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Old 12-31-2011, 09:36 AM   #1
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New to JUDDD having problems need advice

Started JUDDD the day before Christmas with a big DD 809. W 324.4 Christmas UD ate 4000
W 323.8
39% 9% 24% 28%
F p c A

11/26
W 333. up 10lbs 10lbs jump in 1 day had to be water. I think
C 224 the alcohol did it.
48% 44% 8%
F P C

11/27
W 332.4 down 1lb.
C 2573
51% 30% 20%
F P C

11/28
W 335.2 up 3
C 324
48% 31% 21%
F P C

11/29
W 329.5 Birthday party more alcohol not a good thing.
C 4064
55% 20% 13% 12%
F p C A

11/30 Did not weigh
W DNW
C 448
52% 45% 0%
F P C

11/31 Thought I'd be down but up 9lbs.
W 338.4
C 941 So Far it's an UD

I was doing EFGT with about 1800 cals a day and maintaining at 323 for a couple of months.

Switched to JUDDD
BMR 2800-3200 depending on calculator
DD cals 225-637 depending on will power

I have trouble eating to BMR without alcohol which I usually don't consume
(make me hungry) I don't intend to do anymore. If I don't drink I have trouble eating 2300 cals. DDs are pretty easy.
I intend to go back to very low carbs and moderate protein along with JUDDD.
Do I really need to make BMR every UD?
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Old 12-31-2011, 10:56 AM   #2
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Do you know how many calories you eat in a day if you do vlc and eat to satiety? Maybe you should just try that for your UD's. If you maintain at 1800 a day, then it seems like 2800 is awfully high for your UD's. Have you read the last couple of pages of the "weight management" thread? They're talking about this exact subject there.
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Old 12-31-2011, 10:59 AM   #3
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I don't know your height or age, so I used 5ft6" and 40 years old, no exercise and got 2645 for up days, and that seems high to me. I'd suggest shooting for 2200 on up days and 600 on down for a while and see how you do. No real "professional" reason for those numbers, just they seem about the right range to me.
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Old 12-31-2011, 11:09 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fozzie99 View Post
Started JUDDD the day before Christmas with a big DD 809. W 324.4 Christmas UD ate 4000
W 323.8
39% 9% 24% 28%
F p c A

11/26
W 333. up 10lbs 10lbs jump in 1 day had to be water. I think
C 224 the alcohol did it.
48% 44% 8%
F P C

11/27
W 332.4 down 1lb.
C 2573
51% 30% 20%
F P C

11/28
W 335.2 up 3
C 324
48% 31% 21%
F P C

11/29
W 329.5 Birthday party more alcohol not a good thing.
C 4064
55% 20% 13% 12%
F p C A

11/30 Did not weigh
W DNW
C 448
52% 45% 0%
F P C

11/31 Thought I'd be down but up 9lbs.
W 338.4
C 941 So Far it's an UD

I was doing EFGT with about 1800 cals a day and maintaining at 323 for a couple of months.

Switched to JUDDD
BMR 2800-3200 depending on calculator
DD cals 225-637 depending on will power

I have trouble eating to BMR without alcohol which I usually don't consume
(make me hungry) I don't intend to do anymore. If I don't drink I have trouble eating 2300 cals. DDs are pretty easy.
I intend to go back to very low carbs and moderate protein along with JUDDD.
Do I really need to make BMR every UD?

OK first after looking at the alcohol and the over 4,000 cal day in your first week I'd say ... don't fret, you just need to get things on track and it will probably be easier to do that now that the holidays will be behind you.

Since you plan to go low carb/mod protein, I will assume that will increase your fat % which wil definitely help you reach that UD number without alcohol. Sssssssssssh! but I couldn't reach my UD cals and for the first week or 2 I ate ice cream with chocolate syrup each UD night so that I could come close to my calories. I have since gotten better at figuring my meals before I start the day so that I can do better at getting closer to UD calories without relying on a big bowl of ice cream!

After looking at your numbers and the fact that you said that you were maintaining at 1800 cals I think that if it were me I'd try these numbers and really stick with them for a couple of weeks to give it a chance to work: 2800 UD and 500 DD. If you add those numbers then divide by 2 you get 1650 calories average which would definitely put you under the 1800 you were maintaining with previously. Of course I'd use those numbers as a starting point and see how they work as sometimes the numbers can be tweaked to get better results and of course you are tall and male so you really should need more calories than most of us hanging out here so you might want to start with those UD calories even higher but try to use the 500 DD calories for the first 2 weeks. And NO you don't have to hit the UD calories but everyone suggests that you do. However, I have a tough time making mine on UD and I have done alright

If you came from low carb and have been drinking alcohol and adding back carbs you can count on a good bounce up in weight right away but, if you stay on your numbers you will see that work itself back down. It took me just under a week to show a difference in the scale after adding carbs back with JUDDD. But, once I got through the water weight the carbs added I started dropping to new lows right away.

I'd suggest starting from scratch and looking into choosing your numbers and really sticking with them long enough to see how the results pan out. I hope that helps and that someone with more experience than myself comes along with some more insight. Hang in there!
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Old 12-31-2011, 11:53 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lori-s View Post
OK first after looking at the alcohol and the over 4,000 cal day in your first week I'd say ... don't fret, you just need to get things on track and it will probably be easier to do that now that the holidays will be behind you.

Since you plan to go low carb/mod protein, I will assume that will increase your fat % which wil definitely help you reach that UD number without alcohol. Sssssssssssh! but I couldn't reach my UD cals and for the first week or 2 I ate ice cream with chocolate syrup each UD night so that I could come close to my calories. I have since gotten better at figuring my meals before I start the day so that I can do better at getting closer to UD calories without relying on a big bowl of ice cream!

After looking at your numbers and the fact that you said that you were maintaining at 1800 cals I think that if it were me I'd try these numbers and really stick with them for a couple of weeks to give it a chance to work: 2800 UD and 500 DD. If you add those numbers then divide by 2 you get 1650 calories average which would definitely put you under the 1800 you were maintaining with previously. Of course I'd use those numbers as a starting point and see how they work as sometimes the numbers can be tweaked to get better results and of course you are tall and male so you really should need more calories than most of us hanging out here so you might want to start with those UD calories even higher but try to use the 500 DD calories for the first 2 weeks. And NO you don't have to hit the UD calories but everyone suggests that you do. However, I have a tough time making mine on UD and I have done alright

If you came from low carb and have been drinking alcohol and adding back carbs you can count on a good bounce up in weight right away but, if you stay on your numbers you will see that work itself back down. It took me just under a week to show a difference in the scale after adding carbs back with JUDDD. But, once I got through the water weight the carbs added I started dropping to new lows right away.

I'd suggest starting from scratch and looking into choosing your numbers and really sticking with them long enough to see how the results pan out. I hope that helps and that someone with more experience than myself comes along with some more insight. Hang in there!
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Old 12-31-2011, 12:12 PM   #6
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I was thinking along similiar lines. The last week has been so rocky up and down and not at all like my regular eating. I was worried that on 1200-1800 cals I wasn't eating enough and wouldn't release because of not making BMR (slowed metabolism).
I'm 57 W 338 height 6'0" and list no activity to keep the cals lower and BMR is still 2800-3200. What causes the losses on JUDDD is it the difference between UD and DD or some other factors. I'm up 12-15 lbs and have not eaten enough extra cals to account for the gain.
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Old 12-31-2011, 12:54 PM   #7
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Fozzie, I would just say that much gain in that short a period is just water weight so give it a few days to drop back down.

Part of the way that JUDDD works is yes the difference between the UD and DD as it seems to keep the body guessing and doesn't allow the metabolism to slow down enough as you are eating higher calories one day and lower the next (A very good reason to try to keep your UD calories as high as possible while still allowing for weight loss). Also, it is plain old calorie restriction as well as you can see by averaging the UD and DD. The difference between this and just plain daily calorie restriction is not allowing the metabolism to slow and get used to the lower calories and it's really only restricting (dieting) every other day.

When I chose my numbers I took into consideration that I didn't want to lower my metabolism and wanted to push it a little as well as factoring in what my DD numbers were so that the average between the 2 gave my the right number for weight loss. Of course I had to keep track of everything so that I could make sure that it worked in reality the way it worked in theory. Taking the 2 weeks at 500 DD and whatever UD you feel will suit you will give you a good picture of whether or not you might want to change the numbers up after "induction".
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Old 01-01-2012, 05:36 AM   #8
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Happy New Year!!
1/1/12
W DNW
3013 cals UD
73% 25% 2%
F P C
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Old 01-01-2012, 04:20 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fozzie99 View Post
I have trouble eating to BMR without alcohol which I usually don't consume
(make me hungry) I don't intend to do anymore. If I don't drink I have trouble eating 2300 cals. DDs are pretty easy.
I intend to go back to very low carbs and moderate protein along with JUDDD.
Do I really need to make BMR every UD?
Hi, fozzie! It's wonderful to see you with us here, and I'm pretty sure JUDDD is going to make a new man of you within mere months! It's a pretty exciting and dynamic and yet very, very simple way to eat and manage your calorie intake and so, manage your body weight.

I think one thing you have run into here is relying too strongly on the accuracy of the calorie calculators to come up with your Up Day calorie recommendation, and I say that because the heavier we are, the more *over* the correct calorie number we are given, and we end up sometimes trying to eat up to a number that is truly way too high for us... figured with all our body fat included.

So in this instance, I think we're far better off in figuring what our UD calories should be if we are just feeding the lean mean fighting machine within us.. and not the excess body fat we start out with.

I wonder if you wouldn't find a great deal more success, and a lot faster, if you held your UD calories to about 2200 or so to begin with, as this is a lot closer to a correct number for a man of about 6 feet who is currently slim but not exercising a lot.. like a desk job or sedentary. If you exercise truly well, and I mean some real hard sweaty continuing workouts, then add to your UD calorie number some if you think you need some extra. And hold your DDs as close to 500 calories as you can.. maybe a bit more if necessary, but even less than 500 is great too. The fasting part of JUDDD is where a lot of weight loss happens, with the Up Days nourishing us and replenishing us.

I'm really excited to see how you proceed these next weeks. If you include a higher carb level in your diet and haven't been used to it, expect to gain some initial weight on the scale as that will certainly be water weight. Many JUDDDers and dieters in general will have weight gain from Holiday foods and treats and alcohol over these Celebration Days, but that all melts away again, so don't worry there.

And if you want to do low carb while you are doing JUDDD, that works well too. But do be aware that if you slide into and out of low carb eating while you do JUDDD, you will also slide up and down in water weight gain and loss too, which corresponds to your carb intake some, and that can be pretty confusing and sometimes discouraging when you weigh-in each morning. LOL But that is only water.. not FAT.. so I just say to myself, "Who Cares?"..
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Old 01-01-2012, 04:49 PM   #10
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I agree that the calculators "pad" the BMR numbers. I really have trouble making 2500 in a day unless I eat a huge breakfast 1000-1200cals. I'm not having to much trouble on DDs and now that I don't have any excuses to "pig" UDs should be OK. If results start soon I'll feel a lot better. Family set backs are worrying me also losses would help my state of mind ALOT. My understanding of JUDDD is that UD + DD / 2 x 7 should equal a calorie deficit low enough to cause a loss of at least 3500 - 4000 cals a week below your BMR x 7.

Last edited by fozzie99; 01-01-2012 at 04:56 PM..
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Old 01-01-2012, 05:03 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fozzie99 View Post
I agree that the calculators "pad" the BMR numbers. I really have trouble making 2500 in a day unless I eat a huge breakfast 1000-1200cals. I'm not having to much trouble on DDs and now that I don't have any excuses to "pig" UDs should be OK. If results start soon I'll feel a lot better. Family set backs are worrying me also losses would help my state of mind ALOT.
Aw... sorry about the family set backs.

Just hang in there with the alternating feeding/fasting schedule. It does sometimes take a body a bit to get itself running smoothly with this strange cycling way of eating, but I'll bet you will find great success with this if you give it just a few weeks.

One interesting thing you can do as the weeks pass is this: Weigh each morning, first thing, as *empty* and bare naked as you can get. LOL

Then write down that weight. Track your highest weight for the week, your lowest weight for the week, and the average weight for the week. I always tallied the average each Saturday. You usually will see that average a bit less and a bit less as the weeks go by, and it helps you relax about all the gigantic fluctuations JUDDD seems to produce. I've never been on any eating plan that caused more weight fluctuation than JUDDD, but charting the average every week keeps me sane and very relaxed about those fluctuations. I've come to realize that fluctuation in daily weight is NORMAL.
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Old 01-01-2012, 05:26 PM   #12
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And if you want to do low carb while you are doing JUDDD, that works well too. But do be aware that if you slide into and out of low carb eating while you do JUDDD, you will also slide up and down in water weight gain and loss too, which corresponds to your carb intake some, and that can be pretty confusing and sometimes discouraging when you weigh-in each morning. LOL But that is only water.. not FAT.. so I just say to myself, "Who Cares?"..
This is somewhat of a threadjack, but I can really identify with this water weight gain that takes place with the low carb along with JUDDD. I've had four occasions since starting JUDDD in October when I really binged on the carby foods and I have four big spikes on my ****** weight report to show for it! Last night we celebrated New Year's Eve by going out with some friends and having Chinese. DH and I split an order of Mongolian Beef and a small egg roll. Later I had a very small dish of ice cream and half of a Special K bar. I didn't feel deprived at all and I was only up one lb. this morning.
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Old 01-02-2012, 05:13 AM   #13
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1/2/12
W 328.4 down 10lbs
DD cals 664 pigged a little
51% 37% 12%
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Old 01-04-2012, 04:07 AM   #14
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1/4/12
W 325.2 down 3+ lbs still water loss. weighed in am. after DD. I don't weigh am. after UD
DD 588 yesterday
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Old 01-04-2012, 05:00 AM   #15
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Fozzie good to see you doing well. Stick with your numbers and you'll be
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Old 01-04-2012, 05:27 AM   #16
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Looks like you are working your plan!
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Old 01-05-2012, 03:55 AM   #17
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1/5/12
W DNW weigh in am. after DD. I don't weigh am. after UD
UD 1899
56% 19% 25% FPC Trying to eat EFGT percentages at least on UDs
Had some dried fruit it accounts for almost all of the carbs
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Old 01-06-2012, 05:13 AM   #18
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1/6/12
W 320.2 finally into the FAT new low weigh in am. after DD. I don't weigh am. after UD
DD 794 a little high 170 from calc. 200 0r 300 up from average
57% 33% 10% FPC Trying to eat EFGT percentages at least on UDs a little to many carbs.
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Old 01-06-2012, 05:18 AM   #19
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Old 01-06-2012, 05:24 AM   #20
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Glad to read this happy news! Congrats on your new low weight, and there are going to be a whole lot more of them coming up! (Well, along with that darned probable bouncing that we seem to do on JUDDD. LOL)

It looks like you zeroed in on a good calorie number for yourself at this time. Enjoy the ride down.
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Old 01-06-2012, 05:37 AM   #21
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YAY Fozzie! Doing great and congrats on the new low.
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Old 01-07-2012, 05:04 AM   #22
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1/7/12
W DNW
UD 2844 Leftover cookies before bed......The Debbile made me do it!!
45% 21% 34% FPC. I've never had more carb than protein before!
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:41 AM   #23
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Hey Steve, how is it going with you? It's great to see you having such success with JUDDD.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:44 AM   #24
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Hey Steve, how is it going with you? It's great to see you having such success with JUDDD.
Yes, Steve, looks like you are doing well so far, WTG!!

And nice seeing you here Cruz!! Hope all is well with you!!
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:45 AM   #25
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Marie! I'm so happy to see you, and wish you would be able to be here more often these days! I miss you!
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:47 AM   #26
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Yes, Steve, looks like you are doing well so far, WTG!!

And nice seeing you here Cruz!! Hope all is well with you!!
Hi Linda,

All is well with me. I am almost 2 months post surgery now. I'm not back on JUDDD yet, but, need to be. My stats are current, but, it's been a struggle. With JUDDD I could get away with eating about anything. This is not the case on a straight calorie WOE. It's pretty amazing that I am NOT carb sensitive while on JUDDD, but, very carb sensitive when just calorie counting. I know Steve from the hcg board. A few of us had been trying to get him to try JUDDD. He finally gave in .

Edited to say, thanks Pat .

Steve, sorry for the threadjack .
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Old 01-09-2012, 09:33 AM   #27
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Things are interesting......you know the old saw.
Down to a new low weight and I've been eating COOKIES on UDs lately. All gone now so back to VLC EFGT meals on UDs and cabbage soup and miracle noodles on DDs. It would be really tough without the noodles. Great to hear from you all!
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Old 01-09-2012, 09:44 AM   #28
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Things are interesting......you know the old saw.
Down to a new low weight and I've been eating COOKIES on UDs lately. All gone now so back to VLC EFGT meals on UDs and cabbage soup and miracle noodles on DDs. It would be really tough without the noodles. Great to hear from you all!
I did the same thing in the beginning on my UD's, went crazy, lol. It seems you have gotten it out of your system much sooner than I was able. However, I do feel like if I started again, I wouldn't go crazy. I am considering making this an UD, and a DD tomorrow. I will be eating out on Wed/Fri, so this would work with my schedule....still thinking on it....it's those DD's, you know, lol. Keep checking in. The accountability really helps!
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Old 01-16-2012, 11:38 AM   #29
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Stats: 147/136/125; 5'1"
WOE: PSMF/hcg Transitioning to HFLC
Start Date: joined LCF 2003: HCG/PSMF 07/2014
Hey Fozzie, Seems Like I lost your other thread, so I'm glad I found you. I came to cheer you on!!!! Happy New Year.
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:24 PM   #30
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 1,018
Gallery: fozzie99
Stats: 410/298/200 6' 0" 57 years old
WOE: HCG with EFGT meals now just EFGT low cal
Start Date: 7/23/2011
Good to hear from you Metqa....I've been kinda down just "poo happen" kind of stuff.
JUDDD did not seem to be working......I'm down but still not sure about it. I've been posting on the JUDDD threads but there is very little "visiting" between members....I miss it.
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