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Old 01-13-2012, 08:02 AM   #1
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Fasting on DDs

So, I've decided this is what I want to do for a while. I just think it would be
easier to not start eating on a DD, than to try to figure out how to get 443
calories in, without setting off some hellacious cravings. I want to know, though:
the JUDDD calculator puts me at 2271 cals for an UD and 443 cals for a DD, which
is a difference of 1828 between UDs and DDs. Now, if my DDs end up being 0 cals,
would I adjust my UD limit to 1828, to keep that same range?

1828 - 0 = 2271 - 443

Does anyone know what I'm trying to ask? I'm not sure if I'm explaining my question
correctly. I don't know enough about JUDDD yet to make this decision on my own,
and I don't know enough about JUDDD's effect on me to even guess where to go
with this. I guess the biggest thing is to not trash my metabolism, and keep the UDs
rather high, so would this be a good start? Then if I find out that I'm not losing, or
not losing well, I could try lower-cal UDs for a few weeks? I dunno, is this how you
work it?
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:06 AM   #2
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Wow, in re-reading this, I realized that doing 1828 cal UDs, I would only be averaging
914 cals per day- and that doesn't seem like something that would actually help with
boosting metabolism.
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:07 AM   #3
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No no you definitely wouldn't lower your up day calories to compensate for a total fast, if anything it would have been the opposite. I personally wouldn't change the up day calories at all though, I have no real reason for saying that though, just my gut feeling.
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:40 AM   #4
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The way I understand it (tho I could be way off base) most people can not do a total fast, thus why most eat on DD's. As for your UD's they should not increase if you decide to do a 0 calorie fast. I also personally feel Dr. J numbers are a bit too generous IMO. You might check out the thread that lists the calculators. Good luck!
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:06 AM   #5
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Hi Pami! and great to see you!

So I fast until dinner on most DDs. It makes it pretty dang easy to make a "regular" low carb simple meal and stay under the 500cals for the day (usually with a square of Lindt 85% to boot for dessert).

It's so easy to be able to know that from the time dinner hits, I have a whole day ahead where I can eat whatever I want (that doesn't make my blood sugar go crazy).

Last night's dinner:

Big Salad (Romaine, cucumber, purple onion, carrot, tomato, avocado, blue cheese, WF Balsamic Dressing)
Broccoli with 1tsp Butter
4oz Chicken Breast, grilled

Was under 500cals even though I didn't run it through ******. I wasn't hungry enough to do a dessert but I coulda done a Jello or Lindt 85 square or something like that.

Now this morning I had a big breakfast sandwich on my Revolution Roll with sausage, egg and cheese along with blackberries. So good. I'm so full I probably won't eat lunch or will just have a part of an apple and a string cheese and dinner will be a big ole juicy loosey hamburger with green bean fries.

Then tomorrow will be a fast until dinner... very easy once you get into a routine. Hope that helps!
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:03 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
I don't know enough about JUDDD's effect on me to even guess where to go
with this. I guess the biggest thing is to not trash my metabolism, and keep the UDs
rather high, so would this be a good start? Then if I find out that I'm not losing, or
not losing well, I could try lower-cal UDs for a few weeks? I dunno, is this how you
work it?
I think you make some excellent points. 1. Most important, you do not have enough data about you, yet. By carefully observing and monitoring, you will:-) 2. You realize that if the scale does not move in the down direction you want, you are willing to lower the calories. I think this is a great plan and I look forward to reading about your success.
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:21 AM   #7
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Your original question about skipping DD calories and adding them onto the following UD to increase that UD number was just being discussed on somebody else's thread, so I'll just copy and paste my response here. This was my opinion and response: - -


I wouldn't, but you get to do anything in the world you want to do.

For myself, I don't want to encourage my brain to accept that way of eating anymore, to direct that way of eating anymore, to even have that idea pop into it anymore. If I eat lower on my fasting day, or skip my DD calories completely, that just brings me to weight loss a bit faster, which ain't all bad!

But my overeating desire and habit was a great deal of what brought me to the size I was humiliated to live at, so while in maintenance now I'm freer to eat at a higher level than I did during my weight loss, I would never intentionally add calories to my UDs just for the sake of overeating. It's too dangerous to me and my relationship with food. It was my poor relationship with food that started a lot of my unhappy obesity. I want that habit broken for good! LOL

Just my opinion. We all decide for ourselves how we are going to direct our relationship with our foods and food choices. Good luck to you however you decide. I wish you nothing but great success.
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1828 - 0 = 2271 - 443

Does anyone know what I'm trying to ask? I'm not sure if I'm explaining my question
correctly. I don't know enough about JUDDD yet to make this decision on my own,
and I don't know enough about JUDDD's effect on me to even guess where to go
with this. I guess the biggest thing is to not trash my metabolism, and keep the UDs
rather high, so would this be a good start? Then if I find out that I'm not losing, or
not losing well, I could try lower-cal UDs for a few weeks? I dunno, is this how you
work it?[/QUOTE]
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:30 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
Wow, in re-reading this, I realized that doing 1828 cal UDs, I would only be averaging
914 cals per day- and that doesn't seem like something that would actually help with
boosting metabolism.
Part of the metabolic boost seems to come from the overall benefit of fasting, and its ability to heal a lot of stuff that doesn't work in us very well. LOL

And part of the metabolic boost seems to be in keeping your UD calories up to your general maintenance number while holding your DD calories down to your fasting level or less, and then following this up/down/up/down fasting/feasting *pounding like a piston* rhythmic pattern of eating. It's as though the invisible piston keeps pounding up against that UD calorie ceiling, and gradually is able to pound it higher.

After you've been doing JUDDD awhile and enjoying some nice loss, you might experiment with increasing your UD calorie number a bit... bit by bit... and making note of how it's coming along now.

And, of course, in your maintenance you will be increasing your calories too, so that you don't continue to waste away!

I truly think it would be a rare one of us who ever truly ended up with a fabulous raging metabolism again, or for the first time in our lives, like folks who are just truly blessed that way, but many of us have been absolutely delighted to find our metabolic burn has been increased nicely by following JUDDD, and that's an awfully nice little bonus gift to have received. And may turn out to be the biggest gift of all.

Last edited by SoHappy; 01-13-2012 at 10:32 AM..
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:40 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoHappy View Post
Your original question about skipping DD calories and adding them onto the following UD to increase that UD number was just being discussed on somebody else's thread, so I'll just copy and paste my response here.
I had looked at that thread, but what I was thinking about was LOWERING my
UD calories by the amount that I'd be lowering my DD calories- 443 per the JUDDD
calculator. LOL So I guess my question wasn't very clear, after all.
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:44 AM   #10
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Mathematically, I *think*...not eating your DD calories would ADD them to your UD calories, not subtract them.

But I agree, I don't think it's necessary to change your UD calories--
unless, as you said, you're not losing on them, and lowering them helps.

What popped into my head was the Weight Watcher's rule about points, if I recall correctly; you don't have to eat all your points every day, but you can't "save" them from one day to the next.

PS--I guess I don't really understand your question, or why you're picking your DD calories to subtract from your UD ones.
Basically, are you asking whether you should lower your UD calories by 20%?
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Last edited by piratejenny; 01-13-2012 at 10:47 AM.. Reason: PS
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:46 AM   #11
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LOL, maybe we could save them up for 2-3 weeks then have one helluva blowout in one meal!?! J/K but Jenny's reply made me think of pirates (cuz of her name), which made me think of rum, which made me think of baccanalia (sp? sorry. blush), which made me think of eating bad so bad things like chips and mac n cheese and pasta, etc... um guess I haven't evolved as much as I'd hoped.
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:48 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pooticus View Post
LOL, maybe we could save them up for 2-3 weeks then have one helluva blowout in one meal!?! J/K but Jenny's reply made me think of pirates (cuz of her name), which made me think of rum, which made me think of baccanalia (sp? sorry. blush), which made me think of eating bad so bad things like chips and mac n cheese and pasta, etc... um guess I haven't evolved as much as I'd hoped.
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Old 01-13-2012, 10:58 AM   #13
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I understand the Q -- you want to know if you need to keep the difference in your DD and UD calories the same, so if you lower DD by 500, should you also lower UD by 500? I'm new to JUDDD and I haven't read the book, so I don't have a lot of knowledge about how the diet works, but I would say NO. I think, if you're trying to lose weight, then I'd keep UD calories the same. If you're maintaining, then maybe watch the scale and add calories to your UD if you are losing.

My gut says that it's not the differential in calories between UD's and DD's but the total number of calories eaten over the two that matters. So, if anything you'd need to add to your UD's, but I doubt that's necessary, especially since it does seem like the UD #s from Dr. Johnson's site are generous.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:06 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rubidoux View Post
My gut says that it's not the differential in calories between UD's and DD's...
I agree, or otherwise there wouldn't be a DD choice of 20%, 25%, 30%, up to 45% for WL and 60% for maintenance!
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:11 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
I had looked at that thread, but what I was thinking about was LOWERING my
UD calories by the amount that I'd be lowering my DD calories- 443 per the JUDDD
calculator. LOL So I guess my question wasn't very clear, after all.
LOL!

OK, this is what I would expect the overall result would be...

At first, cutting out most/all DD calories by total fasting and then also reducing your UD calories by the amount of your DD figure, so that you also had a lower UD figure at this point... should result in weight loss. Most plans that call for drastic calorie reduction give weight loss results almost off the bat and can continue, at least for awhile.

But, the downside of restriction that holds calories down too low, and low all the time, is that after awhile, the whole metabolism is triggered to slow down too, to more closely match the overall calorie intake of the organism. You are basically stimulating your brain into thinking you are in a famine situation. The response is to slow the metabolism down, to make the best use of every single precious calorie you can find to eat, in the attempt to save your life.

Now if you have a real good metabolism, it most often pops back up again, at least pretty decently, once you start eating lots more calories again. But most of us who became overweight in the first place, already have lousy metabolisms. It's a good part of why we got fat and then most often got even fatter! And doing anything that slows a metabolism down even further isn't a real good idea, to my way of thinking. Holding calories down on an ongoing basis, just seems to be opening the door to the metabolism finally becoming trashed pretty badly, once again.. to my way of thinking.

Well, anyway, I wouldn't do it to myself. I hope everything works out well for you though.

Last edited by SoHappy; 01-13-2012 at 11:12 AM..
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:27 AM   #16
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Thank you all for your patience with me. I now have a plan in place:

-Going to knock the DD calories down to 0
-Going to leave the UD calories at 2271

at least for a period of time, to see how this affects me.

Then re-evaluate in early February, and adjust from there....

That will give me 2 1/2 to 3 weeks doing this, so I may have an idea what needs
adjusting (if anything- who knows? I might hit this on the head on the first try!).

Thanks again, everyone, for all your help!!
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:32 AM   #17
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Pami, here's to you just taking off and soaring! I look forward to watching your progress!
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:40 PM   #18
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Well, it's after 10:30 PM here, and I'm on my way to bed, and I did, in fact, have
0 calories today. It wasn't that hard. Should be even easier when it falls on a school
day. May have to re-align the rotation when mid-terms and finals come up, but for
just a regular school day, I think I'll be fine. This past Monday and Wednesday were
DDs and school days, and I didn't eat at all until after school. Yep, this is what I'm
going to do on DDs,
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:43 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
Well, it's after 10:30 PM here, and I'm on my way to bed, and I did, in fact, have
0 calories today. It wasn't that hard. Should be even easier when it falls on a school
day. May have to re-align the rotation when mid-terms and finals come up, but for
just a regular school day, I think I'll be fine. This past Monday and Wednesday were
DDs and school days, and I didn't eat at all until after school. Yep, this is what I'm
going to do on DDs,
Great job, Pami!
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Old 01-13-2012, 08:44 PM   #20
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:19 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
Well, it's after 10:30 PM here, and I'm on my way to bed, and I did, in fact, have
0 calories today. It wasn't that hard. Should be even easier when it falls on a school
day. May have to re-align the rotation when mid-terms and finals come up, but for
just a regular school day, I think I'll be fine. This past Monday and Wednesday were
DDs and school days, and I didn't eat at all until after school. Yep, this is what I'm
going to do on DDs,
I'm happy you came back to update us! I am doing a 0 calorie DD today, too, and I'm not feeling hungry at all (8:15 pm here). I am feeling very sleepy, though, and I wonder if that has to do with not eating. Oddly enough, I haven't been feeling cold like I often do on DDs. I'm not ready to commit to a total fast for all my DDs, but I'm looking forward to hearing about your results!
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:23 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rubidoux View Post
I'm happy you came back to update us! I am doing a 0 calorie DD today, too, and I'm not feeling hungry at all (8:15 pm here). I am feeling very sleepy, though, and I wonder if that has to do with not eating. Oddly enough, I haven't been feeling cold like I often do on DDs. I'm not ready to commit to a total fast for all my DDs, but I'm looking forward to hearing about your results!
WTG, Rubidoux!

You guys in the Zero Calorie Club are really it!
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