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Old 04-26-2012, 08:45 AM   #1
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Question about JUDD

I'm a VLC Atkins person- on and off for many many years. I'm frustrated currently with no weight loss in a month (I know, not a real stall). I was wondering a few things about JUDD:

1. I would want to stay LC as I don't think I have the discipline to eat carbs again without getting out of control. I would like to have a few higher carb things like greek yogurt, berries, more veggies, etc. during the summer. I assume that works with JUDD?

2. Any benefits to doing JUDD for the 2 weeks then going back to Atkins? Like a jump start?

3. Really my worry about JUDD is sustainability- especially on summer weekends when we are hiking or camping and activity is high- I don't know that I could stay on 500 calories and do that. So, is there any benefit to doing JUDD during the week and moderate levels on the weekend? I would likely end up having 2-3 UD or MD in a row.

The short of it- I believe I can do the DD during the week without any problem, and even like the idea of that. It's the active weekends that I'm not convinced about.

JUDD Calorie counters says 588 calories on a DD and 2900 on an UP day. 2900 sounds like SO MANY!
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:22 AM   #2
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1) You can eat whatever you want with JUDDD. Low carb, high carb, the twinkie diet, the pizza diet, the chicken diet, whatever. Of course not all choices are healthy choices but you get the idea!

2) I would not think there's much of a benefit in doing JUDDD for 2 weeks then going back to Atkins. In 2 weeks you'd barely even get started with JUDDD, I'm not sure why you'd want to do this if you're thinking in the short term, it's not a crash diet.

3) Sustainability... it's what I love the MOST about JUDDD. It's VERY forgiving. I would think you could probably maintain on 2-3 UD or MD in a row but I don't think you'd experience very good losses. But some do 3 down days and 4 up days or 3 down days and 3 up days and 1 mid day, they just don't experience the same losses as you would if you truly followed the rotation. I guess you need to do what you need to do, but I'm wondering... since you say that you're frustrated with no loss in a month, you WILL be frustrated with your losses if you do it this way.

As for the calculator, I would personally recalculate and put in "little or no exercise", I do think the calculator over estimates exercise calories, just my opinion.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:29 AM   #3
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Actually, doing JUDDD for 2 wks might give you an answer re sustainability.

Give it a try.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:34 AM   #4
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Thanks for the response. I think I am interested in doing JUDDD- just scared to leave the comfort of VLC (even though I haven't seen the losses on VLC that I did in the past).

I'll try the no exercise choice on the calculator. I did low to mod 1-3 days a week, and that's lower than I think I do.

Maybe someone could answer this- how do you feel doing higher cardo type (or weight training) on a DD? I can't imagine doing a session with my trainer or a difficult hike, or a cardio class with only 500 calories. But, just because I'm skeptical doesn't mean it's not possible. Your experience would be helpful to note.

As you can see- I'm on the fence .
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:42 AM   #5
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I can't answer for the high cardio, I don't do anything like HIIT, just 30 minutes of inclines on my treadmill... and I see no difference in my performance for that on a DD or an UD. I'm just starting again with the weights and I see no difference on up days or down days for that either. My sleep/energy seems the same on both days. You could always try and if you need it, eat something right before your workout to fuel it since you'll just burn it right off again. Try it with 500 first and then go up if you need to?

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Old 04-26-2012, 09:56 AM   #6
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Tarrah, I'm only 8 days in, but I sense no difference in energy for workouts on DDs and UDs. Psychological differences, yup, but no physical differences. Good luck,
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:56 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randtbrown View Post
Thanks for the response. I think I am interested in doing JUDDD- just scared to leave the comfort of VLC (even though I haven't seen the losses on VLC that I did in the past).

I'll try the no exercise choice on the calculator. I did low to mod 1-3 days a week, and that's lower than I think I do.

Maybe someone could answer this- how do you feel doing higher cardo type (or weight training) on a DD? I can't imagine doing a session with my trainer or a difficult hike, or a cardio class with only 500 calories. But, just because I'm skeptical doesn't mean it's not possible. Your experience would be helpful to note.

As you can see- I'm on the fence .
I came to JUDD from doing the Dukan Diet which is VLC and LF. After 4 months of Dukan my losses had slowed down and the scale actually start creeping back up. BTW he allows Greek yogurt and FF dairy and explains why in his book.

You can stick w/ VLC if you like, but if you are eating a lot of fat you may find it difficult to stick with your calories.

On the calorie thing, can you tell us how tall you are and how old you are so we can double check because 2900 seems really high for an UD. What percentage are you choosing for DDs??

Did you make sure that you clicked the buttons to change from kgs and cms to pounds and inches?? You can really get wrong numbers if that happens.

I work out like a maniac on DDs and have soooooo much energy.

My feeling is that you will benefit greatly from reading Dr. Johnson's book, "The Alternate Day Diet" and also you can google Intermittent Fasting and find lots of great info on the web.

The Fast-Five Diet booklet and also "The Warrior Diet" book will give you more info.

You WILL reap benefits from calorie cycling/ JUDDing Mon-Fri and taking weekends off. However, your losses will be slower.

The magic of JUDD is completely connected to your body activating the SIRT1 and SIRT2 genes which produce a special hormone like protein/enzyme that prevents extra calories from being stored as fat and also depletes your current fat stores.

SIRT1 or sirtuin enzyme, is activated through calorie restriction or fasting on the DD. It is a stress response our body turns on to heal cells and prepare us in case there is no food. That stress response is slammed off on the UD when the fast is broken and we eat about 200 calories above our normal maintenance amount. This lights a fire for our metabolism and begins to speed it up.

Dr. J. explains in the book that for most people it takes about 9 DDs (every other day) to built the sirtuins up to the point where the "magic" happens. That's when you will start to burn fat at a faster rate, preserve and build lean muscle mass and stop storing extra calories as fat. (they will be flushed out through the kidneys as will fat cells from storage).

What I'm trying to say is to really get the benefits of JUDD, you should try to do about 2 weeks of rotations. If you mess up in the beginning, no big deal. It's a learning curve.

Another part of JUDD magic is the eventual appetite suppression, especially on DDs, and most people experience an over-the-top amount of boundless energy and well-being.

One last thing: I would recommend that you stay with VLC in the beginning if you enjoy it and are comfortable doing it. Then, after 2 to 4 weeks if you want to start introducing carbs, start with low GI carbs like vegetables and if you are going to have grains, use whole wheat pastas and double fiber bread.

Even doing that your body will initially retain some water and you will see numbers on the scale go up. It's all good! It's just your tissues holding on to the nutritious fluid from high volume food until it can suck every healthy good nutrient out. Then you will have a downward whoosh after your next DD, especially if you stick to protein on your DDs. HTH!!
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:03 AM   #8
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Also, take your measurements!!! Many of us experienced dramatic loss of inches before the scale caught up. That's the fat burning/muscle preserving magic of JUDD.

And, I meant to say that Dr. J says once the sirtuin enzymes are built up in your body, even if you stop JUDDing for 10 to 14 days they will still be there burning fat and doing their healthy work. Many of us find we can go on a vacation, eat like everyone else not doing the DDs, only gain a small amount and then after one or two DDs when vacation is over those pounds go away quickly and we enjoy getting right back on track!
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:06 AM   #9
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You may also want to do a little research on the benefits of exercising in a fasted state. Cardio + fasting = mega fat burn!

I recently learned about BCAA and take a teaspoon of it before my workouts. I do a lot of weight lifting/strength training. I am definitely toning and building muscle.
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:16 AM   #10
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I have found that from switching from LC to JUDDD that I have way more energy for my activities then I had before. I have started training for a Half Marathon while doing JUDDD and my energy and running are actually better on the DD. The only time I am experiencing a drop in energy is on the morning of the UD so I need to get up early to eat a nice big breakfast a couple of hours before I head out.
I used to have the crazy carb cravings and that was one of the reasons I gained a lot of weight in the past but JUDDD has gotten rid of those for me. The longer I am on JUDDD the more control I seem to have over my eating. Which is a really new thing for me. Not sure exactly how it all works but I have never felt better or happier with a way of eating.
I was stalled at 164 pounds for months on LC and have easily dropped down to 155 since starting JUDDD in March. I have tried to follow JUDDD as closely as possible except for over eating on my UDs way too often so not sure what the results would be with less DD's and more MD's. You might end up with more of a maintance program or you might find a system that works for you. I think that your idea of trying JUDDD for two weeks is a great idea. That would give you an idea of how JUDDD works and how your body reacts to it. I know that after 2 weeks I was sold on this WOEing. I find the diet to be a lot of fun (crazy I know!) and really an effortless way to lose weight. I also think that summer will be easier with this WOE for me as I can eat at BBQ's and social events while getting slimmer at the same time. I hope this helps!
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:19 AM   #11
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That's SOOOO helpful- thank you!

I think another part of the hesitation is being so LC minded, believing in that process as an overall WOE and healthy lifestyle- and then trying to take on a new way of thinking. I'm just hoping they both can work together.

I'm Female
5'8" (68 inches)
195 lbs
33 years old

I work out with a trainer for 1 hour (weight training) 1x a week, do a cardio class 1-2 times a week, and light cardio/and or yoga/pilates 1-2x a week. On weekends (especially during the summer), I hike quite a bit. So I'm not sure which activity that would be.

I don't understand the difference in the restriction percenages......

If I enter what I have above with no activity and 25%- I'm at 500/2000. Or light exercise at 574/2294.

I see now where I might not have converted to lbs or inches in the calculator to get the 2900. Thanks for pointing that out .

I think I'll try it by the book (but still Lower carbs) for 2 weeks and see how I feel. I'll up my carbs with greek yogurt, Lower sugar fruit, veggies and beans. I haven't eaten today so today will be my first DD. I am drinking a dt. coke, is that ok? I'll download the book.

I might reach out for help often!
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:27 AM   #12
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I have only been doing JUDDD for about 3 weeks, having been lower carb before that. One thing that astounded me was how many calories are in many of the low carb foods I've been eating. I know the carb counts for many foods but the calories are a whole new ball game. I've lost about 6 lbs. so far, and I feel more in control of what goes in my mouth. I think it's a good idea to stay low carb; I haven't always and the day after sometimes I'm hungrier. I can still handle it though. Good luck! I have found this forum to be an amazing resource.

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Old 04-26-2012, 10:30 AM   #13
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GREAT info Barb & YamYam!!!
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:51 AM   #14
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What do you use on iphone to track calories? I have ************- never use it anymore- can you do alternate calorie goals?
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:52 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randtbrown View Post
That's SOOOO helpful- thank you!

I think another part of the hesitation is being so LC minded, believing in that process as an overall WOE and healthy lifestyle- and then trying to take on a new way of thinking. I'm just hoping they both can work together.

I'm Female
5'8" (68 inches)
195 lbs
33 years old

I work out with a trainer for 1 hour (weight training) 1x a week, do a cardio class 1-2 times a week, and light cardio/and or yoga/pilates 1-2x a week. On weekends (especially during the summer), I hike quite a bit. So I'm not sure which activity that would be.

I don't understand the difference in the restriction percenages......

If I enter what I have above with no activity and 25%- I'm at 500/2000. Or light exercise at 574/2294.

I see now where I might not have converted to lbs or inches in the calculator to get the 2900. Thanks for pointing that out .

I think I'll try it by the book (but still Lower carbs) for 2 weeks and see how I feel. I'll up my carbs with greek yogurt, Lower sugar fruit, veggies and beans. I haven't eaten today so today will be my first DD. I am drinking a dt. coke, is that ok? I'll download the book.

I might reach out for help often!
Even if you exercise, in the beginning you should choose the "little or no exercise" option. Most JUDDers agree that the calculators over estimate calories for any exercise.

The difference in the restriction percentages for down days is just all about how fast you want to try and lose. Your UD numbers will not change. But, at any point you can change the DD percentage if you find you can't handle it being low. Keep in mind there is no such thing as going too low on a DD.

Dr. J. states that a complete fast would probably work best, but most people, including himself, cannot do it! so, you can go all the way up to 45% and still be in WLM.

When you are playing around with the calculator, use the pull down menu and click 35% for instance. then don't forget to click the "calculate" button so it will re- calculate your numbers.

You and I have pretty similar stats except that I'm 57 and you are so young!! My numbers are 400/1900 right now. I think that's at 25% but I can go all the way to 680 (35%) on a DD. That's my rule. If I'm having a tough and hungry DD which is very unusual lately but does happen every now and then, or if I have to go to a business dinner or social event on a DD I allow myself up to 35% because that's well within WLM.

When that happens you DO NOT change the UD number. It always stays the same. In the beginning you might find yourself going over a bit on UDs just because of your new freedom. Many do. No big deal. JUDD is forgiving.

Some don't have a problem though, right from the beginning. They just get into it and take off and find it easy to stick to their numbers.

I got 700 for you @ 35% DD. So, if it helps you to get through those first weeks, there's no harm in starting higher and working your way down. There is still enough of a calorie gap to activate SIRT1.
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Old 04-26-2012, 10:55 AM   #16
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Did you eat 2000 calories yesterday? If so, make today a DD. If not, start with an UD!!!

You NEED all of the UD calories to fuel your DDs and speed up your metabolism.
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:01 AM   #17
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Wow! You are starting today I hope you love it as much as I do! Most people start with the UD and then do the DD but as long as you ate enough yesturday you should do great. I drink diet sodas with no problems on DD (some people say it makes them hungry). I have also become a tea drinker as something about the warm liquid fills me up. There are lots of great DD food ideas on the forum that I found really useful as I wasn't really sure at first which foods were lower calorie as I was used to counting carbs. !!!

I use ************ but I just set the calories for my UD as the DD cals are easy to track. If there is a way that would be great to know about.

You give such great advice and information Yam-Yam! You are a JUDDD pro!
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:01 AM   #18
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Diet coke is fine. There are absolutely no restrictions on what you can eat. Once SIRT1 is activated and the enzymes building up in you, you will probably start craving healthier foods than you ever did before. It's weird. But that's a "side-effect".

Alot of Atkins loving JUDDers disagree w/ Dr. J's take on fats. I never did Atkins, so I didn't think much about any of that when I read the book. I eat my olive oil and coconut oil and butter sometimes and lots of meat.

Just wanted to give you a heads up on that. I'm not sure why he even addresses fats when he makes it clear that you can eat whatever you want, The only important JUDD rule is to respect your calories numbers on UDs and DDs.
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:01 AM   #19
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I bet I was close to 2000 yesterday- I don't count. I'm sure enough to count today as the first DD.

It does sound forgiving and that sounds nice. I have to watch my own self control though- which is why I'll stay lower carb and sugar free.

Diet soda ok?

I really appreciate you guys- I'm excited to try this! I'm going to vegas for my anniversary mid-may and if I could see some movement on the scale by then I'd be SOLD!
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:07 AM   #20
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I'll for sure need to watch those fats that I don't worry about now. I had been thinking I had nothing to eat today (which is true), but then remembered the HWC in my coffee. 150 calories in that- I'll be looking for a lower calorie option. I'm SCARED to eat more carbs that naturally come with lower calorie options. But I'll try it.

I eat whole foods anyway- not much processed in my WOE as it is. But I gotta say- I'm really looking forward to some fruit and black beans!

And my CSA should start soon- so lots of fresh veggies!
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:08 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randtbrown View Post
Thanks for the response. I think I am interested in doing JUDDD- just scared to leave the comfort of VLC (even though I haven't seen the losses on VLC that I did in the past).

I'll try the no exercise choice on the calculator. I did low to mod 1-3 days a week, and that's lower than I think I do.

Maybe someone could answer this- how do you feel doing higher cardo type (or weight training) on a DD? I can't imagine doing a session with my trainer or a difficult hike, or a cardio class with only 500 calories. But, just because I'm skeptical doesn't mean it's not possible. Your experience would be helpful to note.

As you can see- I'm on the fence .
I have never viewed VLC as a place of "comfort" when I did it, actually hated all the food limitations, but I do view JUDDD as the most comfortable place I have ever decided to be!

Here is some reading material for you and I suggest you do read these before making a decision about JUDDD. And I would also suggest you find a plan that fits for life, not just as a quick fix because quick fixes only are that, quick and a fix, not a WOE that will stay with us for life.

Want To Know LOTS About JUDDD?

Tell Us Your Fears!!

IT'S SO SIMPLE....REALLY!!
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:18 AM   #22
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It's comfort because of the control I feel.

This might not work for me if my control is challenged. But I'm willing to try.
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:34 AM   #23
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I think once you get used to those low cal days that hiking will be fine. I can do complete fasting days and still walk a good 5-8 miles. For a hike it would depend on the time of day for me. If we went first thing in the a.m. and it was a long one I would probably want to eat dinner but would easily be able to keep it below 500. If it were later in the day I could probably go without or just have a protein smoothie.

I don't like to workout with weights on DDs simply because I always have a post workout protein concoction of some sort and I don't want to use those calories on DDs. Energy wise I could do it though.
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:36 AM   #24
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Tarrah, in your op, you said VLC/Atkins on and off.....my question is; if that was more sustainable, why the 'off'?
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:46 AM   #25
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Great advice in this thread!

I just wanted to pop in to emphasize lean protein for the down days. I am no longer low carb on all days, but since lean protein is what fuels me the best on down days, I'm pretty much VLC on those days. Today I'm scheduled to come in at around 12 carbs (down day) with one egg, egg whites, chicken breast, salad, and shrimp. It just won't be the fattier meats on down days but can certainly be low carb if you want it to be.

I've found in a month on JUDDD too that the carbs I felt "sent me over the edge" are not having that effect on me, or perhaps another way of phrasing it is the influence of the sirtuin enzymes is helping me metabolize those things better. I'd been at under 15g of sugar for the better part of a year and most of that under 80g carbs. For much of that time I was at 40g carbs and under with no wheat.

Now I am going between 80-160g of carbs on my up days and that has included (shield your eyes if need be!) Kings Hawaiian rolls, fried chicken, potatoes galore, and even one spaghetti carbonara meal. These things have not spurred me to eat more (I try to balance them with protein and fat, though) and haven't seemed to make the down days harder.

It's an interesting phenomenon for sure.

Welcome to JUDDD!!!
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:54 AM   #26
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I lost almost 70lbs on VLC/LC before having my son (6 years ago). I feel off the wagon while pregnant and tried other "diets" after having him because someone convinced me the low carb way couldn't be healthy.

I've been back, cheat free, since late December. I love eating this way- and feel it is sustainable for me long term. Maybe not VLC, but for sure LC.

The weight came off in my 20s easily- but it's MUCH slower now. I'm starting to wonder if calories are to blame. Though I'm way more active than I was back then- I am older.......

I didn't hit these "stalls" before, and once at goal I moved up the carb ladder a little and was able to maintain.

I will admit to being alittle overwhelmed sometimes by the different information out there. Up the fat, lower the calories, up the calories, lower the fat, try JUDDD. I don't want to eat carbs. I do want something to work for me.

I'm just at a loss now, frustrated. Maybe a little desperate.

Last edited by randtbrown; 04-26-2012 at 12:00 PM..
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Old 04-26-2012, 12:00 PM   #27
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I've not read all the posts, but I know you've gotten excellent advice.

The DD's really do get easier once the Sirt gene kicks in. I also exercise (Curves and Zumba) and even on DD's I'm fine. I make sure I get a protein shake in afterwards, so I alot some calories for that.

I think my gene has kicked in so well that it was suggested I track my UD's because I'd only lost a few pounds and then nothing (and 5 ain't alot - I weigh a little more than you). I found a simple iPhone app to track and found I was way below my UD calories. This is my first week making sure I up those and I can tell some difference - we'll see what the scale says on Saturday!

Although I don't do Atkins, I am keeping low carb for the most part. Fats really do satisfy me and I think that helps tremendously on both UD's and DD's, for me anyway.

Hope you'll give JUDDD a try!
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Old 04-26-2012, 12:11 PM   #28
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My go to DD meal is low carb, and it's a huge plate full too. I slice up between a half to a full tomato, about half of an english cucumber, and 200g of chicken breast. That's about 50g of protein and 300 calories. Add more chicken if you're hungry. Easy!
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:26 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randtbrown View Post
I lost almost 70lbs on VLC/LC before having my son (6 years ago). I feel off the wagon while pregnant and tried other "diets" after having him because someone convinced me the low carb way couldn't be healthy.

I've been back, cheat free, since late December. I love eating this way- and feel it is sustainable for me long term. Maybe not VLC, but for sure LC.

The weight came off in my 20s easily- but it's MUCH slower now. I'm starting to wonder if calories are to blame. Though I'm way more active than I was back then- I am older.......

I didn't hit these "stalls" before, and once at goal I moved up the carb ladder a little and was able to maintain.

I will admit to being alittle overwhelmed sometimes by the different information out there. Up the fat, lower the calories, up the calories, lower the fat, try JUDDD. I don't want to eat carbs. I do want something to work for me.

I'm just at a loss now, frustrated. Maybe a little desperate.
Why change if it's working for you and even with JUDDD you will find you may stall out at times. All WOE do this so if VLC/LC works for you and you find it a comfort because of the control I would say leave well enough alone.
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Old 04-26-2012, 02:19 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beeb View Post
Why change if it's working for you and even with JUDDD you will find you may stall out at times. All WOE do this so if VLC/LC works for you and you find it a comfort because of the control I would say leave well enough alone.
That's probably good advise. I'm sure someone here can relate to the desperate feeling to do SOMETHING to make it happen.

Thanks for your help ladies.
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