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Old 04-05-2012, 05:28 PM   #1
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About to JUDDD but have burning questions first!

Soooooo, I bought and read the book cover to cover, and am ready to begin the program but am really confused about a number of things. I'm hoping my new LCF can help me sort through this! :-)

1) Dr J rounds off DD calories to 500 and says we don't have to restrict UP calories or count them at all (which I MUCH prefer) but I notice a lot of people here tracking their UD calories- why is that?

2) I've heard it mentioned that some people extend their DD to 36 hours but I can't figure out how that works- can someone please explain?

3) Is it true that you can elect to eat NOTHING on DD and if so, what are the benefits as I would be concerned about losing muscle.

4) in terms of exercise, I am doing 3 Bikram sessions weekly plus 3 hours or more of Callanetics plus some track walking- do I have to factor this in for extra calories or is okay to do without that extra annoying step?

5) ALSO! what's this 3 day per week DD? Does that slow down weight loss to choose say, MWF as DD? It seems a lot easier...

I'm trying to simplify yet maximize this program as much as possible. Thanks in advance for your help :-)

Last edited by nickicaps; 04-05-2012 at 05:32 PM.. Reason: forgot to add something
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Old 04-05-2012, 05:45 PM   #2
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I will let the JUDDD experts answer this, as I have only been JUDDDing a month or so. I just wanted to say welcome!!!!
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Old 04-05-2012, 06:45 PM   #3
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[QUOTE=nickicaps..]Soooooo, I bought and read the book cover to cover, and am ready to begin the program but am really confused about a number of things. I'm hoping my new LCF can help me sort through this! :-)


1) Dr J rounds off DD calories to 500 and says we don't have to restrict UP calories or count them at all (which I MUCH prefer) but I notice a lot of people here tracking their UD calories- why is that?

We sort of laugh about this, as it appears he mentions both not having to count calories on UDs and eating that number, both.

Some people do construe his words that on UDs we can eat anything we want to mean on UDs we can eat as much as we want of anything... LOL

At one point he has said our UDs can be relaxed and basically uncounted, but it is pretty obvious his intent when he gives us the online JUDDD Calorie Calculator where we get what are labeled *Normal* calories for an UD figure, and then elsewhere he tells us that on our UDs, we will just eat our *Normal* calories.

As far as simple weight loss goes, I believe some folks can eat freely on UDs without measuring, without counting calories, and (here's the rub) without going a bit overboard and a bit overboard and a bit overboard many/most UDs, until they are getting some pretty poor weight loss progress.


And some folks don't come to JUDDD with normal appetite, and don't have much stimulation to eat nearly up to their UD calorie numbers, and so find that when their not high enough UDs are combined with their very low DDs, their metabolism is slowed down even more than it used to be, and none of us have the goal of trashing our metabolisms further. Slow metabolic function is a lot of why most of us put on weight and ended up being here to begin with.

I did notice early on that on some other sites where JUDDD is followed - and where they did not advocate counting calories and eating at their given *Normal* UD calorie numbers... their weight loss results sucked compared to the folks here. So most of us (me, for one) advocate counting calories on UDs too, at least most of the time, just to be sure you are respecting your calorie ceiling numbers and sticking to them pretty well. Overall, that seems to make the JUDDD *magic* work as powerfully as it has been shown to be!



2) I've heard it mentioned that some people extend their DD to 36 hours but I can't figure out how that works- can someone please explain?

Say you eat breakfast at 7:00 am, lunch at Noon, and supper at 7:00 pm. Every Up Day. So you eat supper on your UD at 7:00, then go all through that night of sleep with no food, and all through the next DD on your *fasting* few calories, and you go through all of that night of sleep with no food, until it's finally about 7:00 am again on your next UD. You've done the Down Day plus both nights on each end of it, for a total of about 36 hours.


3) Is it true that you can elect to eat NOTHING on DD and if so, what are the benefits as I would be concerned about losing muscle.

Yes, you can do your 500 calories or fewer, all the way down to nothing, and you won't lose muscle from just that one day. But that's another reason to not go cutting your UD calories down.. 'cause they are necessary to nourish your body very well from the UDs. It's a real mistake to think of JUDDD as just another *lower your calories to lose weight* diet plan!!! UD calories have their place in this plan! Use them!



4) in terms of exercise, I am doing 3 Bikram sessions weekly plus 3 hours or more of Callanetics plus some track walking- do I have to factor this in for extra calories or is okay to do without that extra annoying step?

I think once we are at goal weight, slim and sleek, we need to eat those additional calories given us to cover exercise, or else become a lot more gaunt and scrawny that we want to be. But until we're at goal weight, I don't see why we'd want to work to burn that extra fat with exercise, and turn around and eat those burned calories right back again. I use the *little or no exercise* choice when figuring the *Normal* UD calories.


5) ALSO! what's this 3 day per week DD? Does that slow down weight loss to choose say, MWF as DD? It seems a lot easier...

If you just rotate UDs and DDs, you will also rotate them by weeks, so 3 Ups and 4 Downs one week, and then 4 Ups and 3 Downs the next week. This straight rotation is thought to produce a bit better results, a bit faster, than constantly breaking the piston action of the cycle by inserting MDs into every week. Never-the-less, holding DDs to the same days each week works so much better for some people, that they accept whatever slow-down they are given and use a MD each week.

It's advised to at least do the first couple of weeks without a MD, to get this off and working well. The rest is up to you. I do a straight rotation for the most part.



I'm trying to simplify yet maximize this program as much as possible. Thanks in advance for your help


This program is already extremely simple. And easy. All you have to do is respect your calorie numbers and hold to them pretty well.

Visit here and be an active member. Share your success. It's motivating to read of all the success here, so come play with us!
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Old 04-05-2012, 07:21 PM   #4
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Looks like Pat's got all your questions answered.
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Old 04-05-2012, 07:29 PM   #5
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Great post Pat.

It really is simple. Rotate UD/DD every other day. Respect BOTH your UD and DD calories, and eat what you want/what your body tolerates to those calorie limits.

Give it at least 2 weeks doing the program "straight" before doing any tweaks or modifications, or passing judgement on whether it is working or not.

Welcome!
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Old 04-05-2012, 10:23 PM   #6
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Nickicaps, you did not misconstru anything. I have read the book and he does indeed say that you can eat whatever you want and as much as you want on up days. The doctor does contradict himself in his book and online. However, it is not the case. You will notice when you calculate your calories there is a limit for your up days as well as your down days. We must stay within our calorie limits everyday. I hope this has helped to clear things up for you.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:25 AM   #7
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There are many places in the book where Dr. J qualifies his statements about "eating freely" on UDs.

Here's one of many, from page 103 "...I've said that on the up day of the Alternate Day Diet you will be eating freely, and I'm not going back on my word...but, In terms of calories and weight loss, it's still how much you eat that counts."

He high lights "how much" in itallics.

The studies he points out where mice (and people, too in the old hospital experiment w/ IF) were fed twice their normal amounts on the feeding day and 20% or less on fasting days, resulted in the subjects maintaining their weight.

On page 103 he goes on to mention that the other health benefits will remain in the case of people who eat more than their normal calories on UDs. But they will not lose weight.

Obviously, since he goes into such great detail about keeping a food journal and weighing and measuring your food, writing down everything you eat, how could that mean that he does not intend for there to be a calorie ceiling on UDs?

Everything I read, and I too read the book cover to cover more than once, led me to believe if we want the weight loss benefits and not merely the healing benefits of UD/DD rotations, we must calculate our calorie limits and ceilings.

You have to refrain from taking something out of context and instead, consider the whole of the book to get it right.

The detailed explanation of the SIRT1 gene and how it becomes activated is all about calorie restriction. And, when he is specifically talking about weight loss, he continually repeats that no weight loss can occur unless we create a calorie deficit. In other words our average daily intake needs to be less than what our daily maintenance calories would be.

Sorry this got long! I just agree with Pat and felt I wanted to throw my 2 cents worth in here and maybe help to clarify this for any who might be reading this. I have seen many people comment on the idea that UDs can be a free-for-all eating wise. and I scratch my head because I just didn't get that when I read the book.

Eating "whatever you want" is different from "eating as much as you can stuff in of whatever you want" or maybe "as much as you want of whatever you want". Eating freely means no restricting food groups or any foods at all. You can eat all kinds of stuff. But if you eat too much, you will not lose weight. I just think he made it really, really crystal clear.

Dr. J is talking about many benefits from IF. There are health benefits. There are weight loss benefits. You can get the first without the second if you eat more than your body needs on the UDs.

If you have the book, read page 148 also where he talks about the importance of eating your calories on UDs to keep your metabolism from slowing down.

OK, I'll shut up now!!!
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:53 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yam-Yam View Post
Eating "whatever you want" is different from "eating as much as you can stuff in of whatever you want" or maybe "as much as you want of whatever you want". Eating freely means no restricting food groups or any foods at all. You can eat all kinds of stuff. But if you eat too much, you will not lose weight. I just think he made it really, really crystal clear.
This is how I understand it as well, and for me in particular it's an important point because I don't have the sort of "normal" appetite that some might have where I can just eat as much as I want on an UD and hope that the calories just fall at the level where I can lose weight on that. There are times I could eat 1+ lbs of bacon in a sitting, or an entire giant Costco 24oz can of Mauna Loa macadamia nuts in a day (yes I've done that before....5585 calories in nuts), or just normal amounts of hwc which adds up real fast, and still feel like that's a totally normal day where my appetite is concerned. So I definitely need to watch my UDs closely to lose. I know there are some of us lucky enough to still be able to lose without keeping an eye on UDs at all, but I think most of us probably can't. I guess it depends on how "normal" your appetite is.
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Old 04-06-2012, 12:32 PM   #9
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Yes, sadly most of us would not be here at all if we ate 'normally'.

We need rules.
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Old 04-06-2012, 02:28 PM   #10
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Thanks SO MUCH for the detailed and thoughtful responses!

Thing is I won't be one to count calories every day of my life, being vegan I feel restricted enough at times. I will let you all know how it goes with counting DD only and if the weight loss doesn't happen or is minimal, I will reassess.

Yay JUDDD!
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Old 04-06-2012, 02:32 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickicaps View Post
Thanks SO MUCH for the detailed and thoughtful responses!

Thing is I won't be one to count calories every day of my life, being vegan I feel restricted enough at times. I will let you all know how it goes with counting DD only and if the weight loss doesn't happen or is minimal, I will reassess.

Yay JUDDD!
That sounds like a plan. I wish you nothing but fabulous success. Post often. Let us know how it's going. Stick around to play with us here.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:20 PM   #12
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i think i remember reading about letting the mice " gouge " themselves full they didnt lose.
meaning dont stuff yourself and you " should" be fine.
if youre vegan you shouldnt have any issues. now if youre a vegetarian eating mac and cheese and cheese pizza daily ....different story
hmmm i wonder whos done that before........
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Old 04-07-2012, 03:27 AM   #13
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Learning how many calories are in the foods we eat regularly becomes second nature. Most of us eat the same - what? - twenty or so meals over and over. Once you know those calories, you know them. This simplifies JUDDD.

You may find that calorie counting becomes self-reinforcing. The results are so positive, and seeing the scale drop or seeing how high/low the bounce is, is so interesting that - at least for me - counting the calories and learning about how different foods affect me is all part of the game now.
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:16 AM   #14
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Good points about why counting calories makes sense. If I find it becomes necessary I totally will but I read in the book that when someone isn't losing, 98% of the time it's due to DD calories being too high. Having never done LC, I am not used to counting anything. My rules are more like "no animals, no soy, no wheat." But I think the reason why I am having trouble losing the last 15 pound sis 1) I am under INCREDIBLE, chronic stress and 2) I rely on a lot of nuts and seeds and gourmet raw foods and I think the calories are really high. I'm hoping that by sticking to green juice and protein shakes every other day (400 calories seems to be my number) then the issue will correct itself. If nothing else it will be an interesting experiment :-)
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:47 AM   #15
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Nikki, you are likely right. Nuts/seeds are so calorie dense, it is very easy to eat 500 calories in them for a snack without blinking. Simply measuring them out in 1 oz increments and putting in baggies might help with portion control, without actually counting calories. If you open the 3rd or 4th baggie, it might be time to stop. LOL

I had to do that. And I totally understand about being restricted and rebelling against counting. I have lots of food restrictions too (allergies and blood sugar issues).

I think your plan is fine to start with, and if you aren't losing, you can start counting UD's.

Do you have any good grain-free vegan baking recipes to share?
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