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Old 05-09-2012, 10:50 AM   #1
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Newbie questions

Hi All!

I'm so excited to join you all on JUDDD after having moved over from HCG'ing. I find this to be a much more sustainable way of living and much less restrictive on food choices.

Couple questions:

1) I notice many of you keeping to a certain calorie limit on your up days. In Dr. Johnson's book it says you are not limited on choices or amounts. Obviously gourging would not be recommended but it seems many of you limit even on up days. What is up with that?

2) Dr. Johnson instructs the first 2 weeks to use protein shakes only on your down day. He say this is to not only keep you honest, but it also helps your body switch to burning fat and to turn on your SIRT gene, which does a bunch of things but all I can remember right now is appetite reduction.

Would some of you seasoned JUDDD'ers please advise?

Thanks so much all!!
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:14 AM   #2
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1) See this. Dr. J responded to my questions! Also he says eat 'normally' on UDs. If most people here ate normally, they would not need to be here. Most of us a overeaters by nature. Sad but true.

2) This is a matter of choice, personally I like real foods too much and the sooner I learned to calorie count the easier I thought it would be. I do know one or two very successful JUDDDers who did do the shakes. I love the normality of JUDDD so I avoid any type of diet food.

Lovely to have you with us here on the JUDDD board.

Oh I see that Dr J thread is now the top Sticky!
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Last edited by Kissa; 05-09-2012 at 11:22 AM..
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:23 AM   #3
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Such a timely post! Thank you! Question from a fellow newbie--did you begin with the 2-weeks of shakes on DD??
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:34 AM   #4
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No, as I said in the answer to 2. above. I love real food.
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:37 AM   #5
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yeah! There really IS true freedom with this WOE--how refreshing. I am on my 2nd DD and was feeling like "I can't do this--only drinking my calories." Thanks.
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:42 AM   #6
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Kissa took care of you so I just wanted to say to Anne & Elburn
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:43 AM   #7
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No need to feel that way at all. Have look at the DD Sticky suggestions and ask lots of questions.

Some of start eating late in the day as we like 'bigger' meal in the evening. Others happily eat 3 meals a day.

Some like to eat protein to stave of hunger pangs, others find oatmeal and veggies work better for them. The best thing is that there are no forbidden foods. You find what works for YOU.

But count the calories.
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:37 PM   #8
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Thank you for your replies!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kissa View Post
1) Also he says eat 'normally' on UDs. If most people here ate normally, they would not need to be here. Most of us a overeaters by nature. Sad but true.
Hi Kissa ~ But wouldn't Dr. Johnson be addressing all overeaters being his plan is a diet, intended for people who could not stick to or lose weight with other diets...including himself? That's the part of his book that REALLY appeals to me, where he says several times in his book no need to count calories on up days.

Also, it's only the first 2 weeks where the down day is shakes only. Having come over from HCG, and having a "normal day" (whatever that ends up for me) in between sounds so easy to me! Maybe that's the benefit from being a recovering HCG'er

Maybe I will try it this way, whatever on up days, and the shakes on down days for two weeks...and see how I do as kind of a test on my interpretation. I look forward to getting to "know" you all!
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:39 PM   #9
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Welcome to both of you!
You will soon be surprised at just how much food you can get from just 500 cals...check out the DD recipe sticky thread!
I make it my mission to squeeze out every last calorie from my allowance...I love to eat...drinking is for tea n coffee...not food..lol!
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:33 PM   #10
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Go for it Annefran! We all do JUDDD our own way, and that is just as it should be.

If you need to change things up at any time you can, no one is judgemental here. Looking forward to seeing you around the boards.
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Old 05-09-2012, 02:09 PM   #11
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annefran. I think most of us prefer real food on DD. But as you read more posts you will see how differently we all do our DD. What I think we do all agree on is that is is important to stick to your allotted UD calories. Good luck you will do fine.
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by annefran View Post
Thank you for your replies!



Hi Kissa ~ But wouldn't Dr. Johnson be addressing all overeaters being his plan is a diet, intended for people who could not stick to or lose weight with other diets...including himself? That's the part of his book that REALLY appeals to me, where he says several times in his book no need to count calories on up days.

Also, it's only the first 2 weeks where the down day is shakes only. Having come over from HCG, and having a "normal day" (whatever that ends up for me) in between sounds so easy to me! Maybe that's the benefit from being a recovering HCG'er

Maybe I will try it this way, whatever on up days, and the shakes on down days for two weeks...and see how I do as kind of a test on my interpretation. I look forward to getting to "know" you all!
Anne: So glad you are here! I'm going to take the liberty of sharing a little on your question regarding UD calorie counting.

As to your first question "Yes and No". The word "diet" does not only apply to weight loss plans. Diet simply means a way of eating. For instance, some countries like France have a diet rich in healthy fats and wine....

I've heard news reports that say the American DIET is made up of fast foods and large portions. Now that's a diet not made for WL!!!

Dr. J. sites many, many health benefits in his book besides weight loss. Apparently, he says, if people fast or restrict calories one day and then over-eat on UDs, they will not lose weight. However, they will still reap health benefits given by the activation of sirtuin enzymes.

When he specifically talks about weight loss in his book, he refers to self-control and awareness of how much and what kinds of foods we choose to eat.

Page 143: "The point at which you should also start keeping a record of what you're eating on your up days is when you stop losing weight or begin to lose less than a pound a week. The objective is to maintain the sense of freedom alternate-day restriction provides without falling off the wagon, so to speak."

Page 146: "Remember that I'm not advocating overeating on your up days, but you do need to eat normally not just to prevent "diet fatigue" but also to prevent your metabolism from slowing down. "

Page 148: "It's tempting, when something is working, to want to do it more and better...it did appear that some subjects in our study were restricting calories to some degree on their up days. You, too may begin to think that the less you eat on your up days the better off you'll be, but again, it's a question of balance. You don't want to slow down your metabolism and you also don't want to feel deprived every day..."

"That said, however, the fact remains that in order to lose weight we have to use more calories than we are eating. So whether or not there is a change in metabolic rate with this or any diet, we simply have to accept the fact that we have to restrain ourselves sufficiently to lose weight."

There are many places in the book where he talks about having measuring spoons and a food scale in your kitchen.

When you figured out your UD calories they were a guide for you (not set in stone) so that you would not eat too little and have a sluggish metabolism. Also so that for people who start out with no appetite control whatsoever will have a guide and not eat way over and end up maintaining or gaining.

I really like the decision you have come to. For 2 weeks do the shakes or whatever works to you to stick to your DD calorie limit or below or just choose 500 calories on DDs and stick to that. Eat "normally" on Uds. Which really means eat what you should eat to maintain your weight and no more.

If you don't have any binging issues and don't turn every UD into a Free-For-All day, you will lose weight. If you don't lose weight, it's a pretty good indicator that your estimates are off in one direction or the other.

For some, the appetite suppression effect of the SIRT1 gene kicks in pretty quickly. Then they think because they feel satisfied on UDs that they are eating enough. When they analyze it and start counting calories they realize they were UNDER-eating on UDs!!! Slow metabolism = slow or no weight loss. That's just a law of nature.

HTH! Again You are going to love JUDD and the JUDD BUDDs!!!
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:32 PM   #13
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:44 PM   #14
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:45 PM   #15
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Yay Yam-Yam. You are so thorough.
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:54 PM   #16
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I'm thinking about trying this. I had a question, I read dd should be 24 hours. If I eat closer to bedtime (7pmish) do I have to wait til that time the next day for my up day?
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Old 05-09-2012, 03:58 PM   #17
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I'm thinking about trying this. I had a question, I read dd should be 24 hours. If I eat closer to bedtime (7pmish) do I have to wait til that time the next day for my up day?
Have you figured out your UD/DD calories yet?
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Old 05-09-2012, 04:09 PM   #18
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Quote:
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Have you figured out your UD/DD calories yet?
I did the calculator yesterday and remembered that my down day should be 383.
I just did the calculator again and it says 2773 and 555 for down days. I just noticed that the calculator is located under the maintenance section. Now I'm confused! LOL
Went back and forgot to change cm to inches in height and kg to pounds. It's 1913 and 383 for down days. I'm going to start later this week. I'd like to lose 10 pounds I keep bouncing around while in maintenance.

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Old 05-09-2012, 04:16 PM   #19
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Sounds right Izzy. I see that Dawn answered your question on the new thread. Think of an UD as your normal day when you start eating, eat through the day and then stop and go to bed. A DD is the next day. You wake up. You figure out how to get through the day with 383 calories (plan, plan, plan...read the DD foods threads, or just drink shakes, but plan!). Go through your DD. go to bed. The next day you wake up. It's an UD. You can EAT. So, Eat! Pretty simple. Don't over think it unless you have some kind or weird or unusual schedule. k??
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Old 05-09-2012, 04:44 PM   #20
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Thank you Yam-Yam, for your detailed response and for providing some clarity on the issue for me. Eating until satisfied is definately subjective. Being I'm just coming off of 500 calories every day with HCG, I think my eating until satisfied will be well below what it should be on the majority of my UDs. I have no problem with the 500 calorie days. I'm just SO excited to be able to eat what I want to make up those 500 calories!

In the meantime I'm going to see how it is to do shakes for my DD, for just the two weeks as I head into JUDDD'ing!

Again, thank you all for your warm welcomes!!
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Old 05-09-2012, 05:07 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by annefran View Post
Thank you Yam-Yam, for your detailed response and for providing some clarity on the issue for me. Eating until satisfied is definately subjective. Being I'm just coming off of 500 calories every day with HCG, I think my eating until satisfied will be well below what it should be on the majority of my UDs. I have no problem with the 500 calorie days. I'm just SO excited to be able to eat what I want to make up those 500 calories!

In the meantime I'm going to see how it is to do shakes for my DD, for just the two weeks as I head into JUDDD'ing!

Again, thank you all for your warm welcomes!!
Hi there...I am on R1 P3 D2 of HCG and have decided to use JUDDD for my P3. My problem is that I do not feel like eating on my UP day...my DOWN day(today) has been just fine. I worry about not getting in enough calories in order to cause my body to metabolize different & hold on to everything. Even fried eggs & sausage which I craved on P2 did not appeal to me. Just wondering if anyone else encountered this & did it change as the days went on. I have lost .8 the last few days.

I'm only staying on P3 for 3 weeks, then on to R2 P2 again...lost 30, wanna do 2 more rounds the same (hopefully!).

Angela in TX
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:50 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy PreK Teacher View Post
Hi there...I am on R1 P3 D2 of HCG and have decided to use JUDDD for my P3. My problem is that I do not feel like eating on my UP day...my DOWN day(today) has been just fine. I worry about not getting in enough calories in order to cause my body to metabolize different & hold on to everything. Even fried eggs & sausage which I craved on P2 did not appeal to me. Just wondering if anyone else encountered this & did it change as the days went on. I have lost .8 the last few days.

I'm only staying on P3 for 3 weeks, then on to R2 P2 again...lost 30, wanna do 2 more rounds the same (hopefully!).

Angela in TX

Hi Angela and You may want to start a new thread with a title like: "Newbie needs help: HCGers and JUDDers..."

I have never done HCG and don't know anything about it, but I think more people will see your question.

As for my experience, in the very beginning on JUDD (I came from Dukan, VLC) my UDs turned into Up Up and Away Days because I knew nothing was off limits. My DDs were great. After a few weeks when the sirtuin enzymes built up in my system, the magic appetite suppressant kicked in.

Now I have to reming myself to eat sometimes on UDs!! I'm just not hungry.

The way I solve this problem on UDs is to remember to just eat something fairly early in the day. Once I eat something, anything, it triggers my appetite. Then I'm good. Thankfully another benefit of the SIR genes is they seem to cause us to crave healthy food and take away the desire to over eat.

Not all the time because when we have stress or lack of sleep that old emotional eating habit can rear it's ugly head.

There will be a lot of JUDDers who can help you figure out how to get in your UD calories.

Glad you are here!
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:50 AM   #23
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When we eat very low calorie or nothing on DD our bodies are designed to respond: Oh No! A famine may be coming! This body needs energy if it is going to be able to go hunt a wooly mammoth or find a berry bush or dig up some tasty tubers...and that energy is going to have to come from within because there is no food to eat! Release The Sirtuin Enzymes!!!!

And those lovely little enzymes flood our bodies. They get out their hammers and levels and get down to converting our bodies into fat burning machines. They also get out their dust pans and brooms and begin cleaning up inflammation in the body so it will be as healthy as possible while it deals with the famine. As the enzymes do their work, they are effectively burned up in the process.

If the famine goes on longer than, roughly - depends on the individual metabolism - 40 hours, then the body responds: Dang, we are in deep trouble here...we could starve. Turn off the sirtuin enzymes. Slow down the metabolism. Go into starvation/survival mode. Start cannibalizing both fat and muscle.

This is not a good thing. This is the reason so many people have problems losing on low cal WOEs.

BUT if the famine ends within those 40 hours, then the body responds: Cool, we found food. Turn off the sirtuin enzymes and use the food for energy.

On UD we have to eat enough calories to convince our bodies the famine is over. If we don't break the famine, starvation mode here we come. For many/most people, the calculated UD calories break the famine.

Getting back to our epic adventure, during the famine, a few of those sweet little enzymes did not get burned up. They hang around, continuing to do their fat-burning, inflammation-fighting thing.

The next day is DD and it all happens again. Gradually, over a period of about two weeks to a month, so many sirtuin enzymes accumulate in our bodies that we are almost always in fat-burning mode. Our bodies lose weight and gain health.

The longer we follow the DD/UD rotation, the more good things happen.

Let's go back to the breaking the famine. UD calculations are designed to ensure that happens.

Some people experiment and find they can break their famine at lower UDs - it really does depend on the individual metabolism. You do have to be careful with low UDs though. Too low and eventually weight loss stalls and health improvements stop happening as good old low cal starvation mode sets in.

On the other hand, some people experiment and find they can continue to lose weight at higher UDs. But, eventually some of those people see their weight loss stall. It seems like it is possible to eat so many calories that the fat-burning thing cannot keep up. If that happens, the body can begin storing those excess calories as fat - effectively neutralizing weight loss.

YOU get to experiment and figure out the DD/UD ranges that work best for YOU. Many/most of us find the calculated DD/UD calories produce very good results.

Does any of that make sense?
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I did not "lose" weight. I evicted it. It is gone and it ain't coming back!

JUDDD cares about calories. JUDDD does not care what you eat. Your body probably does.

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Old 05-10-2012, 05:02 AM   #24
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Old 05-10-2012, 05:03 AM   #25
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Old 05-10-2012, 06:51 AM   #26
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I am fairly new as well. Only 3 weeks in. When I started I tried to just fast during the day and eat at night. That did not work for me. I got to where I couldn't concentrate at work. Shakey, low bloodsugar issues. Now I eat throughout the day. I focus my morning / afternoon on protein and evening on veggies. I have reactive hypoglycemia and this seems to work best for me. You will have to figure out what works best for you! This plan is perfect for HOWEVER you set it up!
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Old 05-10-2012, 08:34 AM   #27
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I am one that used shakes for induction . It worked well for me. I still use shakes when I go to craft shows on a DD since they are so easy. No thinking involved. Just drinking. A shake that is.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:20 AM   #28
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I'm sure this has been mentioned, but some of us need to track our UD's so we'll eat enough. I wasn't tracking but thought I was eating enough - and not losing. Began tracking to eat up to my UD calories and the weight is coming off.

I didn't do shakes for induction. I needed real food with plenty of fat to feel as satisfied as I can on a DD.

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Old 05-10-2012, 09:51 AM   #29
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GREAT post, Nancy!!!
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:27 AM   #30
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Start Date: Aug 2011/I've been maintaining since April 2012
Yam and Nancy, awesome posts!

I am one who has to count to make sure I get enough UD cals in. Eating to satiety I can easily survive on 1100 cals/day. But I stall out big time. I have recently (in the past week) realized that if my UD's drop below 1500 calories, I gain, and it doesn't matter what my dd's are. I've seen it happen at 500 cal dd's, and at 900 cals.

Get around 1600-1700, and I have no UD bounce at all.

I'm in maintenance, so am not trying to lose more, but I sure don't want to gain.

So while you do these first 2 weeks, while you may not want to count to restrict what you eat, I do advise you count to keep track to make sure you are eating enough.
__________________
Tina--wife of 21 years and mom to 4 great kids. Paleo/primal since Aug 2011. Lost 20 pounds. Started JUDDD 1/13/12 to lose the last few and maintain for life.
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