that. Today is my DD and I will just follow the VLCD way of eating for these first few weeks to let my body get used to this WOE. So far, I am not happy and this group is so encouraging to me. I will also keep going and definitely stay away from carbs, which I do normally. I don't know why I gained 1.4 lbs from one UD when I was so good. Oh well, I guess that's just the way this goes when your body is learning something new. We'll both have to stick with it to see what happens. Good luck to you (and me!)
Good luck to you as well! It's exciting for me to see ex-hcg'ers here because I also felt I could not live with what I called the "every other correction day", which ironically is sort of what we are doing on JUDDD except that I appreciate the ability to choose what those 500 calories are going to be.

Dr. Johnson mentions in his book (and I believe on his website) that he doesn't recommend weighing after an up day--I think it would be normal to be a bit heavier after eating more. I just had hoped to lose this weight faster--I usually lost 7 pounds in the first week on hCG. I didn't expect to lose those 7 that fast this time, but I had hoped I'd be further along by now. I just have to accept that I cannot ignore the calorie counts on the up day. Sigh. I hope we both see success with this program!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heather View Post
Garnet10 - I agree with the first 3 posters. My first thought was are you counting your UD calories? I could not lose if I ate till "satisfaction" like Dr. J. said.

This is what I would do if I were you - and I'm not, so take what you need and leave the rest: I would psych myself up by choosing my maintenance range as 130 to 120. I would join the maintenance lane and draw encouragment from those who are having such success there. You need to see their examples. Many of them went on maintenance and surprisingly kept losing. The best thing you said is "I can see myself eating this way for life". Start now - tell yourself you have achieved the high end of your maintenance leeway and enjoy your success. OMG 52 lbs - enjoy that! Go to the gym and pick up a 50 pound dumbell and you'll be shocked.

I don't know if you exercise - but "what I would do, and am going to do" when I get 10 lbs. within my desired weight is zero in on building more muscle. Muscle has such density, you could wear a few sizes smaller at the same weight! Muscle will speed up your metabolism. "Diet if you want to look good in clothes. Excercise if you want to look good naked (or in shorts?)." This is for your good health, and you don't want to be weak by fasting every day. So JUDDD is the perfect answer for you. You have done so fantastic and now you've found JUDDD - the perfect way of life for maintenance. Just relax and enjoy your success. You're there and don't see it. So hopefully you'll read the posts at Maintenance Lane and draw insights from them also. I'll see you there by the end of the year. Don't disappoint me now - I'll need your help. Hope something I've said helps.

P.S. - Wow, 7 more posted while I was typing - see how everyone wants to help you?
Heather, thank you so much! It's funny but I never saw myself as that 182 pound person, so I'm right back to where I spent most of my life, struggling to lose 5 to 10 pounds. I remember when I first lost all that weight how thrilled I was and I thought I looked so good! And now I look at my thighs and I am sad to think they may look like this the rest of my life, since they looked this way in my 20s as well (I'm 49 now).

And yes, it is likely those dang Up Day calories. I was able to avoid counting calories on the hCG protocol (Dr. Simeons basically outlines what you eat while on the diet, and then in P3, the no sugar, no starch phase, I just ate all protein, fat and veggies and didn't count anything. Hmmm...maybe I really do need to stop the bread and pasta on my up days!

And yes, I do need to get back into exercising. I used to kickbox but stopped when (before hCG), I was eating low carb and doing this aerobic and muscle building exercise for an hour 2 to 3 times a week with ZERO weight loss. I plan to start slowly with some long walks and light weights. I have plenty of exercise DVDs just waiting to be followed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yam-Yam View Post
I don't have anything to add accept a big hug.
Thank you! Hugs right back to you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jem51 View Post
Eating to satisfaction, hmmm.

Sounds good but many of us had no idea what a person of our size would be consuming in calories.
It would not hurt to calculate and go from there.

JUDDD is such a great plan!! Sometimes it takes some trial......
Yes, I should have known that "eating to satisfaction" was too good to be true!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muffabuff View Post
Garnet, please don't let yourself get discouraged so early on. I lost the first three weeks on Juddd then stalled until I lowered my DD to 300 calories from 500. There is a learning curve to this woe as every body is different. It is amazing how much weight you have already lost, I am in awe of anyone who can accomplish what you have. It took me 5 months to lose my goal of 25 lbs. You already know how to be a successful dieter and Juddd is like no other woe you have ever tried. You will find that for the most part it is quite enjoyable. It is kind to the body and the spirit. We are all here to support you whenever you need us. Relax into Juddd and give it some time. Let your body do some of the healing that it requires. You may find that you feel better even before you see a loss. I know you will do fabulous at Juddd and I can't wait to hear about your losses. one last thought JMHO I find that it's best to only weigh once a week after a DD. I see no reason to torture myself by being made aware of every little daily bounce on the scale. I think this has saved me a lot of insanity. I also think its best to count UD calories, it is so easy to go over or under. Better to play it safe. I use an old fashioned pen and paper. Again good luck!
Vanessa
Thanks, Vanessa. I was so stubborn when I started--I did read here that people were counting their Up Day calories but I refused to believe I would have to. But now I know I have to. I'm a pen and paper gal myself!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawnyama View Post
sweetie--this is me I have done JUDDD last week and lost 4.2 pounds. This week has brought nothing but gains I would be not ok with it, if I were not eating too! But I am eating what I want. I am taking this as a break from the total hcg protocol and enjoying my few weeks off. If I can maintain this loss/being stable I will be OK. But I want to lose more. I am going to hop on another round so I can be good for vacation as I have some shorts I cannot fit into--I am fitting into only 1 pair from last year when I sitting at goal weight. I will get over my cold that I have right now and begin my other round. This seems like a great plan to maintain on, right now I am not losing and need to see those losses.

*Now, I am off to read the responses to your post. I wanted to give you my view before reading the others. Maybe I can find some answers too.
Oh, Dawn, you know what this is like! I wish I could do another round of hCG but I just can't and I'm not sure why. My body is just refusing to do the VLCD for more than a couple of days. I was in a mall on my 4th day of the VLCD and my head felt woozy. I thought I was going to pass out. I've tried to restart the VLCD 3 times in the past 2 months and just couldn't continue it. I would have loved to have lost this weight with hCG and then continued to eat JUDDD as a way of life, but it looks like I'm going to have to just be patient and see the weight come off more slowly. Good luck to you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by circusgirl View Post
I came here off of p2. I chose to introduce carbs immediately. I gained over 10 pounds when I started JUDDD, but just kept going. I was buoyed by the lovely people here and just kept the faith. Sure enough after a few weeks I started losing. I've been doing JUDDD since the end of April and this is the first week I've gotten below my starting number.

I am comfortable, I am happy, I am experiencing ALL of the other benefits JUDDD has to offer, so I figured I'd stick it out. I'm so glad I did! I've had some crazy UD's eating things I wouldn't have dreamed of before, all within my calories. One day I made and ate a small batch of oatmeal butterscotch cookies! And the scale moved down the following day.

This way of eating has so many gifts above and beyond loss! I'm also fully convinced that the body isn't ready to lose after it drops so much so rapidly on hcg. It needs some time to stabilize and I'm not sure playing with the numbers is going to change that. The best thing you can do is stick to your numbers, count the calories, and trust.

YES, you may find that you have triggery foods. YES you may find you don't feel as good when you eat certain things. YES you may find that for you not all calories are created equal, but even so I think you will still experience the healing benefits of JUDDD. Honestly, I do.

Stick around, let these amazing people help you and don't get too discouraged. And if you find yourself feeling low, read over the non-scale victories. That can really help in the dark moments.
Thanks so much! You guys have really made my day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunday View Post
After losing 52 lbs, you will need to rest some and stabilize! Circusgirl, Redhead, and SunGoddess have experience with the protocol and Juddd. It is a perfect way to heal your metabolism. Wishing you much better days in the next few weeks!
Thanks so much!

Quote:
Originally Posted by circusgirl View Post
I really think that anyone coming off of hcg should expect a month of no movement (if p3) or even a few weeks of gaining (if adding carbs.) Not just based on my experience-I think it makes sense.

I swear, it WILL come off, but I think you need to give your body a buffer of a month to have it start happening. It may happen faster, it may not. But I do think it's unrealistic to think you'll lose off the bat coming from p2. Not because it doesn't work, or because your body is broken, but because your body is SMART as all get out and needs a moment to regroup. This is a good thing. This is a protective mechanism. While you wait for the weight to start dropping you can chill with us here and enjoy the other parts.

I know it's frustrating. Trust me, I was frustrated too! And I think it's fine to feel that way, I'm not going to talk you out of it or tell you you're wrong to have those feeling. We all process things differently. BUT I think it's important to sit with those feelings for a limited time, and then step out of the darkness and get a view of the bigger picture. Because as hard as it is to see if from where you're standing now, it's just a perspective issue. It's there!
I didn't start JUDDD from P2--I was actually 130 pounds for several weeks before coming to JUDDD, so I believe my hypothalamus truly stabilized at this weight. It may also be one of the reasons it is taking so long to move past it.

While you wait for the weight to start dropping you can chill with us here and enjoy the other parts. Thanks so much--I will do that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpinDizzie View Post
Two weeks is such a short time. And, if I'm reading your stats correctly, you're almost at goal. You don't have very much to lose, so it may go slowly. I agree with the others on tracking your food. It is the best tool! Until you see it in black and white, you have really no idea. Your calorie intake could be much higher or much lower than you think. Either way, give it some time.
Thank you all! You have all made my day! So grateful to meet such a wonderful and supportive group of people! Thank you for lifting me up!

Last edited by garnet10; 06-21-2012 at 08:00 PM..
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:57 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by circusgirl View Post
I really think that anyone coming off of hcg should expect a month of no movement (if p3) or even a few weeks of gaining (if adding carbs.) Not just based on my experience-I think it makes sense.

I swear, it WILL come off, but I think you need to give your body a buffer of a month to have it start happening. It may happen faster, it may not. But I do think it's unrealistic to think you'll lose off the bat coming from p2. Not because it doesn't work, or because your body is broken, but because your body is SMART as all get out and needs a moment to regroup. This is a good thing. This is a protective mechanism. While you wait for the weight to start dropping you can chill with us here and enjoy the other parts.

I know it's frustrating. Trust me, I was frustrated too! And I think it's fine to feel that way, I'm not going to talk you out of it or tell you you're wrong to have those feeling. We all process things differently. BUT I think it's important to sit with those feelings for a limited time, and then step out of the darkness and get a view of the bigger picture. Because as hard as it is to see if from where you're standing now, it's just a perspective issue. It's there!
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:51 PM   #30
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,105
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Stats: 270/down 110-ish/ goal 147
WOE: hCG Rx shots/JUDDD maintain
Start Date: 1/4/2010 Now R9 P2
@Garnet I remember you from hcg and I wish I had something to say that was spectacular but I don't! I will be doing JUDDD right along with you for awhile until I am ready for my next round. I don't find the protocol so hard, but I can tell you this round 7 did challenge me. After losing and being more happy with myself I'm not so "desperate" so then I get annoyed easier I know you're real strict and follow it when you do it so if you couldn't, so you couldn't! Good thing there is something else for us to go to, huh?!

I'm just here to "chill" for awhile and get that anti-inflammation gene going and then I guess if I decide to not do another round for quite awhile I at least have a plan. I got really tired of just eating LC, I was overindulging on some things because I missed others. This plan seems more balanced to me.

(((HUGS))) we can do this !
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