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Old 05-15-2012, 01:12 PM   #1
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Question about when to "break the fast"

I noticed in a thread Yam Yam posted yesterday that she said she didn't want to lose the fat-burning effect by going past the 40-hour mark of fasting. Which got me to wondering what that was all about? I have read countless posts in which it is recommended the fast last at least 36 hours for optimal benefit, but had never seen that going past 40 hours was a detriment. I usually break the fast at 1-2 p.m., which goes well past 40 hours, mostly because I'm not a breakfast eater and just don't normally want to eat until that time. Should I be breaking sooner?
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Old 05-15-2012, 01:29 PM   #2
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I don't think you're going to run into one bit of trouble, and if you do, you can always eat sooner.

I'm not one who believes in metabolism screeching to such an absolute halt in 40 hours that you would be in *starvation mode*. Unhappily for those in true starvation situations, their metabolisms are still running, still burning, and they're still starving down to the point of death.

Many people fast for far, far longer than 40 hours and reap the benefits. Their metabolism doesn't close down, although it will slow down further and further as the days of fasting continue, but mainly metabolism slows and speeds up in response to a lot of factors, and whether we've eaten recently is one of them.

So if it slows a bit more and a bit more as the hours pass, that's really not much of a big deal, because you are also not consuming calories to even BE burned during that time. And when you do, the metabolism will handle them.

But I will add this: Our bodies are governed by our circadian rhythms, set by the daylight and nighttimes of our existence. Some of our *systems* speed up and work at high efficiency during daylight hours. Some of our functions slow down and nearly close down during nighttime hours. Our bodies are geared to our daylight/nighttime division of existence.

So whether you fast until the early afternoon hours, even on your Up Days, doesn't matter as much as the fact that you need to eat your full UD calories before you go to bed that night. Which means that you are going to get some great suppers.
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Old 05-15-2012, 01:42 PM   #3
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Boy howdy do I love my suppers! Tuna noodle casserole, corn and a great big greens salad with some yummy Sweet Vinegar and Oil dressing I found at Walmart the other day. **love visiting mom - thanks mom for making all my homemade childhood faves!

Thank you for the info! Guess I got a little geeked out, which is my life's signature!
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Old 05-15-2012, 01:46 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kimberino View Post
Boy howdy do I love my suppers! Tuna noodle casserole, corn and a great big greens salad with some yummy Sweet Vinegar and Oil dressing I found at Walmart the other day. **love visiting mom - thanks mom for making all my homemade childhood faves!

Thank you for the info! Guess I got a little geeked out, which is my life's signature!
I'm 69 years old now, and I still miss my mom's cooking and the family favorites she'd have when we'd gather at her home, our old childhood home. I have the recipes. I can make these dishes too. But, somehow, they just aren't as good as mom made them. It was mom's sparkle and love that brought it all up to yummy perfection.
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Old 05-15-2012, 01:57 PM   #5
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You just gave me goosebumps, Pat. I'll make sure to cherish every moment with mom. I'm here visiting due to her having some heart issue testing, so your post is very poignant and relevant to me right now.
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:09 PM   #6
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Kimberino: I think that was on the "I've always wondered this..." thread, right? We were having a discussion because I actually have a problem believing the "starvation mode" theory. I was asking more questions than answering any! I was asking: if our bodies are smart enough to go into starvation mode (slow metabolism; conserve energy) when lack of food threatens our lives, why are our bodies not smart enough to go into "release dangerous excess" mode (speed up metabolism; expend extra energy) when excess food intake threatens our lives?

Yesterday was an UD for me and I was not hungry. But, I had read Nancy's reports about the approximate 40 hour mark. She learned that 40 hours is about the time that the stress response (SIRT1 gene action) will shut down.

Nancy can explain it better than I can. The stress response and hormones are activated in our bodies when no food is coming in. It energizes us, supposedly, to be able to go hunt for food. It also does many other wonderful healing and anti-aging things to prolong life, like renewing and rescuing our cells.

Pat is right. There is no exact way of knowing when each person arrives at the point where the stress response will shut down and the body will start to rest to conserve energy. Scientists believe it's probably around 40 hours.

Pat: Didn't you experiment with having 2 consecutive DDs early on in your JUDDing? Maybe it was someone else who said it. But I just recall it being said that there was no evident benefit to having 2 DDs in a row.

I love hearing you two talking about your Mom's cooking! My mother was a great cook as well and she taught me. Now I'm a great cook and I love to eat my yummy meals. DH has always been a very happy camper at the table! Same with my kids, especially my son who is now grown and married. But he still asks me to cook some of his favorites for him.
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:17 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yam-Yam View Post
Kimberino: I think that was on the "I've always wondered this..." thread, right? We were having a discussion because I actually have a problem believing the "starvation mode" theory. I was asking more questions than answering any! I was asking: if our bodies are smart enough to go into starvation mode (slow metabolism; conserve energy) when lack of food threatens our lives, why are our bodies not smart enough to go into "release dangerous excess" mode (speed up metabolism; expend extra energy) when excess food intake threatens our lives?

Yesterday was an UD for me and I was not hungry. But, I had read Nancy's reports about the approximate 40 hour mark. She learned that 40 hours is about the time that the stress response (SIRT1 gene action) will shut down.

Nancy can explain it better than I can. The stress response and hormones are activated in our bodies when no food is coming in. It energizes us, supposedly, to be able to go hunt for food. It also does many other wonderful healing and anti-aging things to prolong life, like renewing and rescuing our cells.

Pat is right. There is no exact way of knowing when each person arrives at the point where the stress response will shut down and the body will start to rest to conserve energy. Scientists believe it's probably around 40 hours.

Pat: Didn't you experiment with having 2 consecutive DDs early on in your JUDDing? Maybe it was someone else who said it. But I just recall it being said that there was no evident benefit to having 2 DDs in a row.

I love hearing you two talking about your Mom's cooking! My mother was a great cook as well and she taught me. Now I'm a great cook and I love to eat my yummy meals. DH has always been a very happy camper at the table! Same with my kids, especially my son who is now grown and married. But he still asks me to cook some of his favorites for him.
Yes, it was me. Somebody had been wondering whether there would be a nice benefit from doing one UD and two DDs, then another UD, followed by two more DDs, etc. So I volunteered to do that for a couple of weeks and report back. (I think it was a single UD... perhaps it was two and two....... I can't quite remember now...)

Result: No big burst of extra weight loss. Just a period of missing out on some good UDs! Just more of a bother. Harder to work two straight DDs into the schedule of my life with meals out, social fun times, etc.

Recommendation: Not worth the effort. Just follow JUDDD and enjoy the food as well as the results.

And as to you being a great cook.. I have an idea! Let's all go to your house and you can cook for us! Woo Hoo! This is going to work great!
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:31 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoHappy View Post
Yes, it was me. Somebody had been wondering whether there would be a nice benefit from doing one UD and two DDs, then another UD, followed by two more DDs, etc. So I volunteered to do that for a couple of weeks and report back. (I think it was a single UD... perhaps it was two and two....... I can't quite remember now...)

Result: No big burst of extra weight loss. Just a period of missing out on some good UDs! Just more of a bother. Harder to work two straight DDs into the schedule of my life with meals out, social fun times, etc.

Recommendation: Not worth the effort. Just follow JUDDD and enjoy the food as well as the results.

And as to you being a great cook.. I have an idea! Let's all go to your house and you can cook for us! Woo Hoo! This is going to work great!
C'mon over!!! We'll have a party!!
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:34 PM   #9
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Make it a potluck--save yourself some work. I don't cook, but I have wonderful take-out-ordering skills!
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:41 PM   #10
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Make it a potluck--save yourself some work. I don't cook, but I have wonderful take-out-ordering skills!
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Old 05-15-2012, 02:50 PM   #11
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Thanks Yam Yam! I hope my original post didn't sound accusatory, I just couldn't recall ever reading anything about the 40-hour point and I get just a wee bit obsessive about any plan I'm on.

Now...about that potluck. Lord help us, I don't cook (well, I do, but my family probably can't think of one dish they'd recall as being a favorite), so I'm all for heading over to your house. And I'll join Dawn and order some mean take-out (as long as it's not chili, Dawn!)
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Old 05-15-2012, 03:04 PM   #12
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Nah, if I brought chili, it would be homemade (not by me!). DH makes a wonderful chili. I was thinking more along the lines of something from the French bakery.
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Old 05-15-2012, 06:57 PM   #13
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Dawn I went out for croque madame with a duck egg and some little French lemon pastry last week for a girls lunch at a little Parisian-Ish cafe. Lets go!
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Old 05-16-2012, 12:27 AM   #14
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Sorry I have been mostly away from my computer the last two days. Family needs superseded having a life.

Yeah, I lost two pounds (and nine inches) in March and four (and no inches) the first two weeks of April. Then I stalled.

First I figured out that, although I was preparing my UD meals properly, I was not actually getting around to eating them. I lost the four pounds when I upped UD calories by cleaning my plate into my mouth (and not into the garbage can).

During the April stall, I started losing NSVs. My bright red cheeks and nose came back. The pouches under my eyes came back. Even though I drank coffee in the afternoon, I needed a nap or I was so tired I felt ill in the evening. And I bounced between 148.2 and 149.6 over and over.

I am not at home, don't have my spreadsheet here. So I cannot be excruciatingly precise. But....

I finally figured out, from end of UD1 until dinner time on UD2 I ate 500 cals or less on DD, and another 200 cals on UD2. That made about 700 cals spread out over 47 hours. And, from the way the NSVs went away that seems to be long enough to slow my metabolism.

Once I started eating at least 500 cals for UD lunch my weight dropped three pounds and the NSVs came back quickly.

If you run some internet searches, you will find 40 hours used as the approximate length of time it takes for caloric stress respond to get turned off and metabolism to slow. No one can put a finger on an exact time, because this really is specific to each person's metabolism and health.

But, the abrupt way my rosy red cheeks/nose went back to matching the rest of my skin, the way my energy came back (no more naps), and the way weight loss resumed all convince me that there is some length of time, after which DD was too long.

And, when I had too many of those too-long-DDs in a row, bad things happened to me.

Fortunately, JUDDD forgives.
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I did not "lose" weight. I evicted it. It is gone and it ain't coming back!

JUDDD cares about calories. JUDDD does not care what you eat. Your body probably does.
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